So, mid-term plan suggestions:
  • Go to a beach and take some time to destress.
  • Go to Iron. Noburi gets his Med 10/10 finally. Hazou and Kagome do seal research. Ideally, we want to get through J's seals, and get the Skywalker technique up and running (heh), at least. Maybe Kagome will feel up to researching some of his own projects.
  • Merchant Empire take two. Find a caravan and offer them money in exchange for rumours. Sell them chakra beast parts and give them a code word to identify us later. Sets up a friendly relationship and makes it easier to employ them once we're in a position to do so.
  • Build unconventional bases. Underwater. In the sky. Underground. Learn what is and isn't practical.
  • Have Kei ask the pangolins about her bloodline. Seriously, this is killing me (edit: and possibly killing her).
 
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I feel that this pulls in a little too much OOC knowledge - unless there's something I missed, the team has no real indication Zabuza in particular is actively after them.
Except we know Hot Springs was an international debacle, Honami was going to be interrogated (Kagome) and she knows what Hazou looks like, and Komori (Joutarou's Stone buddy) saw all of us save Kagome. A barrel is pretty obvious.

Once word got to Mist there's no way Zabuza, or a similar squad of hunter-nin, wouldn't be dispatched. Unless Hazou and co. don't think Yagura hates all missing-nin? And at that point we may as well call them Zabuza, it amounts to the same thing.
 
Does this not apply to any situation in which an enemy is sneaking towards you?
The question, I think, is how often they have to roll. For example, them having to roll for every meter of movement produces (in expectation) vastly different outcomes from having to roll for every ten meters...

Well, not for Zabuza, since if he gets within 100 meters of us, we're dead anyway. But, in general...
 
I feel that this pulls in a little too much OOC knowledge - unless there's something I missed, the team has no real indication Zabuza in particular is actively after them.
I disagree. The barrel thing is a smoking gun for hunter nin.

Also there's no such thing as too much paranoia!
 
I disagree. The barrel thing is a smoking gun for hunter nin.

Also there's no such thing as too much paranoia!
The point is more that while you can assume that there will be hunter-nin who want you dead, purely on the strength of you being missing-nin, your party doesn't know that Zabuza has been personally involved ever. As far as they're concerned, they could be being hunted by anything from no one (if nobody in Mist has connected the dots as to their identity and they're still believed to be dead) to the sort of giant murdersquad that took down Swamp (if Yagura is serious about not letting three clan bloodlines and a top-tier jōnin fall into enemy hands).
 
I disagree. The barrel thing is a smoking gun for hunter nin.

Also there's no such thing as too much paranoia!
I agree. Someone carrying around a barrel is fairly identifiable. And making it less identifiable has nothing to do with Zabuza. Right now I think it's a clear indicator that we're from mist. I imagine it was why the trainer Noburi was matched with was so anti mist to. He'd probably seen such things before. I posted:

Are rucksacks commonly used by civilians traveling long distances? Do we have any idea how much it'd cost to commission one for noburi to hide his barrel in?

earlier and I think we should look into it if rucksacks or some type of pack people carry with them are common. I'd assume they would be for anyone who can't use storage scrolls and who isn't traveling with an animal.
 
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Are rucksacks commonly used by civilians traveling long distances? Do we have any idea how much it'd cost to commission one for noburi to hide his barrel in?
This was answered earlier, but civilians don't usually travel long distances because deathworld. The exception are merchants, who will typically either travel in caravans with guards or will hire ninja escorts (or will travel in caravans with ninja escorts).
 
The point is more that while you can assume that there will be hunter-nin who want you dead, purely on the strength of you being missing-nin, your party doesn't know that Zabuza has been personally involved ever. As far as they're concerned, they could be being hunted by anything from no one (if nobody in Mist has connected the dots as to their identity and they're still believed to be dead) to the sort of giant murdersquad that took down Swamp (if Yagura is serious about not letting three clan bloodlines and a top-tier jōnin fall into enemy hands).

Why would we not assume that Zabuza or someone of his caliber is hunting us? Whether he is or isn't makes no difference, but its the worst case scenario and preparing for that one handles the other cases as well. His threat level is magnitudes higher than a random team of chunin or something that we may actually face.

I personally think he's going to get recalled soon because it's not like he's an asset that can be tied up indefinitely, but taking that assumption doesn't further our primary goal of not dying.


