Does Noburi's draining technique break Genjutsu?

If he takes chakra from a specific place on a body, can he disrupt techniques?

I noticed that the description of Noburi starting his drain mentioned that he formed his chakra into the requisite shape. If he shapes a water whip in the right way, can he execute techniques, through his enemies, with their chakra?
 
Does Noburi's draining technique break Genjutsu?
Yes.
If he takes chakra from a specific place on a body, can he disrupt techniques?

I noticed that the description of Noburi starting his drain mentioned that he formed his chakra into the requisite shape. If he shapes a water whip in the right way, can he execute techniques, through his enemies, with their chakra?
Unknown, but quite possible.
 
I suggest that in the next couple of updates we discuss this point with him (with CCnJ), both to hopefully make him less angry toward us and hopefully make the whole clan more powerful in the end.

I don't think CCnJ would be particularly useful with an angry Noburi. It works best when the topic itself is uncomfortable or liable to provoke anger but the people involved are calm, and unless CCnJ is deeply entrenched then it would be easy for an angry mind to dismiss or cast doubt on the technique. I would trust CCnJ to calm down an angry Keiko, or the reverse for Keiko calming an angry Hazou with it, but I fear if we use CCnJ to try and calm down Noburi he'll just scoff at us and in the process make the technique viewed as less trustworthy.

Once we have him calmed down, CCnJ will be viable for addressing his remaining resentment, but an emotional Noburi is a Noburi who won't care that we said 'Clear Communication no Jutsu' before we started 'making excuses', which is what an explanation would appear like to an emotional Noburi.
 
I mean, he drained Neji without a barrel and used said chakra to form a Water Whip...

I think he means using techniques from locations disparate to his own body?

Cariyaga is right - it is especially significant for techniques like great fireball, or suicide techniques.

I'm imagining somebody with something that holds a mouth closed (like somebody with a face mask, or other restraint) who is forced to use something that needs to expel from their mouth.
 
Interlude: Meating Mist
Interlude: Meating Mist

"Left!"

Adachi Eiji spun left, thrusting his naginata-cum-walking-stick into the teeth of a leaping brown-furred nightmare. The blade slid straight through the roof of the beast's mouth and out the top of its head, killing it instantly. Unfortunately, it also meant that he now had ten pounds of dead weight hanging off the end of his naginata and there was another of the bastards right behind the first one.

He flipped the haft of the weapon up and into the creature's face, diving aside before the claws could rip his chest open. A ninja or a storybook hero would have rolled smoothly to his feet, grabbed the beast by the scruff of its neck, and ripped its head off. Eiji was a merchant; he sprawled on the ground, frantically yanking his knife from his belt and scrambling backwards on his ass and one hand.

Before the thing could leap again Sawaya was there, her fist glowing with chakra enhancement as it smashed through the creature's spine at the base of the neck. The genin pivoted neatly around the reflexive dying snap of the teeth and punted the carcass away.

Eiji sat for a moment, bringing his breathing back under control before he spoke. "Nice job," he said, pushing himself to his feet and tucking his knife away. He tried hard to seem casual and relaxed; sure, she was a ninja and he was a civilian, but no man enjoyed looking panicked in front of a woman. Still, he was pretty sure that the stocky, flat-chested brunette's quick glance caught the quiver in his knees. For that matter, the pounding of his heart was so loud that she could probably hear it.

Sawaya shrugged. "What you pay me for." She turned, surveying the dead body. "What do you call those things, anyway?"

