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Yup, looks like I was right: Jiraiya ordered Minami's death. Either that or a Mist-nin decided it was a good idea to not capture some of the Cold Stone Killers.

Well Jiraiya killed Minami

Well, here's an idea that should never be in our fucking head so lets kindly never talk about this again. Do you really believe Hazo will not blurb this realization out at first opportunity? Do you want a Yamanaka reading this suspicion out of our mind? Let's make sure these accusation disappear in a sea of other posts, and never bring it up again.

(Can Yamanakas read ROT13?)
 
Okay. That's fine.

We can probably blow a hole through the building.

Um... Obviously when we leave the dome we hold seals and prepare to set up another dome the moment The Enemy returns. And... Seal Minami's corpse, duh.

Uh- Let's see... We reconvene with Rockfall B, and Akane decides whether to continue the mission or hurry back to Leaf. We absolutely don't go chasing after The Enemy. They're a jonin and we're not idiots.

That cover everything important?
 
There's literally no way the info could have got to the yakuza.
They could have interrogated the contact in Ise (who gave us intel on Goda)...

Actually that makes a lot of sense. It's been several days since the attack and the Yakuza have to know something went on. That combined with the fact that ninja (us) were spotted running on roofs to get out of Ise means that they'd start interrogating, especially with the bouncer contact. They torture him, they get info on Jiraiya (since the contact knows we work for Jiraiya). Yakuza around the (everywhere) would start looking for other members of Jiraiya's network and find this contact, then kill + replace.

I still think it's Jiraiya since they showed usage of Hozuki's Mantle and a Mist-nin affiliated with the Yakuza would want to capture us alive.
 
Ultimately we have learned that small plans won't work for this quest. We split the party up and didn't bother preparing for the meeting. It was a fun expirement while it lasted but clearly we can't count on any degree of competence from the team
 
This seems too risky for J to have ordered--there are easier ways to kill Minami.
Except that assuming Jiraiya wants to kill Minami, he's constrained by the following:
  • He has to do it before Minami returns to Leaf and (possibly) jeopardizes his political position in Leaf.
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't kill us (since we're on the same mission and would try to protect her as a teammate).
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't implicate us as killing her (since us surviving while she dies is suspicious).
This is probably how Jiraiya would do it. Make it seem like a Yakuza response to Goda's kidnapping, and make it seem as though the Yakuza would want revenge specifically on the team leader. Implicate Mist through use of Hozuki's Mantle, a jutsu known to Leaf as a Mist technique.
 
They could have interrogated the contact in Ise (who gave us intel on Goda)...

Actually that makes a lot of sense. It's been several days since the attack and the Yakuza have to know something went on. That combined with the fact that ninja (us) were spotted running on roofs to get out of Ise means that they'd start interrogating, especially with the bouncer contact. They torture him, they get info on Jiraiya (since the contact knows we work for Jiraiya). Yakuza around the (everywhere) would start looking for other members of Jiraiya's network and find this contact, then kill + replace.

I still think it's Jiraiya since they showed usage of Hozuki's Mantle and a Mist-nin affiliated with the Yakuza would want to capture us alive.

I was just writing about this when @eaglejarl updated the timeline to 23-27 September, which means it's 8 days. So not impossible also.
 
We need to work out solutions to the problems we can solve right this moment to keep living people. We kinda need to get past this point if we are going to be able to do anything about the situation in the long term.

Can Noburi use water whip with water in his line of sight or manifest water with chakra within his line of sight but outside of the Air Dome? If so we could try and clean the air of poison using the water, or manipulate latches to open doors to allow for airflow to reduce the presence of poison in the area. Do we have a solid enough connection to the ground to make use of MEW to fortify our position/destroy the foundations of the building to let in clean air. We are going to be observed while doing anything so putting up MEW would work to our advantage by blocking the prepared line of sight of the people attacking us.
 
Except that assuming Jiraiya wants to kill Minami, he's constrained by the following:
  • He has to do it before Minami returns to Leaf and (possibly) jeopardizes his political position in Leaf.
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't kill us (since we're on the same mission and would try to protect her as a teammate).
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't implicate us as killing her (since us surviving while she dies is suspicious).
This is probably how Jiraiya would do it. Make it seem like a Yakuza response to Goda's kidnapping, and make it seem as though the Yakuza would want revenge specifically on the team leader. Implicate Mist through use of Hozuki's Mantle, a jutsu known to Leaf as a Mist technique.

And do it in such a way that we won't do anything more than mentally label him as one of multiple possible suspects.

After all, it's entirely possible from the information we have that this A) really was a Yak hit, or B) was Mist false-flagging as the Yak.
 
Which means that, since we split up, Akane could be killed as well. Since she's her team's leader, and she's also possibly going into a trap.

I'm not unduly concerned. The message could also have been "kill the team leader, who looks like <Minami>."

