@Zampano , while obviously none of these are serious plans since we've already decided against the XP rewind, pedantry compels me to comment on them.
Training Plan: Rune Slave
+ Earthshaping from 50 (current) -> 60 (555 XP)
* this is Hazo's "calligraphy" stat for runes afaik. We should try and avoid infusion failures when prepping for the attack. If Hazo can carve runes flawlessly then maybe Oro will let him survive the next 5 months.
Quite apart from the fact that significant chunks of the hivemind would (figuratively) murder you for trying, Hazō doesn't have the pyramid space to support another 60 at the moment.

Training Plan: Fiscal independence
+ BoC from 1 (current) -> 46 (540.5 XP assuming 1/2 cost due to ES being an earth jutsu at higher level)
* Hazo needs to be able to make substrate and this is the specific jutsu to do that.
There's little obvious reason to level BoC beyond 30; we just need it to make substrate, and it can do that at level 30. It's possible it could do it faster and/or more chakra-efficiently at higher Effects, but otherwise the only reason to level it beyond 30 is if we wanted to use it as a Calligraphy stat for rune creation in order to do that "directly extrude chakra-conductive stone" thing that it allows. And even then, if we levelled BoC we'd unlock Earth Element Apprentice and get the 1/5 capped-bonus from Earthshaping, so there'd be no reason to level it beyond 40.

Training Plan: Social Smoothing
+ Deceit from 24 (current) -> 40 (520 XP)
* Shrimply lie to Oro about how much we have prepared for the attack
This one's fine in principle. Oro's Deceit is probably still too high for this to let us lie to him, but maybe it isn't; and Hazō would need another 20 for this to work, but we could raise another Earth ninjutsu to fill that slot for a relatively low cost (or eat some of the TH notes and push TH to 29 or something). It would mess up our ability to raise Ath and Alt in future, though.

Training Plan: Minatosealing:
+ Technique Hacking from 11 -> 35 (575 XP)
* I believe there are TH notes we haven't eaten because of Stagnancy rules. But after rolling back CR, this plan would need 190 XP to get to TH 40 and then 125XP to lock in the Minatosealing Stunt.
TH is doublecost, but since we have 1000 TH notes XP banked, we could level TH to 40 with the notes XP plus 530 normal XP (plunging ourselves into the icy wastes of stagnancy in doing so). However, I wouldn't expect the QMs to allow us to spend XP earned before we swallowed the notes on a stunt which we could only buy with the TH we got by swallowing the notes, so we likely wouldn't be able to buy Minatosealing even if we had enough XP for it saved up.

Training Plan: save for Lightning
+ what if we didn't spend any of it and just saved for the Lightning + SotS build?
This is probably less efficient than just raising Ath and Tai. SotS provides a 3xAB bonus without self-damage, which would give us effective +15 on Ath and Tai at current levels, for 1000 XP plus a few hundred XP for combination stunts. But for that much XP, we could do:
  • Ath 37 -> 49 = 522 XP
  • Tai 40 -> 56 = 776 XP
Which gives us comparable bonuses without needing to spend chakra or a Supplemental. Granted SotS can provide larger boosts if we have it deal self-damage, but raising our base stats gives us the benefit immediately and is better for our build-path in the long run.


Honestly, if we were doing the rewind, I'd be pushing either for pushing Ath as far as we can go (doesn't help us against Akatsuki but helps a lot against random other ninja) or starting what I think is the official build-path of buying the combination stunts for Chakdar+Banshee Slayers and Roki+RRBs and then raising Ath. I'm fine with more CR, though, even if it doesn't let us summon Cannai it's good to have for other reasons.
 
Chapter 9β: Seduction by Deduction
Chapter 9β: Seduction by Deduction

"...and after the Yamanaka are done sucking all my secret lore out of my head through a hollow straw, they can just shove lupchanzen in my ears and lock me in a sealing workshop to make weapons of mass destruction for them for the rest of my life, is that the plan? Well, you weren't smart enough to trick old Kagome, you stinkers! This time, I'm going to–"

"Kagome-sensei!" Hazō interrupted. "There aren't any lupchanzen in Leaf."

