Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
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- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
1) He's recently been a bit introspective on the Kurosawa Question. Besides, its an opportunity for us to rake Shin over the coals a bit with the home court advantage.
2) She has a choice there? AFAICT she's at Ren's mercy if she wants to get anything she wants (Hazou) at all.
- Location
- Italy
No.
It's quite to opposite in my opinion.
Remember, we are talking about someone that is so fixated on her goal, that practically became a control freak incapable of doing anything that isn't being in control.
She isn't like that.
She doesn't want to be like that, but she still is.
What does it tell us?
That whatever her priorities are, these priorities are important that she willing to practically kill her own true self to make her own objective true.
This isn't the behavior of someone that plays around, this is the behavior of someone that believe in what she's doing, to the point of sacrificing the sanctity of her own mind.
No, in my opinion Ami has a plan, and it's something really important to her.
I'm of the opinion it's something big.
Personally i think she would try to use them, even if i don't think how successful such action would be
Kage is just a word, there is a person between the hat, and for Ren this is one her greatest regrets.
And it's not a threat, it's quite the opposite.
Hazou is saying "I decided to gave you a chance, a single one, to explain why all this happened", it's a single hope, that she probably never thought it would happen.
In exchange, Hazou is asking for nothing, quite literally.
We are not asking for Mist military secret or anything like that, we are asking for something deeply personal for the both of them, that at the end of the day have no value to anyone else.
Ren would give nothing up.
It's just a matter or priorities, does she cares enough about her relationship with her sister and Hazou to explain herself?Or she prefer...doing i don't really know what, because the second she doesn't do that Hazou would walk out of the room.
The situation would be simply:
Hazou:I want to know why you did what you.
Ren:No/Tries to change the argument.
Hazou:I see you care not for this and you have intention of mending what happened, goodbye.
A threat implies harm, we wouldn't be harming her, we would simply retract our proposal.
We offer possible forgiveness for an explanation.
Both are personal things, completely devoid of value for someone else.
She can accept, or she can refuse, but after our offer we don't need to offer anything else, and any other action would be a betrayal of ours proposal.
it's as simple as that.
With Hana to make sure everything goes okay...i'm more than okay with having her there too.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Elaborate?
Specify Shin.
- Location
- Why would this be required?
Yeah I'm sure that'll go over well, trying to convey that, as a traitor to the village kage and head of her clan, I'm sure it won't just come off as offensive and give Ren extra poltical clout to use on Jiraiya in favor of Mist.
I'm pretty sure her position as both the kage and the kurosawa head is more important to her, no matter how much she loves her sister.
I feel like you're severly overestimating both our worth in her eyes, and our ability to see through her manipulation. Ami is obvious because she wants to be obvious, she wants to come off like a crazy wild card. Ren could manipulate us and Hazo wouldn't even know it. Sure stats are stats but there's a reason she was good enough to take the hat in Mist. From the little we've seen of her, she's a political monster.
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- Location
- Yes.
Literally Googling "Threat" gives you "Ultimatum" as a synonym. And the definition of threat (a statement of an intention to inflict pain, injury, damage, or other hostile action on someone in retribution for something done or not done) and ultimatum (a final demand or statement of terms, the rejection of which will result in retaliation or a breakdown in relations) makes me think that they're really more or less the same thing here.
And anyone with a brain knows that Hazou's "possible forgiveness" is a pile of shit. Ren isn't giving up anything by saying no, and FMPOV she cares far less about Hazou's forgiveness than Hana's. Hazou saying that he'll retract the possibility of his forgiveness isn't a big deal for Ren. Ren's had all of...3 (?) conversations with Hazou.
It's just a feeling. That the Kurosawa that shows up will try to fuck us in some way, though perhaps not as stupidly as Kouta did given the situation (Kouta had Hidden Mountain to draw upon, Kurosawa has nobody).
- Location
- Italy
One can do both, you know?
We are not asking her to betray Mist, we are asking her to explain why we were exiled to clan and what is her opinion of that.
Ren sent Hana as envoy and she did that both as Mizukage and as her sister.
People brought this up time and time again.
How exactly would she manipulate us?What would she do that would force us to remain on the table?
I see the plan is not approved, so i'll stop.
But i would like to understand how? Aside from mind control.
Explain how, in the setting and context i made she would manipulate Hazou, because i can't understand how.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
My viewpoint here is that we have enough resources to draw upon and they have to play sufficiently nice that any subversive action taken by them would be countered easily.
It's not out of the question for them to have an assigned tail on their ass following them around the clock, they're a foreign agent in the middle of Leaf village.
