RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

kokuenDG · May 1, 2022

so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.

inverted_helix · Oct 22, 2016

I found Jaune's strategy so incredibly pointless. I mean wow, hit in the face, no way anyone else could have come up with that.

Also this is the first time we've seen Ruby carry someone else with her semblance and no one seems to have commented on that? That seemed like a big deal to me.

Pyrrha's tiara being used for embellishing Jaune's weapon and shield was incredibly feels. It hurt so much.

Confirmed CCT is still down months later. That's pretty disturbing. I mean the CCT tower (as opposed to Beacon tower) wasn't actually blown up or anything, just infected with a virus.

I'm not buying Ozpin is dead. I mean in the WoR about Aura it ends with "can turn them into something much more than just a man" with a picture of Ozpin. There's no way he's going to be just dead with that not explained.

DezoPenguin · Oct 22, 2016

Very happy with Episode 1.

I don't know what everyone else is complaining about; I really liked the intro. And the song. Mind, V3's opening was my least favorite, particularly musically, so there's that. Explicitly upbeat opening music suggests "overcoming struggles" instead of "wallowing in narmy angst" as the theme.

Maybe we could have an episode with Yang in it before we start wondering why she doesn't have a new arm yet? We have no idea of either her personal circumstances, Vale's circumstances, or the level of technology access.

Meh on the villain council. Looks like Salem's Mordor is the source of Grimm. I wonder if Salem is behind the existence of Grimm or has been co-opted into a pre-existing template of evil critters (i.e. do they reflect her or vice versa?). Emmy looks scared as hell to be in this place and even Merc looks significantly uncomfortable, like the kids are in "what the hell did we really sign up for?" mode. I really do like that Salem actually seems to have read the Evil Overlord List and that she was supportive of Cinder, who did, after all, achieve all mission goals: Beacon down, CCT down, Fall Maiden power captured, dissension sown among kingdoms. Ozpin possibly believed dead (I say "possibly" since I don't know if Salem believes what she's saying). New villains seem very generic--Watts is the snooty one, Tyrian(?) is the crazy one, Hazel is the brute warrior who grunts a lot. Hoping for some character put into them. Tyrian/Ruby conflicts are going to happen, so we should get to see what he's all about this year. That the others would be snotty at Cinder doesn't seem wrong, since, well, evil. And we don't know their individual motivations yet, while Salem clearly seems to have greater-scope goals.

Farm kid is going to be important. I wonder if he really did dream-vision the Villain Council, or that was just a segue?

Loving the fight animation. Honestly, this was as good as anything in all of V3 except possibly Cinder/Pyrrha. New software makes a huge difference, obviously, but the choreography also seems significantly more inspired. Between her Semblance-warping and new Dust ammo, though, Ruby barely seems like she's the fighter from previous seasons (as opposed to Nora and Ren, who feel more like they just leveled up). Ruby being able to take Nora with her on the team attack, though...that was very cool. I love how the others gave Jaune-the-Strategist the WTF? look at "Hit it really hard!" The execution of the plan wasn't all that great, though: "disarm the critter so that it can't protect its vulnerable core" somehow turned to "one massive Limit Break!" so they do lose a point for that.

The Geist Grimm that can possess objects was pretty creative, though. I liked it. Nice to see them branch out from "black 'n' bony versions of normal animals.

Damn, Jaune, the feels. I think I'd have lost it if he'd pointed out to Ruby that Pyrrha was on the Pumpkin Pete's box, though. Dude is literally carrying her symbolically both outwardly and next to his heart.

Weiss stinger felt very...cold by comparison (I mean, that's obviously what they're going for, with the Atlesian weather and the color scheme of blues and grays everywhere, but it works).

I wonder who the extra guy is in the OP scene with Blake, Sun, and Blake's dad? Brother? Or someone else?

Tython82 · Oct 22, 2016

DezoPenguin said:
Very happy with Episode 1.

I don't know what everyone else is complaining about; I really liked the intro. And the song. Mind, V3's opening was my least favorite, particularly musically, so there's that. Explicitly upbeat opening music suggests "overcoming struggles" instead of "wallowing in narmy angst" as the theme.

