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RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

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Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
  • Staff Post
    • so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
    We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

    That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

    So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

    In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
     
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  • Staff Post
    • tankdrop24 said:
    Also, liking how they are making Blake's ears more expressive, though I'm still just weirded out by the fact that she has two sets of ears.
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    I'm fine with it. I'm not perfectly satisfied with any of the configurations for cat ears on a human head: putting cat ears on the side of the head tends to look less cat-like, though some artists pull it off better than others, while putting them on top of the head and leaving the spot where human ears would go blank can also look odd if you draw attention to it. On balance, two sets of ears may be the least bothersome option: having accepted the combination of human and feline traits, what's one more set of ears?

    Of course, this is why most depictions cheat by using lots of hair to cover the sides of the head, leaving the question unanswered. :p

    DezoPenguin said:
    Q-Tip sales reps are always jealous of the guy who gets Menagerie for their territory. Double the business per person!
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    "Q-Tips: #1 Faunus Recommended Brand!"
     
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    'Not paranoid' Blake wow you're a better liar than this.

    SSSN must be really, really used to Sun fucking off on his own. Maybe they'll be RNJR tour guide :V. That ship is armed to teeth, and it's just a passenger ship, truly the culture of Remnant Deathworld showing. Sun creeping on Blake that way, he probably thinks it's cool and mysterious with how he approaches the subject and went 'ohhh crap yeah it's creepy' when Blake exploded on him for following her.

    Sun's poses are on point (draw me like one of your Vale girls ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) ) and he seems to be getting way better with his clones, as does Blake. That 'my hero' moment kinda spoofs Jaune's fail of an attempt to catch Weiss, also I'm tickled on Sun's smirk on catching Blake to return the favor.

    That ribbon-abandoning scene is kinda sad. Blake going about it in a resigned way and all.

    Taiyang is such a good dad, he must be trying to get Yang a prosthetic arm for months by now, and the General is such a bro for getting Yang that arm. Top scientist that made it huh, could it be Papa Polendina? Guilt may have played a part in Ironwood smoothing getting a seemingly top-end prosthetic for her. It seems she's still depressed, she's not ready. That scene with her doing daily activities while getting used to being less one arm is somber.

    Ya Allah her PTSD is triggered by glass breaking. Stay strong Yang, and Taiyang knows what's wrong but is short on ideas to help.

    Merc is getting irked more and more, and Emerald is a bad scare away from shitting her pants. Apparently learning Cinderese is mooted becauss Salem, good to know :p. That's an anti-deathflag if I ever saw one, I gotta agree with the BBEG here what're ya planning Oz? Btw that tentacle Grimm apparently is already R34, impossible for M&K to not know this. Ffs.

    You know, could Jaune have known some villagers of Shion personally? He said he used to visit it in his childhood to go camping. With what happened to it in 2nd ep, I guess by 'losing everything' that's what he meant? He lost the 'least' compared to the other three, so it could be after a comparatively happy life this is very jarring to him and he dealt with it not as well as his teammates who has experienced more hardships than him. (even then Ren is raging around, Ruby is stunned, and Nora shows her cynical side).

    Also dammit I can't wait what Ren and Nora's history for that mark, as well as Ruby's grieving for her two friends being shown. How would ruby react when she meets her team again will be gureto, though I know if it happens later it'll have more impact. Gotta wait after Extra Life.

    I'll be delighted if CRWBY subverts expectations on Lil ShitleyWhitley, if he turns out to dislike Winter and ambivalent for Weiss but actually respects them in his own way and plays his own game separate from their father.
    Renewal said:
    He is in many ways similar to Jaune: both can be rather oblivious and offputting because of their resulting thoughtlessness, but are fundamentally goodhearted and willing to face their mistakes once they've been made obvious. Neptune's just rather more selfish and self-absorbed, given his obsession with his image.
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    Neptune=Jaune+swagger and skill? Ah, reminds me of that "you're a cool guy too Jaune" moment. Cringe yet hilarious at the same time, and that awkward fistbump.

    I wager his aquaphobia has some dark story behind it and SSSN is joking about it to lessen his baggage on it.
     
    Does anyone know if we'll be getting Episode 4 this week or a WoR or other skip instead? There haven't really been story arcs the way there were in V2 (where the breaks came after E4, E7 and E10 (cliffhanger!!)) but now that we've seen a major chunk with each of RWBY that might be seen as the end of the "introduction" section.

    Also, given that we're now 25% of the way through the season, I definitely think the Band will Not Be Getting Back Together this year. Instead, I think it's going to be WBY completing their personal bits to the point that they decide they need to get back together and that'll be V5. (Not sure if RNJR brickwalls in Haven or succeeds in learning something that makes them, too, want to reunite.)
     
