RWBY Thread III: Time To Say Goodbye

Stop: So gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
so gotta few things that need to be said real quick.
We get a lot of reports from this thread. A lot of it is just a series of people yelling at each other over arguments that have been rehashed hundreds of times since the end of the recent Volume. And I get that the last Volume - and RWBY in general, really - has some controversial moments that people will want to discuss, argue about, debate, etc.

That's fine. We're not going to stop people from doing that, because that's literally what the point of the thread is. However, there's just a point where it gets to be a bit too much, and arguments about whether or not Ironwood was morally justified in his actions in the recent Volume, or if RWBY and her team were in the right for withholding information from Ironwood out of distrust, or whatever flavor of argument of the day descend into insulting other posters, expressing a demeaning attitude towards other's opinions, and just being overall unpleasant. That tends to happen a lot in this thread. We want it to stop happening in this thread.

So! As of now the thread is in a higher state of moderation. What that means is that any future infractions will result in a weeklong boot from the thread, and repeated offenders will likely be permanently removed. So please, everyone endeavor to actually respect the other's arguments, and even if you strongly disagree with them please stay civil and mindful when it comes to responding to others.

In addition, users should refrain from talking about off-site users in the thread. Bear in mind that this does not mean that you cannot continue to post tumblr posts, for example, that add onto the discussion in the thread, with the caveat that it's related to RWBY of course. But any objections to offsite users in the thread should be handled via PM, or they'll be treated as thread violations and infracted as such.
 
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Everyone! It's here! At long last! The myth! The legend! The phenomenon!
Gun/Gun of legend!



link



The circle is complete! The prophecy came true!


And god that is just such a perfect "upgrade" for James isn't it? It suits him to a tee. And don't think I didn't notice that it glows green. Probably similar to Floating Array but also I will be sorely miffed if Emerald doesn't use her stolen loot to blast the hell out of some Grimm or Cinder or something at least once this volume.
 
Haha Ironwood got beat up and thrown in his own shitty prison. Classic.

Ambrosius is neat, I loved the team's solutions for dealing with both the Penny problem and the get everyone out of Atlas and Mantle problem. Also, Ambrosius, as in Merlin Ambrosius.

Virus is is dealt with, that problem is out of the way, just make she sure gets out of this alive, guys, because I don't think I can handle another Penny death.

Jaune's broadcast cutting out was absolutely Watts. Cinder looks cool with a cloak but I am dreading how this all goes wrong, because this is going too well and we have two episodes left. Also, I imagine Salem's respawn timer is nearing its end.
 
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Something new




Penny seems to be a being of pure Aura now. Raw soul without nuts and bolts or squishy guts. I hope this doesn't make her super vulnerable to Aura breaks.


its like the theory from Kingdom Hwarts I've seen that in KH1 Kairi didn't make Sora a full body because Roxas technically was that body. She only made a shall for Soras heart. Sora didn't get a full body back until he merged with Roxas in KH2.
 
its like the theory from Kingdom Hwarts I've seen that in KH1 Kairi didn't make Sora a full body because Roxas technically was that body. She only made a shall for Soras heart. Sora didn't get a full body back until he merged with Roxas in KH2.
Look, I love Kingdom Hearts and I see the point you're making, but let's not bring that bonkers plotline into this :p
Oh and implicit confirmation every Relic presumably has a spirit.


Hi, Glynda.
 
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Someone asked last page how many episodes we have left: It's two. So probably one episode of intense fight(s) and one episode of wrapping things up, similar to how in Volume 5 the fight between Cinder and Raven took place in the penultimate episode and the final one was just a denouement.

its like the theory from Kingdom Hwarts I've seen that in KH1 Kairi didn't make Sora a full body because Roxas technically was that body. She only made a shall for Soras heart. Sora didn't get a full body back until he merged with Roxas in KH2.
GOD I hope we go full Kingdom Hearts here. RWBY's already draws a lot from Final Fantasy (science-fantasy setting, cool powers, etc) and Kingdom Hearts (the power of the soul, the accumulated forces of anonimity and darkness as antagonists), but now we straight-up have a world between worlds. Come on, lets do this. Lets straight up have most of the next volume be team RWBY trying to get back to Remnant.
 
Everyone! It's here! At long last! The myth! The legend! The phenomenon!
Gun/Gun of legend!



link



The circle is complete! The prophecy came true!


And god that is just such a perfect "upgrade" for James isn't it? It suits him to a tee. And don't think I didn't notice that it glows green. Probably similar to Floating Array but also I will be sorely miffed if Emerald doesn't use her stolen loot to blast the hell out of some Grimm or Cinder or something at least once this volume.