"Ugly," Eiji said. "Come on, let's go. I want to make it the rest of the way to Mist before nightfall."

o-o-o-o​

It had been two years since Eiji had made the trip to Mist. It was a long trip from the Land of Vegetable to the Water Country, and dangerous. The winter caravans always made a modest profit; sure, you had to struggle not to freeze to death when the blizzards hit, but the sightlines were long with no leaves on the trees and much of Marsh was frozen so you didn't have to worry about being attacked while crossing. Plus you could put all the stock in sleighs and make good time. With fifty merchants clubbing up for protection it was affordable to hire enough ninja that the caravan could travel safe. Of course, with fifty merchants all splitting the profits there wasn't a lot of profit to be made. Especially when Tawara and Soga came along; born-rich bastards always insisted on selling statuary (in Water? How the hells do you make a profit dragging heavy statuary to Water?) and they couldn't negotiate worth a damn so they always brought the averages down. Of course, between them they had five ninja on permanent retainer so that helped balance things a little.

Everyone had told him he was crazy to be doing the trip in summer, by himself, with just one genin for protection. He wasn't sure why Sawaya had been willing to take the job for such a reasonable rate, but he was glad she had. If he could get this cargo through...well, it probably wouldn't be retirement money, but it would set him up. Keep food on the table for Noriko and the kids. Pay off the debt he'd incurred to the sealmaster—and hadn't that been fun, bowing and scraping in front of a drunk old man with hands so shaky that he probably had to discard half his production? Pay the ninja their taxes (because of course we don't even think the word 'tribute', now do we?) for the next year so the family could afford to stay in the village. Pay the tutor for Akira and Kaiya so they could start out knowing how to read and write and figure instead of having to spend ten years working three jobs to scrape by while learning just enough that they didn't get ripped off. Probably not enough to buy out his debt to the speculators that had funded the trip, but enough to justify an extension. If he could make another trip before autumn then he'd be ahead of the game. Spend most of the proceeds buying two or three more storage scrolls, put some towards inventory, the rest for the family.

He could almost see that future, hanging before him like a mirage. All it needed was this one trip...and for him to have guessed right about product.

"Stop."

The voice came from above them to the left. Sawaya clearly had not detected the speaker or she would have warned him; out of the corner of his eye Eiji watched her hand twitch towards one of the kunai on her belt before she aborted the motion.

Very carefully, merchant and bodyguard turned in the direction of the hail. There was a ninja in the tree above them, wearing the camoflage pattern favored by the Village Hidden in the Mist. He was probably in his thirties, thin and weedy with a too-large chin that stretched the camoflage bandana covering the lower half of his face. Had he been a civilian he would have been the victim of village bullies, but the fact that he was sticking himself to the trunk of a tree meant that he was a ninja and therefore dangerous.

"I am Adachi Eiji," Eiji said carefully. "I'm a merchant from the Land of Vegetables. I've been here the last three years with the winter caravans and now I'm trying a summer trip."

The ninja snorted. "Uh-huh. Where's your wagon, 'merchant'?"

"I don't have one," Eiji said. "I have a storage scroll. It's in my pack."

One eyebrow went up. "A storage scroll, huh? Let's see."

Moving slowly, Eiji swung his pack off his shoulder and set it on the ground. He unbuckled the straps and flipped the top back, pulling out his waterproofed groundcloth and spreading it out before removing a canvas-covered bundle. He laid it on the cloth and unwrapped it carefully to reveal the wax-enclosed wooden scrollcase inside.

"Open it up."

Eiji suppressed a grimace. He'd known this would happen, but still.... He nodded to Sawaya, holding the scrollcase out.

Without a word she took the case from him and used a kunai to peel away the thick layer of wax before popping the endcap off and sliding out the vellum scroll itself. She held it out and did whatever it was that ninja did. A waist-high cloth-wrapped bundle fell out.

"Unwrap it," ordered the Mist ninja.

Eiji sighed, wondering how much this was going to cost him. Still, he unwrapped the bundle to reveal the massive pile of freshly-cut, still-bleeding steaks.

"Grass-fed daggerhorn from the Land of Vegetables," he said.

The sentry dropped from the tree and paced closer, his eyes locked on the meat. "That is...a lot of meat," he said.

"Yes. I noticed that the market in Mist mostly sells seafood and I thought people might like something different."

