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RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

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Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
  • Staff Post
    • so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
    We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

    That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

    So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

    In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
     
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  • Staff Post
    • So! On a more positive note, a couple of things.

    First is a bit of fluff:

    This is made by Bach Do, or as he's better known in this fandom Dishwasher1910. Since he's working at RT doing the mech designs for Gen:Lock, maybe there's a chance we'll see this in about 5 volumes or so?

    Second, and I think it's specially relevant to both this thread and site these couple of videos:

    I don't really agree with a lot of what this guy is saying, especially on the first half of the video, though I sympathize with some of the points that he raises.

    This one, on the other hand? I agree 100% with everything she's saying, specially with her attitude on criticism.
     
    LancerisDead said:
    I don't really agree with a lot of what this guy is saying, especially on the first half of the video, though I sympathize with some of the points that he raises.
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    It would be hard to agree with what this guy is saying, because he isn't actually saying anything.

    He says that RWBY critics fail, but he never actually addresses any criticism. He repeats over and over that 'RWBY critics critique RWBY in the way that they would critique something in school, and this is not a good way to critique RWBY', but then he never actually makes a case for why what he's saying is true, or why the critique is flawed.

    To quote him, 'This isn't really criticism, it's just complaining.'

    He makes two points in the later portion of the video-
    The RWBY 5 season finale was 'trending' on Youtube for 2 days, which is better than any of it's previous volume's finales
    RWBY broke through into the Japanese market.

    These two points are, as he notes, purely about RWBY's 'Market Share'. This... Doesn't actually count as a defense against literary criticism? Like, would anyone take 'Twilight was a commercial success, therefore it was a literary success' seriously? Is that an argument that anyone here would accept as a counter to the argument that Twilight has flaws as a story?

    As far as the second clip is concerned, I think that the speaker's general point regarding criticism is valid, but I disagree with her conclusion that criticism has to offer an alternative that would make the show better. Consider this- The vast majority of criticism is aimed at stories and media that have already been produced and released. If it were a critic's role to point out the flaws in the media in order to improve the media they critique, then it would be functionally pointless- The ship has already sailed, the chickens have already flew the coop, and the book has already been published.

    Ultimately, criticism can only be aimed at improving a specific work if that work is not yet complete, or if it would be reasonably possible for the author of the work to respond to the criticism and alter their work prior to it being finished. There are only a couple of scenarios where this makes sense- The primary one, which I'm sure we're all familiar with, being fanfiction.

    However, with most traditional media, this role- pointing out errors so that the content creators can fix things- is still filled. It's not done by critics- it's done by editors, and by the content creators themselves going through their own story and revising away flaws prior to release. In context of web shows like RWBY, this process is known as pre- and post- production- Revisions that take place both before production starts (to make sure that the narrative works overall) and after production ends (to cut away things that are just clunky about the finished product).

    The speaker in this second clip seems to have somehow conflated the role of the editor and the role of the critic together. A critic does not need to offer a way for the story to become better in their criticism- Their job is only to point out how and where the story has failed or succeeded, so that people who are interested in understanding how stories work can use whatever is being critiqued as a case study.

    (As an aside- if you're critiquing a work of fiction from the perspective of a future author, 'This story failed here, how would I avoid this failure' is a valuable question to ask in order to improve your skill as a writer. However, this isn't the sort of question that I think a third party critic should answer for you, as it fundamentally relates to your own writing style and habits.)
     
    Grimnir said:
    It would be hard to agree with what this guy is saying, because he isn't actually saying anything.

    He says that RWBY critics fail, but he never actually addresses any criticism. He repeats over and over that 'RWBY critics critique RWBY in the way that they would critique something in school, and this is not a good way to critique RWBY', but then he never actually makes a case for why what he's saying is true, or why the critique is flawed.

    To quote him, 'This isn't really criticism, it's just complaining.'

    He makes two points in the later portion of the video-
    The RWBY 5 season finale was 'trending' on Youtube for 2 days, which is better than any of it's previous volume's finales
    RWBY broke through into the Japanese market.

    These two points are, as he notes, purely about RWBY's 'Market Share'. This... Doesn't actually count as a defense against literary criticism? Like, would anyone take 'Twilight was a commercial success, therefore it was a literary success' seriously? Is that an argument that anyone here would accept as a counter to the argument that Twilight has flaws as a story?

