RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

kokuenDG · May 1, 2022

so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

I think that's largely because the reverse is true of most other places to discuss RWBY. Discussing the show's flaws has historically not been an easy thing to do unless you were on tumblr or 4chan (and offshoot threads on SB/SV). One of which usually involves "this whole thing smacks of gender" and the other involves digressions into which girl has the most feminine penis.

This season at least, the fandom seems a little more open to critical discussion, but that hasn't always been the case in my experience.

LilyWitch · Jan 5, 2018

hellgodsrus said:
It won't. Half the people in the thread are the ones who stormed out after V3 in outrage over what had happened to 'their show'. And Leila's stopped really doing proper critique to instead pander to her audience - which is understandable, given that she's now getting paid for this, but is somewhat disappointing.

I'm really looking forward to her getting there. The ending of V3 and going into V4 & 5 basicly addresses all of Leila's complaints about the early seasons. Its going to be amasing seeing thesevenwielder eat crow.

Again, its not that the new RWBY doesn't have problems. However, they are different ones then the early seasons.

Leila Hann · Jan 5, 2018

hellgodsrus said:
It won't. Half the people in the thread are the ones who stormed out after V3 in outrage over what had happened to 'their show'. And Leila's stopped really doing proper critique to instead pander to her audience - which is understandable, given that she's now getting paid for this, but is somewhat disappointing.

So, someone just linked me to this post. I'm going to carefully avoid looking at any of the ones above it, because spoilers, but I AM going to reply, because this kind of spurious bullshit is not something I am willing to stand for.

I am not pandering to my audience. I said in the OP of my thread that I would take the show on its own merits and judge it accordingly, and THAT IS WHAT I HAVE BEEN DOING. If I've been getting more sarcastic over time, it is because the show has been pissing me off more and more, not in order to placate my readers. There most DEFINITELY wasn't any quantum shift in how I talked about the show following the launch of my patreon; in fact, my snarkiest and most negative post (the season one review) was before I even considered charging.

I also am kind of amazed that you would decide to accuse me of this the day after I gave my first positive review to a RWBY episode ("Burning the Candle").

To me, it really seems like you're just butthurt that someone is dissecting a show that you like, and are looking for or making up reasons to make my critique seem illegitimate. Which I wouldn't normally care about, but the fact that I am - as you yourself pointed out - getting paid for these reviews now means that you are accusing me of cheating my patrons by providing something other than the honest reactions that I promised. That's a pretty fucking serious accusation.

Oh, and fucking LOL at the part about how my readers are all just salty Volume 1-2 fans, when so far my thread has consisted entirely of critiquing those two seasons.

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

Yikes.

StellarSeeker · Jan 5, 2018

Barnaby said:
Yikes.

Y'see what I mean by saying shit gets toxic?

Because shit gets toxic.

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

StellarSeeker said:
Y'see what I mean by saying shit gets toxic?

Because shit gets toxic.

I don't know if we're talking about the same thing, though.

StellarSeeker · Jan 5, 2018

Barnaby said:
I don't know if we're talking about the same thing, though.

I said that it's hard to have honest critique of RWBY, but I didn't say that it was because of people who hate it too much or love it too much.

So either way, my point is made.

hellgodsrus · Jan 5, 2018

Deleted my above posts because I was being a salty dickhead and that doesn't help anyone. I apologise to all and sundry for being a bad reflection on fans everywhere and will unwatch the thread so as not to bother anyone again.

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

I get you, @StellarSeeker

Back to reasonable RWBY discussion on 4chan, I guess. Also who do you think is more into vore Yang or Weiss asking for a friend

/s

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

ColdGoldLazarus said:
Been reading through Leila's "Let's Watch RWBY" thread.

With all the stuff about Pyrrha being Jaune's titninja that was pointed out there, suddenly her role in Volume 3's ending becomes awful beyond measure. Dammit, the show had to go jump the shark within a season of growing the beard. The ending bugged me upon initial release, too, but now I suddenly understand why. May as well have stuffed her in an actual fridge for all the difference it made. Which sucks, because titninja-ing aside, she was one of my favorite characters in theory - famous but socially isolated badass champion who winds up getting involved in the whole Maidens issue.

I should probably get around to watching Volume 5, but that thread has lowkey ruined the show for me. How good would people say it is? Still Volume 3/4 level material, or more about what I've been dreading it to be based on hearsay?

