so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.
That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.
So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.
In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
The thing I don't get is that the people who seem most concerned about this are not people who like the product RT puts out now anyway. So what do they care? It's not like if the doors close it's suddenly going to poof all those classic RvB episodes into nothing. Beyond that RT wasn't exactly a well-run organization that was a dream job. Like even inside the "inner circle" of core public-facing personalities it was a pretty miserable job most of the time. It just seemed cool because they didn't talk about it publicly.
Well it's not concern that drives them, is it? They care because RT's failure would be seen to validate them and their opinions, of which they care about a great deal.
The viewing figures would suggest that, once again, volume on the internet does not equal consensus in reality. It points to the insular nature of much of the conversation.
No, that's the appropriate response to people who still go on about Adam being justified in his abuse of Blake, or claiming he wasn't actually abusive.
So....
Ruby has a Scythe
Maria had Sickles
and in Fairy Tales the Lady In The Woods had a Billhook
so by this logic Summer's weapon would also be a hooked farming tool used in harvesting.
Any ideas?
So....
Ruby has a Scythe
Maria had Sickles
and in Fairy Tales the Lady In The Woods had a Billhook
so by this logic Summer's weapon would also be a hooked farming tool used in harvesting.
Any ideas?
Oh god.....
now I have this image of my head of Summer dropping a tractor on a grimm and screaming "WRRRRYYYY!!" much to the mixed horror/confusion of her team.
Oh god.....
now I have this image of my head of Summer dropping a tractor on a grimm and screaming "WRRRRYYYY!!" much to the mixed horror/confusion of her team.
Maybe I should try making a photoshop with Ozpin. XD
Anyway so I've finished reading the entire book, it was a fairly quick read. Especially since I had already read the Silver Eye story in the previews.
My conclusion?
......It's good.
It's damned good. If I had some misgivings about recommending After the Fall and Before the Dawn to anyone who isn't a hardcore RWBY-fan/RWBY-lore-fan then despite it's even more niche subject matter I find that Fairy Tails of Remnant is something that I would actually be willing to recommend to people who have never watched the show, if for no other reason than the absolutely gorgeous illustrations by Violet Tobacco.
Seriously, there is a ton of stuff about the stories themselves that I liked and despite the occasional instance of Meyers writing RWBY terms in somewhat clunky ways (as I've come to expect) the writing ranges from fairly solid to very good, and at times even excellent. So yeah, writing is good but I just need to dedicate this first part to praising the artist because holy moley did Violet Tobacco perform a stunning job on the artwork. It is sooooo good.
Seeing the images on the wiki just does not do the art justice compared to how they look and feel in the book. Especially when combined with their placement in the story, like this image of the Crown in The King, The Crown and The Widow:
which pairs very well with the downward spiral the king is experiencing because of the crown. The chapter covers are also utterly stunning and I love the little touches in each chapter where every page has a miniature drawing depicting something important from the story at the top and has these flowery/cloudy flourishes at the bottom of the pages. The Crown story has a crown at the top of each page for example, The Grimm Child has a Grimm mask, and Judgement of the Faunus has a dove.
I ended up with less time to write this than I wanted so I will have to get into the details of the stories themselves more later, but just to leave some small teasers:
CRWBY once again proves themselves way too adept at writing horror. This story and the worldbuilding it revealed is utterly horrifying. Right up there with the Apathy in terms of sheer
that it induces in the reader. Remnant is a terrifying place to live.
Long ago, before the fish had scales, before the birds had feathers, and before the turtles had shells, when our god still walked and crawled and slithered the earth, there were only Humans and animals. (And Grimm. There have always been Grimm. There will always be Grimm. But those creatures don't figure in this story, so just put them out of your mind, if you can.)
This has to be one of my favorite RWBY quotes. It really highlights the sort of quiet despair and Grimm acceptance that people in this world live with every day and how they basically have to do their best to just not think about the fact that they live on a horror filled death world just in order to stay sane and stay safe.
