You know, we might ought to stop saying stuff like this since we're part of Hazou's psyche...

Hm. I'd kind of prefer diplo since we're gonna be in Leaf, tbh...

Chuunin sealing by XP is 25, Jounin sealing by XP is 31.

It only takes 1620 XP invested in a disciple to reach jounin level? That's only Weapons 48, seems pretty low to qualify for jounin status in a primary ability, though I could see Jounin having such levels for support / secondary abilities. Maybe that's what Kagome was referring to as 'Jounin level.' The main issue is that there isn't that much mechanical difference between Sealing 25 and 31...
 
It only takes 1620 XP invested in a disciple to reach jounin level? That's only Weapons 48, seems pretty low to qualify for jounin status in a primary ability, though I could see Jounin having such levels for support / secondary abilities. Maybe that's what Kagome was referring to as 'Jounin level.' The main issue is that there isn't that much mechanical difference between Sealing 25 and 31...
Maybe I'm wrong, then; I'm just repeating what I've been told.
 
Chunin Sealing assuming Taijutsu 40 is low Chunin is 23, almost 24.

Dunno what you're all using for Jonin Sealing, though.
 
45-50 Sealing being Jounin level sounds reasonable. 10 years exp at 3xp per day and 25% of xp spent towards Sealing is low 40's. Probably a low estimate.
 
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45-50 Sealing being Jounin level sounds reasonable. 10 years exp at 3xp per day, or higher, and 25% of xp spent towards Sealing. Probably a low estimate.
...of course, you can only assume that Kagome spent closer to 50% in Sealing since he didn't worry about socials at all... :p

e: @faflec Water Whip 60 = ~2067 XP
 
I just realized that we're going to have to apologize to Akane about the whole Hazou x Ino thing.

This is gonna suuuuuck.

I distinctly disagree on immediate apologies over that bit.

1. Assess the situation first. If Ino and Akane in the time passed since then haven't
a. Forgotten us entirely and moved on
b. KIlled each other in a cat fight that will have Jiraiya throw in a bonus out of pride and share-of-royalties
c. Agreed to attack us on entry with spiky shoes and garden shears
Then its some measure of evidence towards "not as much a problem to them as we fear", yes?
2. Consider Akane's perspective. Feeling weak, a bit scared, nervous about first relationship, and depressive generally...BUT
a. Still boosted by the realization of Sensei's love which should counter some of those
b. Best Apprentice should really trust in Youth a bit more than to be assuming "Hazou will totally dump me if I don't agree to this". Thats a pretty awful assessment of us, and ignores the clear uncertainty and lack of social skills he's shown around the whole issue. Akane (moreso with time passed to be rational) has shown to be much more mature generally and should be adding a "sucks at diplomacy" modifier rather than assuming negative motives.
c. Happy Youth Girl is really going to be so selfish as to say "No I demand all the happiness to myself, this other nice girl gets none of it its all mine" ?
d. Fears objectively assumes moral wrongness to the situation. We announced ahead of time immediately as it occurred as an issue, so no deceit. Uncertainy of ninja lifes and frequent deployments adds some rational-world bonus to the idea of ready-reserves and 'time is shared easier when ones deployed anyways'.
e. Do we assess that Akane would automatically reject this aspect of Hazou's personality? "Love is love whoever its focused on" is a principle of acceptance that seems amenable to Youth, as is "Sharing is Caring"
3. Consider from Ino's perspective. Barely knows him and early stages. Most social of the girls and potentially more amenable than most (Sakura xD) to experiment with sharing. Most likely "romantic" enough to see 'first girl wins' advantage making this likely her best chance to be included.


In summary, we can perhaps apologize for the poor timing of not saving it till after hospital (or maybe not, it basically calls her too depressed and irrational to have honest discussion with) , but I hope that Akane would acknowledge uncertainty of our schedule (quickly proven thereafter), the honesty of rushing to admit it, and that it is a flaw of social skill (which nearly got us killed shortly thereafter, punishment enough?) rather than an unkindness of intent.
 
Some math, for math people who like math. (and WMDs)

This is how the world ends this is how the world ends... pretty much exactly as expected.

@Enjou Adjustments to @Radvic's plan.
Zephyr's reach bullets - Have keiko or Mari test this. They'll need to go to a wide open area, either way up in the air or slightly above the ocean. Use ZR on a 10 gram pebble and see how fast they can rotate it at the farthest part of their range, using mirrors for line of sight, if necessary. Actually, first try only the largest circle within the front of their range. If ZR has no maximum velocity limit, this should be near super sonic. If this works, spend time perfecting their aim and otherwise getting used to the new application of ZR. (also try this with a circular arrangement of wind wall, either deactivating it to fire or casting a second wind wall to divert the sped up bullet to it's desired path.