The thread is a bit of an echo chamber (Which, to be clear, is the fault of the readers more than the Reviewer)

That said, I actually started liking Pyrrha more after the thread, since I had to pay more attention to her in volume one in order to provide a counterpoint to the Titninja stuff

The conclusion I came to was that the majority of Pyrrha's actions in that volume make perfect sense if you understand that Pyrrha is an altruist

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

Well, I'd say self-sacrificing might be more descriptive than altruistic, but then again the Pyrrha I like so much might only exist in my head and not actually in the show proper.

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

Barnaby said:
Well, I'd say self-sacrificing might be more descriptive than altruistic, but then again the Pyrrha I like so much might only exist in my head and not actually in the show proper.

I think Altruism fits better as a primary trait, though Self-Sacrificing definitely describes her

Uncle · Jan 5, 2018

I think we all know Prryha saw in Jaune.

His big...aura.

In all seriousness, I can't for the life of me understand what Prryha sees in Jaune. I mean, the guy faked his transcripts to get into Beacon and didn't understand basic terms like aura.

I might be more forgiving if he had a more likeable personality but he doesn't.

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

Jcogginsa said:
I think Altruism fits better as a primary trait, though Self-Sacrificing definitely describes her

The issue I have with altruism as a defining trait is that it doesn't imply character flaws and weaknesses as effectively.

When I talk about my favorite characters on the show, it often comes across as me criticising them, but in those cases I'm really not.

Roman really was one of the best characters because he was such a loser.

Cinder honestly was more engaging when she was injured and didn't talk.

Yang's actually coolest when she's being a self-hating, self-destructive psychopath.

And for my money, Pyrrha was interesting because of all her dumb decisions to put other people before herself, not in spite of them.

Tiresias · Jan 5, 2018

Uncle said:
In all seriousness, I can't for the life of me understand what Prryha sees in Jaune. I mean, the guy faked his transcripts to get into Beacon and didn't understand basic terms like aura.

I might be more forgiving if he had a more likeable personality but he doesn't.

He wasn't intimidated by her reputation, which she liked.

'Course, he was also stalking Weiss. You'd think it would balance out somehow.

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

Barnaby said:
The issue I have with altruism as a defining trait is that it doesn't imply character flaws and weaknesses as effectively.

When I talk about my favorite characters on the show, it often comes across as me criticising them, but in those cases I'm really not.

Roman really was one of the best characters because he was such a loser.

Cinder honestly was more engaging when she was injured and didn't talk.

Yang's actually coolest when she's being a self-hating, self-destructive psychopath.

And for my money, Pyrrha was interesting because of all her dumb decisions to put other people before herself, not in spite of them.

Pyrrha's altruism, while not in an of itself a flaw, does become one in excess.

Helping people gives her a genuine sense of accomplishment, but she takes it to far, to the point where she sacrifices herself when she doesn't necessarily need to

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

Tiresias said:
He wasn't intimidated by her reputation, which she liked.

'Course, he was also stalking Weiss. You'd think it would balance out somehow.

The whole "risks life to help others in the face of all adversity" thing is probably fairly appealing

Emma · Jan 5, 2018

Uncle said:
In all seriousness, I can't for the life of me understand what Prryha sees in Jaune. I mean, the guy faked his transcripts to get into Beacon and didn't understand basic terms like aura.

Most people will say he saw her for who she truly was, but my headcanon is that fixing people lets her ignore her own insecurities- it lets her be "good" in a way some adult told her was the proper way to be "good".

Basically, Jaune is Bojack and Pyrrha is Princess Carolyn.

Probably not the intended reading of their characters, I admit, but it's my takeaway.

Zam · Jan 5, 2018

Barnaby said:
I think that's largely because the reverse is true of most other places to discuss RWBY. Discussing the show's flaws has historically not been an easy thing to do unless you were on tumblr or 4chan (and offshoot threads on SB/SV). One of which usually involves "this whole thing smacks of gender"

I have no idea what "Smacks of gender"means but let me assure you, there is a horrible and large collection of people on tumblr who defend pretty much everything about the show from even the softest critique to the point of doxxing people who critique it.

Lupercal said:
Again, its not that the new RWBY doesn't have problems. However, they are different ones then the early seasons.

I kind of disagree, some of the problems, at least things I found to be problems are the same, though they improved in other areas.

Uncle said:
In all seriousness, I can't for the life of me understand what Prryha sees in Jaune. I mean, the guy faked his transcripts to get into Beacon and didn't understand basic terms like aura.

I might be more forgiving if he had a more likeable personality but he doesn't.

I always found her investment in him weird, he was rude and dismissive when they first met, creeped out Weiss and once he found out she was famous got all excited, while only Weiss really treated Pyrrha differently for her fame.

Barnaby said:
self-destructive psychopath.

When has Yang ever been like this?

