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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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Traiden said:
Did you miss the part where Kagome blew the whole ship up?
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I mean, most of the "we can't explain how the documents went missing!" was from the distinctly-murder-focused group, so yes, we could have spared the civilians and explained some things.

Edit: it is way too damn late to be discussing this though, we should be preparing for the next time we do this whole dance.
 
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faflec said:
In any case...I was thinking about telling them that we did the best we could have, and that sometimes that just isn't good enough. What matters is that we get better so that when we come across this sort of thing again, we can do better. Like have one of us sneak aboard as a member of the crew while the rest lure a chakra monster to the ship, and use the ensuing chaos to sneak "Goda" and any important intel away. And destroy the cabin to fake their d
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Honestly we did the best with our constraints. We are a heavy combat team. We had no time to scout and don't have the experience to social engineer a solution. We played to win. That has consequences
 
Rephrased @eaglejarl's post and added something of my own. Please give thoughts, this part is crucial to inter-team cohesion.
faflec said:
Here's a basic plan that does nothing but what the mission entails, plus a (mostly-empty) conversation with Akane. Obviously it's boring as shit. Feedback and ideas would be greatly appreciated.

[X] Action Plan: Rationalization
  • General:
    • Best girlfriend is best team leader. She says X? DO X!
    • When moving, minimize chatter in favor of alertness.
  • Main Questline:
      • (Almost) nonstop 15-16hr run back.
      • Break only when we need to replace Skywalkers.
        • Take this time to replenish chakra, food, and water.
        • Noburi can check on the prisoners to ensure they are alive but chakra-drained. Unconscious if appropriate.
        • If SOP, slightly hydrate the prisoners.
      • During one such break, check Goda & his retinue for false teeth/cyanide capsules.
        • Just in case Minami missed it. She did seem out of it.
      • If we MUST stop to sleep, set up a Skytower and sleep. Keep shifts.
      • Drop off Goda and his ninja bodyguards. Also give the intel we recovered.
        • Ask if they want us to wake them up via chakra water.
      • If prompted, give a mission briefing.
      • Collect weapons & food supplies.
        • See if we can get a spyglass or telescope. Ask Mari-sensei or Jiraiya if we get the chance to talk with them.
      • Take some time to rest after our run. Keep shifts.
        • If allowed, sleep in Konoha. Our old apartment, or estate if Jiraiya bought it.
        • If not allowed, head a ways to our destination, set up a Skywalker, and then sleep.
      • Skywalk back to the team.
        • It's a 22 hour run (to Nagi Island, on average). Don't exhaust ourselves with a second all-nighter.
  • Reassure Team Uplift before we leave.
    • Be respectful. Don't be tactless, not here.
      • People died, and that sucks.
      • I want to focus on the positive: we accomplished what we set out to do.
        • Keiko, you demonstrated just how powerful and useful your pangolins are, exactly as you said they would be.
        • Noburi, you dealt with that situation with surgical precision: no non-combatants were killed in the takedown and you effortlessly captured two experienced ninja with no risk to our team.
        • We didn't mess up and accidentally kill Goda, or let anyone notice.
      • Given our status as a heavy-combat squad I don't know if we could have done any more.
      • BUT as we get stronger and stronger, we'll gain the skill and ability to do better, and next time we won't have to hurt innocents.
  • Complete an After-Action Report.
    • Do the report after we regroup with the team, as time permits.
    • Keep in mind Minami still considers us to be the Cold Stone Killers/outsiders.
      • Disguising our trump card usages so we might not need to kill witnesses
        • Disguise Pangolins using fur (real, or Henge).
        • Apply Mist first, then Pangolins attack while LOS is blocked using Mist.
      • Timing between the air-team landing and the boat team?
      • Better knowledge of the Pangolin's personal combat ability for better diagnosis of enemy ninja capabilities.
  • Talk with Akane.
    • Do this when we have a break, NOT when we're moving.
    • Be open but respectful. Don't be tactless, not here.
    • Talk about our (Hazou's) feelings regarding what happened.
      • We feel guilty because our long-term plans revolved around destroying the system; now we're complicit in executing dozens of civilians.
      • We understand why it was done (increased risk of Leaf's rivals/Akatsuki finding out), but still hate that we chose killing innocents over the risk of serious failure.
      • We're scared that we'll give up, grow disillusioned, and/or end up becoming just another part of the civilization-eating system.
    • Ask her about Guy's philosophy and YOUTH.
      • How does she reconcile this with what happened?
      • What would Guy do? What would Lee?
    • Give her a hug. Best girlfriend deserves it, and more.
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We are level one thinkers at the moment, we need to figure out how to use our skills to layer deception over top how we win to keep people from figuring out how we did what we did. Be like a stage magician and hide how we do what we do.
 
