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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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charlesrwest said:
Seriously. Time to propose truck seals. It would act as an olive branch to Mist, secure the clan's economic position and start giving the villages a reason to work together.

There will always be a fire. First 7th path, then Akane. Let's get this rolling while it can be in the same dinner!
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I disagree that there will always be a fire: we certainly don't have enough fires to keep us busy all month long. That said, with the Pangolins out of the way Truck Scrolls have risen from 'not right now' to 'one of a few things we should be doing', alongside the Akane situation and challenging Lee to a youthful competition of fixing our social skills and probably a couple other things.

That is to say, I'm now willing to start putting it in our plans and letting the QMs handle it and the other competing topics in whatever order they like.
 
I mean, we've been wanting Improved Storage Seal basically since Macerators so we should put this as a research priority. If we combine this with a bunch of caravans (and by that I mean like, a nondescript ox drawn cart with a nondescript ninja guard) we could fix a lot of this trade war shit.


Plan name:

[jk] Witness the TRUE POWER of "Doing the Thing" !


Anyone? Anyone?
 
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My calculations seem to indicate that we don't actually need an improved version to do most of what we would want to do. It would be nice, but I think the most important thing is to start the ball rolling in a way that most everyone who comes in contact with it benefits and wants to expand it.
 
Should we be worried that someone might sabotage the trunk storage seal network by sneaking bombs into it?

IIRC, someone said storage seals do actually indicate the object stored by changing symbols drawn on it?
 
Improved storage seals also give us better weapons. If we can up the mass by 10x and the velocity of Macerators v3 by 2x, we increase the yield by 40x.

This can only lead to good things.
 
Vecht said:
Improved storage seals also give us better weapons. If we can up the mass by 10x and the velocity of Macerators v3 by 2x, we increase the yield by 40x.

This can only lead to good things.
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Rule #1 of Sealing: A Sealmaster's contribution will invariably include at least one of the following: variation on storage seals, and variation on explosive.
 
Is this a bad time to point out you could make a pretty strong stationary motor if you could get a storage to store/unstore when it got close to a particular pair of points (or cycle based on a timer in a pinch)?
 
Anyone else think that Mari's reaction, while totally justified in and of itself, is weak evidence for her having a kid soon-ish? Or did we talk about that earlier.

I think getting Noburi checked out for shadow clone viability ASAP is key, since then he can just be the party face medic that also has combat prowess. Wait, will Noburi be the first to get a genin team!? (I'm not sure if I'm kidding or not).

Seal suggestion: Forward Arrow Seals
When activated, an inert/ mostly inert object (velocity < 5km/ hour?) Starts moving ~5km/ hour in a set direction. The larger the object, the shorter a distance the object will travel. Still subject to bumping into things and stopping.
 
Roomba said:
What if, after the second event, @eaglejarl created Team Downfall for the sole purpose of forcing us to actually punch in the fifth event (rather than the inevitable nonsense we would've gone for if we were still top ranked at that point)...
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Actually, Downfall was all @Velorien Blame him. I was glad, though.

Cariyaga said:
@eaglejarl Is this what he meant? That's much less alarming if so, and something we can do more to affect.
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You could ask him.

Noumero said:
So they still haven't figured out that Akatsuki are after the bijuu? Come on, they swooped in at the last moment, captured only the two containers, and ran. Ignored Jiraiya, didn't act until most of the other ninja were dead. Surely it's a fair guess?
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He knows that perfectly well. What in particular do they want the Beasts for?



Also, here's a thing that was completely transparent to everyone at the table but I think did not come through in the writing: Kagome was working really hard not to squee about the idea of doing research with Jiraiya. Hence his "yeah, I guess we could do that" schtick -- he didn't want to go full fanboy.
 
eaglejarl said:
Also, here's a thing that was completely transparent to everyone at the table but I think did not come through in the writing: Kagome was working really hard not to squee about the idea of doing research with Jiraiya. Hence his "yeah, I guess we could do that" schtick -- he didn't want to go full fanboy.
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Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

Makes sense.
 
