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RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

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Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
  • Staff Post
    • so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
    We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

    That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

    So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

    In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
     
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  • Staff Post
    • The fact we never saw any of the happy Huntresses fighting this volume always fascinated me. Instead, we see them operating in other, just as critical ways. Coordinating the evacuation, escorting people to safety, they really were defenders of the people.
     
    Matrix Dragon said:
    The fact we never saw any of the happy Huntresses fighting this volume always fascinated me. Instead, we see them operating in other, just as critical ways. Coordinating the evacuation, escorting people to safety, they really were defenders of the people.
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    Logistics are a vital part of warfare and basic civilization that often gets overlooked by the average citizen and especially the average consumer and definitely the average viewer.
     
    I just had a thought.

    Y'all know how people claim Oscar is a pointless character and that if Ozpin had to get stuck in someone's head it should of been one of the already established cast such as Jaune (cause Joan of Arc heard voices)?

    Well....I say Oscar actually works BECAUSE he wasn't established before The Fall.

    I mean, lets say Oz did go into Jaune (or even Yang or Tai because I have seen fanfics with those ideas) and just think how POORLY that would of gone. Jaune was already having issues after The Fall because he both blamed himself for Pyrrha's death AND became bitter to Oz after Qrow joined them. Then we have how Jaune reacted when they met Cinder at Haven, and we know Ozpin can and will wrestle for control of the body at that point if he feels they are in danger just like he did with Oscar when faced with Hazel. Jaune would not stand a chance if he and Ozpin are fighting over the wheel when Cinder is right there.

    Meanwhile for Oscar, he is both his own person but also a relatively blank slate. Oscar can meet and look at so many other characters and because he personally did not have history with them he can open up to them and they can be open to him. Do we honestly think Jaune or anyone else could of pulled off that trust gambit on the whale with Hazel and Emerald? I don't.

    In short, Oscar works because he was not connected to any of this before he got his brain filled with Wizard.
     
    That is fair. Rwby in general is fun but very uneven. There are times when it's good but also times when it's not.

    I've seen people say that Ruby really started to get good in Vol 6-7, and that her characterization in bold 4-5 were kinda Crap.
     
    LordYam said:
    That is fair. Rwby in general is fun but very uneven. There are times when it's good but also times when it's not.

    I've seen people say that Ruby really started to get good in Vol 6-7, and that her characterization in bold 4-5 were kinda Crap.
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    I don't know if I'd go far enough to say Ruby's characterization was "crap," but it was way too thin. V6-Present has done a much, much better job at Ruby's characterization.
     
    LordYam said:
    I've seen people say that Ruby really started to get good in Vol 6-7, and that her characterization in bold 4-5 were kinda Crap.
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    Yeah. For better or worse, she had a character in Volume 6. Volumes 1-4 set up the foundations for her character and where it could go, but Volume 5 kinda dropped that because Volume 5. That said, there was that one moment where the show cleared the way for Ruby to talk with Oscar in what is easily the most memorable scenes from Volume 5. It's jut the major problem is that it was one scene and once that was done, Ruby stays to the side to give a focus on everyone else.

    Her post-Volume 5 character at times does feel like there's a heavy need to course correct but it lines up with what Jaune said in Volume 4 about her being an aspiring leader. At that point, it's only natural for her to have a bunch of speeches.
     
    another thought

    We and Ruby had to lose Penny so we could build to Ruby talking to Salem in similar terms.

    Salem got Ozma. She was happy. But then Ozma died, and she could not stand it. She did all she could think of to get him back, and for a time she did have him back, but in the end she lost him.

    Ruby had Penny. She was happy. Then everything went wrong and Penny's life was in the balance. Ruby did all she could to keep her alive, and for a time it worked, but in the end she lost her once more.

    Ruby has lost. The person she wanted to protect is dead. There is no happy ending for them in that regard. So now in Volume 9 we will see how Ruby handles it, and from here Ruby will grow and come closer to an answer for both Salem and The Gods.
     
    That's....a good theory. Villains are usually foils of the hero, and in some ways they both experienced similar pasts with the difference being that the hero was able to face their trauma and become better while the villain never really got over it.

    Edit: I think Ruby's friends will make all the difference. Salem had no one. She was alone. Even at her lowest Ruby will have Weiss Yang and Blake, and even Jaune. Their words (and possibly even Summer and Penny if they show up in the ghost realm) will give her the strength to fight through the pain and come to terms with it.

    So when the final confrontation comes Ruby will be able to say "I know that feeling" and be honest.
     
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    Hmm, I wonder if there's a way to play all of team RWBY as foils to Salem in some way. Weiss for example has a similar experience of having an abusive father
     
    The key difference is that Ruby has someone; her friends. Salem had no one.