I don't care if it's Zabuza, if the ninja in question hunting us down is threat-isomorphic to him.
 
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I don't care if it's Zabuza, if the ninja in question hunting us down is threat-isomorphic to him.
This is a reasonable stance to take, my objection was that in the plan I quoted it specifically mentioned that Hazou was worried about Zabuza pursuing the team. I would have no objections if it said 'hunter nin' or even 'Mist hunter nin'.
 
Still incomplete. Would like suggestions, especially on the last dot (lack of detail).

[X] Action Plan: Iron Escorts, Take Two

Goals:

  • Survive.
  • Go to Iron.
  • Set up a base.
  • Fix shit.
Methods:
  • Go to Iron.
    • Have the evac plan mapped out before the end of the last update. Doubt we'd get the chance to stop and decide RN or after we've left.
      • Don't pressure the team to talk since they hate us now. Let Inoue-sensei lead and we'll follow with our suggestions as directed.
      • Justifications for going to Iron, if asked:
        • No hidden village.
        • No important ninja clan.
        • Post-Liberator hunter-nin are gone.
        • We know the basic land.
        • Kagome-sensei really knows the basic land.
        • Hashimoto-sensei can teach Noburi medicine.
        • Can make trip to Sarubetsu if Inoue-sensei wants to make up with that one innkeeper (don't actually say this out loud).
    • While in Fire:
      • Make sure Kagome-sensei doesn't go crazy.
      • Be courteous. Say nothing unless addressed.
      • Be on alert for threats.
    • Once escort is dropped follow long-ranged movement SOP.
    • Find a base (see below).
  • Set up a base.
    • Follow the team's lead. Do what you need to do. If we are prompted to make suggestions...
    • Two parameters that matter for finding an ideal location: defensibility and camouflage.
      • Defensibility:
        • More room: More maneuverability.
        • Elevated from surroundings: Prevents enemies from attacking down upon us.
      • Camouflage:
        • Away from civilization/roads/natural resources: No reason for people to go through here.
        • Surrounded by natural barriers: Trees, rocks, hills prevent visual upon us.
      • Given our tendency to run over fight camouflage should be considered moreso than defensibility.
    • Building the base: MEW walls and seal traps.
      • Make as per Kagome-sensei's direction.
  • Do important shit.
    • Team could destress for a day.
      • Hazou doesn't get to loaf around. He needs to make up for his fuckup.
    • Try to start a meaningful conversation with Inoue-sensei:
      • If she blows us off, fine. We won't keep going.
      • If she doesn't, tell Inoue-sensei that you're sorry, but that you know saying sorry doesn't cut it. Tell here you're painfully aware that being missing-nin has messed up your social skills, and being among the most powerful people wherever we go to has messed up your understanding of political power, and that we're going to need Inoue-sensei to help you with this, explicitly.
        • Also talk about how to apologize to the team in a way that doesn't fuck things up further, since we clearly suck at social interactions. Follow instructions as dictated.
        • If possible talk about Hazou's role within the team:
          • Hazou has been the idea guy and agitator for most of the things we have tried.
          • With this current failure, he has no idea if the team wants him to continue in that role anymore.
          • At the same time, the team needs to keep moving and doing things. Trying to dance around the issue might get some or all of us killed.
          • How does the team want to move onward from here? What role do they want Hazou to play in the team and what things do they want to trust to him?
          • This is completely on the rest of the team and Hazou will naturally serve at any role they see fit.
    • Try to talk with Keiko, Noburi, and Kagome:
      • Follow Inoue-sensei's advice. This takes priority over what is written below.
      • Keiko and Noburi:
        • Hazou express trust for their judgement and that he should had asked for help.
        • Hazou noticed how much both enjoy their stay in Leaf.
        • Hazou apologizes for breaking the friends they've made and the opportunities he's cost them.
        • Hazou recognizes that no amount of 'promising' will help them earn their trust back.
        • Nonetheless, Hazou will do everything he can to increase the team's survival and to prevent the kind of mistake that happened back in Konoha.
          • Treat everyone with respect even if they don't deserve it.
          • Learn to control your emotions, esp. when seeing fucked up shit.
          • Avoid doing anything that could conceivably be called a threat of violence.
      • Kagome:
        • Apologize for breaking his trust in Hazou due to our complacency and our dangerous incompetence in areas where it should be Hazo's relative strength.
        • Let Kagome vent, because god damn he's probably pissed off at us.
    • Team could do After Action Report on the Arikada mission & actions in Konoha.
      • Make lists about everything we observed whenever Hazou has time. This is an individual reflection, don't pester the team. We'll combine notes once we do a team meeting or whatever we're calling them.
    • Team could decide where to go after Iron (if prompted):
      • We've been to Iron twice already, probably not a good idea to keep doing that.
        • Also Leaf knows we went here, might not be a good idea to stay longer than we need to. DO NOT FUCKING SAY THIS
      • Heading far east, towards Claw/Fang/Mountain, is farther from the action, but has unknown area.
      • Finding a place in Waterfall would be faster but the possibility of a tailed beast is bad for us.
  • Less important shit:
    • Team could work on training plans.
      • If Noburi goes into Yuni to study medicine, make sure to be paranoid and check the place for potential black ops plants from Mist. Also cover his barrel or use the one in Hashimoto's with Hazou as a battery.
 