    As far as the second clip is concerned, I think that the speaker's general point regarding criticism is valid, but I disagree with her conclusion that criticism has to offer an alternative that would make the show better. Consider this- The vast majority of criticism is aimed at stories and media that have already been produced and released. If it were a critic's role to point out the flaws in the media in order to improve the media they critique, then it would be functionally pointless- The ship has already sailed, the chickens have already flew the coop, and the book has already been published.

    Ultimately, criticism can only be aimed at improving a specific work if that work is not yet complete, or if it would be reasonably possible for the author of the work to respond to the criticism and alter their work prior to it being finished. There are only a couple of scenarios where this makes sense- The primary one, which I'm sure we're all familiar with, being fanfiction.

    However, with most traditional media, this role- pointing out errors so that the content creators can fix things- is still filled. It's not done by critics- it's done by editors, and by the content creators themselves going through their own story and revising away flaws prior to release. In context of web shows like RWBY, this process is known as pre- and post- production- Revisions that take place both before production starts (to make sure that the narrative works overall) and after production ends (to cut away things that are just clunky about the finished product).

    The speaker in this second clip seems to have somehow conflated the role of the editor and the role of the critic together. A critic does not need to offer a way for the story to become better in their criticism- Their job is only to point out how and where the story has failed or succeeded, so that people who are interested in understanding how stories work can use whatever is being critiqued as a case study.

    (As an aside- if you're critiquing a work of fiction from the perspective of a future author, 'This story failed here, how would I avoid this failure' is a valuable question to ask in order to improve your skill as a writer. However, this isn't the sort of question that I think a third party critic should answer for you, as it fundamentally relates to your own writing style and habits.)
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    I have to agree. The guy spends more time talking about how he didn't want to make the video than he does actually making an argument for why the critics are wrong. Ironically his video also fails on his own metric of popularity, it has hardly any views or Likes. While popularity is not everything in this case I think it's telling.


    NorthSouthGorem said:
    Oh yeah, I love Unicornofwar. She's great.
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    I have always had pretty mixed feelings about her. She often makes some good points but I often feel that she ends up being wildly off-base, especially in her Flip-the-script videos. And when she started ranting about Ruby not taking a train to Mistral I stopped being able to take her seriously.
     
    Leila Hann said:
    Because she made a substantive critique of something in the show?
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    Because a train was not a realistic option for RNJR so people who claim they were dumb for not taking one come across as having not paid attention and thus likely having little to offer.

    Edit: I should say probably as that is my reason for ignoring anyone who makes the train claim, but I think I am in the ballpark.
     
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    Zam said:
    Because a train was not a realistic option for RNJR so people who claim they were dumb for not taking one come across as having not paid attention and thus likely having little to offer.
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    Just gonna say, Blake made it to Haven in two weeks by boat when it took 6-8 months for RNJR to get to Haven by foot.
     
    Zam said:
    Because a train was not a realistic option for RNJR so people who claim they were dumb for not taking one come across as having not paid attention and thus likely having little to offer.

    Edit: I should say probably as that is my reason for ignoring anyone who makes the train claim, but I think I am in the ballpark.
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    You are but there are a couple of other additional problems with the complaint. For one thing its not framed as a world-building issue: "why aren't there any trains there?" which would still be an invalid complaints as its addressed in the show. Instead its framed as "Ruby is such a fucking idiot for not taking a train" which runs headlong into the issue that even people who don't pay enough attention to remember that Grimm are a thing should at least be able to notice that there weren't any signs of train tracks or train stations in any of the places RNJR visited, not even Oniyuri which was planned to be a massive project meant to rival Mistral, or Kuroyuri which was practically right next door to Mistral.

    Its like calling the characters for not just taking a ride in Wonder Woman's invisible jet. How exactly are they supposed to use transportation that doesn't exist?

