RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
 
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Huntsmen and Huntresses, students, granted, were able to create a zone of denial to the Grimm during the Breach, but it took the army to fully secure the area (and Glynda to seal the breach itself).

The Grimm are like water. The Huntsmen and Huntresses can part the waters, but it flows in after they pass. It's not enough to clear an area, but you have to make sure that it stays cleared.

Plus most Grimm are mook tier, and having a Huntsman or Huntress have to deal with the mooks is a waste of manpower and massive combat asset. In order for Huntsmen and Huntresses to be effective at area clearing, they need an army backing them up so that they can focus on on where they're really needed.
I'm not sure I agree with that, Atlas mostly just seemed to dump robots into the area to shoot at Grim while shooting at them from air ships, there didn't seem to be much effort made in establishing a perimeter or anything like that. I mean, if Beacon had sent a few more teams to fill up each street chances are those teams would have easily contained the Grim until Glynda sealed up the choke point.

As I said, I agree that soldiers would be useful for ensuring an area stays cleared, I'm just not sure they are 100% necessary.

I think that depends on the particular situation but I see where you're coming from.
 
No you are wrong.
Recall most of the populace has already been evaced out. All we have now are the stragglers, Atlas flesh and blood, Students, and Huntsmen and Huntress in vale which since this was a fighting multi-national tournament is NOT going to be a small number.
Evacced? Evacced where? To the city under siege? To the school under attack? Ironwood was talking about evacuating people to the city after they've secured it with his remaining forces.
This is the entire kingdom of Vale. And it's flooded with Grimm. There's nowhere to evacuate to. It's stand and fight or die.

The evacuation you're thinking of is the evac from the stadium. Which was under direct threat of crashing out of the sky by Grimm attack.

Also the perimeter has been BREACHED not destroyed you close the breach you stop new grim bar dragon based from getting in recall Vale has NATURAL defenses against grim its why the city was built there in the first place. The perimeter can be closed and easily at that send a team like Sun and co to the breach with their goal to HOLD not defeat hold.
Currently they dont need to clear out all the grim which is another flaw they need to close the breach and keep a safe zone once those 2 are handled they can clear out the grim left in the city at their lesiure.
You've got flying Grimm swarming the city. Incredulity was expressed at their presence, and it was implied that the defenses that was supposed to keep them out got overrun.
We even see what little ground perimeter they had get overrun with Grimm invading overland.
You think that this is a leak that has flooded the city, but it is more like this:
There simply aren't enough Huntsmen and Huntresses to cover everywhere, and while you could feasibly group them up into a deathball and systematically sweep the city, they've got uh, bigger problems they need to deal with, which will leave everything else unattended.

So personally I hope enough of Ironwood's soldiers survived getting shot at by their own armor support to assist, or else the task before the survivors becomes less "save Vale" and more "how many people can we save before we abandon the kingdom?"

Maybe the local gangsters are going to lend a hand? Junior doesn't seem like he's aligned with the big bads, at any rate.

Currently the infrastructure hasnt been damaged much the buildings are still standing and the city isnt ablaze. Yes there is damage but not decades worth of damage at most a year or 2.
Probably, although the loss of life is going to set them back massively, not just in civilian casualties, but in crippled military capacity.
Maybe I'm just being a cynic, but I really can't see them coming back from a disaster on this scale. I'm sure that Vale's outlying communities like Patch are going to survive, since they seem to be able to live on an island with Grimm on it, but....

Actually now that I think about it, it's more an issue of people surviving to operate the infrastructure, in this case. Glynda is HAXOP and puts contractors out of business.

Still, there's no way that the death toll isn't going to be staggering. The Grimm are killing people. The Atlas robots are killing people. The city isn't safe, Beacon isn't safe. Until that safe zone is established, the death toll is just going to keep climbing and climbing.

Right now there are three priority targets that are going to require professional attention. The Goliaths, the Dragon, and Cinder. And given that the cast is slowly being preoccupied and incapacitated, I don't think there are enough characters to go around.