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

Zam said:
I always found her investment in him weird, he was rude and dismissive when they first met, creeped out Weiss and once he found out she was famous got all excited, while only Weiss really treated Pyrrha differently for her fame.

In the forest, She helps him because he needs help.

After the forest, She's see that he's generally brave and wants to help people. Then in the climax of Jaunedice, she sees him risk his life to defend someone he has every reason to hate. Those good impressions are likely what endeared her to him

Zam · Jan 5, 2018

Jcogginsa said:
In the forest, She helps him because he needs help.

After the forest, She's see that he's generally brave and wants to help people. Then in the climax of Jaunedice, she sees him risk his life to defend someone he has every reason to hate. Those good impressions are likely what endeared her to him

She showed an avid interest even before that, shown in the locker interactions, and I am unsure how he showed he wanted to help people beyond what is the norm for other Hunters, at best and I feel and her investment in him continued even when he was getting all shouty at her for offering to help him after he revealed he cheated his way into Beacon, putting his and their lives and potential careers at risk.

Yes he defended Cardin which was noble, but her seeming infatuation seemed to start and persist much earlier than any big shows of nobility and weather every negative aspect of his behavior from creeping out Weiss to shouting at her for offering to help him and her own stated interest was tied to him not treating her like she was above other people even though that is seemingly what he did right after finding out about the cereal box and barring Weiss, no one else treated her differently anyway.

That's just my take though.

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

Zam said:
She showed an avid interest even before that, shown in the locker interactions, and I am unsure how he showed he wanted to help people beyond what is the norm for other Hunters, at best and I feel and her investment in him continued even when he was getting all shouty at her for offering to help him after he revealed he cheated his way into Beacon, putting his and their lives and potential careers at risk.

Yes he defended Cardin which was noble, but her seeming infatuation seemed to start and persist much earlier than any big shows of nobility and weather every negative aspect of his behavior from creeping out Weiss to shouting at her for offering to help him and her own stated interest was tied to him not treating her like she was above other people even though that is seemingly what he did right after finding out about the cereal box and barring Weiss, no one else treated her differently anyway.

That's just my take though.

As I recall, she only spoke to him once before the forest, and didn't show much interest in him beyond being polite and generally encouraging.

At what point in the show would you say Pyrrha's infatuation began? Personally, I don't think she was infatuated with him until after the entrance test, and that would mean she saw him fight the Deathstalker, which is pretty brave.

I think Jaune not putting her on a pedestal was a good first impression, but I also think the role it played in her attraction is a bit overblown in the fandom

Zam · Jan 5, 2018

Jcogginsa said:
As I recall, she only spoke to him once before the forest, and didn't show much interest in him beyond being polite and generally encouraging.

At what point in the show would you say Pyrrha's infatuation began? Personally, I don't think she was infatuated with him until after the entrance test, and that would mean she saw him fight the Deathstalker, which is pretty brave.

I think Jaune not putting her on a pedestal was a good first impression, but I also think the role it played in her attraction is a bit overblown in the fandom

I disagree based on how she seemed to want to get his attention in the locker room and was complimenting him and the like.

By that logic everyone one of them was brave, I feel he's not exceptional in that regard, plus I think it started right away given how the writing seemed to flow, but as I said, that's just my take.

As I said, after his initial bout of rudeness he seemed to do exactly that, but Pyrrha is the one who implied he did not and said that someone like him is who she'd like to be at the dance with so (Shrug) I guess that's what people take from it.

Vindictus · Jan 5, 2018

Jcogginsa said:
At what point in the show would you say Pyrrha's infatuation began?

When he negged her in episode 1 obviously

Jcogginsa · Jan 5, 2018

Zam said:
I disagree based on how she seemed to want to get his attention in the locker room and was complimenting him and the like.

The locker room seen where she
1. Gave him a relatively general compliment
2. Pinned him to a wall when Weiss asked for help
3. Apologized for the excessive force in 2

None of that really indicates attraction to me

By that logic everyone one of them was brave, I feel he's not exceptional in that regard, plus I think it started right away given how the writing seemed to flow, but as I said, that's just my take.

Everyone else could fight. She knew Jaune wasn't a very good fighter at that point, but he still never backed down, even when he had a perfect excuse not to fight.

As I said, after his initial bout of rudeness he seemed to do exactly that, but Pyrrha is the one who implied he did not and said that someone like him is who she'd like to be at the dance with so (Shrug) I guess that's what people take from it.

Admittedly, I probably need to rewatch their arc in Vol. 2 sometime

RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

Good Civ Inspector

Actual Real Game Dev!

XENO