DON'T JUST VOTE FOR IT CRITICIZE IT

PLEASE MY PLANS CAN ALWAYS BE BETTER
EDIT:
faflec said:
Here's a basic plan that does nothing but what the mission entails, plus a (mostly-empty) conversation with Akane. Obviously it's boring as shit. Feedback and ideas would be greatly appreciated.

[X] Action Plan: Rationalization
  • General:
    • Best girlfriend is best team leader. She says X? DO X!
    • When moving, minimize chatter in favor of alertness.
  • Main Questline:
      • (Almost) nonstop 15-16hr run back.
      • Break only when we need to replace Skywalkers.
        • Take this time to replenish chakra, food, and water.
        • Noburi can check on the prisoners to ensure they are alive but chakra-drained. Unconscious if appropriate.
        • If SOP, slightly hydrate the prisoners.
      • During one such break, check Goda & his retinue for false teeth/cyanide capsules.
        • Just in case Minami missed it. She did seem out of it.
      • If we MUST stop to sleep, set up a Skytower and sleep. Keep shifts.
      • Drop off Goda and his ninja bodyguards. Also give the intel we recovered.
        • Ask if they want us to wake them up via chakra water.
      • If prompted, give a mission briefing.
      • Collect weapons & food supplies.
        • See if we can get a spyglass or telescope. Ask Mari-sensei or Jiraiya if we get the chance to talk with them.
      • Take some time to rest after our run. Keep shifts.
        • If allowed, sleep in Konoha. Our old apartment, or estate if Jiraiya bought it.
        • If not allowed, head a ways to our destination, set up a Skywalker, and then sleep.
      • Skywalk back to the team.
        • It's a 22 hour run (to Nagi Island, on average). Don't exhaust ourselves with a second all-nighter.
  • Reassure Team Uplift before we leave.
    • Be respectful. Don't be tactless, not here.
      • People died, and that sucks.
      • I want to focus on the positive: we accomplished what we set out to do.
        • Keiko, you demonstrated just how powerful and useful your pangolins are, exactly as you said they would be.
        • Noburi, you dealt with that situation with surgical precision: no non-combatants were killed in the takedown and you effortlessly captured two experienced ninja with no risk to our team.
        • We didn't mess up and accidentally kill Goda, or let anyone notice.
      • Given our status as a heavy-combat squad I don't know if we could have done any more.
      • BUT as we get stronger and stronger, we'll gain the skill and ability to do better, and next time we won't have to hurt innocents.
  • Complete an After-Action Report.
    • Do the report after we regroup with the team, as time permits.
    • Keep in mind Minami still considers us to be the Cold Stone Killers/outsiders.
      • Disguising our trump card usages so we might not need to kill witnesses
        • Disguise Pangolins using fur (real, or Henge).
        • Apply Mist first, then Pangolins attack while LOS is blocked using Mist.
      • Timing between the air-team landing and the boat team?
      • Better knowledge of the Pangolin's personal combat ability for better diagnosis of enemy ninja capabilities.
  • Talk with Akane.
    • Do this when we have a break, NOT when we're moving.
    • Be open but respectful. Don't be tactless, not here.
    • Talk about our (Hazou's) feelings regarding what happened.
      • We feel guilty because our long-term plans revolved around destroying the system; now we're complicit in executing dozens of civilians.
      • We understand why it was done (increased risk of Leaf's rivals/Akatsuki finding out), but still hate that we chose killing innocents over the risk of serious failure.
      • We're scared that we'll give up, grow disillusioned, and/or end up becoming just another part of the civilization-eating system.
    • Ask her about Guy's philosophy and YOUTH.
      • How does she reconcile this with what happened?
      • What would Guy do? What would Lee?
    • Give her a hug. Best girlfriend deserves it, and more.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
I did criticize, you changed the thing that I wanted to be changed so now I will vote for it too. I would like for the goals to have "Maintain a Growth Mindset" added to it as well to set a positive tone to the update.