I expected this to be some fairly sedate and typical fantasy world building that might explain the presence of Dust or Silver Eyes or something like that. Instead I got full on 9000% SHENANIGANS very much in keeping with real world fairy tales and myth. Seriously this is some Maui style zany schemes at play here. Definitively one of the sleeper hits of this book for me, it gave me a great laugh and it also served as a effective way of reminding us that these are fairy tales at the end of the day. Anything portrayed in the tales themselves should be taken with a grain of salt. They are very much not literally true, though I can see some potential metaphorical truths in this tale.
Maybe I should try making a photoshop with Ozpin. XD
Anyway so I've finished reading the entire book, it was a fairly quick read. Especially since I had already read the Silver Eye story in the previews.
My conclusion?
......It's good.
It's damned good. If I had some misgivings about recommending After the Fall and Before the Dawn to anyone who isn't a hardcore RWBY-fan/RWBY-lore-fan then despite it's even more niche subject matter I find that Fairy Tails of Remnant is something that I would actually be willing to recommend to people who have never watched the show, if for no other reason than the absolutely gorgeous illustrations by Violet Tobacco.
Seriously, there is a ton of stuff about the stories themselves that I liked and despite the occasional instance of Meyers writing RWBY terms in somewhat clunky ways (as I've come to expect) the writing ranges from fairly solid to very good, and at times even excellent. So yeah, writing is good but I just need to dedicate this first part to praising the artist because holy moley did Violet Tobacco perform a stunning job on the artwork. It is sooooo good.
Seeing the images on the wiki just does not do the art justice compared to how they look and feel in the book. Especially when combined with their placement in the story, like this image of the Crown in The King, The Crown and The Widow:
which pairs very well with the downward spiral the king is experiencing because of the crown. The chapter covers are also utterly stunning and I love the little touches in each chapter where every page has a miniature drawing depicting something important from the story at the top and has these flowery/cloudy flourishes at the bottom of the pages. The Crown story has a crown at the top of each page for example, The Grimm Child has a Grimm mask, and Judgement of the Faunus has a dove.
I ended up with less time to write this than I wanted so I will have to get into the details of the stories themselves more later, but just to leave some small teasers:
CRWBY once again proves themselves way too adept at writing horror. This story and the worldbuilding it revealed is utterly horrifying. Right up there with the Apathy in terms of sheer
that it induces in the reader. Remnant is a terrifying place to live.
Long ago, before the fish had scales, before the birds had feathers, and before the turtles had shells, when our god still walked and crawled and slithered the earth, there were only Humans and animals. (And Grimm. There have always been Grimm. There will always be Grimm. But those creatures don't figure in this story, so just put them out of your mind, if you can.)
This has to be one of my favorite RWBY quotes. It really highlights the sort of quiet despair and Grimm acceptance that people in this world live with every day and how they basically have to do their best to just not think about the fact that they live on a horror filled death world just in order to stay sane and stay safe.
I expected this to be some fairly sedate and typical fantasy world building that might explain the presence of Dust or Silver Eyes or something like that. Instead I got full on 9000% SHENANIGANS very much in keeping with real world fairy tales and myth. Seriously this is some Maui style zany schemes at play here. Definitively one of the sleeper hits of this book for me, it gave me a great laugh and it also served as a effective way of reminding us that these are fairy tales at the end of the day. Anything portrayed in the tales themselves should be taken with a grain of salt. They are very much not literally true, though I can see some potential metaphorical truths in this tale.
One nitpick I can see coming up with the book is actually from the Crown story.
In the text it is described as "Silver" but the art shows something more akin to "Gold". And if this is a tale about THE Crown of Choice then looking at the other 2 relics and how relics seem to be colored in WoR then a "Gold" crown makes more sense.
Nitpick, yes, but you just KNOW people are going to harp on it. -.-
EDIT:
Upon further thought....maybe the story calling it a "Silver Crown" is just another example of the Ozluminati cover up. Describe the artifact by the wrong color to through would be explorers off the trail. *shrugs*
One nitpick I can see coming up with the book is actually from the Crown story.