That weapon uses both parts of Due Process as it's handles, or rather two guns. It's actually the GunGun/Gun
 
So, regardless of what else he is, Ambrosus is definitely the Blue Fairy from Pinochio
That is one of his obvious allusions, yes.
That seems especially likely considering the design of his Vault.




Which looks very similar to the Ancient Ruins/Lost Temple near Beacon.
rwby.fandom.com

Abandoned Temple

The Abandoned Temple is a location in the northern part of the Emerald Forest, which held the relics for the Beacon Academy Initiation. The smaller part of the temple seemed to mostly consist of the broken ruins of a rotunda. The floor of the structure beared a symmetrical design. Three of the...




I've commented before that while the entrances to the Vaults match the Kingdom they're located in, the realms and Relics/Spirits inside them may have a pattern of being themed more after a different Kingdom instead. And that pattern has now held with Ambrosius and his realm, which clearly looks nothing like Solitas or Mantle/Atlas culture but would fit right in with Vale and in Europe (particularly the celtic parts of Europe where myths of fairies first originated).


So basically Jinn is a Djinn and has a Vacuo/middle east themed realm.
At first I was disappointed that Ambrosius also seemed to be a Djinn but while writing this post I realized he actually fits better as a Fairy or an Elf. The latter even fits well with his ability to stop time.

edit: Also aside from the ruins, the fact that his realm is a endless field of flowers and meadows makes him feel especially "fairy" like. His vault basically leads to Avalon.
edit2: AAAAH! There are even hills there. Fairies and elves typically live under the hills!
edit3: And to complete the Celtic/Welsh inspirations there is the name itself:
Wikipedia said:
Merlin (Welsh: Myrddin, Cornish: Marzhin, Breton: Merzhin) is a mythological figure prominently featured in the legend of King Arthur and best known as an enchanter or wizard. His usual depiction, based on an amalgamation of historical and legendary figures, was introduced by the 12th-century British author Geoffrey of Monmouth and the translator John of Cornwall. Geoffrey appears to have combined existing stories of Myrddin Wyllt, a North Brythonic prophet and madman with no connection to Arthur, with tales of the Romano-British war leader Ambrosius Aurelianus to form the composite figure called Merlinus Ambrosius (Welsh: Myrddin Emrys, Breton: Merzhin Ambroaz). Geoffrey's rendering of the character became immediately popular, especially in Wales.[2]
Though if he is basically Merlin then he's a bit less of a fairy/elf directly and more of a Changeling due to OG Merlin being a Cambion (half-human/half-demon that might have originally referred to a being similar to Changelings).



That leaves the possibility of the Sword and Crown being Atlas/Norse & Mistral/Asian inspired.

And the chain theme has continued so I'm hoping my idea for Fenrir (the wolf who was chained away until Ragnarok and held in place with a sword in his mouth) as the sword spirit and probably one of the Asian versions of The Honest Woodcutter as the spirit of Choice.


edit4: Here's one of those old posts btw:
So here's an interesting thing about the Gods. When I read Fairy Tales of Remnant I was caught completely off guard by the reveal that the God of Light supposedly was the one that provided the gift of Choice. Granted partially this was because I did not know at the time that the God of Light made all the Relics instead of each god making 2 Relics attuned to their own domains.

But a lot of it was simply that Choice simply seemed like a much better choice for the God of Darkness. Light was the one who was all about following the rules, order and just seemed more knowledgeable in general. Meanwhile Darkness was far more impulsive, free spirited and willing to not just do whatever the hell he wanted but also help other people do what they wanted if they asked nicely. I'm still convinced that if Salem had either gone to him first or even been honest about seeking him out because his brother was a dickbag then he would have stood by his decision to revive Ozma instead of turning on Salem.


It just seemed more fitting too. After all Choice in the real world is pretty intristicly tied with the Problem of Evil. Like, evil is bad but if evil was never an option then free will couldn't exist. So the addition of Darkness to humans so that there was something else they could choose besides Light seemed like a better fit for the source of Choice.


And finally there is the design of the Relics that the God of Light made:



A bit odd for a God of Choice to put a bunch of slave imagery on their creations isn't it? Not to mention that while Jinn seems to have some degree of choice in how she interacts with people and their questions (or lack thereof) the narrative is strongly implying that she and the other Relics have no choice but to follow the rules laid out for them.

If Salem asks Jinn a question then Jinn seemingly HAS to answer her question even if she really doesn't want to.
If someone takes the Staff of Creation and asks it do do X thing then it has to do X thing even if doing so means dropping one city onto another city and killing millions of people.

For that matter the limitations of the Relics seem extremely artificial and more rule based (as in "the lawmakers have decided that you are not allowed to do these things") than based on any naturally arising limitations in how much power they have or whatever. The Staff only being able to perform one task at once even when that task is lifting several moutain ranges+a city+bedrock instead of just doing a bunch of less energy intensive tasks feels very much like something someone in charge decided on rather than a true practical limitation.