Assuming the J didn't anticipate us splitting up he probably didn't have two separate "kill the team leader" directives. By my analysis either just one of the two stops had such a directive (in which case we drew the short straw) or otherwise it'd be a bit awkward (assuming Minami's death didn't trigger a mission-abort) to have this happen twice in a row.

This seems too risky for J to have ordered--there are easier ways to kill Minami.

There's a relatively small window before she could get back to Leaf and leaf (har) a deadman-switch message for her clan regarding what she knows.

Ultimately we have learned that small plans won't work for this quest. We split the party up and didn't bother preparing for the meeting. It was a fun expirement while it lasted but clearly we can't count on any degree of competence from the team

What would a plan that would have avoided this scenario look like?

We did the same thing last update (enter a contact's home and marginally lower our guard) at the end of last update and no one was like "let us never go under another's roof again."
 
Ultimately we have learned that small plans won't work for this quest. We split the party up and didn't bother preparing for the meeting. It was a fun expirement while it lasted but clearly we can't count on any degree of competence from the team

There was no way that we could have predicted that Minami would split up the party, and there was no way we could have prevent the attack, only that we could be prepared.

So, no. It isn't about "small plan" versus "big plan".

Except that assuming Jiraiya wants to kill Minami, he's constrained by the following:
  • He has to do it before Minami returns to Leaf and (possibly) jeopardizes his political position in Leaf.
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't kill us (since we're on the same mission and would try to protect her as a teammate).
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't implicate us as killing her (since us surviving while she dies is suspicious).
This is probably how Jiraiya would do it. Make it seem like a Yakuza response to Goda's kidnapping, and make it seem as though the Yakuza would want revenge specifically on the team leader. Implicate Mist through use of Hozuki's Mantle, a jutsu known to Leaf as a Mist technique.

Doesn't matter who kill who. Our priority to ensure the team's survival, everything is secondary.
 
Lets try and solve the problem killing us right now and figure out the who and whys later. What do we know about buildings made for Chakra monster attacks, and can we pinpoint where the poison is coming from in case we need to deal with a seal or some other delivery method. What can Noburi sign to us about how we are being poisoned and what options we have to counter it. Should we have our lungs flushed out with activated charcoal & water? Would the fact that the antidote was administered via liquid help Noburi pinpoint they type of poison so that he can treat himself and then Hazou?
 
Very important questions to consider - how did they find out, how did they know our route, and how did they get someone in place so quickly?

There's been more than enough time. The end of the previous chapter was five days ago; at the time you were underneath the 'D' in 'Nagi Island'. You spent several days making deliveries down the west side of O'uzu, then at the shrine, then up the east side. Then you island-hopped up those two unnamed islands between O'uzu and Honey, then you traveled a few dozen miles into Honey.

Ultimately we have learned that small plans won't work for this quest. We split the party up and didn't bother preparing for the meeting. It was a fun expirement while it lasted but clearly we can't count on any degree of competence from the team
I'm curious -- had you been in charge of the team, knowing only what they know, what would you have done differently?

also a 1.25 exp per day plan. So even more evidence of a failed experiment
I note that it was a one-line plan with no attached non-binding suggestions. Low-effort plans have never received much in the way of XP.
 
Except that assuming Jiraiya wants to kill Minami, he's constrained by the following:
  • He has to do it before Minami returns to Leaf and (possibly) jeopardizes his political position in Leaf.
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't kill us (since we're on the same mission and would try to protect her as a teammate).
  • He has to do it in a way that doesn't implicate us as killing her (since us surviving while she dies is suspicious).
This is probably how Jiraiya would do it. Make it seem like a Yakuza response to Goda's kidnapping, and make it seem as though the Yakuza would want revenge specifically on the team leader. Implicate Mist through use of Hozuki's Mantle, a jutsu known to Leaf as a Mist technique.

I still think it'd be easier to immediately intercept her on return and immediately send her out. Sending a (presumably) ANBU against a (usually) full team with a paranoid sealmaster seems like a major risk.

We need to get back ASAP to raise the alarm that Leaf may be compromised.
 
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There was no way that we could have predicted that Minami would split up the party, and there was no way we could have prevent the attack, only that we could be prepared.

When we first started the mission we where super paranoid. Had spotters. Had escape routes. Had an ambush set up. After that we got auto missioned every time. Then we got punished for it in this update. Basically we can't expect any degree of compotence from the team so have micro manage everything. Which will slow every thing down.

Like I said before I didn't expect the community and QMs to go for smaller less detailed plans. Then the second time it gets implemented we suffer our first team death.
 
When we first started the mission we where super paranoid. Had spotters. Had escape routes. Had an ambush set up. After that we got auto missioned every time. Then we got punished for it in this update. Basically we can't expect any degree of compotence from the team so have micro manage everything. Which will slow every thing down.

Like I said before I didn't expect the community and QMs to go for smaller less detailed plans. Then the second time it gets implemented we suffer our first team death.