"That's what you would say, isn't it, you… you sympathiser!"

Hazō hadn't heard so much vitriol packed into a single word since one of Yuno's students tried to introduce her to the philosophical concept of conservationism.

"What's a lupchanzen?" Akane asked innocently, conveniently redirecting Kagome-sensei's attention. "It sounds like a rare flower."

"Actually, that's not far off," Hazō said. "They're half-plant, half-animal hybrids that enter your brain through your ears and take over your body. They also have perfect access to your memories, so it's impossible for anyone to tell you've been taken over."

Akane took a step back. "And you're saying, with your future knowledge, that those are real?"

"Uh." Hazō glanced at Kagome-sensei. "I'm not saying they're not real, but I've also never seen any myself, or met anyone other than Kagome-sensei who's heard of them."

"Oh. Ohh."

"Of course they're real!" Kagome-sensei exclaimed. "You'll find out if we go to Leaf, only by then it'll be too late because you'll all be the Sage's mindslaves! Well, I'm not letting them take me down with you, you–"

"Leaf is safe," Hazō said, for far from the first time. "I mean, not from assassination or getting caught up in other people's sealing failures or being executed for treason, but those are just daily occupational hazards of being a ninja. In the alpha timeline, I knew a Yamanaka really well, and I can tell you she would never suck your memories out of your head just because she wanted your secrets."

"Oh, you knew her really well, did you?" Kagome-sensei spat. "I'm sure that'll be a great comfort to the rest of us when the Sage finds out you've got future memories and sends his goons with their genjutsu seals and their–"

"Kagome," Mari said placatingly. "You have to make allowances for Hazō. He's still young and naive. I bet he didn't even know there was such a thing as truth serums. The fact is, though, that we're trying to take on a major conspiracy to take over the world using experimental technology too powerful for the hand of man, isn't that right?"

"It's trying to take over the world using ancient secrets best left forgotten," Kagome-sensei corrected her. "Common mistake, that. Completely different threat profile."

"See?" Mari asked. "Amateurs like us are completely out of our depth here. I'm scared to think what they're going to do to me if I walk into Leaf unprepared. That's why we need you. Not just because you're part of the team, but because you're the only expert who knows what to watch out for. You've already agreed that we need to stand and fight this terrible threat instead of letting Akatsuki have their way. That means we can't avoid putting ourselves in some danger. The rest of us will do it on our own if we have to, but if we want to have a chance, we need someone who knows about the lupchanzen and the Sage and the Yamanaka and all that to help point the way so we can overcome all these challenges together."

Mari gently clasped Kagome-sensei's hands in hers. "I know I don't have any right to ask this of you after everything you've already been through. But please… will you help us?"

Kagome-sensei averted his gaze. "I, uh, I mean, that is…

"I guess I'll think about it," he muttered very quietly.

Hazō's love for Mari notwithstanding, the woman was a monster. He was very glad her beta self had decided she was on their side.

"If I may redirect the conversation towards some semblance of sanity," Kei said, "you have yet to explain why we should attempt to gain entrance to the Village Hidden in the Leaves, where our names are most assuredly in the Bingo Book–or at least Inoue-sensei's and possibly Ishihara's are, considering the insignificance of the rest of us. Convinced as I am that Ishihara's philosophy is guaranteed to grant her an early audience with the Reaper, I am disinclined to risk myself purely for the sake of accelerating the process."

"Aww, thank you." Akane beamed. "I really appreciate that."

"It was intended to be a poorly-veiled insult."

Was it Hazō, or were those two even worse in the beta timeline?

"In answer to your question," Hazō interrupted the building half-argument, "we can't stay missing-nin forever. You said it yourself: global problems need global resources to solve. But we can't go back to Mist, at least not while Yagura's there, and Leaf is the only other place for which I have useful foreknowledge. Also, I don't know anywhere near as much about Rock, Sand, or Cloud as I need to, but culturally, I think Leaf is the closest to what we need. They have a notion of ninja as shepherds to the civilian population, even if they don't always live up to it in practice, and a tradition of leaders who are happy to invest resources in making the world a better place as long as it's put to them in terms of direct benefit to the village.

