Voting is open for the next 6 hours, 50 minutes
Doesn't provide us anything to leverage. It has to rely on chakra mumbo jumbo rather than concrete rules(unlike air domes) that we can work with.

I think you underestimate chakra mumbo jumbo.

I swear, if the GM's throw enough mumbo-jumbo at us that there's an internally consistent viable system there, I'll write a gods damned self-hosting seal compiler.

Edit: And at least @OliWhail knows this is not an idle threat.
 
Last edited:
I think you underestimate chakra mumbo jumbo.

I swear, if the GM's throw enough mumbo-jumbo at us that there's an internally consistent viable system there, I'll write a gods damned self-hosting seal compiler.

Edit: And at least @OliWhail knows this is not an idle threat.
I think that's a possibility that has haunted them since the start of the quest.

QMs: "LBF? That's fun and balanced!"
...
QMs: "Oh god they're making logic gates."
 
I think you underestimate chakra mumbo jumbo.

I swear, if the GM's throw enough mumbo-jumbo at us that there's an internally consistent viable system there, I'll write a gods damned self-hosting seal compiler.

All else being equal, seal difficulty is roughly analogous to 'how difficult it sounds', but that doesn't mean if you can describe an effect in simple terms that it's easy for a seal to do that. "A seal that keeps people asleep" is a seal phrased simply, but one of those words represents a complex biochemical process that modern science in the EN doesn't even begin to understand.

Consider the case of Usamatsu. He wanted to create a seal that could filter air out from all contaminants, and that sounds pretty simple, except it apparently wasn't because he had to test by trial and error until the lab rats stopped dying. If Usamatsu can't just tell a seal what air is, Hazou can't just tell a seal what it means for a person to be asleep and how to keep them that way.
 
I think you underestimate chakra mumbo jumbo.

I swear, if the GM's throw enough mumbo-jumbo at us that there's an internally consistent viable system there, I'll write a gods damned self-hosting seal compiler.

Edit: And at least @OliWhail knows this is not an idle threat.

The problem is not that chakra allow us to break the laws of physics, it's that there's literally no rules for us to work with.

There's no way we can leverage the hivemind.

All we can do is tell Hazō to talk to Noburi about technobabble this and that and then maybe get something like "make people sleep". It is unexploitable. There are virtually no involvement of hivemind creativity and thought. Just an effect that the hivemind wants.

Air domes, on the other hand, are exploitable. It has rules like: will prop a stationary air dome relative to the center of the earth. Which we then use to make skywalkers.
 
All else being equal, seal difficulty is roughly analogous to 'how difficult it sounds', but that doesn't mean if you can describe an effect in simple terms that it's easy for a seal to do that. "A seal that keeps people asleep" is a seal phrased simply, but one of those words represents a complex biochemical process that modern science in the EN doesn't even begin to understand.

Consider the case of Usamatsu. He wanted to create a seal that could filter air out from all contaminants, and that sounds pretty simple, except it apparently wasn't because he had to test by trial and error until the lab rats stopped dying. If Usamatsu can't just tell a seal what air is, Hazou can't just tell a seal what it means for a person to be asleep and how to keep them that way.
Well obviously it's a storage seal variant that stores their consciousness.
 
So what you are saying is that, unless you want the other QMs to veto writing combat scenes, you cannot afford to make bad stuff happen to us in combat or you lose the opportunity to write about punching?
No, I'm saying that if y'all whinge too much when something bad happens, we'll be motivated to never have combat again. Which, since everyone on Team Uplift is optimized for combat, would be to your detriment.

(Assume that I'm "QM" in the above.)

They'll understand, for sure. The question is whether their sense of justice will overcome their love of our suffering.
WWDTTY?
 
(Assume that I'm "QM" in the above.)

But... but you like writing about punching?

For the record, my previous post wasn't meant to be taken seriously (I hoped that would be obvious but you can never tell with just text) and QMs should obviously never reward bad behavior.

Punching is fun to read about, though on the other hand it becomes increasingly worrying to vote for when there is a diplomatic solution since I am quite attached to the characters and don't want to see anyone hurt.

Still looking forward to the tournament though. It should be a pretty safe place to have my cake and eat it, too, due to the no lethality rules.
We are going to show our former clans just how much of a mistake they made to dismiss us.

Just need to survive next update in one piece first.
 
Last edited:
Just a note none of our clans actually abandoned us. Mari arranged everything.

That's not what I meant with that line.

Hazo is estranged from his clan due to them exiling Hana. Hazo's character and achievements are a big middle finger to the Kurosawa and the fact that they exiled Hana for marrying out of clan (take that, eugenics).