RWBY is already down to half-strength.
Ironwood is going to be busy with his ship.
Qrow and Glynda are busy establishing a safe zone.
Ozpin is occupied with Cinder, and might not be able to handle her alone.
So, the remaining forces to deal with the Dragon and incoming Goliaths are... students.
Yay.

I predict Ironwood is going to reestablish partial control over his robots, allowing them to handle at least one of these threats so that name characters can come in and at least "save" Vale and Beacon from total utter annihilation.

Although I am getting death flags for the CCT.

I'm not sure I agree with that, Atlas mostly just seemed to dump robots into the area to shoot at Grim while shooting at them from air ships, there didn't seem to be much effort made in establishing a perimeter or anything like that. I mean, if Beacon had sent a few more teams to fill up each street chances are those teams would have easily contained the Grim until Glynda sealed up the choke point.

As I said, I agree that soldiers would be useful for ensuring an area stays cleared, I'm just not sure they are 100% necessary.

I think that depends on the particular situation but I see where you're coming from.
Not 100% necessary, sure, but at this point, they're needed.
Beacon, the only possible source of assistance in the area, is being swarmed by White Fang and Grimm. It's taking all they've got just to hold it.
Ironwood seems to think that with his remaining flesh and blood forces, saving the city isn't possible. Just a safe zone, and they need to abandon Beacon for the moment.
Which is probably why he wants to take control of his robots again. So long as he can do that, the situation improves from "Doomsday" to "A Really Bad Day".
 
The evacuation you're thinking of is the evac from the stadium. Which was under direct threat of crashing out of the sky by Grimm attack.
Oh yeah, the stadium... wanna bet the dragon and or Cinder shoot it down?

Maybe the local gangsters are going to lend a hand? Junior doesn't seem like he's aligned with the big bads, at any rate.
That would be cool, though apparently all crime in Vale stopped after Roman got caught, which kind of adds to my theory he was a big and powerful enough figure to be the closest thing Vale had to a king-pin before this, though maybe the White Fang or Cinder and the others bullied them into being quiet.

Until that safe zone is established, the death toll is just going to keep climbing and climbing.
Just like that Ursa we saw climbing up an apartment wall, seriously as adorable as those Grim are they got a lot scarier on that alone.

Not 100% necessary, sure, but at this point, they're needed.
Beacon, the only possible source of assistance in the area, is being swarmed by White Fang and Grimm. It's taking all they've got just to hold it.
Ironwood seems to think that with his remaining flesh and blood forces, saving the city isn't possible. Just a safe zone, and they need to abandon Beacon for the moment.
Which is probably why he wants to take control of his robots again. So long as he can do that, the situation improves from "Doomsday" to "A Really Bad Day".
Oh they'd definitely be useful, no denying that.
Ironwood did tell Glynda to get the local Hunters to help out so presumably there might be other fighter available who are just tied up elsewhere and some may still be incoming from Atlas's initial call.


You know we're probably never going to see that smile again. :(
:( We... We might, who knows, maybe Yang will make a terrible joke that brings a smile to her sisters face... I can dream they'll cope... I can dream.
 
Oh yeah, the stadium... wanna bet the dragon and or Cinder shoot it down?
I would think so, if Cinder manages to broadcast (if she hasn't already) the footage of Atlas's robots running amok and then destroys the CCT, then taking down the stadium would be very much symbolic of her victory. The stadium is a symbol of the kingdom's unity, destroying it while she destroys their actual unity...

That would be cool, though apparently all crime in Vale stopped after Roman got caught, which kind of adds to my theory he was a big and powerful enough figure to be the closest thing Vale had to a king-pin before this, though maybe the White Fang or Cinder and the others bullied them into being quiet.
I'm thinking that they didn't want any unwelcome attention. Should they have caused any trouble, local law enforcement would have come down on them hard, given that it was a local crime lord who caused the Breach.