Maybe we could have an episode with Yang in it before we start wondering why she doesn't have a new arm yet? We have no idea of either her personal circumstances, Vale's circumstances, or the level of technology access.

Meh on the villain council. Looks like Salem's Mordor is the source of Grimm. I wonder if Salem is behind the existence of Grimm or has been co-opted into a pre-existing template of evil critters (i.e. do they reflect her or vice versa?). Emmy looks scared as hell to be in this place and even Merc looks significantly uncomfortable, like the kids are in "what the hell did we really sign up for?" mode. I really do like that Salem actually seems to have read the Evil Overlord List and that she was supportive of Cinder, who did, after all, achieve all mission goals: Beacon down, CCT down, Fall Maiden power captured, dissension sown among kingdoms. Ozpin possibly believed dead (I say "possibly" since I don't know if Salem believes what she's saying). New villains seem very generic--Watts is the snooty one, Tyrian(?) is the crazy one, Hazel is the brute warrior who grunts a lot. Hoping for some character put into them. Tyrian/Ruby conflicts are going to happen, so we should get to see what he's all about this year. That the others would be snotty at Cinder doesn't seem wrong, since, well, evil. And we don't know their individual motivations yet, while Salem clearly seems to have greater-scope goals.

Farm kid is going to be important. I wonder if he really did dream-vision the Villain Council, or that was just a segue?

Loving the fight animation. Honestly, this was as good as anything in all of V3 except possibly Cinder/Pyrrha. New software makes a huge difference, obviously, but the choreography also seems significantly more inspired. Between her Semblance-warping and new Dust ammo, though, Ruby barely seems like she's the fighter from previous seasons (as opposed to Nora and Ren, who feel more like they just leveled up). Ruby being able to take Nora with her on the team attack, though...that was very cool. I love how the others gave Jaune-the-Strategist the WTF? look at "Hit it really hard!" The execution of the plan wasn't all that great, though: "disarm the critter so that it can't protect its vulnerable core" somehow turned to "one massive Limit Break!" so they do lose a point for that.

The Geist Grimm that can possess objects was pretty creative, though. I liked it. Nice to see them branch out from "black 'n' bony versions of normal animals.

Damn, Jaune, the feels. I think I'd have lost it if he'd pointed out to Ruby that Pyrrha was on the Pumpkin Pete's box, though. Dude is literally carrying her symbolically both outwardly and next to his heart.

Weiss stinger felt very...cold by comparison (I mean, that's obviously what they're going for, with the Atlesian weather and the color scheme of blues and grays everywhere, but it works).

I wonder who the extra guy is in the OP scene with Blake, Sun, and Blake's dad? Brother? Or someone else?

Personally in the OP I thought the third person in the Blake and her family scene was her mom just that she was flat chested when compared to Blake

jwolfe_beta · Oct 22, 2016

Tython82 said:
Personally in the OP I thought the third person in the Blake and her family scene was her mom just that she was flat chested when compared to Blake

Well considering just how massive her apparent father is (seriously is that guy half bear?) Blake had to get something from his side of the family.

DezoPenguin · Oct 22, 2016

Tython82 said:
Personally in the OP I thought the third person in the Blake and her family scene was her mom just that she was flat chested when compared to Blake

*pauses video at that spot*

Yeah, I could buy that.

(Actually, I don't think you don't need to spoil that--RT released the opener on Youtube so it's publicly available to non-First members.)

Mook · Oct 22, 2016

Feng Lengshun said:
Those also works. It's just so awkward though, especially when compared to the previous OPs and how the show is. New characters all look decisively Meh though. Except for the big black faunus guy, maybe. I swear I've seen a fanart of that guy before though. Or at least someone looking like him, in tuxedo, encouraging Blake who looks like she's going to get married (to Weiss?) or something.

I thought it worked great for the first part when it was more stylistic. When they just used the same animation as the one in the show though? Yeah no that just isn't meant for OP's. Its like the V3 OP all over again, those kinds of rapid scene switches and dramatic close ups don't work with just animating scenes. I hope they switch over to using World of Remnant style art for Volume 5 because I honestly think that would work better. Or get someone to analyze the V1 and V2 openings and how Monty did those and then use that as inspiration.