Zephyr's reach seal assisted bullets - Cut a paper into a circle and infuse a storage seal and 2 LBfs on it(make verticle lips as necessary for LBFs to work) on it. Store a small rock in it. Try using ZR to make it spin about it's center, flat side up, as quickly as possible, activating it by lowering a lip with ZR when it's fully up to speed. If this seems like a viable weapon, Mari and Keiko should practice with it before we leave our camp and we should make a reasonable amount of them.

Both ZR tests should be done behind appropriate defenses composed of 5BS and force walls.

Some complaints about these:

spinning paper disk
Spinning at fast speeds is different than spinning at high RPM. For a disk, the bursting speed of the material is dependent on the tensile strength and the material density (see: specific strength). From Space tether - Wikipedia
"the material's "specific velocity" which is equal to the maximum tangential velocity a spinning hoop can attain without breaking"
is V = sqrt(Specific Strength)
Thus, we need specific strength of at least V^2. for 1300 m/s tip speed, this means 1690 e3 m^2/s^2.
See Specific strength - Wikipedia for a table of typical Specific Strengths.

If you reduce the speed to say 720 m/s, youre at the specific strength of Balsa wood at 520 e3 m^2/s^2 (which despite low tensile strength has very low density).

You may still be satisfied at this speed...

However, you also face trouble with unsealing many things in approximately the same space. The things you unseal have volume, and you are trying to unseal them extremely rapidly... before you have any chance for the previous item to clear the area. Either seal failure or odd collision mechanics ensue. Some redesign of release mechanism is in order


Second:
Spinning in the open atmosphere, large radius:
Air drag is going to affect this, as you mentioned. Here's a way to calculate it-
mS = .01 kg (mass of stone from your math)
Rad = 50 m (radius from your math)
FZephyrMag = 44.5 (from your math)

rhoA = 1.225 kg/m^3 (density of air)
rhoS = 2650 kg/m^3 (density of stone - granite specifically)

Figure out the cross-sectional area of the pebble, assuming a sphere
VS = .01 / 2650 = 3.8 e-6 m^3 (Volume)
rS = (VS * 3 / (4* pi))^(1/3) = 9.7 e-3 m (radius)
AS = 3.0 e-4 (Area)

Drag Coefficient
CD ~ .8 (Cannonball Aerodynamic Drag) for sphere close to Mach 1

You need to use vector summation to combine mutually perpendicular forces
FZephyrT = force due to zephyr reach that is not used to cancel gravity, or used in centripetal acceleration
FZephyrZ = gravity cancel force
FZephyrR = centripetal Force

FZephyr = [FZephyrR, FZephyrT, FZephyrZ] (R to center of circular motion, T tangent to circle, Z up and down)
= [mS*vel^2/Rad, .5*rhoA*vel^2*AS*CD, .1]

for simpler math, assume FZephyrZ ~ 0... i.e. vel^2 * [mS/Rad, .5*rhoA*AS*CD, 0]

FZephyrMag = vel^2 * sqrt( mS^2/Rad^2 + .25*rhoA^2*AS^2*CD^2) = vel^2 * B
where B = sqrt( mS^2/Rad^2 + .25*rhoA^2*AS^2*CD^2)
B = 2.5 e-4 for the numbers provided

vel = sqrt(FZephyrMag/B) = 426 m/s

once released, the sphere sees a drag force of
.5*rhoA*vel^2*AS*CD ~ 26.65 N which decelerates the sphere (initially) at 2665 m/s^2

once released, the sphere accelerates downward at 9.8 m/s^2

Assuming an initial altitude of 1.5 m (Keiko eye level?) and no initial vertical velocity, ground impact after .56 s (ish), at a velocity of ~93 m/s, range 102 m (hitting their feet)

Velocity/Range will be a bit higher, because CD is decreasing with Mach. impact speed will be no greater than 141 m/s, at a range of ~131 m, again impacting at foot level (done by setting CD to 0.45)

The spreadsheet isn't too hard to build in excel, so long as you don't mind cruddy first order Euler approximations for integration.

Bullet shapes and spinning the bullet will change this, but probably not by as much as you might think.
 
Paging @Radvic: time for you to do some math.

Here's your nuke testing block: https://forums.sufficientvelocity.com/posts/8189727/

For the God-breaking Wind, you need to figure out what it does because I don't have the math want to focus on writing the update. An implosion seal teleports all the air within 5-20m (radius set at blank-creation time) into itself. There is no 'unseal' option because that was never intended. When the seal is destroyed its contents are released into a sphere of 1m diameter. The center of the sphere is as close as possible to where the center of the seal was without overlapping. (i.e., about 50cm away) Please do not ask "what if there isn't enough room" because I want to write updates instead of doing rules arbitration. Shelve that question for another time.