Anyways, edits:
WC 393
[X] Action Plan: Getting it out the door
- Debrief the clan.
- Give Keiko the message.
- She might want to wait for Jiraiya to open it.
- Replay the meeting as closely as you can.
- Hazou's thoughts:
- Ami played with him again:
- Her gift was literally a series of distractions.
- The kunai being potentially dangerous is a thin excuse. She accepted the stamp with no hesitation.
- It's likely she wanted to do the striptease to begin with, and simply found a decent excuse.
- Mood swings very similar to the first meeting.
- Literal games. She wasn't even trying to pretend they weren't.
- Continued signs of disillusionment with the world's systems, and cynical fatalism.
- First meeting, it was about her friends being sent to their deaths by the village.
- This time, inter-clan marriages.
- That she "made sacrifices to remain outside this system" means she has leverage or an agreement with her clan head? Something else? Might be verifiable.
- Keiko clearly means something to Ami.
- She changed her tack from playful to stonewall immediately. Wouldn't even acknowledge the issue.
- She got genuinely angry when accused, and immediately turned it around.
- Went into a Frozen Skein trance, presumably making herself vulnerable. Getting the right answer was that important to her.
- Hazou takes the time to consider Ami's tactics, and think of both countermeasures, and ways of applying them himself.
- Debrief Jiraiya when he returns, if necessary.
- Clear the "to-do list" with Jiraiya:
- Mom
- To be clear: are you letting her become the ambassador again once the alliance goes through?
- Suggest politely
erhaps she can bring our dear cousin Shin to tag along as an apprentice ambassador?
- It would be a nice friendly gesture to Mist,Ren, and the Kurosawa and Shin would owe us for advancing his diplomat career.
- Shopping.
- We need lots of clothes for potential future disguises.
- Suggest: Mari might appreciate something nice.
- Acquire some merchants/craftsmen/musicians.
- Grant them writs of patronage/travel to allow them to come to Leaf/Fire?
- Purposes:
- Start up future businesses (of which we have a stake in).
- Consistent income stream is important.
- Start on a Merchant Intel network.
- Travelling musicians/performers sponsored by us would be good for PR.
- Go to the closing ceremony
- Be wary. It would be just our luck for something bad to happen.
- Mention these concerns to the J-man as well.
- Point out a security vulnerability: Sound magnification jutsu + Sonic attack = Very bad news
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- Yes.
She'd point out, and rightly so, that the decision to boot Hana (and likely a lot of the subsequent spite fuckery) wasn't her decision. Remember that after Hana married Shinji Ren was reinstated as clan heir, not clan head. She would then encourage us to ask the people who made the decision, namely the Kurosawa Elders/previous clan head. Who actually did make the decision.
Boom, suddenly Hazou not only doesn't get the answer he was looking for, he is put in the position where following through on the ultimatum would embarass him, while simultaneously making Ren out to be a more reasonable authority figure and also encouraging him to go to the viper's den that is the Kurosawa Clan, who give absolutely zero fucks about Hazou's forgiveness or lack thereof.
Or at least, this is what I would think of on the spur of the moment. I'm not actually politically inclined so Ren could certainly think of something better.
- Location
- Why would this be required?
[X] Action Plan: Getting it out the door
[X] Action Plan: Getting it out the door
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Instead of meeting with Ren 1v1 in a quasi-antagonistic fashion, how do people feel about meeting with her in a non 1v1 fashion just to ask her what her opinion is on the Hana and Hazou? In an earnest, off-the-record fashion kinda way. Just pitching the idea out there.
- Location
- The Void
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I am very on board with this
- Location
- Yes.
Yeah, this might be something we should do...
Something to note: we, the hivemind, know that Ino is aware of the phenomena of "personality manifolds" and that it is not treated as a clan secret. If a reason could be found to raise the subject of needing to understand a jounin's bizarre behavior for the good of Leaf she might well recognize it and inform Hazou.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Not something we have to take care of this plan, I don't think.
I'm a fan of "I can understand the reasons for why you acted the way you did, even if I don't fully agree with them. It would have been nice if you let me know what you were going to do though..."
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
It was, actually. Jiraiya offered that to her. Then she threw it in his face.
- Location
- Why would this be required?
Kind of a far in the future type question, but what type of elemental chakra were you guys thinking should be unlocked for Hazo? I was thinking fire, if mostly for temperature control jutsu. Plus you know, forged in fire, now part of fire country, will of fire, etc. It's sort of symbolic.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I'm of the opinion that there isn't much point in unlocking any additional elements for quite a while.
Maybe lightning, if Rasengan is actually super bullshit armor piercing.
More on that in a few hours.