RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

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Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
  • Staff Post
    • so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
    We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

    That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

    So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

    In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
     
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  • Staff Post
    • Pugman said:
    A Rosey Red Herring

    View: https://anthurak.tumblr.com/post/672921255858651136/something-ive-been-thinking-quite-a-bit-about
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    Idea: instead of being a Hound, Summer turns out to be an unstable human/Grimm hybrid because she was the prototype of Salem's experiment that would ultimately create the Hound. (think her normal appearance with bits of Grimm here and there)
    Because of those circumstances, she's extremely mentally unstable and requires constant attention, a complete contrast of how her daughters and the rest of her team saw her as an invincible monster slayer.
     
    Matrix Dragon said:
    Full frontal nudity is EDGY!
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    At least the genderfluid mind sex was a character progression moment, even if one of them got killed for it the next fight for drama so one of the heroes would run off to join the suicide cult worshiping nanotech as the true answer to all religions and get super powers.
    ElMariachi said:
    Idea: instead of being a Hound, Summer turns out to be an unstable human/Grimm hybrid because she was the prototype of Salem's experiment that would ultimately create the Hound. (think her normal appearance with bits of Grimm here and there)
    Because of those circumstances, she's extremely mentally unstable and requires constant attention, a complete contrast of how her daughters and the rest of her team saw her as an invincible monster slayer.
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    Maybe also elements of what's happening to Cinder too?
     
    Summer goes to fight Salem
    In the course of the incident Salem learns that Magic can mix with Gimm.
    So she develops The Bug Glove and gives it to Cinder.
    Meanwhile Salem works on her own little project....Grimm with a Human Core.
    2 Hybrid Projects running at the same time.
     
    Pugman said:
    Summer goes to fight Salem
    In the course of the incident Salem learns that Magic can mix with Gimm.
    So she develops The Bug Glove and gives it to Cinder.
    Meanwhile Salem works on her own little project....Grimm with a Human Core.
    2 Hybrid Projects running at the same time.
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    This requires the assumption that summer had magic.
     
    Jcogginsa said:
    They're DnD Adventurers. They get hired to hunt monsters and do odd jobs. Calling them Mercenaries is just a disengenuous attempt to assign moral failings from the real world onto a group that does not actually have a real world analogue.
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    This is what I keep seeing when I struggle with any attempt at taking the worldbuilding of RWBY seriously. If the idea is to remove the artifice and try to look at the world as if one was a real person in that world, then the counter to that idea is to ignore any attempt and add secondary layers of artifice to justify the first.

    Which might be the way the show is intended to be viewed? So much of the world is designed not with characters first and building from there, but with video gamey logic and anime pastiche.

    So yeah, DnD adventurers might be the intended analogue, because the world wasn't created to try to look at military power seriously. The world wasn't designed to showcase how a society might realistically organize and collectively work against natural disaster like big ol monsters- it's designed to show off big special heroes being dramatic.

    So like, if a creative is trying to worldbuild with RWBY, there will have to be some degree of reinvention.
     
    ... You know if you want a real world comparison to Hunters, you can just say Bounty Hunters, the mission boards line up well with the concept after all.

    There's no need for this over dramatic 'RWBY's world building is shallow' stuff.
     
    Zam said:
    ... You know if you want a real world comparison to Hunters, you can just say Bounty Hunters, the mission boards line up well with the concept after all.

    There's no need for this over dramatic 'RWBY's world building is shallow' stuff.
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    Well, the literal RPG quest boards wear their influences on their sleeves.

    But anyway, huntsmen seem to do a very wide variety of jobs that revolve around the application of violence, toward either humans or monsters, and at least most of them seem to take jobs for pay on their own initiative. It's a lot less specific than what bounty hunters do. Mercenary is definitely the best fit term.