In the text it is described as "Silver" but the art shows something more akin to "Gold". And if this is a tale about THE Crown of Choice then looking at the other 2 relics and how relics seem to be colored in WoR then a "Gold" crown makes more sense.
Nitpick, yes, but you just KNOW people are going to harp on it. -.-
EDIT:
Upon further thought....maybe the story calling it a "Silver Crown" is just another example of the Ozluminati cover up. Describe the artifact by the wrong color to through would be explorers off the trail. *shrugs*
Had a thought regarding this recently. Some people like you have suggested that the Relic of Choice is an axe based on the axes in Vale's symbol, while others like myself have argued that its a crown based on the laurel wreathe in the symbol.
But recently I thought of a way to unify the theories in a way. The Relic is a crown, but its powers will be a direct reference to the tale of the honest woodcutter. My current theory is that the Relic of Choice not only has powers in regards to choice, but it also presents its user with choices on how they want that power to manifest. So every time someone approaches the Relic of Choice when its not already claimed it splits into three different crowns, each with different abilities:
Gold - The Crown of Dominion: This blinged out variant of the Relic grants the wearer the earlier speculated power to take away Choice from other people. It could be something like "X amount of times per Y amount of years you can give Commands that people have no choice but to obey". This is the crown of those that seek to rule, who see themselves as being above others and possessing the right or superior judgement to make other people's choices for them. It is extremely powerful but also evil or at the very least extremely morally dubious.
Silver - The Crown of Judgement:This rather more subdued but still highly regal crown has no power to dictate the actions of others, however it is perfectly capable of judging them. If the golden crown was based on the Compelling Voice power then this one is based on how the Mirror of Erised protected the Philosopher's Stone. With this crown the wearer can create Laws or conditions based on the Choices that people have already made. For example if one wants to protect a Vault containing an extremely powerful object such as the Relic of Creation then the silver crown can set a condition like "People or beings who have CHOSEN to kill solely for their own personal gain or enjoyment can not approach or discover this Vault" and then make that into reality. The Relic might need to be in proximity to the area under its Law but as long as its there its practically a perfect defense against evildoers.
Edit: Of course, its power can also be abused. An evil tyrant for example could maybe do something like make a Law that "Nobody can enter my castle if they have made the Choice to kill me or dethrone me." and then rule with an iron fist for their entire life as no one is capable of supplanting them and disloyalty is easily discovered as those who wish to take action against him/her suddenly act like they hit a invisible wall when they return to the castle.
Silver ended up being foresight to make decisions to instead but the overall concept can still apply.
Plant - Laurels of peace: The last and seemingly least form of the Relic would be an unassuming laurel wreathe, seemingly made of an ordinary plant. This version of the Relic grants no power over others at all, no authority to decide what choices people make or punish them for the ones they have made. Instead its power is simply to grant free will to beings that do not already possess it. It can be used to dispel the gold crowns mind control for example and possibly other things.*
I think it could be fitting for the Relic of Choice to both have power over choice but also to be all about making a choice when using it. And one neat way to twist the Woodsman thing is that there might not be any takebacks, at least not without help. So if you pick Gold but later have a change of heart and want to free your victims then you can't just take of the crown and pick the laurels, you need to actually give the crown to someone else, and give them the choice to pick which crown they want.**
All the Relics are golden (possibly because the God of Light made them all) but the ones with the domains of Darkness have red as their secondary color instead of blue. I figured the blue might have been a color inversion or something and the Dark Relics would follow a similar theme so I didn't see this coming but I suppose the logic instead was that blue is peaceful, serene, tranquil, calm, etc while red is aggressive, violent, passsionate, etc.
And I suppose with RT producing this it makes sense that the Creation Destruction divide would be represented by Red vs Blue.