Noburi has been the spare son until his big brother died. Of all, he seems to have it best though since he seems to get along with his mom and his twin sisters.

Keiko was pretty obvious in how her parents didn't think much of her (though Ami still likes her ofc).

I am hoping there will be a bunch of mirror matches to be had.
 
Just a note none of our clans actually abandoned us. Mari arranged everything.

Funny enough, their lives improved while being missing nin. Man Mist is really a shit place.

Nobby: Not bullied anymore, found friends, nearly got married to a girl
Keiko: Became somewhat confident, became a summoner, now can marry a library into the Nara clan, not suicidal anymore
Hazou: friends,girlfriend,heir to Jiraiya, Aunt Ren is awesome, mom is alive, (Harem), God Emporer of ninjakind (2/5 villages)

Con:
Constant fear of death and Zabuza
 
The fight will be written for Sunday. Although I'm not taking votes on a plan, one thing you could do would be to compile a list of battle tactics that you want the team to train in and/or for Hazō to use in general. This will help avoid the following conversation:

Players: Hey! Something bad happened in this fight and it could have been avoided if only Hazō had done X! Why didn't you have Hazō do X?! We are very angry about this!!!!

QM: Well, fog of war is a thing, and it's hard to think of the perfectly optimal action when you only have a few seconds to respond to a life-threatening situation.

Players: But we are still very angry!!!! Something bad happened!!!!!!1!1!2!!!!!

QM: *sigh* Other-QM, combat has gotten too complicated. Let's never write another fight scene.

Other-QM: Sounds good to me!


;>

Right, so basic plan stubs of combat I've had floating in my head include:

Banshee Shenanigans: If preparation time is allowed, set up banshee slayers, and have everyone prepared with banshee seals to activate (with a quick action) if an enemy gets too close for comfort.

Breaking Enemy Comms: For large scaale battles, have one Banshee seal go off (with allies wearing Banshee Slayers) so that enemies can't communicate with each other with words. Also try to break enemy sightlines of each other via Misterators, Macerators, MEW, or Hiding In the Mist. Obviously, since we're fighting Wakahisa here, no Mist based tactics. Edit: and since it's dark, probably no MEW either.

Tower Defense: Keiko and Noburi mass spam goo bombs and Syrup Trap to tie up enemies as Akane and Hazou defend them with Taijutsu and Tac Move

Massive Turleing: "Kagome manuever" - Air Dome + Earth Dome/MEW + LBS + Explosives = death to all who remain nearby

Non-violent suppression: Everybody throws goo-bombs and Syrup trap to immobile the enemy, followed by Hazou making a Teepee above them with MEW and Noburi draining them through mist. Then begin negotiations.

Defend and retreat (use when conditioning jutsus pop and people get injured): group up, pop an Air Dome, set up slanted MEW defenses underneath for when the dome expires, have Hazou go underground to scout for a way out, ideally far away. Use Jiraiya's tunneling Jutsu to bring team to safety.

Dominance: Use Fire-log macerators to make massive firey death balls of intimidation. Or for Death if the situation calls for it.


Other things that are important include making sure allies don't die (try to keep an eye out on them - they're probably squishier than us), and not accidentally killing our opponents (in this fight).
 
Last edited:
But... but you like writing about punching?

For the record, my previous post wasn't meant to be taken seriously (I hoped that would be obvious but you can never tell with just text) and QMs should obviously never reward bad behavior.

Punching is fun to read about, though on the other hand it becomes increasingly worrying to vote for when there is a diplomatic solution since I am quite attached to the characters and don't want to see anyone hurt.

Still looking forward to the tournament though. It should be a pretty safe place to have my cake and eat it, too, due to the no lethality rules.
We are going to show our former clans just how much of a mistake they made to dismiss us.

Just need to survive next update in one piece first.

Nah, it's fine. I was thinking back to the salt that got thrown around when Minami died. Reasonably restrained, yet still aggravating since we put a lot of effort into making the characters do the smart thing (and even tweaked the rules slightly by allowing combat actions to be swapped for quick actions) but still got criticized. Most people were pretty cool about it, though.

The real problem is that the number of potential actions the team can take has grown enormously over the past in-game year or so. When I wrote Let the Bodies Hit the Floor the options for everyone were either "punch people" or "stab people", with one guy having the wild card "burn people" instead. Everyone had exactly one option with no modifiers except Roki, so it was straightforward. Now when I write a fight scene for Team Uplift I need to choose between:

Keiko: Throw pointy thing, throw explodey thing, throw gooey thing, throw loud thing, throw burny explodey thing, use misty thing, make windy spot, move (vacuum step), do ranged grabby thing, summon scaly murderball.