"Uh-huh." The ninja stared at the pile a moment longer before shaking himself back into focus. He pulled a wadded-up bag out of his beltpouch and threw it at Eiji. "Border tax," he said. "One quarter."

"Sir, if you take a quarter I won't be able to make a profit," Eiji said carefully. "I won't be able to afford another trip later, and that means no more border tax."

The ninja blurred across the distance between them, planted a boot on Eiji's chest and shoved, sending him sprawling. "Show respect! The tax just went up to a third!"

Thankfully, Sawaya hadn't moved when the ninja attacked. Her loose and relaxed stance would have seemed casual, except that Eiji had seen her stand just like that while a pack of spikerats prowled around the edge of their camp. When the things had finally gotten their nerve up to attack, she had launched straight into the fray without even seeming to shift her weight.

"Of course, sir! One third, as you say, sir! Please forgive me, sir!" Eiji bowed dogeza, holding it until the ninja's grunt showed that he was satisfied. The merchant quickly scrambled over and shoveled steaks into the sack. If there was still dirt on his hands from the bow then that wasn't his fault, right? And there absolutely wasn't any spit. Really.

"Here you are, sir," Eiji said, gesturing to the sack with his eyes carefully cast down. The sack actually wasn't big enough to hold a third of the meat, but what it could hold was more than he could lift while on his knees and leaning forward.

"What else you got in here?" the ninja asked, toeing Eiji's pack over and bending down to dump it out. He stirred through the camp gear until he found the nearly-flat pouch of ryo at the bottom. He poured the contents into his hand and sniffed in dissatisfaction at the amount. "Marsh Country ryo and not much of it. Pretty lousy merchant if this is all you've got."

"Sorry, sir." Eiji bowed dogeza again. "Everything else went into buying the meat, sir."

The ninja grunted again and shoved the handful of coins into his pocket. "What's in yours?" the ninja demanded. Still in dogeza with his eyes an inch from the dirt, Eiji could only assume the man was looking at Sawaya.

"Stuff."

The silence dragged on for several seconds, the tension palpable. Eiji risked turning his head a little so he could see Sawaya, standing casually with muscular arms crossed over her chest. Some crazy part of his brain couldn't help but notice that Noriko often wore that same disapproving expression when the kids had been getting up to mischief. Noriko was too buxom to comfortably cross her arms like that, though.

The tension broke when the Mist ninja stepped back. "Better hurry if you're going to make the gate before night," he said, scooping the sack of 'taxed' meat up and tying the neck in a quick knot. He tossed it over his shoulder and leaped back into the trees. There was no sign that he was at all bothered by the weight of a hundred pounds of prime grass-fed daggerhorn. Thieving bastard.

Eiji sat up, blowing out a breath he hadn't realized he'd been holding. "Well handled," he said to Sawaya.

"What you pay me for." She moved to the stack of meat and rewrapped it with deft fingers before shoving it back into the storage scroll.

By the time she was done, Eiji had already gathered his gear up and into his pack. He swung it onto his shoulder with a practiced motion. "You heard the man," he said. "We'll need to hurry."

She didn't say a word, just fell in beside him as he strode off down the poorly-maintained trail.

o-o-o-o​

They made it with minutes to spare, the city gates closing practically on their heels. Each of the gate guards had "confiscated" a pair of steaks as the "entrance fee", but that was expected. The scroll was only about half-full now, not nearly enough to pay for the trip. Still, Eiji headed straight for the night market, pausing only briefly to pull enough coin out of the moneybelt he wore under his shirt that he would be able to pay the vendor fee.

The merchant factor who ran the night market was a civilian and a professional; he demanded only the standard rate, rattled off the standard rules, and let them get on their way.

Eiji found an unused section of the plaza and spread out his groundcloth. Sawaya unsealed the remaining meat and then stepped back to stand guard, arms folded on her chest and eyes constantly roving.

