Obsidian is 100% a rock, and obsidian is still used today as a scalpel blade because it's so damn sharp. Far sharper than diamond or steel blades. I kinda doubt Hazou is good enough to shape the cutting edge (3nm), so the obvious thing to do is to knap some obsidian flakes and use the jutsu to reshape the flake into a blade.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
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- Tags
- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
That's... a really good idea.
We can provide them to Tsunade for medical use free of charge. Merchant council can't say a damn thing about us doing that, or she would have some things to say to them.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
This is rich coming from me, but dude people have phobias, spoiler the spider.Credit to @hYGP in discord for the dialogue
Also, we should make a memorial shrine for Jiraiya and future fallen Goketsu, using this new jutsu to create lifelike busts/statues.
- Location
- United States
This smelled like complete BS to me so I looked it up.
How Stone Age blades are still cutting it in modern surgery | CNN
Obsidian is a volcanic glass used to make tools for Stone-Age man -- and for modern surgeons.
www.cnn.com
Surgical Blades: Which Scalpels Are Right for Your Operating Room?
Choosing the right types of surgical blades for the operating teams at your hospital or surgical center can be a daunting challenge. Surgical blades vary by size and shape, while some models are manufactured for specific surgical procedures.
www.usamedicalsurgical.com
TLDR: I was dead wrong
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
That should be the first thing we do once we get rid of the severe consequences.
The reason that obsidian blades are a rounding error in scalpel blades today is 1) they can only be used on soft tissue 2) they are expensive as heck $85/blade vs $0.09/blade 3) they aren't disposable and you can't sharpen them.
But for soft tissue work they are strictly better. The incisions don't scar as much and they heal faster.
Fortunately, much of the wear and tear on the blades in MfD will be reduced b/c they don't need to be autoclaved since the medic can just chakra things sterile. I bet Hazou can make one in about 10 minutes, given the small size and simple shape. So we could have a couple dozen done in a day easily. Could be pretty neat.
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
Good way to make nice with our aunt, that's for damn sure; and even better, shadow clones can make them.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Metal does not count as Earth Element and therefore cannot be affected by this jutsu.
Stoneshaping requires a few minutes at the beginning in order to saturate the material with your chakra and then a few minutes at the end to pull your chakra out. "A few minutes" is vague, but assume it's about 5. The middle part, where you're actually shaping the material, takes minutes or hours.
tl;dr and ponwog because @Velorien isn't around to confirm with: Making a scalpel with this would take at least an hour, probably more.
- Location
- The state of Paranoia
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
Would it take less time to make more than one scalpel at once out of a larger amount of material?
Still super worth doing though!
- Location
- Earth
I was once told by someone who did scalpel work that a lot of doctors consider the possibility of leaving obsidian flakes and shards in someone's wounds too risky for their malpractice insurance. Anecdotal evidence though, also a different context than within the quest. Perhaps the flakes and shard issue could be overcome here.
- Location
- The Void
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Yeah this is a cool idea but instead of having Hazō do it we should just pay someone to do it for us. That way everyone wins
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- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
I'm a bit confused because I thought that the Will of Fire as a religion was pretty much founded by Hashirama (and then fiddled with by Tobirama), though layered upon and making use of older beliefs regarding the spirits and the Sage of Six Paths. Hashirama himself based a lot of his philosophy on those of some some hill daimyo, but at that point it wasn't a revered religion yet.
In that light I have follow-up questions:
1. That sounds like the doylist answer, or at least the answer that Hashirama and other ninja in the know would give in confidence. Is it also the actual answer taught to lay civilians? I.e. kami are divisive spirits and even casual reverence to them risks tearing apart the sacred unity of Leaf because jealous kami delight in taking more than offered and are jealous of the humans bond shared in Leaf?
2. I was curious whether the initial founders of the religion (the first two Hokage I assume) are quoted or "quoted" to have said or done something against homosexuality. Something that the Hagoromo can point to the way religious nutjobs point to Leviticus 18:22/20:13 in the old testament and 1 Corinthians 6:9–10, 1 Timothy 1:10 or Romans 1:26–27 in the new one. Or in other words, were Hashirama or Tobirama openly enough homophobic for it to be genuinely hard to shift the Will of Fire's dogma on it even with a more sympathetic Hokage than Asuma at the head?
