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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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Left-Hand Mutant said:
He researed all those seals at once because the plan said to, I think.
The genin seals were apparently fine, it was researching 4SoP without SSA that got us.
I believe we spent SSA on RRB and Rift Seal 0
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No, he doesn't have time to do all those seals at once. He can only do 3 seals + Prime with the 14 training blocks he has after notes and Asuma, each seal takes 4 training blocks.
 
acidshill said:
I'm a little confused about how this sealing failure happened—are we going to get to see the research rolls? Why the hell was Hazou researching every single genin seal at once? What was even going on with SSA?
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The sequence went like this:
  1. The players voted in a complicated plan involving lots of research
  2. @Paperclipped , being the brilliant and organized and helpful person he is, figured out the exact sequence of research and put together a document that clearly outlined when each roll happened and what the outcomes were. All of the rolls were successful except the last one, which had a failure
  3. I didn't get to that point in the update until 2am and was determined to push it out without delaying to Monday, when I wouldn't have been able to finish until late in the evening after work
  4. I went through Paper's document quickly and didn't pay enough attention, so I misunderstood who was doing what when and I assumed that all of the research was happening at the same time
  5. The plan called for Hazō to do two seals with SSA, thereby ensuring he had two Mild Consequences. I didn't want to dive into the timeline details to figure out exactly which of those were in effect by the time he talked to Ma and Pa, so I chose to say that they were not in effect at the time of the psychic attack but that he still picked them up after the fact, meaning that he ended up with Mild+Mild+Medium Consequences
  6. I did all the "psychic attack" rolls and, in the process, forgot that Hazō was out of FP after the encounter with the Sages.
The mistake in step 4 probably doesn't matter, or doesn't matter very much. Hazō would have had either the same number of clones out or one fewer, depending. They would have been doing things other than sealing but they still would have been there. The same psychic echo would have hit all of them and bounced around the same way that it did here.

The decision in step 5 either matters a lot or doesn't matter very much.
  • If both SSA Consequences were in effect then Hazō would have been down 8 points and failed most of the rolls, meaning he would have taken more damage and probably died or at least ended up with a Severe Consequence
  • If only one of the SSA Consequences was in effect then he would have failed one additional roll, meaning another round of attacks at a reduced number. He might or might not have taken damage from that. (Someone can do the math if they want.)
  • If Hazō survived the psychic attack without taking more than a single Mild Consequence, I could have decided that he passed on using SSA for one of his subsequent research rolls. He would therefore have ended up with the two Mild Consequences that were expected instead of two Milds and a Medium. Also, one of the Milds would have healed in 24 hours instead of the 48 that SSA Consequences take. On the other hand, a Medium heals in a week so it's not really that big a deal.
The mistake in step 6 matters a lot, because Hazō would have died without those FP.

Were I to go back and retcon this, I would do it all properly. I would figure out where in the timeline Hazō had the Consequences in order to know what penalties to apply on the psychic attack rolls. If he survived then I would have him bail on doing further SSA research so he might have ended up with only a Mild+Mild instead of the Mild+Mild+Medium that he ended up with. On the other hand, he would have had to do the psychic attack rolls without FP and probably would have died. Yay for EJ's brain being made of cheese?

(Oh, also: retcons are grumpy-making, so the "QM had fun" XP for the seal failure would go away.)
 
Hey, this is seriously spoon-draining to even read, let alone engage with. Let's drop it. QM made a statement as a WoG. That is enough to know what color the sky is on the Seventh Path, that should be enough here.

New topic.

We have an utter buttload of money. A truckload. Fat Stacks. We're loaded. Let's use that money to buy a THer's time.

I'm thinking Lightning Element, to help our clan members (who are amusingly weighted towards Lightning Element for being natives of Fire Country). Or, failing that, Water Element?

What do y'all think? AoE is a slot filled by Goo Bombs, debuffs are covered by seals/MARS, defense is covered by Ghost Scales, so... attack jutsu?

Edit: ninja'd,
 
eaglejarl said:
I did all the "psychic attack" rolls and, in the process, forgot that Hazō was out of FP after the encounter with the Sages.
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So he spent all 4 of his FP on socials and did sealing research anyways? Is this because we didn't include a line about 'hazōpilot's best judgment' or 'do not proceed if insufficient FP'?

I'm trying to figure out how this happened and how to prevent it in the future, because a surprise lack of FP makes it really difficult to plan sealing research, even if EJ made a lucky mistake this time.
 
acidshill said:
So he spent all 4 of his FP on socials and did sealing research anyways? Is this because we didn't include a line about 'hazōpilot's best judgment' or 'do not proceed if insufficient FP'?

I'm trying to figure out how this happened and how to prevent it in the future, because a surprise lack of FP makes it really difficult to plan sealing research, even if EJ made a lucky mistake this time.
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Sounds like Hazō used two FP on prior research rolls, two FP convincing Ma and Pa to help us, and then the sealing failure happened.
 
Ipsos Custodes said:
That phrasing "related to the EM nuke" is interesting, not "related to the storm/seal failure from a few months ago" unless that's just QM shorthand for "all things related to that topic."
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Yes, it is QM shorthand for "all things related to that topic."