Zam · Oct 22, 2016

Finally watched the episode, over all I liked it, I guess it makes sense Jaune gets to command given most of the team are JNPR, hope Ruby gets to do some though, the fight itself was awesome and Ren has boomerang blades which is neat. Salem seems like a pretty solid boss and it sounds like Adam and the WF are on-board with her plans now, a shame, but its interesting to see all her elite are humans; also even Merc looks pissed at the sight of Grimm spawning, I like that, even his crazy has its limits. I am extremely wary of Blake's plot, the possible Schnee and this farm kid though, but otherwise I like where its going so far and feel awful for Weiss, she looks so miserable

Also Salem said that the Maiden powers are weak to silver eyes which reminds me of a theory regarding a magic 'purge' someone came up with, which intrigues me.

TheBleachDoctor · Oct 22, 2016

Guys. There was something with Nora's rendering in one scene.
Was it just the one that I watched, or at one point after Jaune gets his sword, there's an overhead shot, and Nora's outline does not move in sync with her body?

Zam · Oct 22, 2016

So lot of people have noted Cinder looked sad in the opening and episode, my thinking for that is as follows:

Given Cinder's motives were noted as wanting to be powerful and feared I feel her sadness may come from all her efforts feeling for nought, she got her power but right on her victory high something blind sides her, making her vulnerable and permanently, or semi permanently damaged and weakened.

Her allies all see her as more helpless or a failure, there's no fear only scorn from her crew, pity from her minions and a loose sort of acceptance from her boss. Then she is told her great, grand magic powers she went so far for, have a crippling weakness she seemingly did't know about.

She stole Superman's power only to get blasted by a krptonite laser and its eating at her.

blast flame · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
I found Jaune's strategy so incredibly pointless. I mean wow, hit in the face, no way anyone else could have come up with that.

Also this is the first time we've seen Ruby carry someone else with her semblance and no one seems to have commented on that? That seemed like a big deal to me.

Pyrrha's tiara being used for embellishing Jaune's weapon and shield was incredibly feels. It hurt so much.

Confirmed CCT is still down months later. That's pretty disturbing. I mean the CCT tower (as opposed to Beacon tower) wasn't actually blown up or anything, just infected with a virus.

I'm not buying Ozpin is dead. I mean in the WoR about Aura it ends with "can turn them into something much more than just a man" with a picture of Ozpin. There's no way he's going to be just dead with that not explained.

Beacon Tower is the CCT.

inverted_helix · Oct 23, 2016

blast flame said:
Beacon Tower is the CCT.

No it isn't. We see it separately in Volume 2 episode 3, as well as Volume 2 episode 7. It's not the same building. The top alone is far too different. As we can see in those episodes vs the end of volume 3 where Cinder battles atop Beacon tower.

Plus when Weiss gets in the elevator of the CCT tower it says "Hello Welcome to the CCT" which the Beacon tower elevators never do.

Tython82 · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
No it isn't. We see it separately in Volume 2 episode 3, as well as Volume 2 episode 7. It's not the same building. The top alone is far too different. As we can see in those episodes vs the end of volume 3 where Cinder battles atop Beacon tower.

Plus when Weiss gets in the elevator of the CCT tower it says "Hello Welcome to the CCT" which the Beacon tower elevators never do.

Then why did Cinder upload the virus in Beacon and not the CCT directly?

Genolution · Oct 23, 2016

The tower is in Beacon but is not Beacon Tower.

Mook · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
No it isn't. We see it separately in Volume 2 episode 3, as well as Volume 2 episode 7. It's not the same building. The top alone is far too different. As we can see in those episodes vs the end of volume 3 where Cinder battles atop Beacon tower.

Plus when Weiss gets in the elevator of the CCT tower it says "Hello Welcome to the CCT" which the Beacon tower elevators never do.

No we don't. Seriously stop this nonsense. Ozpin's tower and the CCT is the same thing. We have word of god on that and the CCT went down when the Dragon bumrushed Ozpin's office.

blast flame · Oct 23, 2016

Further proof: Ironwood's phone was infected with the virus when he put it down on ozpin's table. Because Ozpin's office is at the top of the CCT tower that cinder infected with the virus.