5. How long a history? Hiruzen was personally taught by both the second and the first Hokage, the guys who started the whole Will of Fire business. So Leaf itself isn't even two centuries old. So the Hagoromo might have claim to knowledge regarding the writings of the Sage of Six Paths, but any knowledge they claim to the stuff added by the religious reformation upon which the foundation of Leaf lies must have some different background. Either they somehow became fanatical followers of Hashirama from earlier than anyone else, or they already had massive religious influence before him (as a roaming ninja clan?) and Hashirama made some kind of deal with them, or they actually developed a lot of the Will of Fire alongside Hashirama. I assume Hazou doesn't know which of these is correct, but it can't just be time or closeness to the old Hokages. Because if anything, the Sarutobi clan would have claim to that in this day and age. So the actual question: Thinking about it a little more and based on the snippets learned while living in Leaf, what does Hazou believe to be the actual source of the Hagoromo's near monopoly on Will of Fire interpretation?
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Out of curiosity, why do you want all this heavy-lifting worldbuilding? What specifically are you trying to get to?
In my experience, no one asks for this level of detail unless they have an exploit in mind or they are looking to trip the GM up on an inconsistency for the fun of it. (A cynical worldview, I grant.) What specifically are you looking to do here? Simply telling us that will allow us to tailor the focus of our answers.
- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
Well, the Hagoromo are the closest we have to a rival clan in Leaf and I still struggle to understand their power base. I also am a fan of cultural verisimilitude and currently it still feels like Leaf believes in [placeholder religion] that is designed to be more about simulating the challenges that religion posed or poses IRL than really being adapted to the local history and lore. But religion is such a big part of a society's history that I can't quite imagine that you just blindly showed it in to Leaf, not with the massive amount of hidden cosmological world-building you have implied and hinted at throughout the quest.
As for tripping up GM inconsistency "for the fun of it", I don't actually know if that's a fair assessment. Is it "for the fun of it" if the inconsistency in question makes the whole thing less fun for me? The inconsistency being the (on the surface) apparent lack of reconciliation between the Will of Fire being an old and established religion with idiosyncrasies and baggage on the one hand and a philosophy set up and spread by an intelligent ninja that revolutionized the world's social structure ~100 years ago on the other.
Also, the Will of Fire is not just some background world-building trivia. Our plans and our IC loved ones have been impacted by it multiple times and the majority of named characters around us, be it ignorant peasant folk blindly believing something they don't understand or highly intelligent and powerful battle wizards and political leaders like Naruto and Asuma, credibly profess to base their personal morals and ideals on.
Even from a pure gameplay perspective, players were about to commit quite large blunders because they didn't understand the Will of Fire's sociological underpinnings, like when they suggested undermining it by introducing and fostering new religions in Leaf. Luckily IC advice stopped that.
Or to put it in very simple terms: The Will of Fire is being used as a cudgel against us and one of the reasons we are vulnerable to it is because knowledge about it that seems like it should be available to us IC is not available to us OOC.
And beyond that, the Will of Fire seems to me like one of the most important world building blocks of Leaf society right after a) the clans, b) the clanless situation and c) civilian economic status. It is also closely intermingled with all three of those.
So both from a gameplay perspective and from an enjoying and exploring the rich world you created perspective understanding the Will of Fire seems important to me.
But if I am asking for too much, then I guess the most actionable questions I have are these:
A) Are there purported actions or words of Hashirama or Tobirama (or Hiruzen I guess) that can be easily extrapolated into a clear homophobic message?
The answer would change how we tackle that whole social issue.
B) Is there anything known and actionable when it comes to the Hagoromo making the switch from whoever they were before Leaf to becoming the main and most respected teachers of Senju Hashirama's philosophy (and/or its cosmological aspects) that would allow us some advantage if exploited?
The answer might allow us to undermine the Hagoromo in the longer term by letting someone else take their place and/or by relegating them to being the foremost scholars on pre-Hashirama spirit and cosmology knowledge only instead of them having such a stranglehold on Leaf political philosophy as well.
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Shard
One and Many
- Location
- Malaysia
Perhaps at a high enough level Hazo can change the properties of the obsidian so it isn't prone to breaking.
- Pronouns
- She/Her/They/Them
Hello everyone!
I've recently caught up to the main story (and making my way through the apocrypha/interludes/etc)... daaang this is LONG
I resented Chosen for the Grave's commentary on Olympics-style fencing, having practised the sport for 11 years... I'm now watching the épée Olympics finals and wow, do they look ridiculous. I know what they're doing and why they're doing it that way, but... they do look dumb. They're trying to scare each other off for half a minute of playing chicken and trying to fool the other into launching an attack before a hot second of good action, and they look like chickens doing it. You look better after one year of playing than at the Olympic level. How?
The bottom line is: great story everyone, love reading what you write, congrats to the community, and you were right about high-level fencing being unbearable to watch.