    But it gets worse. Instead of just complaining about Ruby being dumb for not taking a train she presents the whole thing as a "what should have happened" video, dubbing her complaints over the scene where Ruby talks to Raven and presenting Raven as the voice of reason while Ruby is presented a retard. Which makes the whole thing even worse since Ruby and co did try to get a ride on a airship but couldn't because because Raven burned it down. It basically ends up sounding like this:

    RavenofWar: Ruby you are such a fucking idiot! Why didn't you just procure some transportation!?
    Ruby: Because you destroyed the only transportation that was available? :eyebrow:

    Even worse is that this was after Volume 5 where Leo has made a big deal about how hard it is to defend Mistral's territories due to how much ground they cover, and we've seen that even ships right next to Mistral can get shot down by Grimm, so even people who paid no attention to the WoR's or all the characters talking about how dangerous travel is should still have gotten the message that travel on Remnant is dangerous, especially long-distance travel.

    Psyga315 said:
    Just gonna say, Blake made it to Haven in two weeks by boat when it took 6-8 months for RNJR to get to Haven by foot.
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    Irrelevant since she traveled from Menagerie instead of Vale and we don't know how long it took her to reach Menagerie in the first place. She also didn't have as many delays such as her transport being burned down by crazy bandits or having to slow down to deal with a poisoned party members or save villages from being burned down in front of her.
     
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    Psyga315 said:
    Just gonna say, Blake made it to Haven in two weeks by boat when it took 6-8 months for RNJR to get to Haven by foot.
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    In all fairness we don't know the exact timelines of when they left and what got in whose way, I think, plus maybe Blake just got dropped at a better place XD

    Mook said:
    You are but there are a couple of other additional problems with the complaint. For one thing its not framed as a world-building issue: "why aren't there any trains there?" which would still be an invalid complaints as its addressed in the show. Instead its framed as "Ruby is such a fucking idiot for not taking a train" which runs headlong into the issue that even people who don't pay enough attention to remember that Grimm are a thing should at least be able to notice that there weren't any signs of train tracks or train stations in any of the places RNJR visited, not even Oniyuri which was planned to be a massive project meant to rival Mistral, or Kuroyuri which was practically right next door to Mistral.

    Its like calling the characters for not just taking a ride in Wonder Woman's invisible jet. How exactly are they supposed to use transportation that doesn't exist?

    But it gets worse. Instead of just complaining about Ruby being dumb for not taking a train she presents the whole thing as a "what should have happened" video, dubbing her complaints over the scene where Ruby talks to Raven and presenting Raven as the voice of reason while Ruby is presented a retard. Which makes the whole thing even worse since Ruby and co did try to get a ride on a airship but couldn't because because Raven burned it down. It basically ends up sounding like this:

    RavenofWar: Ruby you are such a fucking idiot! Why didn't you just procure some transportation!?
    Ruby: Because you the only transportation that was available? :eyebrow:

    Even worse is that this was after Volume 5 where Leo has made a big deal about how hard it is to defend Mistral's territories due to how much ground they cover, and we've seen that even ships right next to Mistral can get shot down by Grimm, so even people who paid no attention to the WoR's or all the characters talking about how dangerous travel is should still have gotten the message that travel on Remnant is dangerous, especially long-distance travel.
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    Not a fan of the use of the R word, but otherwise agreed.

    Plus those who cite Oscar, he was noted to be from Mistral, which implies he likely lives in the area of the city itself IE, relatively close and thus easier to protect.

    RNJR could have been dumped via ship on the Western end of nowhere in Anima depending on the airship/boat situation where extending train tracks would be really expensive, dangerous and impractical.
     
    From a narrative standpoint, having Ruby take a train to Mistral and get there in a flash wouldn't have worked, both because she be there way too soon while the other characters were still working through their own shit and because she and the others wouldn't get to do the adventurer's road trip thing and travel through the wilds.

    From a practical standpoint, there's nothing to indicate that there is a train in the part of the continent that they're in. It's way the hell out in the boonies, sparsely populated, with only one attempt to establish a major city (which was never finished) and some smaller villages, of which two-thirds of the ones we see are destroyed. There's probably not enough people traveling back and forth to justify running an Amtrak out there every day.

    It would be nice if we had a map of the routes everyone was taking. I suspect that RNJR took the shortest boat ride they could and landed on the westernmost part of the continent, but that's just guesswork.