    DezoPenguin said:
    Does anyone know if we'll be getting Episode 4 this week or a WoR or other skip instead? There haven't really been story arcs the way there were in V2 (where the breaks came after E4, E7 and E10 (cliffhanger!!)) but now that we've seen a major chunk with each of RWBY that might be seen as the end of the "introduction" section.

    Also, given that we're now 25% of the way through the season, I definitely think the Band will Not Be Getting Back Together this year. Instead, I think it's going to be WBY completing their personal bits to the point that they decide they need to get back together and that'll be V5. (Not sure if RNJR brickwalls in Haven or succeeds in learning something that makes them, too, want to reunite.)
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    I heard that it's WoR this week and then next week is the extra life stream, so we possibly wont get anything for another two weeks, though I cant promise im right, just what I heard.
     
    What I'm hoping for is more on the actual working mechanics of aura. like for instance Blake can shoot out mini Getsuga Tenshous and that's all aura some times characters can rapidly accelerate or control their momentum without dust explosions(we say these thing happen due to rule of cool but i think that would only really apply if rwby only had one season)
     
    anailater said:
    I heard that it's WoR this week and then next week is the extra life stream, so we possibly wont get anything for another two weeks, though I cant promise im right, just what I heard.
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    Extra Life is this weekend actually, which is likely justification for WoR.

    And honestly, that's the real purpose of WoR: it gives the team a break week to smooth production over. It's the exact same reason they do PSAs for RvB. The world building is just a side benefit.
     
    You know, it's starting to bug me...

    I've seen a number of complaints (such as in the Twitter responses linked in @r0b0panda's post) basically complaining "Oh, they should have this in the show!"

    And the more I think about it, the more I think that that's a stupid complaint, on three levels:

    1) RWBY has, from Day 1, been starved for time and budget. If there's one complaint about the show, it's that they don't have enough screen time available to tell the whole story. Exactly where are they going to get the time to infodump? (And no, "cut all of Jaune's scenes" is not the answer.) Can we really afford to just stop the show so that Ruby can listen to some third person tell a group of kids the Tale of the Four Maidens just so that the audience will know the fairytale?

    2) In-show infodumps are often boring and usually clumsy. In-show infodumps about basic world-building information are hard, and difficult to work their way into the show, because it's talking about information that the characters would know anyway. Remember, say, how annoying it was in V2E4 when Ruby tells Blake and Weiss about Yang's Semblance? That, y'know, they should all have known already because of months of working together on team combat strategies and how jarring that felt?

    3) WoR hasn't been used to give necessary information about the story, anyway. It's been used to give us, the audience, more fleshing out of things about the story (and to cut off some of the epileptic trees). Like the CCT. They told us in-show what that was in V2. In V3 and V4 we've seen the effects of it being down; heck, it's been specifically stated that it being down was why inter-kingdom communications were out. The WoR about it didn't convey any necessary story information. Things like Dust and Aura were covered for our edification; the characters (...Jaune excepted) didn't need these details. The WoR on the Maidens was basically the recital of the fairy tale--the one Pyrrha already knew--and conveyed little significant information (mainly that a wizard gave the original Maidens their powers) that we didn't get in-show. Most of the time, they've actually done a decent job giving us the minimum necessary to move the story forward in a comprehensible fashion.

    I mean, it's one thing if you don't like WoR. If they bug you because of the narrative style, or because of the animation used, or whatever. Or if it irks you that you have to wait an extra week for the next episode (though in that case, without WoR we'd probably just get nothing at all). But saying that RT should get rid of them in favor of providing the information they give within the body of the series itself...no, I don't agree with that at all.

    tl;dr There is a real difference between "the information the audience needs to follow the story in a coherent fashion" and "the information the audience is curious about because the story's setting is interesting," and AFAIK the WoR segments have been the latter.
     
    DezoPenguin said:
    1) RWBY has, from Day 1, been starved for time and budget. If there's one complaint about the show, it's that they don't have enough screen time available to tell the whole story. Exactly where are they going to get the time to infodump? (And no, "cut all of Jaune's scenes" is not the answer.) Can we really afford to just stop the show so that Ruby can listen to some third person tell a group of kids the Tale of the Four Maidens just so that the audience will know the fairytale?
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    Especially since, even if Jaune's haters were right and he really does contribute nothing, he hasn't actually gotten nearly enough screentime for his scenes to fit all the exposition that's been given in the WoR videos. Because despite the constant bitching about him, the latter half of v1 is the only part of the series where Jaune actually got an entire story arc to himself. In v2 he's just one part of the dance arc with Blake/Sun/Yang, Weiss/Neptune, and Pyrrha. And in v3 he's only there as a part of Pyrrha's story arc.