The meat sold quickly, as Eiji had expected. It was a luxury in Mist and the money was good. If he'd had the full contents of his scroll then he could have afforded an inn for the night and still brought that imagined mirage-future into reality. As it was...not so much.

The pile was almost gone when Sawaya leaned in. "Ready for the rest?" she asked quietly. At Eiji's nod she reached under her shirt and unwound the bandages that were binding her breasts flat and also holding the second storage scroll to her chest. She unwrapped it, stripped the wax off the scrollcase, and unsealed the second pile of meat.

"Fresh meat!" Eiji cried into the seething mass of potential customers. "Grass-fed daggerhorn steaks, fresh from the Land of Vegetables! Tender and juicy! Fresh steaks!"
 
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Much more peaceful than what's been going on in the rest of the world. It's nice to see that, even as Mist is no doubt suffering or about to suffer major instability from the Ultimate Showdown of Ultimate Destiny, civilian life goes on.
 
I've been thinking things over a bit, and I don't think Noburi's ability to drain through mist was actually a valuable secret to keep. Obviously we fucked up by not consulting Noburi first regardless, but I don't think we've actually harmed our clan much or at all by doing so. In fact, making the ability known may actually help our clan.

Draining through mist is a very valuable ability for Noburi to have, but what makes it valuable, and what uses does the ability best serve? Draining through mist allows Noburi to fight for longer periods of time without running out of chakra, and allows him to end fights with close to full chakra, allowing him to help the team either recharge or flee. The ability also allows Noburi to sense the amount of chakra his enemies possess and what direction they are in, helping him to fight effectively in thick mist others would struggle in. Combine that with the stealth buff of skywalkers and you get the ability to imitate Zabuza, with the added benefit that every second your enemies are looking for you they are losing chakra. And, obviously, it allows Noburi to drain the chakra of his enemies when they aren't on or in water. However, draining takes time, and is in some sense an attrition technique. Suddenly opening up on draining people isn't usually going to turn the tide of battle in a way that wouldn't have been better served by simply draining people from the start. This isn't to say that suddenly draining someone at an opportune moment couldn't effect the course of the battle, simply that it isn't going to take someone down in mere moments, what you would want in a trump card. If someone is a second away from killing Noburi or someone he cares about, draining them probably isn't going to put them down in time. For example, he couldn't have used the ability to stop Mari from dying in Hot Springs, or suddenly broken in out in the fight in Mountain after it was clear things were going south. In both cases, he would have been best served draining from the start, which could have changed the overall flow of the battle significantly.

So, in summary, the ability to drain people through mist is something best used from as early on in the fight as possible to maximize chakra drained. In nearly any case where suddenly draining someone mid-fight would be helpful it would have been better to simply drain them from the start. Extrapolating from that, Noburi's ability is only useful as a trump card in fights we will know are incredibly difficult beforehand, so he can use it from the start. Thus, if Noburi keeps the ability secret he risks a medium-difficulty fight unexpectedly turning against him.

So, I see two counterfactual worlds here. In one Noburi keeps the ability secret. While he's doing so both he and any team he's with have a higher risk of death on mid-risk missions, but if they know beforehand that they're going into an unusually tough fight Noburi can decide to break the ability out. Eventually Noburi uses the ability on a team that isn't entirely composed of his clan and the secret gets out. Before that, he has a higher chance of dying all round in exchange for a trump card only useful if he knows he's going need it in advance. Keeping it secret isn't particularly useful because he's not going to make it to the point that he's famous enough that people would know his abilities in advance without having to use it, and before that it doesn't matter if it's technically known. In the other world, he uses the ability from the start. It boosts his rep significantly, and greatly decreases the chance of death on his missions. He bases his entire ability set around it from the start. The clan as a whole is known to be more powerful. In exchange, he loses the ability to surprise some people with the capability, but the ability to make use of Mist Draining in all of his fights increases his chance of survival overall.