Just like that Ursa we saw climbing up an apartment wall, seriously as adorable as those Grim are they got a lot scarier on that alone.
Yeah.
Vale doesn't seem to have a contingency for Grimm within city limits, huh?
Or maybe they do and it just went to shit.
I mean, they do have a siren after all. I'd like to think that serves a purpose other than a "You Can Panic Now" alarm.

Oh they'd definitely be useful, no denying that.
Ironwood did tell Glynda to get the local Hunters to help out so presumably there might be other fighter available who are just tied up elsewhere and some may still be incoming from Atlas's initial call.
What if when the reinforcements arrive, they start fighting Ironwood's remaining forces, thinking that he's a traitor?

:( We... We might, who knows, maybe Yang will make a terrible joke that brings a smile to her sisters face... I can dream they'll cope... I can dream.
The innocence will be gone, though...
Poor Ruby.
 
One thing I want for season 4, Blake dropping the bow, it'd be nice if she stopped hiding her ears, though I get why she does it and what it symbolises so maybe its not the best idea.

I would think so, if Cinder manages to broadcast (if she hasn't already) the footage of Atlas's robots running amok and then destroys the CCT, then taking down the stadium would be very much symbolic of her victory. The stadium is a symbol of the kingdom's unity, destroying it while she destroys their actual unity...
That would definitely be deeply upsetting for the other kingdoms. Though I could also maybe see it being hijacked to crash on the dragon as others have suggested.

I'm thinking that they didn't want any unwelcome attention. Should they have caused any trouble, local law enforcement would have come down on them hard, given that it was a local crime lord who caused the Breach.
Insightful point there I hadn't considered that option but it makes a lot of sense. Poor Roman, dragged into this madness that will forever mark him as a mad man rather than a selfish criminal.

Yeah.
Vale doesn't seem to have a contingency for Grimm within city limits, huh?
Or maybe they do and it just went to shit.
I mean, they do have a siren after all. I'd like to think that serves a purpose other than a "You Can Panic Now" alarm.
I think its a case of "no plan survives contact with the enemy" just on the heroes side, that is to say they have plans but so much was allayed against them and it all went down hill so fast that whatever they planned went to hell fast. Though we aren't seeing many people running or dead so maybe they found their ways into shelters?

What if when the reinforcements arrive, they start fighting Ironwood's remaining forces, thinking that he's a traitor?
That would be hilariously tragic. Plus Qrow mentioned he saw some Hunters in the bar hired for some 'dirty business' so who knows maybe they'll be on Cinder's pay role?

Though thinking on it, what if her virus extended to other Atlas robots, like the one's in Atlas?

The innocence will be gone, though...
Poor Ruby.
Poor RWBY really, only Weiss so far is coming out of this well, only as broken as she went in rather than more-so and there's still an episode left for everything to go to hell.
 
One thing I want for season 4, Blake dropping the bow, it'd be nice if she stopped hiding her ears, though I get why she does it and what it symbolises so maybe its not the best idea.
Yeah. I'd like to see her drop it too, but given what the White Fang just did... not the best idea.

That would definitely be deeply upsetting for the other kingdoms. Though I could also maybe see it being hijacked to crash on the dragon as others have suggested.
That would be interesting. A symbolic "Face the power of our combined might" moment.

Insightful point there I hadn't considered that option but it makes a lot of sense. Poor Roman, dragged into this madness that will forever mark him as a mad man rather than a selfish criminal.
Hey, as long as he survived, nothing else mattered to him.

I think its a case of "no plan survives contact with the enemy" just on the heroes side, that is to say they have plans but so much was allayed against them and it all went down hill so fast that whatever they planned went to hell fast. Though we aren't seeing many people running or dead so maybe they found their ways into shelters?
Maybe. I hope there are security shelters, and that Vale's defenses weren't just a big show of Security Theater.
Or maybe they got eaten.