    DezoPenguin said:
    2) In-show infodumps are often boring and usually clumsy. In-show infodumps about basic world-building information are hard, and difficult to work their way into the show, because it's talking about information that the characters would know anyway. Remember, say, how annoying it was in V2E4 when Ruby tells Blake and Weiss about Yang's Semblance? That, y'know, they should all have known already because of months of working together on team combat strategies and how jarring that felt?
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    Originally, the one Ruby was talking to would have been Neptune, not Blake. Unfortunately, Sun and Neptune got cut out of the Paladin fight to save on time, so...
     
    Leingod said:
    Especially since, even if Jaune's haters were right and he really does contribute nothing, he hasn't actually gotten nearly enough screentime for his scenes to fit all the exposition that's been given in the WoR videos. Because despite the constant bitching about him, the latter half of v1 is the only part of the series where Jaune actually got an entire story arc to himself. In v2 he's just one part of the dance arc with Blake/Sun/Yang, Weiss/Neptune, and Pyrrha. And in v3 he's only there as a part of Pyrrha's story arc.
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    Yeah, that double-arc for Jaune was just epically bad pacing; they did learn from that in multiple ways. (Ironically, though, it has a perfect example of what I mean about the show being good at providing the minimum of infodumping to carry the story, with Pyrrha's bit about her Semblance: we're told that Semblances exist, that pretty much everyone has one (by identifying Ruby's and Weiss's), it's presented in such a way that the speaker and the speaker's audience all know what Semblance is already so it's not forced "Semblance, which is the unique expression of my aura..." blather, and we get enough information about them that we can understand the story and move forward. We could even go back through the show and see where in V1E8 Pyrrha reclaimed her spear jumping over the dying Deathstalker with the sound effect so that we could realize the Semblance was there all along.)

    Originally, the one Ruby was talking to would have been Neptune, not Blake. Unfortunately, Sun and Neptune got cut out of the Paladin fight to save on time, so...
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    Okay, now that makes perfect sense: we'd get the reveal of Yang's Semblance to people who'd genuinely have no reason to know what it was. (They really should have rewritten Ruby's line, though.) Just another example of time and budget getting in the way of good storytelling.
     
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    [Discussion] Volume 4, World of Remnant: Between Kingdoms
  • Threadmarks
    • Link: RWBY: Volume 4, World of Remnant: Between Kingdoms


    Transcript:



    If the imgur album embed isn't working for you (as is the case for me right now), open the album directly: imgur.com/a/0hk2R

    Or use the spoiler:

    So, now you know more about the kingdoms. But, what's between the big cities?

    Alright, the easy answer is: Grimm. There's no reason to beat around the bush, they're out there. And it probably won't go well if you run into one.



    But that's okay, because you're a huntsman.



    Or, huntress.



    And you've trained at one of the major academies, so you're probably fine.







    Just don't get yourself overrun by a pack of them.





    Now, after a long day of killing Grimm and saving the world, you're going to probably want to stop at a small town inn.

    *bell rings*



    Small villages dot the land between the major cities. You might ask, with the wilderness being so dangerous, why not just live in the big cities?



    Well, that life isn't meant for everyone. These small towns are founded by people that have a problem with the kingdoms, or don't want to deal with the kingdoms' problems, or maybe just enjoy the simpler life and would rather take their chances in the wild than in a kingdom.



    It goes, about as well as you'd think.



    If the founders are smart, then there's a good chance these towns can survive for the same reason the kingdoms continue to: natural barriers, strong defenses, and stubborn citizens.





    If you don't have at least a few of those, then... well, the chances of a town lasting more than a year isn't great.



    Unfortunately, it's not just the Grimm running around ruining towns.



    Wandering bandits are another threat.

    These groups of usually fairly skilled fighters travel the lands, never settling in one place. They often prey on convoys sending goods between kingdoms, but that's not all. These raiders will often wait for a town to be at its weakest, maybe after a Grimm attack or while its fighters are out hunting, before finally moving in at night and striking. Bunch of jerks.



    The worst part is, if the Grimm hadn't attacked before, you'd better be damn sure they will now. You can't exactly have bandits raid your town without at least a few "negative emotions".



    This is also why bandits never stay in the towns they conquer. With attitudes like the ones they have, Grimm tend to be pretty interested in them as well. As long as they keep moving they have a better chance at survival.



    Besides these small towns, the areas between kingdoms really depend on the continent. Harsh deserts, icy tundras, lush forests: you name it.

    At this point pretty much every inch of Remnant has been mapped out. Although there are some areas that no one's gone into and come out alive.



    And of course, somewhere out there, is where *she* is.
     
  • Threadmarks
    • Okay, so this taught us absolutely nothing. Serioisly, what's the point of these WoRs if they don't even give us relevant information? Like, we won't be visiting vacuo until v5 at the earliest, so why have a WoR about it? Why not Menagerie?