Plus normal Grimm have a ton of red, while Summons (aka Good/Peaceful Grimm) have blue instead. So while the gods don't follow those color themes personally their creations do.
Still, with the Relic of Choice being in Vale I kind of hope that a Silver+Purple/Red crown is still an option in addition to the crown in the backstory.
I think it would be fitting for the Relic of Choice to grant the freedom to Choose what kind of power one wants the Crown to give (though presumably no takebacks per person).
Assuming the fairy tale is accurate the Silver Crown would give the power to see choices you're going to have to make ahead of time (and possibly their consequences) so that you can choose the most optimal outcome. Despite the cautionary tale this seems like a perfect fit for a surface level "good" crown that gives a "good" power. Wear the silver crown and you can make sure that you never make any mistakes that could hurt people and always make the right decisions (until the day you encounter a situation where there is no right decision).
If you pick the Silver Crown then that represents choosing Creation over Destruction and Good over Evil (or so it seems).
Assuming that is Ozma in that fairy tale (although I think I would prefer if he wasn't related to every fairy tale, or was the widow/queen instead) then it makes sense for the Good King to choose a power tht helps him help people and avoid fucking things up.
The Gold Crown would then be a good place to insert a more evil destruction aligned power. Mind control is the obvious one here. Again assuming that's Ozma in that fairy tale there's no way he would be comfortable using a power like that so he would never even consider picking something other than the silver crown.
And that brings us to the true aesop of the legend. Being humble and choosing something that doesn't involve giving you power at all. That could be represented by the decision to just lay the crown down and let it lie. But alternatively:
Ruby is (possibly) the nemesis of the Maiden of Fall, aka the key to the Vault that the crown is stored in. And Vale's symbol besides the axes isn't a crown, it's a laurel wreath. And Ruby is associated with roses, which can be used to make very humble "crowns", just like the Honest Woodcutter only asked for a humble wooden axe and in return was richly rewarded, while asking for the gold or silver axes was a trap that led to gaining nothing (just like the silver crown is presented as a trap that isn't worth using and mind control is obviously evil that would likely lead to a very empty unfulfilling life).
So theory, Ruby is going to get the crown, be presented with a choice and somehow pick a third option where her smaller more honest soul is the key to unlocking a power that might not have previously even existed (since Ozma either can't unlock this power himself or didn't know about it despite asking Jinn) previously. My theory: Ruby is going to ask for the power to give the Gift of Choice to other beings, such as the Grimm and the newly free willed and no longer inherently evil Grimm will prove key allies in turning the tide against Salem. An important lesson that she's learning after all is that killing monsters is not the goal, protecting people is.
Upon further thought....maybe the story calling it a "Silver Crown" is just another example of the Ozluminati cover up. Describe the artifact by the wrong color to through would be explorers off the trail. *shrugs*
I don't think the Crown would have the power to take away free will. It's not like the Lamp had the ability to take away other people's memories, and it certainly doesn't seem like the Staff can prevent others from making things, and I doubt the Sword can prevent others from breaking things except by killing them first.
But the idea that the Crown might have different appearances based on the choice of the one who lays hold of it makes sense.
I don't think the Crown would have the power to take away free will. It's not like the Lamp had the ability to take away other people's memories, and it certainly doesn't seem like the Staff can prevent others from making things, and I doubt the Sword can prevent others from breaking things except by killing them first.
But the idea that the Crown might have different appearances based on the choice of the one who lays hold of it makes sense.
Well it is just a theory, however I feel like Choice is a very thematically different Relic than either Knowledge, Creation or Destruction. Jinn does actually have a bunch of powers that are not directly related to knowledge but in any case the other Relics all represent basically a single concept. Creation is just Creation. You can choose to apply it's powers for different purposes but it's ultimately still just different flavors of the same thing, if you want to Destroy something then there is a different Relic for that. Knowledge is knowledge, apply it how you will but it's not the Relic of Ignorance so there's no reason for it to take Knowledge away.