I am going to roll my eyes on this one.

Our plan, a poorly made one, was our fault. That is why we only got 5 XP. We got lazy and sloppy.

Whether or not we could have avoided or done something differently is another matter to prevent Minami's death is another matter.
 
I don't understand this. Could you give an example?

Sure. Here's a random post in the Second Uchiha quest I picked out as an example.

You'll see in the middle of the update, the first vote point is listed.

You have a choice here. These runes are useless to you, but you can take them or destroy them, thus practically eliminating the Rain team from the second test. The less competition the better. Or you could return them. The girl, at least, looks reasonable and has an interesting ability. Maybe she can knock out some other teams, leading to less clutter of competition and -assuming she manages to pass- show you more of her skills.

What do you do?
[] Take the runes and go.
[] Give the runes back and go.
[] Write-In


Decision made, you let the Rain genin take care of her teammates, who don't look to be in any condition to be much of a threat anytime soon, and turn to continue your way towards the meeting point.

Whatever the voters choose, Sasuke is going to move on afterwards and proceed on with things in pretty much the same way. There's a write-in option, but it's assumed that the vast majority of possible write-ins aren't going to change anything. (Naruto is there and isn't going to let Sasuke kill the giel and he knows that, so it's not a valid write-in.)

Here's another from the post before that one.

To your very positive surprise, all three of them are different from the two you already have. This makes five runes. You really struck a gold mine with this team. You consider what to do with your defeated opponents. If you tie them up securely, they won't be able to escape unless they have a hidden trick that you don't know about. That means that either the examiners will fail and collect them if losing your starting runes results in disqualification, or they will die; be it from dehydration or any of the roaming animals.

You could bind them loosely, so that you have plenty of time to make sure they don't follow you by the time they get free. Of course, that would still leave them open to death by wildlife, but why should be your problem.

You could, of course, kill them yourself. The examiner did suggest against it, but you can't be entirely sure that these guys won't be back to bother you later, and this is the only way to make sure that a team that knows you are in possession of at least five runes won't cause further problems.

Regarding the defeated team, you …
[] Do nothing.
[] Tie them up securely.
[] Tie them up in such a way that they could potentially break the bonds given a few hours.
[] Kill them.
[] Write-In


Your teammates hardly seem to care what happens to the enemy team, being far too distracted to do anything but execute your quick commands.

And then again in the same post. Naruto is not there for this one, and Sasuke's team is much less anti-killing so they'll kill the enemy team if he orders it. Or pretty much anything else.

"Fascinating," Neji says, his mouth quirking into a small smile. "No hesitation at all. Would you really fight us, even your alleged friend, Sarikasa? Could you hurt her?" he asks, motioning with his open palm toward to the Inuzuka at his side.

You break eye-contact with Neji for a second to look at Sari. She's looking back at you, expression unreadable beyond a bit of curiosity, the slightest hint of apprehension.

Turning back to Neji, you present him with your answer.

[] If I had to.
[] Enough to get her to stop.
[] I can work around her.
[] Try me.


You don't see how Sari has taken your response, as your gaze remains on Neji, who takes it in with the same indulgent semi-smile.

"I have heard enough," the Hyuga decides, his tense muscles relaxing as he turns his back to your team and begins walking away. "Let's go."

This one is pure character development. Neji will back down no matter what, but how does Sasuke feel about having to fight his not-girlfriend? No write-in option here because it's not that important so the QMs want to keep things simple.

Oh, and to go back to quoting Velorien....

You are in the dome. She has left the building and locked the door behind her.

Since a QM may mislead but never lie, she really did leave the building. That's a relief!
 
I don't have the tallies handy, but out of interest, which plan did you vote for?

She didn't vote.
Adhoc vote count started by eaglejarl on Jul 20, 2017 at 3:06 PM, finished with 329 posts and 13 votes.
 
When we first started the mission we where super paranoid. Had spotters. Had escape routes. Had an ambush set up. After that we got auto missioned every time.
None of those things would actually have helped in this instance. About the only thing I can think of would be if you stopped Minami from splitting the team, and I think that would actually have gone worse. A lot worse.

Thank you. That's very helpful and I'll bear it in mind.

Since a QM may mislead but never lie, she really did leave the building. That's a relief!
Drat. I should have thought of that, insofar as Hazō wasn't actually watching her at the time.
 
I'm curious -- had you been in charge of the team, knowing only what they know, what would you have done differently?

The basic contingencies we had when we made our first contact with the jeweler. Don't split the party up. Have escape routes planned. Have spotters prepare an ambush. Assume that every contact might be a ninja. Have a bit of paranoia.
 
*snrk*

I'm imagining if Jiraiya was behind the attack but we managed to save Minami.

Just Jiraiya sitting there listening to our report.

Smiling.

Using henge to stop us from seeing how bad his eye is twitching.
 
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