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RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

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Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
  • Staff Post
    • so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
    We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

    That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

    So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

    In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
     
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  • Staff Post
    • owls said:
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    Hm, nothing on when they air but if the Weiss trailer airs one week after RTX as previously stated then it likely airs on Saturday 15th of Juli for First members and then possibly on Sunday for free members of the RT site and then one week after that on Youtube and stuff.

    It would make sense if the Blake trailer then aired Saturday on August 18 and then Yang's trailer airs Saturday in September 16. That way there's a roughly equal amount of time between each trailer and the release of the volume. There's no long stretch of nothing to make people frustrated or lose interest but there is enough time between each trailer and the volume to give plenty of time for discussion and speculation to maintain the hype. To drum up some extra interest right before the volume airs they could release a World of Remnant episode each day in the week leading up to the release like they did with Volume 4. I know there's a lot of stuff I would like to know more about, starting with a more detailed look at how Aura works and what it can do.
     
    So it looks like Jaune's probably going to be getting his semblance in volume 5 for convenient exposition?

    If what was said in the panel was true.
     
    VolantRedX said:
    I binged the series like a week or two ago. Really good show. Wish I watched it earlier.
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    On the other hand you started at a really good time, the switch to Maya and Autodesk(?) Pencil really made the animation leap in quality and the voice actors have gotten better and better with each volume. Not to mention that its only one week until the first Trailer for Volume 5 airs and only a few months until the volume itself comes out. :smile:
     
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    Speaking of voice actors am I the only one that thinks Adam's voice is sort of not really right for the character? Like no disrespect to the actor himself, but when I look at the character I'd expect him to sound like Wesker from Resident Evil, not like Zuko from A:TLA.
     
    VolantRedX said:
    Speaking of voice actors am I the only one that thinks Adam's voice is sort of not really right for the character? Like no disrespect to the actor himself, but when I look at the character I'd expect him to sound like Wesker from Resident Evil, not like Zuko from A:TLA.
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    I kind of like it myself, though that's because I treat it like Adam is actively trying to sound edgy and badass, and like he's some kind of master mind when really he's just an above average minion with delusions of grandeur and a vicious, abusive streak.
     
    Zam said:
    I kind of like it myself, though that's because I treat it like Adam is actively trying to sound edgy and badass, and like he's some kind of master mind when really he's just an above average minion with delusions of grandeur and a vicious, abusive streak.
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    I mean he is legitimately dangerous.
     
    Zam said:
    Oh sure, no denying that, but being dangerous doesn't change what he is or how pathetic he is, or the fact he's really little more than one of Salem's conquests.
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    I actually find him a somewhat interesting villain. He's far more interesting than Cinder is for instance or Scopion!Joker was. I just imagine him having a deeper more menacing voice.
     
    VolantRedX said:
    I actually find him a somewhat interesting villain. He's far more interesting than Cinder is for instance or Scopion!Joker was. I just imagine him having a deeper more menacing voice.
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    Your call really. I think he has some interesting attributes, but that his ultimate state is that of a pathetic person with illusions of grandeur and adequacy and so him trying to sound more badass than he is works for me.

    In comparison I really liked Tyrien once he got to show off his full range motion, really using body language when talking down to RNJR and literally blasting his way through a building just for an entrance before speaking grandly about his goddess.
     
    Zam said:
    Your call really. I think he has some interesting attributes, but that his ultimate state is that of a pathetic person with illusions of grandeur and adequacy and so him trying to sound more badass than he is works for me.
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    Except to me he doesn't feel pathetic or grandiose. He's actually one of the least pathetic villains in my view. Adam is at least not motivated by self-serving power fantasies. His backstory to is at least some what intriguing as Blake points out that at one point he wasn't as radical as he now is. Meaning that at some point he had at least some noble end to his actions. There's an implied arc to his character that led him to settling on genocide as being the right answer. Plus it's interesting to have a character be sort of right while also being totally in the wrong. Like Mageneto, he is driven by genuine injustice but has reached a point where that injustice no longer can be used to justify his actions. Compared to the Big Schnees, who is just a rich twat or Cinder who is just power hungry.