I've recently caught up to the main story (and making my way through the apocrypha/interludes/etc)... daaang this is LONG
I resented Chosen for the Grave's commentary on Olympics-style fencing, having practised the sport for 11 years... I'm now watching the épée Olympics finals and wow, do they look ridiculous. I know what they're doing and why they're doing it that way, but... they do look dumb. They're trying to scare each other off for half a minute of playing chicken and trying to fool the other into launching an attack before a hot second of good action, and they look like chickens doing it. You look better after one year of playing than at the Olympic level. How?
The bottom line is: great story everyone, love reading what you write, congrats to the community, and you were right about high-level fencing being unbearable to watch.
- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
Doing a bit more soul searching, I think my initial push down this rabbit hole was trying to understand why the Will of Fire was suddenly homophobic, both from a doylist and from a watsonian perspective.
IRL Abrahamic religions carry on the deeply sex-negative attitudes of ancient Jews (don't know where that initially came from though) and spread it all over the world. Especially in the case of Christianity the (often unequal power dynamics wise) socially acceptable homosexual practices in the Roman Empire (which included Greece at the time)were a good target to attack while still seeming like the good guys. This attitude then synergized with already existing Roman machismo and homophobia and ended up in the near-totalitarian oppression of homosexuality that we know and hate.
But in this Quest it seemed to me at the time as if religious homophobia was inserted as an interesting obstacle and reminder that we are in fact still in a medieval world with medieval attitudes, while the QMs did not feel it necessary to anchor that problematic belief firmly into their world. I of course very much hoped and hope that that is not the case. Which is why I asked those questions that dig into the roots of the relevant world-building in order to uncover the hopefully far more elegant (if obscured) way that the offending bigotry was integrated into the whole of Leaf's belief system.
But maybe I was just wrong.
So, if I may ask, what are the reasons and thoughts behind adding homophobia to Leaf, from a doylist perspective? And how much effort did actually go into its watsonian underpinnings in order to keep it in line with "rational questing"?
IRL Abrahamic religions carry on the deeply sex-negative attitudes of ancient Jews (don't know where that initially came from though) and spread it all over the world. Especially in the case of Christianity the (often unequal power dynamics wise) socially acceptable homosexual practices in the Roman Empire (which included Greece at the time)were a good target to attack while still seeming like the good guys. This attitude then synergized with already existing Roman machismo and homophobia and ended up in the near-totalitarian oppression of homosexuality that we know and hate.
But in this Quest it seemed to me at the time as if religious homophobia was inserted as an interesting obstacle and reminder that we are in fact still in a medieval world with medieval attitudes, while the QMs did not feel it necessary to anchor that problematic belief firmly into their world. I of course very much hoped and hope that that is not the case. Which is why I asked those questions that dig into the roots of the relevant world-building in order to uncover the hopefully far more elegant (if obscured) way that the offending bigotry was integrated into the whole of Leaf's belief system.
But maybe I was just wrong.
So, if I may ask, what are the reasons and thoughts behind adding homophobia to Leaf, from a doylist perspective? And how much effort did actually go into its watsonian underpinnings in order to keep it in line with "rational questing"?
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- Location
- Book Fort
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Hello, welcome to the quest!! ^.^
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Welcome! Nice to have you. How did you find us?
Yeah, I did Olympic style for two years in high school and duelling for ten years as an adult. My high school teacher was results-oriented: He wanted us to win competitions. As a result, his training was actually fairly similar to my duelling studies later on: Concise movement, intention behind each action, actively draw your opponent to make an error instead of simply hoping they do, etc. It's why I'm so filled with rage about what I see in the Olympics. I'm glad it's not just me.
- Location
- The state of Paranoia
Welcome to the Hivemind! Your anti-lupchanz gear is to your right, and the sealing failure protocols are *terrified screaming* -on your left!
Please don't mind the goo on the floor. I assure you it is probably not sentient and almost definitely will not try to eat you. This time. Probably.
On second thought, try to stay away from the goo.
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[X] Sealing Thursday
Delegation:
- Is Kagome's dimensional detection thingie ready?
- If so, request Goketsu sealmasters use it in their work when infusing seals and report result.
- Distribute said thingie to Leaf's sealmasters.
- New 3D Great Seal copy if it hadn't been done already.
- Discuss progress being made:
- 3D Seal attempt?
- HOWS revision?
- Understanding the Great Seal
- Find rock samples most closely matching the Great Seal.
- Need to gather more sealing lore, but how, and where?
- Contact the SSSSS? Treasure hunters?
Delegation:
- Mari: Sells Hazo's sculptures without pissing off the MC.
- Gaku: Distribute sample spidersilks to appropriate Goketsu crafters for experimentation.
- Enough money for flak jacket? Armor? How strong or weak it is? Light enough for skyslider?
- Gaku: Figure out a more permanent Doggos bison, spidersilk, and tower trade.
- No chocolate for Doggos or other known poison for dogs. Consult Inuzuka.
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