That would be hilariously tragic. Plus Qrow mentioned he saw some Hunters in the bar hired for some 'dirty business' so who knows maybe they'll be on Cinder's pay role?

Though thinking on it, what if her virus extended to other Atlas robots, like the one's in Atlas?
....
Probably not. She uploaded a virus to the CCT which allowed her to take control of the tournament's matchmaking, and even allowed her access to military files, but apparently the robots are on separate isolated local networks, otherwise Roman and Neo wouldn't have needed to seize the command ship.

Poor RWBY really, only Weiss so far is coming out of this well, only as broken as she went in rather than more-so and there's still an episode left for everything to go to hell.
I'd love it (plot-wise, this would be tragic to the extreme) if they're evacuating Vale, and Ruby takes one moment to look back at the Grimm-swarmed city... only to have an enraged Neo de-stealth behind her and run her through.
Then they leave Ruby's survival up to our imaginations for a year.
 
Most of that is wrong
The Kingdom isnt under siege the CITY is. I understand the confusion but its ONE city not the whole kingdom.
Vale (kingdom)
Vale (city)
Notice the difference? Vale where beacon is located is the capital but it is not the Kingdom of vale.

First the bigger problem? Yeah what I have been saying is the first order of business please dont act like I havent. The dragon comes first has been my key point this whole time so long as its up the city cant be saved.
I have been saying the dragons needs to die HARD and fast from the start.
That thing is literally the key point of my whole argument it NEEDS to be killed before ANYTHING can be done.
After its killed the "Deathball" is actually easy because it gathers around the people then moves to Beacon the safest place in the city as far as they are aware.
Also counter point the Goliaths are smart. They are smart enough not to stick around once the dragon is dead. Meaning once the dragon is killed which is AGAIN the FIRST order of business they are going to realize they have a high chance of dying and get out.

Yes the loss of life is HUGE no question but it isnt destroying infrastructure. and recovering from this is VERY possible look at real world disasters where not a single building is left standing and its rebuilt years later.
The issue here is the grim are not disasters like you are treating them as ie tornado or a flood. Grim target PEOPLE not buildings. A Prime and good example of this is the old city from season 2 notice all the buildings are still standing? That is because the grim dont care about that sort of thing. Unlike a flood which destroys everything in its way or damages it to the point a building needs to be demolished because it just cant be saved the grim dont do that.
Damage is going to be aimed at people buildings will get damaged but not as the purpose or anything just things getting in the way. So barring the dragon Golaiths and fires most of the damage is going to be widespread but not massive. building toppled more like windows broken and insides trashed.

The targets right now are
1. Dragon seriously the dragon PERIOD that thing is spawning grim and calling them in so it pretty much makes things priority
2. Goliaths only if they stick around if the Goliaths back out after dragon let them go
3. Cinder and only because she is probably going to destroy the CCT if she runs letting her go in this situation is the best course of action though if a free lethal shot opens up TAKE IT.

I also dont think the damage is bad as you think it is.
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net...1_00093.png/revision/latest?cb=20160207160723
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net...0_00155.png/revision/latest?cb=20160131160407
I tried to find better wide shots but really couldnt there is no fires going and outside of that one leaning building in qrows its only the streets damaged.
My personal theory is this MOST of the grim are at the Vital festival which was the largest concentrated source of negative energy which we are told is like catnip to grim. So it makes sense that is the highest amount of them.
We know whitefang are dropping in grim into the school itself and as we saw its not a safe drop for their bulls.
So my current theory is RIGHT NOW the damage is mostly being contained to Vital and Beacon with some slop over to the city itself.
Aerial shots dont show glows coming from the city so its not on fire or at least noticably so. The only glow is after ruby kicks Roman!griffin through the deck and that is coming from the ship.
There should be some fires from the crashed ships but they dont seem to be spreading.