    Now, we don't know why they didn't take a boat to a port closer to Mistral. Maybe they didn't want to wait for one taking a more direct route because they wanted to get off Patch before Ruby's dad realized what happened and tracked them down and dragged her back home. Maybe they couldn't afford it. This whole thing was basically done on a whim by a bunch of unemployed teenagers and poorly planned.
     
    The Narrator said:
    From a narrative standpoint, having Ruby take a train to Mistral and get there in a flash wouldn't have worked, both because she be there way too soon while the other characters were still working through their own shit and because she and the others wouldn't get to do the adventurer's road trip thing and travel through the wilds.

    From a practical standpoint, there's nothing to indicate that there is a train in the part of the continent that they're in. It's way the hell out in the boonies, sparsely populated, with only one attempt to establish a major city (which was never finished) and some smaller villages, of which two-thirds of the ones we see are destroyed. There's probably not enough people traveling back and forth to justify running an Amtrak out there every day.

    It would be nice if we had a map of the routes everyone was taking. I suspect that RNJR took the shortest boat ride they could and landed on the westernmost part of the continent, but that's just guesswork.

    Now, we don't know why they didn't take a boat to a port closer to Mistral. Maybe they didn't want to wait for one taking a more direct route because they wanted to get off Patch before Ruby's dad realized what happened and tracked them down and dragged her back home. Maybe they couldn't afford it. This whole thing was basically done on a whim by a bunch of unemployed teenagers and poorly planned.
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    Agreed, good insights!

    Plus RNJR would have been leaving shortly after Beacon fell and we know by V4 when they had arrive evacuations were still ongoing, so chances are they couldn't take the fastest routes which would be clogged with refugees.
     
    The Narrator said:
    From a narrative standpoint, having Ruby take a train to Mistral and get there in a flash wouldn't have worked, both because she be there way too soon while the other characters were still working through their own shit and because she and the others wouldn't get to do the adventurer's road trip thing and travel through the wilds.

    From a practical standpoint, there's nothing to indicate that there is a train in the part of the continent that they're in. It's way the hell out in the boonies, sparsely populated, with only one attempt to establish a major city (which was never finished) and some smaller villages, of which two-thirds of the ones we see are destroyed. There's probably not enough people traveling back and forth to justify running an Amtrak out there every day.

    It would be nice if we had a map of the routes everyone was taking. I suspect that RNJR took the shortest boat ride they could and landed on the westernmost part of the continent, but that's just guesswork.

    Now, we don't know why they didn't take a boat to a port closer to Mistral. Maybe they didn't want to wait for one taking a more direct route because they wanted to get off Patch before Ruby's dad realized what happened and tracked them down and dragged her back home. Maybe they couldn't afford it. This whole thing was basically done on a whim by a bunch of unemployed teenagers and poorly planned.
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    Alternatively there just plain weren't any better routes they could have taken:


    Remember those crazy fish stories Qrow talked about? We know the waters around Vale itself is mostly safe, there's no telling if any of the reasonably direct routes from Vale to Mistral are.



    And with air traffic from Vale being restricted to evacuation only its not like they could have taken an airship from Vale itself.
     
    Zam said:
    Plus RNJR would have been leaving shortly after Beacon fell
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    Not that shortly, since the seasons change in a transition shot before they depart. But "the evacuation" was apparently still going on well after they'd left, enough for all air traffic to still be dedicated to it.

    (As for what's being evacuated if the city-state didn't fall, there could be areas besides the school that were overrun and not retaken or that are considered too dangerously exposed now and need to be abandoned.)


    Mook said:
    Remember those crazy fish stories Qrow talked about? We know the waters around Vale itself is mostly safe, there's no telling if any of the reasonably direct routes from Vale to Mistral are.
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    The problem with "sea travel is dangerous because of Grimm attacks" is that land travel is also dangerous because of Grimm attacks, so I'm not sure that really provides much motivation.

    Of our protagonists, Blake travels by sea and gets attacked by a Grimm, Weiss travels by air and gets attacked by a swarm of Grimm, and Ruby travels by land and gets attacked by a particularly epic Grimm and would have gotten attacked a lot more if Qrow hadn't been covering for them. They don't fuck with Yang, however. :D
     
    The Narrator said:
    Not that shortly, since the seasons change in a transition shot before they depart. But "the evacuation" was apparently still going on well after they'd left, enough for all air traffic to still be dedicated to it.