Note that (a) I'm on the tail end of a head cold and (b) I'm wanting to write the update (which will take most of the day) and then do a boatton of other things. "Kurosawa's Glorious Life-Destroying Device" requires too much worldbuilding and rules-arbitration time, so I'm ruling that it makes Kagome twitchy and he forbids it for now. You can maybe talk him around later.

... Yeah, you're right. I revise my previous assertion: it obviously would matter. That was just laziness on my part.
It never ceases to amaze me that people here are actually willing to change their minds when given sufficient evidence. Seriously, y'all rock. Please go into politics.

Low chunin decep die on a decep-specialist is calc'd at 29 using the relative costs (although those calcs have now been called into question due to an explained discrepancy in the relative costs for medical skills calcs).
Note that, so far as I'm aware, no one has any idea what the 'costs' sheet is for. When calculating costs for things I would suggest using the actual numbers.

The main issue is that there isn't that much mechanical difference between Sealing 25 and 31...
*puzzled* There isn't? On average 31 dice gets you an extra 303 points on your roll vs 25 dice, meaning that you can safely research significantly more complex seals and you get done much faster on a seal of a given level.
 
Personally, I kind of expect that an apology to Ino/Akane in the context of "I'm socially inept forgive me" should work out. I mean, it might not be pleasant, but it should work out. Don't make it more complicated than it needs to be, we're bad at social stuff as it is :p
Note that, so far as I'm aware, no one has any idea what the 'costs' sheet is for. When calculating costs for things I would suggest using the actual numbers.
Spoooooky.
 
The implication is that we would continue to act this way. Which sadly isn't likely to happen when surrounded by a majority who doesn't.

Yeah this only really happens when you have a culture that considers "updating your beliefs" to be more/equally virtuous than/to "having been correct from the start". And this thread is one of the very few places I've seen that has that cultural trait.

If we tried to act this way in politics we'd be laughed out of the campaign by accusations of flip-flopping and being "consistently wrong".
 
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I predict we're going to be much more successful at being a mad scientist then actually changing the social environment. At the very least, Hazō will be able to start the seed of something.

And hopefully we'll get to start the Kurosawa university.
 
I'd just like to repeat the fact that the Aburame are going to take over the world once we're in Leaf. We can make seals for them that their insects can trigger with relative ease (by what Kagome said): Simply make pressure-triggering seals. All hail your new insect overlords.
 
We should just assume taijutsu 40 and taijutsu 60 is the equivalent amount of exp required to hit low chunnin low jounin. 80 should be begging s rank
 
Oh god, you all actually voted in the "make a nuke and set it off" plan?

Even if we survive, there's no way that nobody is going to swing by to see what the fuck happened.
 
*puzzled* There isn't? On average 31 dice gets you an extra 303 points on your roll vs 25 dice, meaning that you can safely research significantly more complex seals and you get done much faster on a seal of a given level.

It's a relevant difference, just not as large as I'd intuitively consider "chunin to jounin." For example, we've been eyeballing primary combat stats as 40 for a focused chunin and 60 for a focused jounin. A 6 die gap matters, but seems small compared to a 20 die gap.

If we tried to act this way in politics we'd be laughed out of the campaign by accusations of flip-flopping and being "consistently wrong".

I can see the ads now... "MadScientist? Who'd want to vote for a scientist?"
 
Paging @Radvic: time for you to do some math.

Here's your nuke testing block: https://forums.sufficientvelocity.com/posts/8189727/

For the God-breaking Wind, you need to figure out what it does because I don't have the math want to focus on writing the update. An implosion seal teleports all the air within 5-20m (radius set at blank-creation time) into itself. There is no 'unseal' option because that was never intended. When the seal is destroyed its contents are released into a sphere of 1m diameter. The center of the sphere is as close as possible to where the center of the seal was without overlapping. (i.e., about 50cm away) Please do not ask "what if there isn't enough room" because I want to write updates instead of doing rules arbitration. Shelve that question for another time.

Note that (a) I'm on the tail end of a head cold and (b) I'm wanting to write the update (which will take most of the day) and then do a boatton of other things. "Kurosawa's Glorious Life-Destroying Device" requires too much worldbuilding and rules-arbitration time, so I'm ruling that it makes Kagome twitchy and he forbids it for now. You can maybe talk him around later.

Just a note of clarification in case it was missed - the plan calls for us to only do Deathenators/Youthenizers, not the other two. Well, if you want you could still do God-breaking Wind, I just didn't think we'd want to spend that much time on it.

EDIT:
Test the Deathenators/Youthenizers WMDs testing block if the team doesn't veto it.

Might have been a bit unclear in intent due to a couple missing words. Should be:
"Test the Deathenators/Youthenizers in the WMDs testing block if the team doesn't veto it."
 
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