Also another key factor is Ironwood he is not acting like its lost and since RT has made it clear Ironwood is a smart man chances are good the city can still be saved mind you he isnt aware of cinder so....yeah.

Outside of the dragon and Cinder I havent seen anything that makes me think death wail for Vale and I have looked at a LOT of ancient battles in fact I did a paper on Troy at Hislarlik.
 
The Kingdom isnt under siege the CITY is. I understand the confusion but its ONE city not the whole kingdom.
Vale (kingdom)
Vale (city)
Notice the difference? Vale where beacon is located is the capital but it is not the Kingdom of vale.
...
Dude, Vale the kingdom is a megacity+Patch. The only thing that isn't under attack at this point is Patch.

First the bigger problem? Yeah what I have been saying is the first order of business please dont act like I havent. The dragon comes first has been my key point this whole time so long as its up the city cant be saved.
I have been saying the dragons needs to die HARD and fast from the start.
That thing is literally the key point of my whole argument it NEEDS to be killed before ANYTHING can be done.
After its killed the "Deathball" is actually easy because it gathers around the people then moves to Beacon the safest place in the city as far as they are aware.
Also counter point the Goliaths are smart. They are smart enough not to stick around once the dragon is dead. Meaning once the dragon is killed which is AGAIN the FIRST order of business they are going to realize they have a high chance of dying and get out.
And as I said, most everyone who could deal with it are kind of tied up right now. Once they have more forces at their disposal, they can take the Huntsmen and Huntresses off of damage control. As for now, they need to fight mooks, because if they try and deal with the Dragon, and ignore the regular Grimm, there won't be a kingdom left to enjoy their victory.

Yes the loss of life is HUGE no question but it isnt destroying infrastructure. and recovering from this is VERY possible look at real world disasters where not a single building is left standing and its rebuilt years later.
The issue here is the grim are not disasters like you are treating them as ie tornado or a flood. Grim target PEOPLE not buildings. A Prime and good example of this is the old city from season 2 notice all the buildings are still standing? That is because the grim dont care about that sort of thing. Unlike a flood which destroys everything in its way or damages it to the point a building needs to be demolished because it just cant be saved the grim dont do that.
Damage is going to be aimed at people buildings will get damaged but not as the purpose or anything just things getting in the way. So barring the dragon Golaiths and fires most of the damage is going to be widespread but not massive. building toppled more like windows broken and insides trashed.
A dead populace is just as devastating as infrastructure damage, honestly.
If not enough people are alive to operate that infrastructure well in the aftermath, Vale won't be able to sustain itself.

The targets right now are
1. Dragon seriously the dragon PERIOD that thing is spawning grim and calling them in so it pretty much makes things priority
2. Goliaths only if they stick around if the Goliaths back out after dragon let them go
3. Cinder and only because she is probably going to destroy the CCT if she runs letting her go in this situation is the best course of action though if a free lethal shot opens up TAKE IT.
Except unless the Dragon or Goliath choose to target the Hunters and Huntresses rather than the hapless civilians (which I think they might because plot and fight scenes), there's nobody free to deal with 1 and 2. Cinder is already being addressed, but even then it looks like Ozpin needs backup.

I also dont think the damage is bad as you think it is.
http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net...1_00093.png/revision/latest?cb=20160207160723
http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net...0_00155.png/revision/latest?cb=20160131160407
I tried to find better wide shots but really couldnt there is no fires going and outside of that one leaning building in qrows its only the streets damaged.
My personal theory is this MOST of the grim are at the Vital festival which was the largest concentrated source of negative energy which we are told is like catnip to grim. So it makes sense that is the highest amount of them.
We know whitefang are dropping in grim into the school itself and as we saw its not a safe drop for their bulls.
So my current theory is RIGHT NOW the damage is mostly being contained to Vital and Beacon with some slop over to the city itself.
Aerial shots dont show glows coming from the city so its not on fire or at least noticably so. The only glow is after ruby kicks Roman!griffin through the deck and that is coming from the ship.
There should be some fires from the crashed ships but they dont seem to be spreading.
You mean the Vytal Festival. The celebration that is being held explicitly in the city and Beacon school grounds?