ProperAttorney said:
Is there anything we can do to make this easier on the QMs? Hopefully besides just sticking to one or two projects at a time.
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Nah, you did fine. This is on me for not paying sufficient attention due to poor time management and resulting sleep deprivation.
 
eaglejarl said:
The sequence went like this:
  1. The players voted in a complicated plan involving lots of research
  2. @Paperclipped , being the brilliant and organized and helpful person he is, figured out the exact sequence of research and put together a document that clearly outlined when each roll happened and what the outcomes were. All of the rolls were successful except the last one, which had a failure
  3. I didn't get to that point in the update until 2am and was determined to push it out without delaying to Monday, when I wouldn't have been able to finish until late in the evening after work
  4. I went through Paper's document quickly and didn't pay enough attention, so I misunderstood who was doing what when and I assumed that all of the research was happening at the same time
  5. The plan called for Hazō to do two seals with SSA, thereby ensuring he had two Mild Consequences. I didn't want to dive into the timeline details to figure out exactly which of those were in effect by the time he talked to Ma and Pa, so I chose to say that they were not in effect at the time of the psychic attack but that he still picked them up after the fact, meaning that he ended up with Mild+Mild+Medium Consequences
  6. I did all the "psychic attack" rolls and, in the process, forgot that Hazō was out of FP after the encounter with the Sages.
The mistake in step 4 probably doesn't matter, or doesn't matter very much. Hazō would have had either the same number of clones out or one fewer, depending. They would have been doing things other than sealing but they still would have been there. The same psychic echo would have hit all of them and bounced around the same way that it did here.

The decision in step 5 either matters a lot or doesn't matter very much.
  • If both SSA Consequences were in effect then Hazō would have been down 8 points and failed most of the rolls, meaning he would have taken more damage and probably died or at least ended up with a Severe Consequence
  • If only one of the SSA Consequences was in effect then he would have failed one additional roll, meaning another round of attacks at a reduced number. He might or might not have taken damage from that. (Someone can do the math if they want.)
  • If Hazō survived the psychic attack without taking more than a single Mild Consequence, I could have decided that he passed on using SSA for one of his subsequent research rolls. He would therefore have ended up with the two Mild Consequences that were expected instead of two Milds and a Medium. Also, one of the Milds would have healed in 24 hours instead of the 48 that SSA Consequences take. On the other hand, a Medium heals in a week so it's not really that big a deal.
The mistake in step 6 matters a lot, because Hazō would have died without those FP.

Were I to go back and retcon this, I would do it all properly. I would figure out where in the timeline Hazō had the Consequences in order to know what penalties to apply on the psychic attack rolls. If he survived then I would have him bail on doing further SSA research so he might have ended up with only a Mild+Mild instead of the Mild+Mild+Medium that he ended up with. On the other hand, he would have had to do the psychic attack rolls without FP and probably would have died. Yay for EJ's brain being made of cheese?

(Oh, also: retcons are grumpy-making, so the "QM had fun" XP for the seal failure would go away.)
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So, question about the general ruling of the sealing failure attacking us. In the jutsu doc, the Shadow clone rules say that any consequences stemming from the same event don't stack. Rules as written, the worst case scenario is (failing and dying, or getting a severe) what we got, failing at least one roll.

Was this sealing failure meant to sidestep that? Rules for reference
When a clone pops, its Physical Consequences are not transferred back to its creator. Mental Consequences do transfer back to the original, with the caveat that Mental Consequences that were created by a given event do not stack with themselves and therefore are not transferred.
In this context, an 'event' is something that happens at a single point in time and is caused by a single source.
When a Prime receives Consequences from their clone then, as always, if the given Consequence slot is full then a Consequence will roll up to the next available slot.
Examples where the Consequences DO transfer from a Shadow Clone back to its creator:
Hazō Prime has no Consequences. He creates a Shadow Clone, who also has no Consequences. The clone gets hit with a genjutsu and acquires the Mild Mental Consequence "Jumpy". When the clone pops, this Consequence will be transferred back to Hazō Prime and he will have the Mild Mental Consequence "Jumpy".
Hazō Prime has no Consequences. He creates a Shadow Clone, who also has no Consequences. Hazō gets hit with Orochimaru's jōnin aura, giving Hazō the Mild Mental Consequence "Cowed".Itachi hits the clone with a genjutsu and the clone acquires the Mild Mental Consequence "Jumpy". When the clone pops, the clone's Mild Consequence will be transferred back to Hazō Prime, whose Mild slot is already full. The Consequence will then roll up into his Medium slot, leaving him with Mild ("Cowed") and Medium ("Jumpy"). (Note that it doesn't matter if the genjutsu and the aura happen at the same time or at different times, the key point is that they are separate events because they come from separate sources.)
Hazō has no Consequences. He creates three Shadow Clones, all of whom have no Consequences. The four of them go off and do seal research on the Activation Relay Seal, the Air Tunneler Seal, the Light Relay seal, and the BecomusGodus seal respectively. Each of them makes an infusion roll for their assigned seal. Each of them has the Sealing Scroll Acolyte stunt, so each of them suffers a Mild Mental Consequence. These Consequences were caused by separate events (that individual making a roll), so when the clones pop, their Consequences will transfer back to Hazō. He starts with his own Mild Consequence and then receives three more. The first rolls up into his Medium slot, the second rolls up into his Severe slot, and the third one renders him Taken Out, which in this context probably means dead.
Examples where the Consequences do NOT transfer:
Hazō Prime has no Consequences. He makes a sealing research roll. Because of his Sealing Scroll Acolyte stunt (SSA), he receives a Mild Mental Consequence, perhaps "Psychic Headache". He creates a Shadow Clone. The clone has the same "Psychic Headache" Consequence. When it pops, this Consequence is not transferred back to Hazō because it was caused by the same event -- Hazō's use of SSA.
Hazō Prime has been drugged and has a Mild 'Hallucinating' Mental Consequence. He creates a Shadow Clone. The clone also has that Mild Consequence and is hallucinating. When it pops, this Consequence is not transferred back to Hazō because it was caused by the same event -- Hazō's being drugged.
Hazō Prime has no Consequences. He creates a Shadow Clone, who also has no Consequences. Hazō and his clone simultaneously get hit with Orochimaru's jōnin aura, giving both of them the Mild Mental Consequence "Cowed". When the clone pops, this Consequence is not transferred back to Hazō because it was caused by the same event -- Orochimaru attacking with his aura. (Note that this is an example and should not be used as evidence for or against the idea that it's possible to aura blast multiple people at once.)
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Especially relevant bits (as far as I can tell) bolded <3
 