"Also, Leaf is where all the secret power multipliers are. We're in several races against time, and while I'm sure together we're badass enough to find equivalents elsewhere eventually, I don't think we can justify that gamble. There are other reasons too, which are probably better delved into as they come up. I learned a lot about Leaf over my years of living there."

Not least was that without Kei getting the Shadow Clone Technique, Snowflake would never exist. There was an argument to be made that this didn't mean anything–his Snowflake was forever gone, and he didn't owe anything to a completely unrelated person who didn't even exist–but for some reason, it wasn't an argument Hazō could make. It wasn't that there was anything rational about it. It was just that it would just be… too sad to know about the possibility of Snowflake and go, "I won't help this person exist because it would be too inconvenient". Hazō was very grateful that there were enough other reasons to go to Leaf that he didn't have to weigh that one on any scales.

He'd have to let Kei know in advance. He remembered the pain of Snowflake's awakening, and surely she'd be spared that if she knew immediately that she'd be welcomed and accepted. But it would also be another point of divergence from the people he remembered and understood.

"All right," Mari said. "I'm willing to play along with the why, though you can bet I'll be wanting more details later. What about the how? It was going to be a job and a half to sell Hidden Swamp to the Hokage back when we were a small army. Now we're just an extra-large genin team plus Kagome, and one of us is their traitor–no offence, Akane, sweetie. We know your story.

"Not to mention," she went on, "that we somehow need to get Leaf's attention without being summarily murdered by hunter-nin. Jōnin missing-nin are kill-on-sight, and that goes double for genjutsu users."

"Piece of cake," Hazō told her. "First, we get ourselves two summoners. That's over a third of what Leaf already has. That easily gets Jiraiya's attention, and he knows better than to steal scrolls and start off on the wrong foot with their clans when he can cultivate us as assets and see what we're worth. Then we contact him using his spy network. I was never an expert, but I remember one or two people and passwords. Then we earn his trust with an off-the-books mission and get Air Dome seals as a reward. From there, Leaf's ours for the taking."

"Air Domes?" Mari asked.

"Standard defensive seal," Kagome-sensei said. "Like Earth Dome, only you can see through it, so you know what the enemy's up to."

"It uses two seal elements placed on the ground," Hazō elaborated, drawing a basic diagram on the ground with a stick. The rest of the team crowded around him to see, Kei staying well back and unfortunately having a hard time seeing anything as a result. "It generates a dome of frozen air between them, with the elements on the inside. It's about as tough as granite, so you can break through it with explosives or good ninjutsu, but it takes effort, and in the meantime, the user is free to prepare on the inside."

"Sounds useful," Mari said. "You can buy time while you use enhancement techniques, and transparent barriers don't block genjutsu–except that the enemy's safe too, and they have way more freedom to manoeuvre."

"It's not all-powerful," Hazō admitted. "It still saved my life once."

"Fine," Mari said. "What makes it important?"

"Oh, that's simple." Hazō grinned. "Want to know how to use one simple seal to revolutionise warfare forever?"

Everyone tensed in anticipation.

"Go on."

Hazō showed them a cupped hand.

"Turn it upside down."

He flipped his hand over dramatically.

Noburi was the first to react. "I don't get it. Is this some kind of metaphor?"

"That doesn't make sense," Kagome-sensei agreed. "The seals don't work unless they're aligned on a firm surface, and the effect fails if they move. You can't just stick them in the air and hope for something to happen."

Kei slowly walked around the group, stopping across from Hazō so the diagram was upside down to her.

"One could maintain the alignment by also rotating the ground 180 degrees," she said thoughtfully. "A cave would suffice, though cave ceilings are rarely even unless sculpted. Would the earth kami pull the dome down, or is frozen air antithetical to their domain?"

"The latter," Hazō said. "As long as the seals are in place, the dome can't move. Do you want me to explain, or..."