    Zam said:
    In comparison I really liked Tyrien once he got to show off his full range motion, really using body language when talking down to RNJR and literally blasting his way through a building just for an entrance before speaking grandly about his goddess.
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    I mean from an animation standpoint he's amazing, but his character is just the Joker with some added god worship of Salem.
     
    VolantRedX said:
    Except to me he doesn't feel pathetic or grandiose. He's actually one of the least pathetic villains in my view. Adam is at least not motivated by self-serving power fantasies. His backstory to is at least some what intriguing as Blake points out that at one point he wasn't as radical as he now is. Meaning that at some point he had at least some noble end to his actions. There's an implied arc to his character that led him to settling on genocide as being the right answer. Plus it's interesting to have a character be sort of right while also being totally in the wrong. Like Mageneto, he is driven by genuine injustice but has reached a point where that injustice no longer can be used to justify his actions. Compared to the Big Schnees, who is just a rich twat or Cinder who is just power hungry.
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    I think this may be a divide I have with a lot of people on Adam, his rant to Blake about what she wants is impossible can add some depth, but with everything else he just feels very self serving and petty to me. I'll try and explain.

    OK, so Adam & Blake's backstories are intertwined, an important thing to remember about Blake, especially in reference to Adam, is that she is by no means an objective individual, she was 12/14 when the WF went violent and he was her mentor/partner/eventual possible lover which adds so many layers of messed up stuff to their relationship, given his position, age, authority and the fact she ran away from home. Add in that we know he was abusive, but Blake never brings this up herself, only talking about how he hurt others, trusting her take on him as having once been noble is not something I can entirely do.

    What's more, in the trailer we know he manipulated her in some manner, because she did not think they'd be killing anyone and went on the mission where Adam revealed his intent to pointlessly blow up an entire train and mass murder some civilians which seems wasteful at best, and her surprise and horror only net a "What about them?" conveying just how little her feelings mean to him, same for the other people.

    Yet, while he does help Blake against the bot when she first gets rebuffed, when it comes to facing it, he belligerently sends her out again so he can hang back. Semblance are tied to the personality & both Adam & Yang have similar Semblance, taking an opponents attack and turning it into strength, but where Yang has to either be taking a blow for someone else or be up and close, Adam's negates him taking damage. If Semblances were built on practicality his would be great, but as they are tied to the individual, I get the impression of a coward who is unwilling to be risk injury (Sending Blake in against a much stronger foe) and who only wants to enter a fight he's confident he can win (hanging back against the bot, bowing to Cinder, seemingly relishing in the fear he caused Blake (Along with being her abuser) and going out of his way to goad Yang).

    Essentially, within the trailer alone, & Blake's line about being dramatic, he feels like someone who aspires to be a super badass, but is petty, foolish, manipulative with an undercurrent of cowardice. Then we find out he's basically gone all in with Salem, being totally fine with forcing his troops to help her despite so many of them dying pointlessly for her and possibly being ready to run away or rebel, so his desires and feelings seem to dominate his decisions, not actual affection for his people. They're an excuse to him, it almost feels like to me.

    Add in that he's kind of a terrible leader to, Cinder compliments him, but he lost Blake & when the battle of Beacon stared he gave a vague order and then ran off to kill students rather than actually lead and then spent time punishing and tormenting his ex and her partner out of spite.

    Plus he's ultimately someone who Cinder just bullied into serving her, putting him at Roman's level at least throughout the current volumes. Roman was fun, but within the framework of the story, he lack grandeur to me.