There's a small fair ground near Beacon apparently, but they're out in the open (and unarmed), and will be overrun soon.
And if they're attracted to negative emotion, the city is going to be the biggest source, since the arena is now empty, and pretty much the entire nation was watching the tournament.

I wouldn't be surprised if the White Fang was dropping Grimm into the city as well, since the Breach was originally supposed to coincide with this, and they're probably compensating (although the Dragon renders that moot. Grimm airdrops!). After all, Cinder's secondary objective seems to be the complete annihilation of of Vale as a viable nation, and so far she's done a good job of decapitating their leadership and sowing chaos among the population.

Also another key factor is Ironwood he is not acting like its lost and since RT has made it clear Ironwood is a smart man chances are good the city can still be saved mind you he isnt aware of cinder so....yeah.
He's not acting like he's lost because there are still people to save. He's not going to go "Welp they're going to die anyways" and leave just like that. He's going to save as many people as he can, and seems hopeful about regaining control of his robots. So yeah, he probably thinks he can salvage the situation, and he might have been able to before...
Cinder.

Welp, let's hope Ozpin can handle her.

Outside of the dragon and Cinder I havent seen anything that makes me think death wail for Vale and I have looked at a LOT of ancient battles in fact I did a paper on Troy at Hislarlik.
Pretty sure that Troy really has no bearing here, man. Remnant isn't exactly an ancient setting. They have more in common with modern day than Ancient Greece. Wanna explain what parallels you're drawing?

This last episode, everything from the character's actions to the soundtrack told us that everything hinged on that moment, and it swung clear in Cinder's direction.

Vale may not be doomed quite yet, but saving it requires an application of force that, unless Ironwood regains control of his robots, is simply not available. Everybody is too wrapped up dealing with issues that demand their immediate attention, and no one is free to tackle the priority threats.

If Ironwood takes control of his robots, then yes, I agree, the city can be saved. Without them, though.... it's still doable, but requires that the named characters pretty much abandoning some priority threat. Like the Grimm attacking the populace.

I am not a nice writer.
 
Yeah. I'd like to see her drop it too, but given what the White Fang just did... not the best idea.
Indeed, I'm hoping we get to see more examples of anti-Faunus sentiment due to the White Fang and pre-existing stuff, but yeah chances are,not a safe time to be a Faunus.

That would be interesting. A symbolic "Face the power of our combined might" moment.
I hadn't even considered that but yeah it works on a very thematic level... Hmm, you know it occurs to me, have we considered that this season might end on a cliffhanger? Red VS Blue has done so in the past, for all we know it could look like they've defeated the dragon, all looks good, then they hear a roar or somehting and Cinder starts pulling out new Magical BS unseen up to this point even by Ozpin and then it just cuts off with everyone looking shocked. Or scattered, scattered could work too.

Hey, as long as he survived, nothing else mattered to him.
But look how that turned put :( A victim to melodramatic monologues, when will they cure this horrible disease! What you said is still true though, but I am sad to see my favourite villains go, maybe Neo will live, perhaps Roman will but I am nervous. Though the fact Roman was referenced as having a Semblance we haven't seen yet helps calm me a little, we might get a flashback as well I guess.

Maybe. I hope there are security shelters, and that Vale's defenses weren't just a big show of Security Theater.
Or maybe they got eaten.
I doubt Vale would be able to survive if its security was just a theatre.

That is possible, but given the population and the Hunters and robots I'm not sure the Grim have the time.

....
Probably not. She uploaded a virus to the CCT which allowed her to take control of the tournament's matchmaking, and even allowed her access to military files, but apparently the robots are on separate isolated local networks, otherwise Roman and Neo wouldn't have needed to seize the command ship.
I think she got the match ups via Ironwood's scroll, though yeah I agree its unlikely her virus extended that far.