I don't think he gains anything worthwhile from the first scenario. Keeping the ability secret to use in case of emergency won't really work, as in any case where suddenly being able to drain through mist would be helpful it would be a better idea to just burn the fucker with a macerator. It would be different if that was the only trump card Noburi had, but he has hundreds of explosive tags, macerators, and the expectation that Hazou will come up with even more things along those lines in the future. It makes much more sense for Noburi to base his entire style around draining through mist, meaning the secret that he can wasn't particularly valuable in the first place. If he does so, the fact that he can sense and drain chakra through mist is going to be common knowledge anyway, so Minami's understanding of his abilities wouldn't be harmful.

None of this is to say we didn't err in not talking to Noburi before letting Minami know of his ability. From what I can tell Noburi would be best served by making Mist Draining a cornerstone of his fighting style that he uses more often than Water Whip, but that should have been his choice. However, I don't believe the clan as a whole or Noburi in particular are worse off for Minami knowing this. Thus, the main thing we've done is harmed our relationship with our teammates. Damage control thus should be focused on that aspect of our mistake.

EDIT: I had actually already been thinking of Mist Draining as one of the building blocks of Noburi's style, actually. Not utilizing something that gamebreaking as much as possible would be a terrible waste. I had basically already assumed that Noburi would be using it like that, and I wouldn't be surprised if that was common among many members of the Hivemind. Could explain why nobody noticed the problem with using Noburi's Mist Drain ability: we had all assumed that Noburi was already going to use it in any fight we got into, and thus it wasn't really a secret.

I'm really not sure that Naburi's routinely using Drain Through Mist in combat would result in Drain Through Mist becoming well known.

Let's assume that the ability is not known. Not known that it exists, and certainly not known that Naburi can do it.

So. Team Uplift goes into combat, and the first thing they do is create mist as area camouflage, as somebody pointed out they should be doing anyways. Since the area is now all misty, Noburi can start using Drain Through Mist on enemy ninja immediately, presumably draining the most dangerous first. He doesn't care if he drains more than he can handle; he can simply waste the extra, or do extra jutsu to burn it.

Since he is actively draining the enemy, they are getting weaker by the second, contributing to Team Uplift's victory. Since he's got all that extra chakra to burn, he can do more jutsu, also contributing to Team Uplift's victory.

When the battle is over, anyone not from Team Uplift sees a bunch of dead enemies and victorious Uplifters. He does not see Drain Through Mist, precisely because he doesn't even know to look for it. Doesn't know it's a thing, doesn't dream that Noburi can do it--why would he say "Oh, I see that Noburi was Draining the enemy through Mist?"

He won't. Of course he won't. He'll say "Oh, these Team Uplift youths are really strong and tough."

On the other hand, if it becomes known that Drain Through Mist is a tool in Noburi's pack, enemies will target him at the beginning of the battle, look for ways to dispel the mist that they know is coming, or otherwise try to compensate. His ability to use it in combat goes way down.

So yeah, I think it is a secret very much worth keeping.

Also, while it's not clear to me why you felt it important to explore whether Noburi would use DtM from the beginning of combat or at an opportune moment, we don't actually know--at least I don't know--how long Drain Through Mist takes. Even if it is true that it presently takes a lot of time, perhaps as Noburi becomes better at it he will be able to do it more quickly? Perhaps at some level it will be quick enough to be indistinguishable from instantaneous?
 
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"You are currently stuck in a confined space thousands of feet above the ground in close proximity to a jounin, two explosives experts, and a team of international terrorists best known for killing jounin via positively obscene levels of collateral damage. Please think carefully before initiating violence."​
 
They made it with minutes to spare, the city gates closing practically on their heels. Each of the gate guards had "confiscated" a pair of steaks as the "entrance fee", but that was expected. The scroll was only about half-full now, not nearly enough to pay for the trip. Still, Eiji headed straight for the night market, pausing only briefly to pull enough coin out of the moneybelt he wore under his shirt that he would be able to pay the vendor fee.