    Also, DnD adventurers NOT being mercenaries is kind of a weird take? Sure, it's campaign dependent. I've played DnD games where we're on a single, epic quest all along, or where we're sworn, paid agents of a single organization. But the default assumption of the game as written is DEFINITELY that the party is wandering around doing violence for money, and even campaigns that don't focus on that tend to have sideplots that indulge in it. Most DnD PC's are absolutely mercs.

    Like, this isn't even an attack on the worldbuilding or whatever (though it could certainly serve as a basis for such attacks if interrogated further). It's just a simple, obvious description of part of it.
     
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    Leila Hann said:
    Well, the literal RPG quest boards wear their influences on their sleeves.

    But anyway, huntsmen seem to do a very wide variety of jobs that revolve around the application of violence, toward either humans or monsters, and at least most of them seem to take jobs for pay on their own initiative. Mercenary is definitely the best fit term.

    Also, DnD adventurers NOT being mercenaries is kind of a weird take? Sure, it's campaign dependent. I've played DnD games where we're on a single, epic quest all along, or where we're agents of a single organization. But the default assumption of the game as written is DEFINITELY that the party is wandering around doing violence for money, and even campaigns that don't focus on that tend to have sideplots that indulge in it. Most DnD PC's are absolutely mercs.
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    Sure but that can also be viewed as a modern spin on the old fashioned "Wanted poster board". One could also compare Hunters to Knight Errant.

    Except mercenary applies to wars and armies and soldiers with large groups, none of which hunters are. What's more, Hunters take on personal missions for the public or tasks left open for willing applicant by the government, or that are facilitated by the government Bounty Hunters strikes me as much closer to what Hunters are in terms of function and structure than Mercenaries which.
    Frankly calling them mercenaries in a world that is so unlike ours, feels like a failure of imagination to me. Remnant is barely inhabited by sapient life, if someone wants to disappear, provided they can fight and find a place to sleep, one can bail on any given nation and the moment they are outside the borders, no one is going to find them.
    The White Fang, large bandit and pirate groups can just exist here, because there is no governmental mandate outside the city states after a given point, its very 'Wild West' but jacked up to eleven and the Hunter system better fits that than military or Mercenaries. Especially given the semi to totally independent nature of settlements outside the capitals.

    Frankly given stuff like adventurer guilds exist and you have stuff like Fairy Tale, I feel anyone acting as though D&D holds the sole rights to this concept, or that utilizing it when discussing Hunters is mostly just being unfair, the concept is broadly known and as I cited with my reference to Knight Errant and Bounty Hunters, not unfamiliar to our own world.
     
    Carrnage said:
    Though the academies manage the job boards.
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    And also provide licenses and levels, enforcing ethics and standards and before anyone notes the dumb guys, keep in mind Leo's been actively sabotaging the system there for several years and that just because a system can be corrupted (Cough, Atlas) doesn't mean its inherently worthless.
     
    You know thinking about the idea of remaking RWBY as other types of series and I was thinking of what I would do if I were to make it R rated, in a serious way not meme way, and the only real changes that I would make would be:
    1. Add gore, not a lot of Gore, Invincible and Castelvania levels, and mostly on the Grimm attacks specially since it can serve a narrative propose, people on people violence leaves dead bodies, they may be a little mangled but they are still dead bodies, Grimm attacks leave chunks, easily recognizable chunks but chunks none the less. Maybe even an scene in Mt Glen where Dr Oobleck points out that the body of a WF defector couldn't have been killed by Grimm because the injuries were actually done by a weapon, bonus point if the description makes it clear to Blake and the viewer that the weapon was Wilt.
    2. Make Roman and Adam curse like a 12-year-old on CoD multiplayer, Roman because is fun and he doesn't care what everyone else thinks and Adam because he thinks that it makes him sound though.
    3. As for sex scenes, I wouldn't actually add sex scenes, the most that I would do is a "Making out while taking off their clothes and cut to black" and "Waking up naked in bed together", or "Qrow on his underwear attempting to leave through the window", as for who would be, Qrow, in a series of one night stands, maybe one with Cinder before the Fall Beacon where she sleeps with someone to get access to something, maybe a post fall with Mercury or Emerald as long as it makes clear that it is completely fucked up, and a post hookup Bees, specially if the camera pulls back to show that Weiss had been trying to sleep in the upper bunk the whole time.
     