    Also, we're 25% through the season. Looks like RWBY won't be getting back together til v5 at the earliest. Which begs the question why it's still called RWBY.

    @DezoPenguin, the big flaw in your argument is that it doesn't provide much worldbuilding, either. I mean come on, when Ozpin asks Pyrrha if she knows about the story of the Maidens, Pyrrha literally recites the story we just heard in WoR. Why was the story even a WoR then?

    Like I don't have an issue with the WoR providing worldbuilding, necessarily. It could have been provided in a better fashion in the show itself that wasn't infodumps, but since that is beyond their ability I'll take World of Remnant as a substitute.

    HOWEVER, that information actually has to be relevant to the show. Like, this is some nice backstory for the kingdoms, but how does it affect them now? How are faunus treated in Mistral? What do they eat? Is all their architecture Greco-Roman, or is just Pyrrha that way because she's supposed to be like a Nasu-Achilles? Little things like that. This World of Remnant has provided absolutely no new information. RT wants theor WoR? Fine. But make the information useful.
     
    thesevenwielder said:
    Okay, so this taught us absolutely nothing. Serioisly, what's the point of these WoRs if they don't even give us relevant information? Like, we won't be visiting vacuo until v5 at the earliest, so why have a WoR about it? Why not Menagerie?
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    For completion's sake, as they were showing the Four Kingdoms, and because the fans wanted it. Menagerie is probably saved within the show itself because there's a story to be told there, something that could be used in the plot.
    thesevenwielder said:
    Also, we're 25% through the season. Looks like RWBY won't be getting back together til v5 at the earliest. Which begs the question why it's still called RWBY.
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    Because they're still the main characters. Seriously, the show is still focusing and giving screen time to each one of them, despite being separated into four different continents.
    thesevenwielder said:
    @DezoPenguin, the big flaw in your argument is that it doesn't provide much worldbuilding, either. I mean come on, when Ozpin asks Pyrrha if she knows about the story of the Maidens, Pyrrha literally recites the story we just heard in WoR. Why was the story even a WoR then?
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    To tell it in its complete and proper form. There's a difference between reading a story on wikipedia and actually reading it. It is, for all intent and purpose, and omake/short story about the Maidens instead of exposition about them. And it's not wrong to tell the complete version of a story/song/legend that has been talked about in the main story as extra content. It's been done many times - see the GoT animated shorts.
    thesevenwielder said:
    HOWEVER, that information actually has to be relevant to the show. Like, this is some nice backstory for the kingdoms, but how does it affect them now? How are faunus treated in Mistral? What do they eat? Is all their architecture Greco-Roman, or is just Pyrrha that way because she's supposed to be like a Nasu-Achilles? Little things like that. This World of Remnant has provided absolutely no new information. RT wants theor WoR? Fine. But make the information useful.
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    Those information are things that can be told within the story itself. WoR covers the most basic of basics so that we don't have another situation with Dust and Aura with Weiss/Ruby and Jaune again.
     
    It was a monumentally stupid decision to break up the team. I don't care if it came straight from Monty's mouth. The man was not infallible. Even if it was his idea, it was a stupid idea.
     
    thesevenwielder said:
    It was a monumentally stupid decision to break up the team. I don't care if it came straight from Monty's mouth. The man was not infallible. Even if it was his idea, it was a stupid idea.
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    Why so? I can argue that the decision to break up the team would allow them to face their own personal issues - issues that we've had since the start of the series now - and grow as their own person. In addition, it allows them to show more of Remnant without having the team magically hop between continent or suddenly gain an airship a la JRPGs they are based on, which doesn't really work without the gameplay that allows such freedom. In turn, it allows for more perspective and wider scale in their storytelling. They do have the White Fang, Salem/Cinder, and the SDC as the most important antagonist faction, and by placing one character on each of their operating areas, they can show them all together and make it so that they're not silent doing nothing while the team deals with one problem or somehow magically happen to all be located in the same area.

    In addition, it should be noted that the fan does get really pissed off whenever it seemed that Monty's will is not being followed to the letter, so it's understandable why they want to avoid that by doing their best to follow it and only deviating when necessary.

    You can't just throw an idea that something is "monumentally stupid" without giving a proper and logical reason as to why it is "stupid". It's fine if you don't like it because that's just emotional feeling and it's fine to feel, however, if you are going to state something as being bad or "stupid", you should back it up with the reason why it is so and why the opposite or the alternative you are proposing is the better idea.
     
    Fine. Here's why it is monumentally stupid. From day 1 we were sold that these four would be working together. That they would be a team. In it for the long haul. That whatever they were going through, no matter how bad things got, they would be in it together.

    This flies in the face of three seasons plus half a year of pre-series advertising have presented us. By defending them, you are defending RT having lied to us since day 1.
     
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