Vecht said:
@Radvic already beat you to it.
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I was going to credit that one to you in the spirit of creditting all non-nuke related ideas to you and all nuke ideas to Radvic regardless of who's actually responsible for them :p
eaglejarl said:
Also, here's a thing that was completely transparent to everyone at the table but I think did not come through in the writing: Kagome was working really hard not to squee about the idea of doing research with Jiraiya. Hence his "yeah, I guess we could do that" schtick -- he didn't want to go full fanboy.
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That's a bit of a relief.
 
eaglejarl said:
"Number one: My missing godson, who will be adopted into this clan the minute he returns and will therefore be your brother. Right now he's being held captive by a bunch of psycho S-rankers, including a guy who can put you through three days of torture every second just by looking at you. I don't know—yet!—why Akatsuki wants Naruto. Maybe they can brainwash him into being their soldier? Naruto is an insanely powerful ninja; I could probably beat him, especially if I got to prep the terrain, but I wouldn't want to try. More importantly, he was being groomed to be either Hokage or Jōnin Commander when he got older. He had top secret clearance; he knows a lot about Leaf politics, defenses, seals and jutsu, and the personalities and psychological weaknesses of key personnel. I literally cannot think of a greater threat that Leaf could possibly face that having Naruto turn on us. Akatsuki alone we maybe could deal with, albeit with heavy losses. Naruto fighting alongside them? Leaf is utterly fucked.
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Wow, I didn't understand how different MfD Naruto is from canon Naruto at all. Is he considerably older? He sounds like he's been treated well and brought inside the tent in an opposite way to how the young canon Naruto was treated because of the whole demon inside him prejudice thing, but some of those things sound like they'd only happen to someone who was older (and far more mature than young canon Naruto) as well.

As for Jiraiya's worst case geopolitical scenario, yikes. We need to work on ways to prevent another war. And I'm afraid he's kind of confirmed my worst fears about the Pangolin-nazis being something we can't do much about. His idea to persuade them to shift to consolidation is the best thing I've heard so far. In addition to having the Toads do it politically maybe there's some way Keiko could contribute to the persuasion too. That way it's more likely to be effective and she can feel like she stood up and did something instead of feeling powerless and immoral.

Also, I fear the new worst case scenario is the Pangolins responding to Toad pressure by invading the Toads like they're Hitler tearing up the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact, followed by going full Nazi on the rest of the summon path and that going about as well for the Pangolins as it did for Hitler. Hopefully the Pangolin boss summon isn't that much of a megalomaniac and idiot. Hopefully. If it gets that bad we might need to seriously consider abandoning the Pangolins and joining their enemies, because it's the right thing to do and because we don't need summoner assassins breaking down our door. We could use the Pangolin scroll (or its destruction) to demonstrate that we're sincere and as a bargaining chip in negotiating an alliance.
 
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eaglejarl said:
Actually, Downfall was all @Velorien Blame him. I was glad, though.


You could ask him.


He knows that perfectly well. What in particular do they want the Beasts for?



Also, here's a thing that was completely transparent to everyone at the table but I think did not come through in the writing: Kagome was working really hard not to squee about the idea of doing research with Jiraiya. Hence his "yeah, I guess we could do that" schtick -- he didn't want to go full fanboy.
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For the record, I thought that was clear to me (but I remember him being excited for it in the past and so probably took that context into account)
 
Vecht said:
The more I think about it, the more I like this plan. She doesn't want the hat, but surely she'd support Jiraiya, especially if we could convince her that we might be able to make progress on areas she cares about.

Sure, we need to spend the next month training, but do all three of us? I'm almost willing to bite the bullet and have Hazou (mostly) ignore training and instead go on a quest to find Tsunade. He has the best shot of winning her over, and if we could get her back and take up a vote for Jiraiya, his Hokageship is that much more secured. Plus, we get another S-rank ninja on our side.
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Tsunade is already in Leaf, but I'm not sure what she's really up to. I agree that bringing her in as a political force to aid Jiraiya in exchange for a medical school, university, or things she wants that would aid Leaf anyway might be a good strategy. Maybe we should talk to her and pitch the idea. Plus, Jiraiya is working his best to forestall a 3rd world war, and Tsunade will probably support that. Hell, maybe we should tell Tsunade about our entire dream of uplifting the world. If she doesn't fall into cynicism about it being impossible she could be our most steadfast ally.

1234qwerty said:
Tripping up in interactions with social specs like Shikamaru, our teammate in red group A, the Oyabun, etc
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Arguably messing up social specialists is a feature and not a bug of us puppeting Hazou, but him acting schitzophrenic isn't ideal. I do like the idea of Hazou doing some mature self-contemplation to see if he can make personal progress in his issues and evolve his personal beliefs into better refined forms.
 