Akane: Punch thing youthfully, explodey-punch thing youthfully, use misty thing, use loud thing, use explodey thing, use burny explodey thing.

Noburi: whip, drain, use one of (misty, explodey, burny explodey, loud) thing, make goo, make watery guy.

Hazō: Punch ((deceptively)? (clawed?) (explodey?))? thing,
use (explodey / misty / loud / burny explodey / gooey) thing, make dirt shield, make hurty dirt shield, be a varmint, make a dirt guy.

Those are just combat actions, just the ones I can think of offhand, and don't include the new pangolin jutsu that are still being reviewed.

Oh, and add "put down domey-thing (windy | dirty) maker" to everyone's options.
 
Given the sheer variety of Jutsu, seals, and mundane tools a ninja can use...

We had a lot of time where we were basically dirty homeless ninjas, and suddenly we have access to secret libraries of techniques, tutors, blacksmiths, and all the other trappings of civilization. I dont know if its just growing pain, or if the combat system needs a re-work...

Sigh* You guys have handled (pretty much) everything in this quest with grace and aplomb so far.

If you wanted to try something new a comparatively low stakes Chunin Exam would be the place...
 
Nah, it's fine. I was thinking back to the salt that got thrown around when Minami died. Reasonably restrained, yet still aggravating since we put a lot of effort into making the characters do the smart thing (and even tweaked the rules slightly by allowing combat actions to be swapped for quick actions) but still got criticized. Most people were pretty cool about it, though.

The real problem is that the number of potential actions the team can take has grown enormously over the past in-game year or so. When I wrote Let the Bodies Hit the Floor the options for everyone were either "punch people" or "stab people", with one guy having the wild card "burn people" instead. Everyone had exactly one option with no modifiers except Roki, so it was straightforward. Now when I write a fight scene for Team Uplift I need to choose between:

Keiko: Throw pointy thing, throw explodey thing, throw gooey thing, throw loud thing, throw burny explodey thing, use misty thing, make windy spot, move (vacuum step), do ranged grabby thing, summon scaly murderball.

Akane: Punch thing youthfully, explodey-punch thing youthfully, use misty thing, use loud thing, use explodey thing, use burny explodey thing.

Noburi: whip, drain, use one of (misty, explodey, burny explodey, loud) thing, make goo, make watery guy.

Hazō: Punch ((deceptively)? (clawed?) (explodey?))? thing,
use (explodey / misty / loud / burny explodey / gooey) thing, make dirt shield, make hurty dirt shield, be a varmint, make a dirt guy.

Those are just combat actions, just the ones I can think of offhand, and don't include the new pangolin jutsu that are still being reviewed.

Oh, and add "put down domey-thing (windy | dirty) maker" to everyone's options.

So we are level 6 wizards?
 
For the record, my previous post wasn't meant to be taken seriousl
Oh, just in case it wasn't clear: I didn't take it seriously, no worries.

I dont know if its just growing pain, or if the combat system needs a re-work...
I do find myself thinking, relatively often, "I wonder if I could convince everyone involved in this quest to switch to Fate / Shadowrun / Ninja HERO / almost literally any professionally-designed system that was thoroughly playtested before implementation." Then I consider the amount of work that would require and the level of justified grievance players might well have. At which point I go do something else while carefully not saying a word.
 
I do find myself thinking, relatively often, "I wonder if I could convince everyone involved in this quest to switch to Fate / Shadowrun / Ninja HERO / almost literally any professionally-designed system that was thoroughly playtested before implementation." Then I consider the amount of work that would require and the level of justified grievance players might well have. At which point I go do something else while carefully not saying a word.

I still think a superhero system would be perfect for Naruto. I'd run it as Mutants and Masterminds, tuned for higher lethality options.
 
Oh, just in case it wasn't clear: I didn't take it seriously, no worries.


I do find myself thinking, relatively often, "I wonder if I could convince everyone involved in this quest to switch to Fate / Shadowrun / Ninja HERO / almost literally any professionally-designed system that was thoroughly playtested before implementation." Then I consider the amount of work that would require and the level of justified grievance players might well have. At which point I go do something else while carefully not saying a word.

I wouldn't exactly describe Shadowrun as a professionally designed system, and I certainly wouldn't describe it as a playtested system.
 
Voting is open for the next 6 hours, 50 minutes
Back
Top