    (As for what's being evacuated if the city-state didn't fall, there could be areas besides the school that were overrun and not retaken or that are considered too dangerously exposed now and need to be abandoned.)
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    Probably the thousands upon thousands of people from all over the world who were here for the festival who now find themselves in a city where Grimm are constantly showing up around Beacon and Grimm in general are more agitated than they've been in a long time.

    The problem with "sea travel is dangerous because of Grimm attacks" is that land travel is also dangerous because of Grimm attacks, so I'm not sure that really provides much motivation.
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    Yeah, and if the one that attacked the ship hadn't been flying for most of the time, it would have been a massive bitch to fight. Have you ever tried fighting underwater? It's not easy.
     
    The Narrator said:
    The problem with "sea travel is dangerous because of Grimm attacks" is that land travel is also dangerous because of Grimm attacks, so I'm not sure that really provides much motivation.

    Of our protagonists, Blake travels by sea and gets attacked by a Grimm, Weiss travels by air and gets attacked by a swarm of Grimm, and Ruby travels by land and gets attacked by a particularly epic Grimm and would have gotten attacked a lot more if Qrow hadn't been covering for them. They don't fuck with Yang, however. :D
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    Note that Qrow makes a distinction between the "crazy fish stories" that you can get even in safely shallow waters (like the ones Blake traveled through) and the "real threats" that can pop out of deeper waters. Also all those Grimm attack just kind of support my point for why RNJR needed to travel on foot. They're Huntsmen so they feel confident in traveling through Grimm infested wilderness, normal people don't have that assurance so unless they can stick to a route that is mostly safe or there's enough money involved in whatever needs trafficking to be worth the risk or let them hire proper security they're just going to not travel at all. Also correction: They don't fuck with Yang on-screen.
     
    The Narrator said:
    Not that shortly, since the seasons change in a transition shot before they depart. But "the evacuation" was apparently still going on well after they'd left, enough for all air traffic to still be dedicated to it.

    (As for what's being evacuated if the city-state didn't fall, there could be areas besides the school that were overrun and not retaken or that are considered too dangerously exposed now and need to be abandoned.)
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    Fair enough, but yeah as noted, the evacuation was still going on so methods of travel may have been limited.

    I assumed it was people visiting from other kingdoms and or provinces.
     
    The Narrator said:
    From a narrative standpoint, having Ruby take a train to Mistral and get there in a flash wouldn't have worked, both because she be there way too soon while the other characters were still working through their own shit and because she and the others wouldn't get to do the adventurer's road trip thing and travel through the wilds.

    From a practical standpoint, there's nothing to indicate that there is a train in the part of the continent that they're in. It's way the hell out in the boonies, sparsely populated, with only one attempt to establish a major city (which was never finished) and some smaller villages, of which two-thirds of the ones we see are destroyed. There's probably not enough people traveling back and forth to justify running an Amtrak out there every day.

    It would be nice if we had a map of the routes everyone was taking. I suspect that RNJR took the shortest boat ride they could and landed on the westernmost part of the continent, but that's just guesswork.

    Now, we don't know why they didn't take a boat to a port closer to Mistral. Maybe they didn't want to wait for one taking a more direct route because they wanted to get off Patch before Ruby's dad realized what happened and tracked them down and dragged her back home. Maybe they couldn't afford it. This whole thing was basically done on a whim by a bunch of unemployed teenagers and poorly planned.
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    You're missing the point. The criticism about not taking a train isn't literally "there should be a train between these two points". It's that the method of travel that Rwby and co are taking seems counter to their goals and their means. And this includes where they're starting from: sure, I can buy that there aren't good ways of getting from the backwoods area they start in to Haven. But why do they start there? After all, we know that better means of travel exist (we've seen trains and boats), and generally for travel it's easier/cheaper to get to major hubs than it is to get to random backwoods areas (which is probably even more true in a world with grimm). And the messaging is saying that they want to get to haven quickly because they need to thwart Cinder. Yet that's not what we are shown. Maybe headcanons can be crafted to explain this, but that still leaves one in the position of needing to make an excuse.