    Essentially, I feel his trailer alone shows Adam as a very crappy and terrible person who's not what he projects himself to be, that his behavior in the series shows someone dominated by his personal complexes most of which are tied to his abusive relationship with Blake and violence, that his actions as a leader leave a lot to be desired and that Blake's testimony on his character is... unreliable at best doesn't help.

    VolantRedX said:
    I mean from an animation standpoint he's amazing, but his character is just the Joker with some added god worship of Salem.
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    I don't really agree, they both have a manic laugh yes, but Joker is often all about killing people, or torturing them and making them 'laugh' at his jokes. Tyrien was just having a ball tossing around RNJR while being a massively showy guy, who is just wonderfully theatrical, which I guess Joker can be as well, but eh, I don't think he's the best villain but I came to like him a whole lots in that episode.
     
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    Zam said:
    What's more, in the trailer we know he manipulated her in some manner, because she did not think they'd be killing anyone and went on the mission where Adam revealed his intent to pointlessly blow up an entire train and mass murder some civilians which seems wasteful at best, and her surprise and horror only net a "What about them?" conveying just how little her feelings mean to him, same for the other people.
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    Given the pause he has and the movements of his head he seems actually confused that Blake would care what happens to the humans.

    Zam said:
    Yet, while he does help Blake against the bot when she first gets rebuffed, when it comes to facing it, he belligerently sends her out again so he can hang back. Semblance are tied to the personality & both Adam & Yang have similar Semblance, taking an opponents attack and turning it into strength, but where Yang has to either be taking a blow for someone else or be up and close, Adam's negates him taking damage. If Semblances were built on practicality his would be great, but as they are tied to the individual, I get the impression of a coward who is unwilling to be risk injury (Sending Blake in against a much stronger foe) and who only wants to enter a fight he's confident he can win (hanging back against the bot, bowing to Cinder, seemingly relishing in the fear he caused Blake and going out of his way to goad Yang).
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    Umm you seem to have totally misread what was happening in the trailer. He wasn't hanging back to stay safe, he was charging up his Semblance. She was buying him time to get ready. She was Goku to his Piccolo basically. Like everything else is down to individual interpretation of the character, but the specific instance of him sending Blake to buy him time is just working on bad information.

    Zam said:
    Add in that he's kind of a terrible leader to, Cinder compliments him, but he lost Blake & when the battle of Beacon stared he gave a vague order and then ran off to kill students rather than actually lead and then spent time punishing and tormenting his ex and her partner out of spite.
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    I mean he gave a vague order in a vague situation. They're just there to kill people and sow chaos. He doesn't really need to issue a lot of orders beyond that.

    Zam said:
    I don't really agree, they both have a manic laugh yes, but Joker is often all about killing people, or torturing them and making them 'laugh' at his jokes. Tyrien was just having a ball tossing around RNJR while being a massively showy guy, who is just wonderfully theatrical, which I guess Joker can be as well, but eh, I don't think he's the best villain but I came to like him a whole lots in that episode.
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    I mean he's compelling but not all that interesting. He's just a violent maniac that laughs a lot. That's been done bunches of times.
     
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    For reference, I'm just trying to explain my side, if you like Adam and feel he deserves and or would be better with a different voice, then that's cool.
    VolantRedX said:
    Given the pause he has and the movements of his head he seems actually confused that Blake would care what happens to the humans.
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    Given Blake's confusion though, this implies he didn't tell her about the mission, implying her was either manipulating her, or if he was confused, had a very bad understanding of her character, and given the tone, I just don't read confusion from that. Plus confusion could also be sparked by him being surprised she'd speak up to him at all, given the Cinder flashback he seems to prefer Blake as silent, so his rough tone in his answer may have been a subtle warning to just drop the topic and obey.