I'd love it (plot-wise, this would be tragic to the extreme) if they're evacuating Vale, and Ruby takes one moment to look back at the Grimm-swarmed city... only to have an enraged Neo de-stealth behind her and run her through.
Then they leave Ruby's survival up to our imaginations for a year.
You're a cruel persons ;) I totally get where you're coming from though, granted Ruby's already lost Penny.... Winter may die, like she arrives as the cavalry but dies or something. Still I wouldn't be super worried about Ruby, well OK a little, but mostly I'd assume she'd be fine given the shows name.
...
Dude, Vale the kingdom is a megacity+Patch. The only thing that isn't under attack at this point is Patch.
And we don't even know if that'snot the case.
 
I hadn't even considered that but yeah it works on a very thematic level... Hmm, you know it occurs to me, have we considered that this season might end on a cliffhanger? Red VS Blue has done so in the past, for all we know it could look like they've defeated the dragon, all looks good, then they hear a roar or somehting and Cinder starts pulling out new Magical BS unseen up to this point even by Ozpin and then it just cuts off with everyone looking shocked. Or scattered, scattered could work too.
A cliffhanger would be so evil...
They're gonna do it, aren't they?

And we don't even know if that'snot the case.
Patch already has Grimm on it.
So I guess that the Grimm might be acting up, but ironically, due to the ever-constant Grimm presence, Patch might actually be better prepared to deal with this.
 
Fuck it. Just have the dragon grimm crush everyone and have the next 17+ minutes be the entire globe being overrun with Grimm as people desperately try to hold back the tide.

Done.
 
No its not Vale the kingdom is much bigger just taking a look at the map would show you that. We know there is also small villages both from Qrow's short skirt story and Amber's flashback. If it was all a megacity those 2 points wouldnt make a lick of sense. And no Qrow couldnt be somewhere else he is a teacher at Signal so he cant roam that far from it. Also the village Ren wanted to Sheriff from season 2 that is in the Kingdom of Vale at least. Vale the city is huge yes but it is not the kingdom just the fact Patch is on an island to the NORTH of vale would tell you that.

No we dont know that actually that most forces are tied up we just know where the named characters are. And RT is a big believer of not showing till needed look at most of the cast as proof most didnt even get a name drop or hint before they showed up.

Yes if not enough populace is left key word IF. As far as we know that isnt the case we KNOW people are being evaced out we were in fact SHOWN it. So assuming the populace is in large masses being killed when that is EXPRESSLY being shown so far as not the case is not likely. So far we know there should be deaths but all we have been shown is people running and safely getting away so far no mass deaths.

Yes the NAMED characters are tied up but who just got freeded up? MOST of them. Neptune, velvet, and so just got finished fighting a mech and ruby is also free. They WERE tied up but arent outside of Blake Yang Qrow Glynda ozpin and Ironwood. Key words there WERE.

Uhmmm No and yes. Vytal is held on a floating land mass you know the one we got shown a LOT? Its not actually on Vale ground which is why its only flying grim there.
Fair grounds is true but the rest iffy. While the Grim will move towards the city no doubt they will be coming FROM the fair grounds which makes them easier to handle.
We arent shown the White Fang airdropping grim into the city only Beacon. Most likely they couldnt not enough resources. I would also assume they would drop into the city but we are shown the beacon but not the city. So currently we have to take in the idea they didnt or most likely couldnt after all breach was suppose to come at the same time and it didnt.

No you missed my point Ironwood is a MILITARY leader funny thing about military tactical withdrawal aka orderly running away. He doesnt suggest that which if things were ANYWHERE as bad as you claim that would be the order of the day but he doesnt even suggest that.