    As for your narrative excuse, the fact that the plot that's made requires plotholes or awkward reasoning isn't a defense of those holes or reasoning. This isn't a work of history. If the authors instead had a story where Ruby and co took a boat to Haven and then the story was about their investigation once there that took enough time for the others to catch up, then that would be the story.
     
    Cosar said:
    You're missing the point. The criticism about not taking a train isn't literally "there should be a train between these two points". It's that the method of travel that Rwby and co are taking seems counter to their goals and their means. And this includes where they're starting from: sure, I can buy that there aren't good ways of getting from the backwoods area they start in to Haven. But why do they start there? After all, we know that better means of travel exist (we've seen trains and boats), and generally for travel it's easier/cheaper to get to major hubs than it is to get to random backwoods areas (which is probably even more true in a world with grimm). And the messaging is saying that they want to get to haven quickly because they need to thwart Cinder. Yet that's not what we are shown. Maybe headcanons can be crafted to explain this, but that still leaves one in the position of needing to make an excuse.
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    As was noted, people were still being evacuated from Vale so most good means are likely clogged and they did seek out travel hubs, IE, the airship, it just didn't work out for them.

    Could it have been handled better? Maybe, like showing a map of where they left from, where they landed and having an explanation as to why they had to take that path, but then people would be whining about them being 'rail roaded' and after a point one has to give the audience some credit I feel.
     
    Leingod said:
    Probably the thousands upon thousands of people from all over the world who were here for the festival who now find themselves in a city where Grimm are constantly showing up around Beacon and Grimm in general are more agitated than they've been in a long time.
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    That is a good point. They've got all those tourists who would be wanting to get home in a hurry, so I could see that tying up all air traffic for a few days afterward. But for months? For it to take so much longer for the same number of people to leave as it took them to arrive, the number of available vehicles would have to have dropped precipitously....

    ...you don't suppose the stadium was also transporting passengers when it arrived, do you? It's the biggest thing in the air, so that could explain how their airlift capacity is suddenly so much smaller going then it was coming.
     
    The Narrator said:
    That is a good point. They've got all those tourists who would be wanting to get home in a hurry, so I could see that tying up all air traffic for a few days afterward. But for months? For it to take so much longer for the same number of people to leave as it took them to arrive, the number of available vehicles would have to have dropped precipitously....

    ...you don't suppose the stadium was also transporting passengers when it arrived, do you? It's the biggest thing in the air, so that could explain how their airlift capacity is suddenly so much smaller going then it was coming.
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    I mean, there were a lot of dropshop-things that people were using to get there and back and it was one of the first places attacked, so that's possible. I also have no doubt the White Fang were picking strategic targets to start dropping Grimm into and would want to cripple things like transportation along with communication. Speaking of which, remember the massive blow to their communications in the form of the fall of the CCT; travel suddenly gets a lot more dicey when you can't just talk to the guys on the other side anymore. Imagine how much of a pain managing air traffic in the midst of what is essentially a refugee crisis would be if you couldn't even plan things out until you were within sight of the landing zone, especially when you have Cessna-sized giant murder-birds out for blood.
     
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    The Narrator said:
    That is a good point. They've got all those tourists who would be wanting to get home in a hurry, so I could see that tying up all air traffic for a few days afterward. But for months? For it to take so much longer for the same number of people to leave as it took them to arrive, the number of available vehicles would have to have dropped precipitously....

    ...you don't suppose the stadium was also transporting passengers when it arrived, do you? It's the biggest thing in the air, so that could explain how their airlift capacity is suddenly so much smaller going then it was coming.
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    Intriguing idea with the stadium, not so sure myself but even then, apparently things got a lot worse after Beacon so safe air travel out may be harder to come by and thus a lot slower. Plus all the stuff that Leingod noted, travel is likely way more dangerous and slow with the CCT down, Grimm up and we've no idea how much their air travel was impacted by the battle. Plus Hunters are also gonna be busy trying to reclaim Beacon and or keep the Grimm contained so how many can be hired to guard ships? Sure there's students but even then (Waves hand) It doesn't sound like it would be a speedy evacuation given all the surrounding stuff.
     
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