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Just a little analysis of what's pulling at our XP in the short and long term:
  • Alertness: the God Stat, immensely useful in all forms of combat, and we just don't have enough of it.
    • What do we want: At least Alertness 40, let's go 45 for good measure.
      • Levels 31-45 will collectively cost 585 XP.
    • When do we want it: short term. Even apart from the tournament coming up we flat out don't want sub-par Alertness ever.
  • Empathy: Our current best bet for trying to make Hazou better at socials. A constant drip into this will, alongside good character interactions, help Hazou grow as a person.
    • What do we want: Let's say level 30, putting it above even Deceit in our social skills.
      • Levels 11-30 will collectively cost 410 XP.
    • When do we want it: short term. Hazou's got social issues and we need to start working on them now.
  • Sealing: Even putting aside the utility of being able to research better and faster, right now we can't infuse Skywalkers and that makes it hard to claim any of the credit for coming up with them.
    • What do we want: We should feel safe to infuse Skywalkers at least by level 30.
      • Levels 21-30 will, at double price, collectively cost 510 XP.
    • When do we want it: short term. The fact that we can't infuse our own darn invention is a real hit to our credibility as 'the guy who revolutionized warfare', and the sooner we fix that the better.
  • Chakra Reserves: Shadow Clones. There's no way we can get them soon, but we want these ASAP.
    • What do we want: Level 40 will give us 400 CP, enough that Jiraiya will teach us the all-important Shadow Clone technique.
      • Levels 11-40 will, at double price, collectively cost 1530 XP.
    • When do we want it: long term. There's no payout until we reach the end and we can't afford to sink everything into this right away.
  • Taijutsu: I suppose we also want more of this on general principles.
    • What do we want: Let's get up to level 50 (53 after Iron Nerve)
      • Levels 41-50 will collectively cost 455 XP.
    • When do we want it: eh, whenever we've got XP to spare for it.
  • Craftsmanship: for some of our personal projects. Far from urgent, but handy to have.
    • What do we want: Let's start with something like level 20 in Craftsmanship (building stuff) (or whatever the QMs would call that)
      • Levels 1-20 would collectively cost 210 XP.
    • When do we want it: mid term. We get payouts immediately but it's not truly important.
Conclusions: Almost everything we want right now costs around 400-500 XP to get, except for Craftsmanship which is half that much but non-urgent and Chakra Reserves which is three times as much and only pays out at the end. Assuming we focus on Alertness first because of the Tournament, I would suggest we split our XP between Empathy and Sealing at something like a 25/75 split until we get good enough to make Skywalkers, and then shift the Sealing XP into Taijutsu and Craftsmanship one after the other, and then shift to the bottomless well of XP that is Chakra Reserves, adding our Empathy XP to that pool once we finish up there.

I did not consider the skill pyramid when making this, but Hazou's has a fair amount of wiggle room so I'm not too concerned. Is there anything in particular you guys think should be on this list? Do you disagree with the order I concluded we should handle this in? Did I mess up my math anywhere?
 
Say, something I'm a little unclear on: Jiraiya said that another world war is basically inevitable, but his discussions with Mist are aimed at trying to find some way of getting along and preventing it, right? Or is there something else going on there?
 