[X] Action Plan: Rationalization
 
Traiden said:
I did criticize, you changed the thing that I wanted to be changed so now I will vote for it too. I would like for the goals to have "Maintain a Growth Mindset" added to it as well to set a positive tone to the update.

[X] Action Plan: Rationalization
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Uh, sure I can add a Goals section. Give me a sec.
Edit:
faflec said:
Here's a basic plan that does nothing but what the mission entails, plus a (mostly-empty) conversation with Akane. Obviously it's boring as shit. Feedback and ideas would be greatly appreciated.

[X] Action Plan: Rationalization

Goals:
  • Survive.
  • Maintain a positive mindset.
  • Continue the mission.
  • Talk with the team.

Methods:
  • General:
    • Best girlfriend is best team leader. She says X? DO X!
    • When moving, minimize chatter in favor of alertness.
  • Main Questline:
      • (Almost) nonstop 15-16hr run back.
      • Break only when we need to replace Skywalkers.
        • Take this time to replenish chakra, food, and water.
        • Noburi can check on the prisoners to ensure they are alive but chakra-drained. Unconscious if appropriate.
        • If SOP, slightly hydrate the prisoners.
      • During one such break, check Goda & his retinue for false teeth/cyanide capsules.
        • Just in case Minami missed it. She did seem out of it.
      • If we MUST stop to sleep, set up a Skytower and sleep. Keep shifts.
      • Drop off Goda and his ninja bodyguards. Also give the intel we recovered.
        • Ask if they want us to wake them up via chakra water.
      • If prompted, give a mission briefing.
      • Collect weapons & food supplies.
        • See if we can get a spyglass or telescope. Ask Mari-sensei or Jiraiya if we get the chance to talk with them.
      • Take some time to rest after our run. Keep shifts.
        • If allowed, sleep in Konoha. Our old apartment, or estate if Jiraiya bought it.
        • If not allowed, head a ways to our destination, set up a Skywalker, and then sleep.
      • Skywalk back to the team.
        • It's a 22 hour run (to Nagi Island, on average). Don't exhaust ourselves with a second all-nighter.
  • Reassure Team Uplift before we leave.
    • Be respectful. Don't be tactless, not here.
      • People died, and that sucks.
      • I want to focus on the positive: we accomplished what we set out to do.
        • Keiko, you demonstrated just how powerful and useful your pangolins are, exactly as you said they would be.
        • Noburi, you dealt with that situation with surgical precision: no non-combatants were killed in the takedown and you effortlessly captured two experienced ninja with no risk to our team.
        • We didn't mess up and accidentally kill Goda, or let anyone notice.
      • Given our status as a heavy-combat squad I don't know if we could have done any more.
      • BUT as we get stronger and stronger, we'll gain the skill and ability to do better, and next time we won't have to hurt innocents.
  • Complete an After-Action Report.
    • Do the report after we regroup with the team, as time permits.
    • Keep in mind Minami still considers us to be the Cold Stone Killers/outsiders.
      • Disguising our trump card usages so we might not need to kill witnesses
        • Disguise Pangolins using fur (real, or Henge).
        • Apply Mist first, then Pangolins attack while LOS is blocked using Mist.
      • Timing between the air-team landing and the boat team?
      • Better knowledge of the Pangolin's personal combat ability for better diagnosis of enemy ninja capabilities.
  • Talk with Akane.
    • Do this when we have a break, NOT when we're moving.
    • Be open but respectful. Don't be tactless, not here.
    • Talk about our (Hazou's) feelings regarding what happened.
      • We feel guilty because our long-term plans revolved around destroying the system; now we're complicit in executing dozens of civilians.
      • We understand why it was done (increased risk of Leaf's rivals/Akatsuki finding out), but still hate that we chose killing innocents over the risk of serious failure.
      • We're scared that we'll give up, grow disillusioned, and/or end up becoming just another part of the civilization-eating system.
    • Ask her about Guy's philosophy and YOUTH.
      • How does she reconcile this with what happened?
      • What would Guy do? What would Lee?
    • Give her a hug. Best girlfriend deserves it, and more.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
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I might try to reconcile the latter thing with Akane with the new add in a bit. It kind of makes it sound like everything Hazou says for the positive bit is a front, which it is to an extent but shouldn't be to that extent.
 