Zam · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
No it isn't. We see it separately in Volume 2 episode 3, as well as Volume 2 episode 7. It's not the same building. The top alone is far too different. As we can see in those episodes vs the end of volume 3 where Cinder battles atop Beacon tower.

Plus when Weiss gets in the elevator of the CCT tower it says "Hello Welcome to the CCT" which the Beacon tower elevators never do.

I'm pretty sure it is, I went to the wiki and here's some images that may prove useful, as I initially assumed they were separate locations as well:

They have the same four towery... things, and the same surroundings at the base with the little ponds and trees and big circle.

Dang this place looks sci-fi.

inverted_helix · Oct 23, 2016

Tython82 said:
Then why did Cinder upload the virus in Beacon and not the CCT directly?

She went to the CCT to upload it directly. Ruby leaves the party then chases after Cinder after she sees Cinder jumping across roofs.

Mook said:
No we don't. Seriously stop this nonsense. Ozpin's tower and the CCT is the same thing. We have word of god on that and the CCT went down when the Dragon bumrushed Ozpin's office.

I want that WoG. Link it.

blast flame said:
Further proof: Ironwood's phone was infected with the virus when he put it down on ozpin's table. Because Ozpin's office is at the top of the CCT tower that cinder infected with the virus.

The CCT is linked into everything. That is no evidence for anything.

Zam said:
I'm pretty sure it is, I went to the wiki and here's some images that may prove useful, as I initially assumed they were separate locations as well:

If you look around, tall buildings in Remnant all seem to have the exterior supporting pylons. That's not very significant.

Zam · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
If you look around, tall buildings in Remnant all seem to have the exterior supporting pylons. That's not very significant.

Perhaps, but them both having an identical room, and identical surroundings I feel is more than enough.

inverted_helix · Oct 23, 2016

Zam said:
Perhaps, but them both having an identical room, and identical surroundings I feel is more than enough.

They don't have an identical top. The top of the CCT is that communications rooms with the windows all around it. The top of the Beacon tower is Ozpin's chamber with all the clockwork. From the top of beacon shots we can tell that the windowed chamber simply isn't there. The communications room is glass walls all around it, the shot of the Beacon tower being decapitated shows there's no where like that on the Beacon tower. Similar architecture is not the same thing as the same building.

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net...est/scale-to-width-down/185?cb=20140903154521
Shows how windows go all around the communications room. While your own picture of the dragon breaking the top off the tower shows there's no level on Beacon Tower with full ring of windows like that.

And the surroundings aren't identical. Both are at or near Beacon, but the main Beacon Tower is in the center, while the CCT tower is away from it across a courtyard from the library.

Zam · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
They don't have an identical top. The top of the CCT is that communications rooms with the windows all around it. The top of the Beacon tower is Ozpin's chamber with all the clockwork. From the top of beacon shots we can tell that the windowed chamber simply isn't there. The communications room is glass walls all around it, the shot of the Beacon tower being decapitated shows there's no where like that on the Beacon tower. Similar architecture is not the same thing as the same building.

And the surroundings aren't identical. Both are at or near Beacon, but the main Beacon Tower is in the center, while the CCT tower is away from it across a courtyard from the library.

I am confident these are identical, and can you provide some image references or episode references for which floor everything is on and the like?

Tython82 · Oct 23, 2016

Cross Continental Transmit System
The Wiki mentions that Vales CCT is located in Beacon Tower.

inverted_helix · Oct 23, 2016

Zam said:
I am confident these are identical, and can you provide some image references or episode references for which floor everything is on and the like?

Look at the picture of the Communications room
Cct-interior-2.png
And then the picture of Beacon Tower:
http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net...r_Falls.png/revision/latest?cb=20160214160844

There is no ring of windows representing the communication room. There's no level at which the communications room could be.

The fact that a first floor is the same doesn't mean every floor is the same, that's a design choice using a central supporting pillar as the primary support structure for a skyscraper. It's actually a very common design system for modern skyscrapers when you want to put less supports into the exterior walls. In our case to go for that classic windows instead of walls look, in their case they appear to be doing it in addition to wall supports, probably because they have to build in such a way to account for battle damage. On Earth that's usually hidden behind other walls so you don't see it as just one massive pillar, but we're obsessed with uniqueness.