    VolantRedX said:
    Umm you seem to have totally misread what was happening in the trailer. He wasn't hanging back to stay safe, he was charging up his Semblance. She was buying him time to get ready. She was Goku to his Piccolo basically. Like everything else is down to individual interpretation of the character, but the specific instance of him sending Blake to buy him time is just working on bad information.
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    His Semblance doesn't work by charging though, he has to have an attack to take, and I wasn't trying to imply it was to stay safe strictly speaking. (I mean it could have evolved since then which could fit, but he seemed to be trying to take the original laser beam but didn't have the time, the 'buy me time' thing feels really odd given how its shown to work later :/ )

    I was trying to say that given how Semblances are tied to personality, and how Adam's work and how he utilities it in combat, like how he shouts Blake at something that's already beaten her, how it allows him to avoid risk personal risk which he foists on to others (in the trailer, Blake) and that given how he operates in the rest of the fight, relishing in Blake's fear, charging up his Semblance and goading Yang into attacking, give the impression of someone who only wants a fight he's assured he can win and is terrified of risking himself for the reasons I listed in the original post.

    Like I said, the way his works contrasts against Yang's really intriguingly, Yang has to take damage, she has to risk herself or be in active danger, Adam's is all about avoiding danger and damage and his set ups always seem to involve him being the vastly more prepared party when 'he' enters the fray compared to his foe.

    It is interesting you mention Goku & Piccolo though, because despite being enemies, they seemed to have a better working relationship in that "By time for me" thing in some ways. Goku trusts Piccolo, Blake expresses fear and concern when Adam orders her to defend him but Adam's response is to just shout "Do it!" over something like "Trust me!"

    VolantRedX said:
    I mean he gave a vague order in a vague situation. They're just there to kill people and sow chaos. He doesn't really need to issue a lot of orders beyond that.
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    We saw the majority of his army get their faces stomped in by Weiss & Blake, I feel if he hadn't left his troops that might not have happened. Plus I don't see how the situation was vague, they have a locale, the school, it would be very easy to have a map of it and with airships they could get an idea of best where to concentrate their forces. Given the timing and Grimm dropping, they had to have planned a lot ahead, but when Adam is left alone & in charge he just gives a threatening one liner and seemingly leaves. I feel a good leader wouldn't leave their troops behind to get their faces kicked in, without even giving a target or basic direction. Like, should they focus on civilians, or soldiers or students, should they try and damages the academies infrastructure or cut of evacuations, but Adam just seemed to wonder off to go murder students and torment his former abuse victim.

    Plus there's all the other stuff I mentioned, like Blake not necessarily being a reliable narrator, Adam possibly having been grooming her since she was a kid and utilizing his position as mentor and superior officer to control/abuse her, how he's so dominated by his complexes in his fight with Blake and the Attack on Beacon, and really selfish, seemingly just using the White Fang as a vehicle for his violence.

    VolantRedX said:
    I mean he's compelling but not all that interesting. He's just a violent maniac that laughs a lot. That's been done bunches of times.
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    I guess I just like that he's done well, he's just so dramatic and grandiose.
     
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    Renu said:
    Autodesk is the company that owns Maya, not another software.

    This was your useless trivia of the day.
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    Does anyone remember what the other thing they were using was called then? I think it had Pen or Desk or something like that in its name. They mention in the Commentary track of the DvD/Blu-Ray that halfway through Volume 4 they decided that since they were ditching all their old stuff anyway they might as well go all the way and get this stuff while they were at it. A bit panic inducing apparently since it involved learning even more new stuff but they were pretty happy with it since it made a lot of stuff much easier and they had wanted to get it for quite a while apparently.
     
    Mook said:
    Does anyone remember what the other thing they were using was called then? I think it had Pen or Desk or something like that in its name. They mention in the Commentary track of the DvD/Blu-Ray that halfway through Volume 4 they decided that since they were ditching all their old stuff anyway they might as well go all the way and get this stuff while they were at it. A bit panic inducing apparently since it involved learning even more new stuff but they were pretty happy with it since it made a lot of stuff much easier and they had wanted to get it for quite a while apparently.
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    They used Poser before iirc, but I don't know if they used something alongside Maya.
     
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