"Please do not," Kei said. "I have been starved for an intellectual challenge of late."

"I still don't see it," Kagome-sensei asked. "The earth kami would still pull you down, and what's the good of lying at the bottom of the dome like when Wakahisa leaves green peppers in the bowl like a little kid?"

"Hey, I don't–"

"Quiet, please. Deny me this opportunity, and I promise I will redirect all my unsated intellectual hunger to the question of revenge."

Noburi shuddered.

"The point, however, is valid," Kei said. "Even with tree walking to remain attached to the ceiling, no advantage is gained. However, Kurosawa previously provided a hint by alluding to a seal that allows shinobi to walk on air, surely no coincidence. A cave ceiling thus cannot be the solution.

"Does it need to be the ground," she asked after more thought, "or is any firm surface acceptable?"

"That time it saved me, I used it on the floor indoors," Hazō said.

"So a ceiling would also suffice," Kei reasoned. "Again, however, no advantage is gained. Walking on air is useful only outdoors. An artificial ceiling outdoors… perhaps some manner of plank?"

Hazō didn't say anything, waiting.

"But without the structural support of the rest of the building, if you released the plank after activating the seal, it would just… Oh."

"Yeah."

"How counter-intuitive," Kei said. "Even so, you would still be faced with the problem raised by Kagome… But no, I am a fool. One can model the plank as a one-dimensional line connecting opposing points on the circumference of a circle, ignoring the third dimension. Assuming arbitrary width, one can simply climb out of the dome and be standing with no material connection to the ground.

"But the plank must be raised to a useful height in the first place, and presumably the dome will not form with the user's feet obstructing the necessary space. Jumping to activate the dome in mid-air? No, even if the seals could activate in motion, Kurosawa would not settle for a solution so inelegant. Ah, wait, a timer would suffice, allowing the user to hold the plank from the side instead of needing to touch the elements from underneath.

"I see now." Kei gave one of her rare smiles. "Assuming the first plank can be raised to a desired height, additional planks can be chained from it, creating a skybridge of arbitrary length. Obviously, the duration of the seal effect would be a limiting factor, but even a temporary skybridge would facilitate aerial travel between any two points. Of course, it would require optimisation to reduce the manual effort and material costs before traversing long distances could be practical, but presumably you have identified solutions. Lighter planks, custom seals, perhaps some process that could lay down the skybridge elements systematically while reducing human labour, after the fashion of wall-building ninjutsu… Furthermore, permanent skybridges are difficult to imagine given the manifold critical problems to be solved, but considering the transformative logistical implications… Kurosawa, you are a genius."

Um.

"That's… actually not where I was going with this," Hazō said carefully, while filing the concept of a skybridge away in the back of his mind (along with the question of exactly how Frozen Skein limitations affected somebody who only thought they were optimising somebody else's plan).

"Oh." Kei looked crestfallen. "Of course there was some ruinous flaw in my reasoning. It was hubristic of me to imagine that a genin of minimal talent like myself could rewrite military doctrine with nothing but a handful of hints."

"I never said that," Hazō said. "In fact, I have no idea if your suggestion would work. I just did something else–taking advantage of the fact that I know what sealmasters can do to modify seals. For example, a sealmaster of Kagome-sensei's calibre could change the trigger condition to be chakra emission, so you could activate the seal elements with tree walking."

"But what could you possibly… no, let me think."

They let Kei think, Mari visibly growing impatient, but apparently unwilling to incur Kei's wrath.

"You would be able to activate the seal with your feet, assuming a very thin plank. What would this achieve that a time delay on the seal would not? Running along the planks? No, the skybridge has been rejected. Some kind of two-plank arrangement, like the skis of Snow Country? I have always wished to attempt those. But no, I cannot allow myself to be distracted. Besides, the domes are defensive fortifications. They must be far too large."

"They can be miniaturised," Hazō said helpfully.

"They can?" Kei stared at him, wide-eyed. "Why did you not lead with that? If one can activate and deactivate multiple air domes simultaneously without interference–up to four, I assume–then it is possible to use some for support while placing others. If one alternates, of course it is possible to walk on air!"