You dont understand troy? A city besieged by years and ultimately over run by a ruse? and you dont draw the obvious parallels? YEAH. Let me be clear then Cinder and co possing as students was the Trojan Horse the Vytal festival was the wine. And troy was just ONE example I have plenty others. My point which you missed is that I have looked at a LOT of cities that have been facing situations just as bad and have come out on top. In fact in comparsion the grim are easier to deal with. Sure they are literal balls of death but they dont Loot, Pillage, Rape, destroy, and salt the earth just because all they do is kill you. Also tactics really havent changed much the tools you can employ have but core tactics that are staples of all modern military have been around for a LONG time IE withdrawals, sneak attacks, Sieges, scouting, and the list goes on while the format HAS changed the basic idea has not.

The song A doesnt have to be an exact match and B its already happened Yang's arm? That is literally going to make things never the same. The city doesnt have to be destroyed for it to come true.
We dont know what forces are and are not in play outside of basic generalities.
We only know there are a LOT of grim and that includes Goliaths and Dragon we dont know the number of Hunters, Soldiers and so on are avabile and being used.
For all we know the rest of the Kingdom of Vales forces are right now getting ready to come in and save everyone we at least know of Patch and Signal there is more then likely others and we just havent been told about them yet because there is no point.

We are going to have to agree to disagree.
 
A cliffhanger would be so evil...
They're gonna do it, aren't they?
At this point, it wouldn't shock me.

You know another thing I might expect in season 4, Yang disappearing for awhile, like if she gets a new arm attached but can't get it working right due to some people struggling with that more than others or it straining under her particular "fire" Aura/Semblance and her needing to take time to master it while the rest of the cast go off for plot stuff, then she makes a badass sudden return later in the season to save Ruby, Blake, Weiss, someone.

Patch already has Grimm on it.
So I guess that the Grimm might be acting up, but ironically, due to the ever-constant Grimm presence, Patch might actually be better prepared to deal with this.
Yeah I was sort of thinking they might be acting up, or that aerial Grim might try and swing by there over Vale. Though they might be better prepared, though at the same time that might not mean much depending on how frequent the Grim threat/presence is.
 
At this point, it wouldn't shock me.

You know another thing I might expect in season 4, Yang disappearing for awhile, like if she gets a new arm attached but can't get it working right due to some people struggling with that more than others or it straining under her particular "fire" Aura/Semblance and her needing to take time to master it while the rest of the cast go off for plot stuff, then she makes a badass sudden return later in the season to save Ruby, Blake, Weiss, someone.
Sounds thematically appropriate.

Yeah I was sort of thinking they might be acting up, or that aerial Grim might try and swing by there over Vale. Though they might be better prepared, though at the same time that might not mean much depending on how frequent the Grim threat/presence is.
I was thinking that Patch has patrolling teams of Huntsmen and Huntresses to protect the civilian populace. At the very least, their police have to be on guard against Grimm attacks 24/7, since the Grimm apparently roam unchecked in uninhabited sections of Patch.

Compared to the streets of Vale, where the police are used to dealing with criminals, not Grimm.

But yeah, Patch security probably isn't equipped to deal with swarms of Griffon.
 
Anyone else amused at the fact the grim dragon isnt a dragon?

For those who dont know a Wyvern said Wy-vern is a small dragon with wings a bared tail and legs. Sometimes it has a fish tail but that isnt common.
A wyvern
Grim dragon
Dragon
Dragons, barring the ones like serpents, have two sets of legs

So the "Grim Dragon" is totally a Wyvern

EDIT
For those confused a Wyvern is to a dragon like a chihuahua is to a Huskie no where even close to being the same level of anything.
 
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Anyone else amused at the fact the grim dragon isnt a dragon?

For those who dont know a Wyvern said Wy-vern is a small dragon with wings a bared tail and legs. Sometimes it has a fish tail but that isnt common.
A wyvern
Grim dragon
Dragon
Dragons, barring the ones like serpents, have two sets of legs

So the "Grim Dragon" is totally a Wyvern
Makes you wonder what a real Grimm Dragon would look like.
 
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