    Zam said:
    And also provide licenses and levels, enforcing ethics and standards and before anyone notes the dumb guys, keep in mind Leo's been actively sabotaging the system there for several years and that just because a system can be corrupted (Cough, Atlas) doesn't mean its inherently worthless.
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    I mean current mercenaries companies like Black Water need a license from their home country to operate and need to meet some standard to actually not get in trouble. Though how much they keep things quiet I don't know.
     
    Leila Hann said:
    Well, the literal RPG quest boards wear their influences on their sleeves.

    But anyway, huntsmen seem to do a very wide variety of jobs that revolve around the application of violence, toward either humans or monsters, and at least most of them seem to take jobs for pay on their own initiative. It's a lot less specific than what bounty hunters do. Mercenary is definitely the best fit term.

    Also, DnD adventurers NOT being mercenaries is kind of a weird take? Sure, it's campaign dependent. I've played DnD games where we're on a single, epic quest all along, or where we're sworn, paid agents of a single organization. But the default assumption of the game as written is DEFINITELY that the party is wandering around doing violence for money, and even campaigns that don't focus on that tend to have sideplots that indulge in it. Most DnD PC's are absolutely mercs.
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    Mercenary is not a catch all term for "People paid to do violence"

    Mercenary means "A professional soldier hired to fight in a foreign army."

    If you're going to expand the word Mercenary to mean "People paid to do violence" in order to make a fictional profession fit the definition, then you can't ascribe the the moral failings of the real life profession to the fictional one. (Which is not something that I recall you doing, but is something I recall the person who first brought up the comparison doing).

    By the "people paid to do violence" definition, most athletes who play contact sports would qualify as mercenaries. And it's kind of silly to call the Green Bay Packers morally equivalent to Blackwater
     
    Honestly, "Huntsman/Huntress" in RWBY is less a specific job and more a qualification. If you're licensed as a Huntsman, it means you're an accredited badass who can be counted on to do the kind of jobs that people would want to hire an accredited badass for, which is as diverse as being a security guard (whether for a village or town, a train or airship, etc.), going out into the wilderness to hunt monsters, essentially doing bounty hunting jobs by chasing down and apprehending wanted criminals, or joining the army and essentially becoming special forces if that's what floats your boat. And if you really wanted to join a criminal organization or whatever, you could do that, too, but if you're ever found out you're losing your license and other accredited badasses will probably soon be accepting jobs to kick your ass and bring you in to face justice, so I sure hope the money was worth it.
     
    Jcogginsa said:
    Mercenary is not a catch all term for "People paid to do violence"

    Mercenary means "A professional soldier hired to fight in a foreign army."

    If you're going to expand the word Mercenary to mean "People paid to do violence" in order to make a fictional profession fit the definition, then you can't ascribe the the moral failings of the real life profession to the fictional one. (Which is not something that I recall you doing, but is something I recall the person who first brought up the comparison doing).

    By the "people paid to do violence" definition, most athletes who play contact sports would qualify as mercenaries. And it's kind of silly to call the Green Bay Packers morally equivalent to Blackwater
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    Most modern mercenaries companies are hired to do security on private installations and people, they aren't only hired as army auxiliaries.
     
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    Also
    Can we give some kudos to Jaune for being the only one of the main cast to keep their head on straight during the entire Grimm Invasion and Fall or Atlas?
    Boy has come so damn far. Pyrrha would be proud of him.
     
    Seriously, Juniors entire character, even after Roman Holiday, is that he's a perv with a nightclub and criminal connections. That's about it.

    Hell, at least Roman doesn't hit on teenagers and has some style.
     
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