Choice however is about having multiple different options. The visions on their own could supply that I suppose, but it would be thematically fitting for the Relic of Choice to offer the Choice of different benefits the Relic can provide. The gift of Choice in RWBY is strongly tied to the theme of choosing between Light and Dark after all, between Creation or Destruction.
The Silver Crown gives you visions of a Choice that you will have to make in the future, like the Widow having to choose between marrying or not marrying the King. That potential for the choice to be entirely benign seems a bit too onesided for a embodiment of choosing between Creation or Destruction. Maybe the entire choice is about using or not using the crown, but that feels a bit cheap. While it has hidden dangers the power to see future decisions doesn't really seem like anything other than a Light themed power. The only reason it caused any problems was because the King had such a strong sense of duty that he freaked out at the idea of making a wrong choice.
I think there is a stronger theme of Light/Dark if the Crown offers the Choice between having the power to make the best choice that can help people the most, or having the power to impose your will into others. There is a stronger divide there. And Vale's emblem really brings to mind the Tale of the Honest Woodsman, which fits well with the idea of both options actually being bad and having hidden pitfalls that make them worse than just not using the crown at all (or picking a third option, as I'm theorizing).
I absolutely could be wrong, but it seems conspicuous that the story would make such a big deal out of the crown being silver (which is associated with GOOD in this setting) while the artwork shows it as being gold. Especially in the context that the crown of Choice is hidden in Vale, land of the two axes (gold/silver).
Did anyone else assume that Cinder found Mercury Black and Emerald Sustrai in Mistral?
Originally, I thought Cinder herself came from Mistral, or was based out of it, but then we learned that her team came from Haven because Salem subverted its headmaster. Huntsmen students can come from anywhere, so Cinder could have found both of them in the kingdom of Vale.
Mistral is the most criminal kingdom, but we know Vale has its own criminals. Mercury might have led Cinder to Torchwick not because he knew better how to find the criminal element than her, but perhaps because he actually knew Torchwick by name thanks to his father.
Emerald might come from Vacuo (Aladdin, after all), though the architecture seen in "Beginning of the End" seems more like Vale or Mistral. That could have been an animation shortcut, reusing assets from Vale scenes.
As for Cinder, we don't know where she's from. There's nothing solid in any direction.
Ironwood's semblence is an Iron-will, and its permanantly on like Qrow and Clover....
Why do i get the feeling it might have a sort of feedback loop effect?
Ironwood's semblence is an Iron-will, and its permanantly on like Qrow and Clover....
Why do i get the feeling it might have a sort of feedback loop effect?
we saw it flare up at least twice during V7. Once when faced with Salem in his office and she gave him the ultimatum to surrender or die. The second time was more obvious and was when he fixed Oscar with that cold stare before shooting him.
Honestly guys.....I do not think we are getting a Vacuo Arc in the show proper. Instead the E.C. Meyers books ARE The Vacuo Arc. Meaning next year we might get a 3rd part.
*shrugs*
we saw it flare up at least twice during V7. Once when faced with Salem in his office and she gave him the ultimatum to surrender or die. The second time was more obvious and was when he fixed Oscar with that cold stare before shooting him.
passive semblences don't really use up Aura normally, right? can they be charged with aura to amplify them? if so, i'm imagining Ironwood doing that in order to keep going, even though he's slowly draining the amount of aura he has available, with that causing him to lose access at just the wrong moment.
Honestly guys.....I do not think we are getting a Vacuo Arc in the show proper. Instead the E.C. Meyers books ARE The Vacuo Arc. Meaning next year we might get a 3rd part.
*shrugs*
Personally I doubt that. I don't think we're close to the end really. I think we're looking at 10-11 volumes at least. And I've heard rumors that this volume would be longer (Which I think was confirmed) but Volume 8 will be like only 10 episodes, which makes me think it's another kind of inbetween volume like 6.
Ironwood's semblence is an Iron-will, and its permanantly on like Qrow and Clover....
Why do i get the feeling it might have a sort of feedback loop effect?