@faflec might mention something about Joe if we had better infiltration skills we might have been able to pull of the mission without killing civilians. How we got complacent without Mari around
 
faflec said:
*DESPERATELY TRIES TO STOP ALL THESE FEET FROM ENTERING HAZOU'S MOUTH*

@faflec: HELP ME PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD HELP ME
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I mean, you can have a contingency section but for this it's basically "see anyone? If yes, DIVE DIVE DIVE".

Also, that no one noticed might skirt the line too much to : "Yeah, nobody alive knows about it except us, just as planned, right?". You could probably change it to : "We didn't kill Goda when there were at least a dozen ninja or summon combatants of chunin class or better at short range."
 
faflec said:
DON'T JUST VOTE FOR IT CRITICIZE IT

PLEASE MY PLANS CAN ALWAYS BE BETTER
EDIT:
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Well if you insist. ;) Do you want, "obvious problems I see," or, "English tutor with a grudge against your work specifically?"

If it's just the obvious, here are my immediate thoughts:

1)

Under "General," you have,

"Best girlfriend is best team leader. She says X? DO X!"

Is this Hazou's opinion, or something he is going to be saying around our actual team leader, who has significant and not-entirely-unjustified insecurities regarding her authority in our eyes? At the moment it is ambiguous -- and, therefore, up to QM interpretations.

2)

Under the "Return to Konoha," section:

"During one such break, check Goda & his retinue for false teeth/cyanide capsules."

Ambiguities are a malevolent QM's friend. I recommend specifying that we conduct this check at the earliest practical opportunity -- where "practical" includes any consideration which Hazou, in his mindset as a paranoid and professional ninja currently working under a team leader insecure in her authority, finds potentially problematic. If the prisoners have suicide options, we should specifically aim to remove them as swiftly as possible; additionally, we want to specifically avoid challenging Minami's leadership-related insecurities.

3)

As might be apparent, I would prefer in general to see more specific safeguards against triggering Minami's insecurities. She's in a delicate place at the moment, as we've seen in the past couple of updates. That can be good, but can also go very swiftly and horribly wrong.
 
Enjou said:
I might try to reconcile the latter thing with Akane with the new add in a bit. It kind of makes it sound like everything Hazou says for the positive bit is a front, which it is to an extent but shouldn't be to that extent.
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The thing is, I'm kind of intending for Hazou to do "Reassure Team Uplift" ASAP, and do "Talk with Akane" afterwards (since time is of the essence). And I feel that talking about Hazou's guilt/self-loathing/fears and the subsequent discussion would take up too much time to justify. I dunno, just throwing out my thoughts.
Oneiros43 said:
@faflec might mention something about Joe if we had better infiltration skills we might have been able to pull of the mission without killing civilians. How we got complacent without Mari around
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Could you expand on this a little? I'm not sure how we got complacent when, after getting the mission, we didn't try an infiltration: FMPOV us getting complacent means that we would have tried (and failed) to sneak in to nab Goda.

I think I'm misinterpreting you but can't figure it out.
huhYeahGoodPoint said:
I mean, you can have a contingency section but for this it's basically "see anyone? If yes, DIVE DIVE DIVE".

Also, that no one noticed might skirt the line too much to : "Yeah, nobody alive knows about it except us, just as planned, right?". You could probably change it to : "We didn't kill Goda when there were at least a dozen ninja or summon combatants of chunin class or better at short range."
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SEE THIS IS WHAT I NEED LOGICAL CRITICSM ON MY SOCIAL PLAN THANK YOU

I LOVE YOU

Alright, I'm adding a contingency and making changes. Will post the edited version after I'm done.
PoptartProdigy said:
Well if you insist. ;) Do you want, "obvious problems I see," or, "English tutor with a grudge against your work specifically?"