The others looked at each other.

"Did you follow that?" Noburi asked Akane.

"I'm not sure. Maybe if I heard it again?"

"As mentioned, Kurosawa, you are a genius," Kei said, "and thank you for providing me with the most delicious puzzle I have enjoyed since… well, perhaps since my departure from Mist. Revolutionising military doctrine or not, your sheer creativity would surely have you married into the Mori Clan in short order were we still in the village."

"They grow up so young." Mari wiped an imaginary tear from her eye. "To think I would be hearing wedding bells after only a matter of months…"

Kei went bright red. "I-I did not mean myself! I was speaking in the hypothetical. That Kurosawa is unexpectedly adept at the art of flirtation does not suddenly mean I am some kind of… of stumpet!"

"A what?" Kagome-sensei asked.

"Highly inappropriate Mori slang," Mari said. "You know I never meant anything like that, Keiko dear."

She gave Hazō a "get on with it" signal with her eyes.

"In conclusion," Hazō said to the rest of the team, not looking at Kei just in case, "we have a Mori-certified way for ninja to walk on air, and all we have to do to get it is find a way to contact a murderous demigod who wants all of us, personally, dead and get him to give us some of his weapons. Luckily, if there's one thing I'm good at, it's persuading people not to murder me against their better judgement."
 
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Not least was that without Kei getting the Shadow Clone Technique, Snowflake would never exist. There was an argument to be made that this didn't mean anything–his Snowflake was forever gone, and he didn't owe anything to a completely unrelated person who didn't even exist–but for some reason, it wasn't an argument Hazō could make. It wasn't that there was anything rational about it. It was just that it would just be… too sad to know about the possibility of Snowflake and go, "I won't help this person exist because it would be too inconvenient". Hazō was very grateful that there were enough other reasons to go to Leaf that he didn't have to weigh that one on any scales.
What can I say? Man has his priorities in proper order.
 
Not least was that without Kei getting the Shadow Clone Technique, Snowflake would never exist. There was an argument to be made that this didn't mean anything–his Snowflake was forever gone, and he didn't owe anything to a completely unrelated person who didn't even exist–but for some reason, it wasn't an argument Hazō could make. It wasn't that there was anything rational about it. It was just that it would just be… too sad to know about the possibility of Snowflake and go, "I won't help this person exist because it would be too inconvenient". Hazō was very grateful that there were enough other reasons to go to Leaf that he didn't have to weigh that one on any scales.
HAZOU: Kei, there's no easy way to say this, but I don't want you, I want your sister.

KEI: You want Ami?

HAZOU: who?
 
The fact is, though, that we're trying to take on a major conspiracy to take over the world using experimental technology too powerful for the hand of man, isn't that right?"

"It's trying to take over the world using ancient secrets best left forgotten," Kagome-sensei corrected her. "Common mistake, that. Completely different threat profile."
I grabbed a quote of this while reading, thinking it would stand out as my favourite part of the chapter.

Boy did I underestimate you.
 
Is this even necessary for Hazo and Kagome? I get that Hazo lost most of his practical sealing experience, but Kagome seems familiar enough with the seal that he can research it himself without a reference seal.
I was thinking the same thing. I'm uncertain if Hazō kept any of his sealing skill but it seems like something he could just create by himself, if he had.

I don't think Velorien is prone to forgetting things like this, so Hazō must no longer have the ability to do it?
 
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Senju Clan bloodline, though Tsunade doesn't have it (as far as we know ...) and so there are no living users.
Shikamaru would like a word… He used Wood element at the Chuunin exam finals.

As such: yes, during the Battle of the Gods, the allied forces did summon various powerful combatants, but one of Pain's powers dispelled them as they arrived on the field, aside from Ma and Pa for whom we have an explanation but HDK what it is.
It's been said before and better, but I'm really grateful to y'all QMs for how you handled the summon boss thing. Y'all are great.
 
I was thinking the same thing. I'm uncertain if Hazō kept any of his sealing skill but it seems like something he could just create by himself, if he had.