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As per usual, square everything with Inoue/Kagome/Keiko.
It's good to know we don't care about Noburi's opinion. [jk]

(Regarding the rest, I'm going to run through scenario preferences when I get home from work. They don't like it when I use the whiteboard for personal things. :( )
 
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Are the ideas people had about hacking things out of our techniques collated somewhere? It's trivial to come up with feasible ideas I don't recall being mentioned in the story, but I really don't want to trawl through hundreds of pages to stop myself saying something that's been "invented" a dozen times, or that got dismissed ages ago.

People were wanting a telescope earlier. Did anyone consider just making one from ice? Assuming basic knowledge of how telescopes work, which seems fair given that they exist, building an ice one seems fairly easy, if not quick. A storage seal plus temperature control means it can last, and Elemental Mastery's fine temperature control plus Vampiric Dew's water control are basically perfect for making clear ice.

How does overlapping Elemental Mastery work? If one used a -X° Elemental Mastery with a range of 10 metres, and followed with a +X° Elemental Mastery in a 5 meter range, what would the result be? What if two people were doing these simultaneously? Does the effect go through walls?

The mistinator ain't bad, but it's slow. It seems like boiling water with a bunch of explosion seals in a suitably contained vessel would be faster. The explosion sounds can be dampened by applying both Banshees locally and Silence Mines to quiet the escaping steam.

The boiling steam could be reduced to a reasonable temperature by using Elemental Mastery, which has the advantage of converting steam into mist fairly directly, as well as effectively containing around the mist in the local area because hot air doesn't carry water as well. The hot steam outside is a minor nuisance to opponents, especially harming their eyes and thus vision, and the mist is useful of its own. This can also be used to hide our sky-platforms inside of artificially created semi-clouds, though that's also a tell if used inappropriately.

How about using Vacuum Step as a projectile, assuming sufficient armor (spiky? seal-enhanced?) to make it generally more damaging for the opponent than the user? Risky, but powerful in a cinch. A sword or spear would be safer, if you have the fidelity to "stop" with just the blade in the opponent.

Why haven't we made a gun/cannon? It'd be easy and potent. Use a Five Seal Barrier on a tube with a flat surface at the end. Include a small cannonball and hook some internal explosive seals up to tripwires. You can't aim them, but a dense array of flak cannons (which can all be carved into the same wall) seems effectively undodgeable, and at least an order of magnitude more damaging than a pure explosive blast. Heck, the guns can even be mounted in the air, which to most ninja is probably somewhat unexpected. Obviously you Banshee Slayer the heck out of them, because hundreds of sniper flak cannons is basically an instant win condition.

Have people considered using Force Walls as near-invisible blade traps? Lay them flat over a path at waist height; an unsuspecting ninja running along that path gets neatly sliced in two, or at least significantly wounded if not running at full-pelt. If this can be tripwired, it's even easier to goad someone into the trap. The advantage here is that it's a silent trap, which makes it useful when stealth is a priority.

Banshee the hell out of your shoes. Heck, anything on you that can as much as crinkle gets a Banshee seal, as long as Kagome thinks it's OK. If a kunai's "whooosh" through the air is a useful tell for dodging them, Banshee them too.