    But that's usually how they defuse the villain in stories where they're motivated by Pain and Rage. The hero (or someone else) underwent a similar enough situation that they're able to understand what drives them and connect with them on that level, which allows them to persuade the villain to stand down.
     
    It's also why I think Ruby and the others will meet Rhodes in the other world; it'll give them the insight into Cinder's psychology which in turn will allow them to defeat her.

    In Codex Alera the main character is forced to fight a champion for a Corrupt Senator (kind of a trial by combat). The champion is easily one of the greatest warriors in the kingdom; certainly better than the hero. During the fight the hero realizes what drives them (they had been abandoned by their father, and they gained their skill in the hope that if they achieved renown their father would finally acknowledge them) and RAMS the button during the fight. The champion looses their composure and gets sloppy enough for the hero to beat them.

    If Ruby were to casually reveal Cinder's past (honestly I doubt even Emerald and Mercury know) and then tell her "You're not powerful. You're just a slave and will continue to be one. I feel sorry for you." I can easily see Cinder going apeshit enough to make blunders in combat.
     
    Jcogginsa said:
    Hmm, I wonder if there's a way to play all of team RWBY as foils to Salem in some way. Weiss for example has a similar experience of having an abusive father
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    Ruby and Yang - Loss of a loved one
    Blake - fought for a cause they thought was right
    Weiss - shitty dad


    LordYam said:
    That's....a good theory. Villains are usually foils of the hero, and in some ways they both experienced similar pasts with the difference being that the hero was able to face their trauma and become better while the villain never really got over it.

    Edit: I think Ruby's friends will make all the difference. Salem had no one. She was alone. Even at her lowest Ruby will have Weiss Yang and Blake, and even Jaune. Their words (and possibly even Summer and Penny if they show up in the ghost realm) will give her the strength to fight through the pain and come to terms with it.

    So when the final confrontation comes Ruby will be able to say "I know that feeling" and be honest.
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    LordYam said:
    The key difference is that Ruby has someone; her friends. Salem had no one.

    But that's usually how they defuse the villain in stories where they're motivated by Pain and Rage. The hero (or someone else) underwent a similar enough situation that they're able to understand what drives them and connect with them on that level, which allows them to persuade the villain to stand down.
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    And that I think is how they will tie the themes of the show together.
    Keep moving forward and Victory is not in Strength, but in Unity.

    Humanity was made as a joint project between the brothers.
    The 4 sisters together helped The Wizard regain heart and confidence.
    Oz/Last King established the Academies and set up the 4 Huntsmen Team system in a way so that no one would be alone.
    The Vytal Festival itself is a celebration of the end of the Great War and showing Unity between the 4 Kingdoms.


    LordYam said:
    It's also why I think Ruby and the others will meet Rhodes in the other world; it'll give them the insight into Cinder's psychology which in turn will allow them to defeat her.

    In Codex Alera the main character is forced to fight a champion for a Corrupt Senator (kind of a trial by combat). The champion is easily one of the greatest warriors in the kingdom; certainly better than the hero. During the fight the hero realizes what drives them (they had been abandoned by their father, and they gained their skill in the hope that if they achieved renown their father would finally acknowledge them) and RAMS the button during the fight. The champion looses their composure and gets sloppy enough for the hero to beat them.

    If Ruby were to casually reveal Cinder's past (honestly I doubt even Emerald and Mercury know) and then tell her "You're not powerful. You're just a slave and will continue to be one. I feel sorry for you." I can easily see Cinder going apeshit enough to make blunders in combat.
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    Doing it that way comes off more as a dick move......but then again we do know that Ruby can and will fight dirty if need be.
     
    I see Ruby offering genuine sympathy to Cinder.....and that just makes her even more pissed off. Being shown honest compassion from the person who she hates most would absolutely enrage her.

    I can even see Ruby making a final offer for Cinder to do the right thing. Hell she might even say "Stop running". Cinder angrily rejects her regardless of what she says, and we get the final fight which ends with Ruby blasting Cinder with Silver eyes and laying her low once again.
     
    So, Death Battle is out.

    Mikasa did better then I expected, given the difference in power levels. She really showed that intelligence has a place in battle.

    But the best thing is how the hosts had no time for Adam and Erens horseshit in the prefight. Especially Adam and his 'mom just doesn't understand me' energy, but Eren, psychopath in training took a few hits as well. Plus, it's nice to have a RT production, even if it's not CRWBY, say point blank that Adam was Blakes abusive ex.
     
    That he is. Though even the show (and amity arena) imply that he was an idealistic youth before the SDC branded him; he's like Cinder in that he took on the value of his abusers (Cinder became like the Madam). It's something that happens depressingly often IRL.
     
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