Inferno Vulpix said:
Just a little analysis of what's pulling at our XP in the short and long term:
  • Alertness: the God Stat, immensely useful in all forms of combat, and we just don't have enough of it.
    • What do we want: At least Alertness 40, let's go 45 for good measure.
      • Levels 31-45 will collectively cost 585 XP.
    • When do we want it: short term. Even apart from the tournament coming up we flat out don't want sub-par Alertness ever.
  • Empathy: Our current best bet for trying to make Hazou better at socials. A constant drip into this will, alongside good character interactions, help Hazou grow as a person.
    • What do we want: Let's say level 30, putting it above even Deceit in our social skills.
      • Levels 11-30 will collectively cost 410 XP.
    • When do we want it: short term. Hazou's got social issues and we need to start working on them now.
  • Sealing: Even putting aside the utility of being able to research better and faster, right now we can't infuse Skywalkers and that makes it hard to claim any of the credit for coming up with them.
    • What do we want: We should feel safe to infuse Skywalkers at least by level 30.
      • Levels 21-30 will, at double price, collectively cost 510 XP.
    • When do we want it: short term. The fact that we can't infuse our own darn invention is a real hit to our credibility as 'the guy who revolutionized warfare', and the sooner we fix that the better.
  • Chakra Reserves: Shadow Clones. There's no way we can get them soon, but we want these ASAP.
    • What do we want: Level 40 will give us 400 CP, enough that Jiraiya will teach us the all-important Shadow Clone technique.
      • Levels 11-40 will, at double price, collectively cost 1530 XP.
    • When do we want it: long term. There's no payout until we reach the end and we can't afford to sink everything into this right away.
  • Taijutsu: I suppose we also want more of this on general principles.
    • What do we want: Let's get up to level 50 (53 after Iron Nerve)
      • Levels 41-50 will collectively cost 455 XP.
    • When do we want it: eh, whenever we've got XP to spare for it.
  • Craftsmanship: for some of our personal projects. Far from urgent, but handy to have.
    • What do we want: Let's start with something like level 20 in Craftsmanship (building stuff) (or whatever the QMs would call that)
      • Levels 1-20 would collectively cost 210 XP.
    • When do we want it: mid term. We get payouts immediately but it's not truly important.
Conclusions: Almost everything we want right now costs around 400-500 XP to get, except for Craftsmanship which is half that much but non-urgent and Chakra Reserves which is three times as much and only pays out at the end. Assuming we focus on Alertness first because of the Tournament, I would suggest we split our XP between Empathy and Sealing at something like a 25/75 split until we get good enough to make Skywalkers, and then shift the Sealing XP into Taijutsu and Craftsmanship one after the other, and then shift to the bottomless well of XP that is Chakra Reserves, adding our Empathy XP to that pool once we finish up there.

I did not consider the skill pyramid when making this, but Hazou's has a fair amount of wiggle room so I'm not too concerned. Is there anything in particular you guys think should be on this list? Do you disagree with the order I concluded we should handle this in? Did I mess up my math anywhere?
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In one in-game year we get ~1,440 XP at an average of 4 XP per day. We might be able to accelerate how quickly we can learn Shadow Clone by getting in-story numbers on chakra points.

To whit: We actually do need to work on that grant.
 
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Briefvoice said:
Agreed. It was some serious scare talk, but this blithe assumption that she can just brute force it through with Mist ANBU is a hell of an ask. Judging by the way Mari reacted, you could be looking at a mass kunoichi-led rebellion (and plenty of male ninja would come on board too).

We're talking about a bunch of superpowered people most of whom have kind of come to accept their own mortality. "I'd rather die" is not an empty threat, and who's to say that the civil war won't extend to ANBU itself?
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I second this. Yagura was much closer to being able to ignore his subordinates' feelings and just kill anyone who tried to rebel, and mistreating his subordinates still ended up with Shikigami running off with a bunch of Mist's ninja. If Ren mistreats most of her subordinates, she will quickly be overthrown. Her direct subordinates are the clan heads (who have wives, daughters, sisters, etc.), and Anbu (who probably have women in their ranks, as well as female relatives).

Noumero said:
So they still haven't figured out that Akatsuki are after the bijuu? Come on, they swooped in at the last moment, captured only the two containers, and ran. Ignored Jiraiya, didn't act until most of the other ninja were dead. Surely it's a fair guess?
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Maybe Akatsuki are trying a tailed beast breeding program?
 
So... as far as putting the pangolin money to good ends go, we could use it to fund whatever Tsunade wants -- she seems to have the interests of the masses at heart more than most ninja do at least, and the expertise to know how best to use it -- in exchange for her claiming her seat on the council.
 
charlesrwest said:
Is this a bad time to point out you could make a pretty strong stationary motor if you could get a storage to store/unstore when it got close to a particular pair of points (or cycle based on a timer in a pinch)?
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...huh.

I wonder...we could make a piston engine like that. Set up a series of cylinders with crankshaft in-line or radial, doesn't matter much. Each cylinder has a storage seal with a working fluid (mineral oil or similar probably are best) sealed inside and set up to unseal near the top and re-seal near the bottom.

EDIT: so we'd just need to get PMYF to re-seal what it spat out, really.
 
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Alright, does anyone have an example grant to work off of? And we should probably set up a communal google doc for it or something.

e: On the plus side, because this is a grant for in-story we don't have to worry about plagiarism.
 
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