Zephyr's Reach seems underutilized in combat, though I might not have been paying enough attention to the story to see what the restrictions are, or when it is used. I suppose it depends on its speed, but playing seals behind your opponent means your opponent now needs to fight in 3D, which hurts their attention, and if you're lucky you can wrap them in ninja wire. That's not a win condition, but even minor mobility impediments matter a lot in combat.

Kawarimi gives you the velocity of the object you swapped with. This sounds like great escape material; shoot the kawarimi target out of a horizontal cannon and swap with it. You are now really darn fast. Sadly it's probably not a good idea because of how finicky and dangerous it is, but it might be better than getting skewered.

Someone else mentioned underwater bases before I had the chance to post this. You can fix a large open-bottomed box in place, and then you're basically impossible to attack directly without the opponent getting in the water or using special jutsu. This won't work amazingly for long-term defense, since it's easy to trap you there, but for short-term protection it seems fairly solid. The idealized situational awareness and immunity from seals in the vicinity are huge bonuses.

A floating island sounds like a less traumatizing long-term base, as long as it's far enough in the water that it's not easily visible. Since the terrain is entirely flat, this allows you both to pepper the sea with a grid of kawamiri targets (on other platforms) and makes you extremely hard to sneak up on. Ice telescopes make the "you can't sneak up on us" point twice as true. Float the platforms at a jump's height above the water, with entrances you can close with MEW, to make attacks significantly harder.

The biggest problem is that you'd get lonely really damn fast. But at least you have Banshee seals to ignore the complaints with.
 
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Why would we not assume that Zabuza or someone of his caliber is hunting us? Whether he is or isn't makes no difference, but its the worst case scenario and preparing for that one handles the other cases as well. His threat level is magnitudes higher than a random team of chunin or something that we may actually face.
The problem is that the only feasible preparation we have for Zabuza is "not be where he is", which limits our options far more than preparations against chuunin hunter nin: we have a pretty good chance of evading even their hot pursuit and even defeating them without permanent losses.
 
Are the ideas people had about hacking things out of our techniques collated somewhere? It's trivial to come up with feasible ideas I don't recall being mentioned in the story, but I really don't want to trawl through hundreds of pages to stop myself saying something that's been "invented" a dozen times, or that got dismissed ages ago.
I can only surmise that there are XP and resource constraints we have otherwise we would have some sort of seal powers floating death fortress by now.

While I am hesitant towards going to Iron again , if Jiraiya has thrown some fake trails around, then whatever.

[X] Action Plan: Iron Escorts, Take Two


The problem is that the only feasible preparation we have for Zabuza is "not be where he is", which limits our options far more than preparations against chuunin hunter nin: we have a pretty good chance of evading even their hot pursuit and even defeating them without permanent losses.
This strategy also works with the other hunter nin.

The point I'm trying to make is that the current strategy should be to stay the hell off the radar. Since J has apparently thrown down some fake trails and hid our real ones at Inoue's request, I think we can return to Iron and be safe as long as we are careful.

Afterwards though it would probably be best not to stay in one place for too long, or go somewhere too often.
 
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I can only surmise that there are XP and resource constraints we have otherwise we would have some sort of seal powers floating death fortress by now.

While I am hesitant towards going to Iron again , if Jiraiya has thrown some fake trails around, then whatever.

[X] Action Plan: Iron Escorts, Take Two
Bro, if you wanna go to Tea or somewhere else, copy and paste my plan and write in "Tea" instead of "Iron". Voting system lets us vote for as many different things as we want.
 
@Dissonance just noticed your sig -- love it!

Are the ideas people had about hacking things out of our techniques collated somewhere? It's trivial to come up with feasible ideas I don't recall being mentioned in the story, but I really don't want to trawl through hundreds of pages to stop myself saying something that's been "invented" a dozen times, or that got dismissed ages ago.
There is a technique tech tree linked in my sig that anyone is free to steal, but I probably will not be maintaining it. By and large the thread's creative juices have been directed towards sealing.
 
Bro, if you wanna go to Tea or somewhere else, copy and paste my plan and write in "Tea" instead of "Iron". Voting system lets us vote for as many different things as we want.
I don't have that many misgiving with the location on further thought.

My point is that, being predictable or throwing down anything resembling a trail is something we should be mindful of in the future. If J has fixed that by request then I assume he did so competently, so no worries. And the bonuses from a trip to Iron outweighs any risks that come to mind.
 
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