If it's just the obvious, here are my immediate thoughts:

1)

Under "General," you have,

"Best girlfriend is best team leader. She says X? DO X!"

Is this Hazou's opinion, or something he is going to be saying around our actual team leader, who has significant and not-entirely-unjustified insecurities regarding her authority in our eyes? At the moment it is ambiguous -- and, therefore, up to QM interpretations.

2)

Under the "Return to Konoha," section:

"During one such break, check Goda & his retinue for false teeth/cyanide capsules."

Ambiguities are a malevolent QM's friend. I recommend specifying that we conduct this check at the earliest practical opportunity -- where "practical" includes any consideration which Hazou, in his mindset as a paranoid and professional ninja currently working under a team leader insecure in her authority, finds potentially problematic. If the prisoners have suicide options, we should specifically aim to remove them as swiftly as possible; additionally, we want to specifically avoid challenging Minami's leadership-related insecurities.

3)

As might be apparent, I would prefer in general to see more specific safeguards against triggering Minami's insecurities. She's in a delicate place at the moment, as we've seen in the past couple of updates. That can be good, but can also go very swiftly and horribly wrong.
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The latter if you have time. Good ideas, I'll implement.
 
@Oneiros43 and @faflec Instead of wording it that way mention how Hazou will be wanting to focus on getting better so that we can fill the gap of skills that Mari brought to the table. Mention how we still are getting used to the expertise that Minami brings to the team and that we took Inoue for granted. Ask what we should bring back as a gift for her once the whole team gets back. Team dinner at a high class restaurant maybe?
 
faflec said:
The thing is, I'm kind of intending for Hazou to do "Reassure Team Uplift" ASAP, and do "Talk with Akane" afterwards (since time is of the essence). And I feel that talking about Hazou's guilt/self-loathing/fears and the subsequent discussion would take up too much time to justify. I dunno, just throwing out my thoughts.
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No, I got that. I'm just saying some of it could be reconciled a bit. The two sections just feel a little disjointed to me because they were written separately. I suppose eaglejarl can probably reconcile them, though.
 
faflec said:
Could you expand on this a little? I'm not sure how we got complacent when, after getting the mission, we didn't try an infiltration: FMPOV us getting complacent means that we would have tried (and failed) to sneak in to nab Goda.
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Mostly how with our skill set we couldn't complete the mission without risking civilians. How normally we would have just deployed Mari if we wanted a social solution. We got complacent by not developing our skills to address the skill gap Mari retiring presented the team
 
Oneiros43 said:
Also @faflec still think if we see Mari or Jiraiya we should ask about Hana
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I'll write that if Hazou meets Mari-sensei, he'll ask her, that sound good?

Hm. Maybe end up writing an entire scene with Mari-sensei if we get the chance to stay in Konoha for the night...
Traiden said:
@Oneiros43 and @faflec Instead of wording it that way mention how Hazou will be wanting to focus on getting better so that we can fill the gap of skills that Mari brought to the table. Mention how we still are getting used to the expertise that Minami brings to the team and that we took Inoue for granted. Ask what we should bring back as a gift for her once the whole team gets back. Team dinner at a high class restaurant maybe?
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Oneiros43 said:
Mostly how with our skill set we couldn't complete the mission without risking civilians. How normally we would have just deployed Mari if we wanted a social solution. We got complacent by not developing our skills to address the skill gap Mari retiring presented the team
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Oh that's what you meant, now I feel dumb.

I feel that given the situation (the suddenness of the mission, the limited time to train...) I wouldn't call it complacency so much as...well, us getting shoved into the deep end. Still, point taken. Dunno where to add it but I'll figure something out.
Enjou said:
No, I got that. I'm just saying some of it could be reconciled a bit. The two sections just feel a little disjointed to me because they were written separately. I suppose eaglejarl can probably reconcile them, though.
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Hmmmm...

Let me take a thinky at it. Having a bit of trouble ATM.
 
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