I don't think Velorien is prone to forgetting things like this, so Hazō must no longer have the ability to do it?
IIRC it was said already that you can assume Hazou has lost all skills, seal downloads, stunts etc. He just has the knowledge of how he achieved them the first time (and maybe would pick it up quicker a second time?)

Is this even necessary for Hazo and Kagome? I get that Hazo lost most of his practical sealing experience, but Kagome seems familiar enough with the seal that he can research it himself without a reference seal.
Could be at the edges of Kagome's capabilities without notes for the dome?
 
Could be at the edges of Kagome's capabilities without notes for the dome?
Air Dome is allegedly a genin seal, according to the unofficial seal veterancy document. So it seems unlikely? I don't know how that difficulty was derived, we learned it way way before I even started following the quest and I have no idea what the mechanics were back then, but even if it's genin-with-notes Kagome could comfortably research chuunin seals when we met him IIUC.
 
Ouch. I can't believe I missed the fakery both times I read that chapter. (I did think it was legit, lol.)
In fairness, I think I kind of bought it the first time I read it too? It's not actually that unbelievable that the Nara would have Wood Element and keep it secret, so the fakery only becomes blatant once it occurs to you that both "Wood Element" techniques Shikamaru uses can be explained by storage seals. At which point you see all the pieces - but any individual piece isn't that weird on its own, so nothing stands out enough to force the hypothesis to occur to you if you don't think about it in too much depth because you're just reading a story and not thinking about the implications for a quest.

Edit: Especially since this is before the Five really come up in-story. Once you know the Nara already have a bloodline, it becomes much harder to believe that they have Wood Element.
 
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EDIT: This is a strange question but how much can a chakra-enhanced Hazou deadlift? If he can pick the blanks up he can shape them on the Seventh Path and Unsummon holding them.
So, the implication here is that Hazou can unsummon with anything that he's able to hold. However, we've previously made the following statement:
A summoner can reverse-summon extra mass equal to their own weight on a single trip, which needs to be held or attached to the summoner.
(This says reverse summoning, i.e. going to the Seventh Path, but it also applies to unsummoning, as the Summoning Technique is symmetrical both ways)

In the interest of pulling back the curtain here: Saying that a summoner can move as much as they can lift gets very thorny very fast. Even setting Hazou's chakra-boosted deadlift weight could come back to bite us in a dozen ways. Now, imagine if industrious players consider things like:
  • Getting equipment to let Hazou lift more, using abundant real-world knowledge about powerlifting.
  • Having others load a weight onto Hazou's back that he couldn't lift on his own, but can support for a bit.
  • Falling while holding onto a larger weight than you can hold -- you're both clearly connected and distinct from the rest of the world, in a "chakra's PoV" sense.
Overall, we think this is a big can of worms we'll never close if we let it be anything that a summoner can lift, so we're sticking to the previous answer of the summoner's body mass. This, at least, is easy to adjudicate.

Consequently, Hazou can transport up to 25-point blanks across the Paths. This covers everything he's researched except the largest size RER and RER 2.0.

Re: the objection about the largest Dragon scale:
He brought the Dragonbits back from the Seventh Path without using a storage seal, and they were heavy, he had to boost to lift them.
The Dragon parts are very clearly not ordinary matter -- in fact, it was explicitly noted by Orochimaru that they had some sort of exotic composition that reacted in a hostile way with regular matter. For whatever reason, despite being heavier than Hazou would normally be able to unsummon with, Hazou was somehow able to reverse summon with the largest Dragon scale.
 
Overall, we think this is a big can of worms we'll never close if we let it be anything that a summoner can lift, so we're sticking to the previous answer of the summoner's body mass. This, at least, is easy to adjudicate.

Consequently, Hazou can transport up to 25-point blanks across the Paths. This covers everything he's researched except the largest size RER and RER 2.0.
[X] Unseal and eat every ration uplift is carrying.
 
Alright, so we're now asking Oro to temporarily graft ~1000 kg of additional flesh onto Hazou's body, right? Can be something we can easily attach/detach in situ.
 
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