The Communications room also must be at the top, perhaps a floor down at most. It lacks the central support pillar of the lower levels, and the room is entirely open with no interior support beams, plus the windows ringing the room instead of walls. This means that this room cannot support very much weight above it. This is the way you'd design a top floor. You can possibly put one more floor on top of it, but a massive clocktower thing like Ozpin's office would be in serious danger of pancaking this room if it was underneath it.

Tython82 said:
The Wiki mentions that Vales CCT is located in Beacon Tower.

Without any real citation for that.

Tython82 · Oct 23, 2016

Just out of curiosity why is it so hard to believe that the CCT and Beacon Tower are one and the same? It makes alot more sense if the tower wasn't repaired/reactivated due to the Grimm then the Virus. Also every source I can find from Reddit and the Wiki and so forth says that the two towers are the same. Unless you can produce the WoG that it isn't.

inverted_helix · Oct 23, 2016

Tython82 said:
Just out of curiosity why is it so hard to believe that the CCT and Beacon Tower are one and the same? It makes alot more sense if the tower wasn't repaired/reactivated due to the Grimm then the Virus. Also every source I can find from Reddit and the Wiki and so forth says that the two towers are the same. Unless you can produce the WoG that it isn't.

All those "sources" don't actually have WoG sources linked.

The reason people believe they're the same tower is because of the architecture of the buildings is similar; notably the first floor and exterior support pylons. Yet that architecture is why they cannot be the same. There simply isn't any spot on Beacon tower that could be the communications room. There's no where with the number of windows, there's no where that even matches what we see inside the Communications room in V2E3 enough that the windows could have been covered and match. The windows extend outward and then a solid piece connects to the top of the window and bends back in. This doesn't match anywhere on the tower even if you covered the windows.

I analyze RWBY frame by frame on a regular basis to try to pick apart the physics of the setting. This is not an unusual level of analysis for me. They're actually much better at physics consistency than you'd expect, probably their animation program has some sort of internal physics engine. This on the other hand is a major inconsistency. It's far more plausible that the CCT tower is a separate nearby tower, than that it's the same tower with moving exterior walls and windows.

The Virus at least makes more sense in the fact that it must have been some sort of super virus in the first place because they should have purged and restored from backups all the tower computers the moment it was physically infiltrated as a basic security precaution in the first place. If that doesn't wipe it out then it probably spread to all of the towers before they could contain it.

Zam · Oct 23, 2016

inverted_helix said:
Look at the picture of the Communications room
Cct-interior-2.png
And then the picture of Beacon Tower:
http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net...r_Falls.png/revision/latest?cb=20160214160844

There is no ring of windows representing the communication room. There's no level at which the communications room could be.

The fact that a first floor is the same doesn't mean every floor is the same, that's a design choice using a central supporting pillar as the primary support structure for a skyscraper. It's actually a very common design system for modern skyscrapers when you want to put less supports into the exterior walls. In our case to go for that classic windows instead of walls look, in their case they appear to be doing it in addition to wall supports, probably because they have to build in such a way to account for battle damage. On Earth that's usually hidden behind other walls so you don't see it as just one massive pillar, but we're obsessed with uniqueness.

The Communications room also must be at the top, perhaps a floor down at most. It lacks the central support pillar of the lower levels, and the room is entirely open with no interior support beams, plus the windows ringing the room instead of walls. This means that this room cannot support very much weight above it. This is the way you'd design a top floor. You can possibly put one more floor on top of it, but a massive clocktower thing like Ozpin's office would be in serious danger of pancaking this room if it was underneath it.

While you raise some interesting pints and I am no architect, given Remnant construction and possibly a lack of research on RT's side could the communication room just be above the pylons but not the top floor?

Also keep in mind Pyrrha went into Ozpin's office, went down the elevator in the same building, contained within was Amber. Later Ozpin was in his office and watching things proceed, called Pyrrha inside and later tole her the tower cannot fall, and there was nos discernible change in location as far as I am aware.

Also I don't think there are any other giant towers in Beacon.

RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

Good Civ Inspector

Text Wall

Semi Genre-Savvy Overlord

Text Wall

Secretly a Cat

How far will we go if it means lighting the way?

Hello there

How far will we go if it means lighting the way?