Seems like pretty poor government on the part of Mist. If you just let everyone in the lower ranks grab what they want, how do the people at the top get rich?
 
We have been assured many times that "trying to track people coming in and out" is in fact a huge concern for ninja villages, and one they devote a great deal of time and resources to handling.
Sure, but the higher ups can't do it personally, and if you need the lower ranks to track people anyway you might as well collect your money from the lower ranks instead of trying to collect it directly from the people.
 
Hmm.

Well, that was certainly a large amount of... stuff that's happened since I last checked in.

There isn't a smoking crater where Leaf is (yet) and the world hasn't ended via insanely huge sealing blunder messing with the very cornerstone of physics itself, so that's good!


I can't help but think that Meat-smuggling interlude was influenced by
the Chronicler's first chapter from Name of the Wind
, or some earlier instance or later derivative thereof.
 
Could Hazou tell Minami something like this?

"Minami, each one of us has, at some point, been with a hairsbreadth of being blown up by Kagome. However, we also all owe him our lives multiple times over. In a sense, this is another step toward you becoming one of us! I'm reasonably sure that he isn't going to try to blow you up again, which puts you in the same position as everyone here. And it's very possible that his expertise will save your life, too, in the near future."

And perhaps point out that getting into a fight ends badly for everyone. If they kill her, then they're missing-nin again, but this time with Leaf mad at them. If she somehow kills them despite being outnumbered, then she has Jiraiya and Mari swearing revenge against her. Fighting almost certainly means mutual annihilation - even if they don't set off ludicrous quantities of explosives in a small space high above the ground.

If he can manage to talk to her in private, it would likely be worth mentioning that yes, Kagome is 75% crazy, and in an ideal situation he would be able to retire to an isolated bunker that he could surround with enough explosives to scour a country. However, he's still uncomfortable being in Leaf, and Hazou needs his help to continue making sealing breakthroughs, and Kagome does in fact get lonely.
 
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I can't help but think that Meat-smuggling interlude was influenced by
Heh. I thought Name of the Wind was a song from Pocahontas. (FAKE EDIT: No, wait, that was Colors of the Wind, wasn't it? Never mind.)

Haven't heard of NotW so no, it wasn't. It does amuse me though -- yet again I see that that it's impossible to have a new idea.
 
@Briefvoice I'm worried Hazou might take one look at that plan and go "Minami isn't immediately pacified, teamwipe". Your objectives and stated dialogue tree don't quite line up in that Minami seems poised to blow at the drop of the pin.

It might be worth it to go: "Do you really wish to be guilty of the same crime as the one you accuse Kagome of, Minami Nikko of the Hidden Leaf?" and then transition into a request to speak.
If she says that suicide is the only choice, move to intercept (might require chakra boosting) and say that she is still guilty of conspiring toward a teammate's death; her own. (creative interpretations ahoy!)
 
@Briefvoice I'm worried Hazou might take one look at that plan and go "Minami isn't immediately pacified, teamwipe". Your objectives and stated dialogue tree don't quite line up in that Minami seems poised to blow at the drop of the pin.

It might be worth it to go: "Do you really wish to be guilty of the same crime as the one you accuse Kagome of, Minami Nikko of the Hidden Leaf?" and then transition into a request to speak.
If she says that suicide is the only choice, move to intercept (might require chakra boosting) and say that she is still guilty of conspiring toward a teammate's death; her own. (creative interpretations ahoy!)

I would generally like to avoid exact wording and instead give the intent of what Hazou is to say while allowing the QMs to pick the words he uses to do so.

Since it is a concern, I added this line at the beginning:
If it seems like Manami is about to unleash violence, seek Akane's verbal support in urging Minami to hold off and talk just a little longer.
 
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