Now the thing is. The Fairy Tales of Remnant are interesting. But they are not supposed to be cold hard facts. In fact most of them are explicetly straight up not true, or at least get a ton of stuff wrong. Because they're in-universe legends composed by fallible people who don't have all the facts and so insert their own ideas, biases and best guesses.

So it's quite possible that the legends are wrong and Choice actually didn't come from Light. In which case the fact that Light made all the Relics gave me an idea for a unifying theme for the Relic spirits. All of the spirits could be mythological creatures that were at some point chained down and enslaved for refusing to submit to the gods.

Jinn already fits the bill on that one to a tee.

Choice and Creation I'm less sure how would be played up.


But Destruction? I recently remembered a perfect fit for that who would work even better than my previous guess of Lady of the Lake / Surtur.






If something from Norse Mythology would be used I figured it must be Surtr, because he is a great big fire giant that helps destroy the world with his extremely famous sword of destruction. But then I remembered that Fenrir is actually also associated with swords and in a way much closer to how Jinni are assocaited with lamps.

A Jinn was trapped inside a lamp like a prison, Fenrir had a sword shoved into his mouth to prevent him from breaking free after being chained down. If there are any crowns or staffs that held important roles in imprisoning (physically or spiritually) mythological beings/figures then we might have a good guess of who the other two Relics are. Assuming this theory of mine isn't off base that is.

edit: Fun note on this theory now that we have more information. Merlin was trapped inside a tree or a block of crystal or something by his apprentice. So he actually fits the theme pretty well.


It could be that Light really is Choice. In which case nevermind I suppose?

edit5: Also speaking of the Blue Fairy:


Personal note: I find it funny that if Mr Blue here is the Blue Fairy then RT managed to make my theory that the Staff spirit would be male (as a counter to Jinn) while also making him the blue fairy (something that blindsided me a bit due to Fria) simply by doing what they've already done plenty of times before and just switching his gender from the original version. Gender bending ahoy, great way to mess with our expectations. :p





Some of us noticed the Cordovin propaganda poster in the background in previous episodes. Here we see it again and it's inclusion in the show was indeed very deliberate.






 
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Given the speed they're resolving these plots, imagine they just finish the Vacuo Arc at the end of Volume 8.
 
So, uh... clarification on what the rules are for using the Staff of Creation? Because from the couple hints in the spoilers here so far indicate that, basically, I should throw out any ideas I have so far such as making a separate anti-gravity staff* to hold up Atlas to free up the Staff of Creation for other shit.

*Fun fact: this idea actually came from a joke over on QQ involving Jaune using the SoC to resurrect Pyrrha... and make a couple of smoothies.
 
how to approach the Pyhrra question for Jaune. he puts on the crown of choice and what if's a life with her in it. Boom 80 years of memories and then he takes it off

Idea they have a bomb and a extra dimensional space that if you fall off the walk ways = BAD end. force bad guys to fight in the world between location with the bomb in there leave with the bad guys inside, boom they all fall forever

atlas hitting the ground is going to be a bigger boom then long memory, that whole force of grimm is getting dusted.
Salem finally pulls herself together, she looks up and OH shit KAboomm

Winter asserted dominance shes the boss now, without the weight of the world on him James can start recovering from the stress and poor life choices
 
basically, I should throw out any ideas I have so far such as making a separate anti-gravity staff* to hold up Atlas to free up the Staff of Creation for other shit.
Yeah, 'cause as soon as the SoC is used to make anything subsequent to that other staff, that other staff would crumble to dust and Atlas would still fall.

But really, good riddance.
 
Yeah, 'cause as soon as the SoC is used to make anything subsequent to that other staff, that other staff would crumble to dust and Atlas would still fall.

But really, good riddance.
Oh yeah, I'm sure that's what people in Remnant would say and not "Holy fuck! ATLAS WENT BOOM! Salem won and now she's going to destroy all!"
 
Well, I did not expect that to be how they resolve things with Penny. I like it though it's sad we lost the robo stuff.
 
So basically, No Ontological Inertia, huh? …Wow, that is fucking useless. I expected better than that.

It's probably a deliberate choice on the GoL's part to make sure people can't just use it to build their whole society and infrastructure for them, and also forces them to really pick and choose what particular project they want magicked up for them. Same reason Jinn can only answer 3 questions a century; otherwise, there'd be no reason to ever bother trying to discover new things, because you could just bombard her with questions 24/7 to find out literally everything you want.

The Relics are meant to be a helping hand, not a four-part strategy to magicking up a Clarktech society.
 
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