eaglejarl said:
Were I to go back and retcon this, I would do it all properly. I would figure out where in the timeline Hazō had the Consequences in order to know what penalties to apply on the psychic attack rolls. If he survived then I would have him bail on doing further SSA research so he might have ended up with only a Mild+Mild instead of the Mild+Mild+Medium that he ended up with. On the other hand, he would have had to do the psychic attack rolls without FP and probably would have died. Yay for EJ's brain being made of cheese?
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Clearly it is the hand of Jashin saving us, not even the QMs are save from his powers. Quick, let's do more bandit clearing missions
 
[X] Things we should probably do
Duration: 10 days or less
Word Count: 218
  • Sealing Failure
    • Hazō, Noburi and combat summons to investigate that the failure is not continuing to get worse.
      • Priority is failure analysis. Clearing the cave comes later.
    • Set off "Sealing Failure" banshee alarm code.
    • Block opening until forces are ready
      • Kagome explosive assistance?
      • Force Walls and traps?
      • Skyslicers along the opening?
      • Straight up rocks?
    • Once Kei arrives, ask Panashe to investigate caverns.
  • Asuma, Kagome
    • Inform of sealing failure.
    • Cave system discovered just outside Leaf.
      • Already existed?
    • Extent is unknown, could lead into the city.
    • Ask Kagome for expert opinion.
    • If situation is out of control, request assistance in clearing the cave.
      • ANBU/jonin strike force, authorizing Zoo rush, mobilizing Leaf S-rankers.
    • If situation is in control, use only Goketsu resources to avoid giving up potential looting rights.
  • Cave Diving
    • Recover from consequences if time permits.
    • Prepare seals to outfit assault forces.
    • Hazō, Kei, Noburi, Kagome prepare combat summons.
    • Send SCs in first.
      • If combat level appropriate
        • Buy 3 FP (-30 XP).
        • Have Noburi fill SCs chakra.
        • Distribute seals.
        • Willing chunin+ Goketsu investigate cave system.
          • Give black paper MARS ahead of time so they can practice.
      • If SC are dying, use Zoo rush + more SC instead
  • Sealing
    • If Hazo waits to heal:
      • Days 1-2 recover from SSA milds.
      • Days 3-10 SC and Prime prep RRB and Rift Seal 0.
 
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eaglejarl said:
On the other hand, he would have had to do the psychic attack rolls without FP and probably would have died.
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Naaaah, no way that could've happened, Lord Jashin would've bailed us out. 😎 He can't afford to let us die, He has too much invested in us, we're too big to fail now. 😎😎😎

Nothing meaningful would change in a retcon, so it's not warranted!
 
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[X] Gōketsu claim their new mine
Round up all chūnin+ Gōkestu available in the village. Pen a missive to Asuma explaining the situation, that are currently handling a localized sealing failure at one of the Gōketsu research facilities. There's no immediate danger, though the failure revealed a mass of presumably hostile creatures near Leaf.

Clearing the cave: Yuno is our cavalry, held in reserve to bail non-summons out. She is under strict orders to engage as hard, fast, and little as possible.

Jin, Haru, and various summons will be our front line, focusing on crowd control and minimizing damage
Ninjutsu specs in the midline, focusing in aoe damage and crowd control, RW specs in the back line focused on anything that breaks through the front line and/or strong single targets
 
[X] Things we should probably do

Thanks, I know it was a bit nitpicky but considering the bold red message about it I didn't want any ambiguity there.
 
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