A Ninja Squad Tactical Guide - Version 0.1 (intended to be a discussion, with feedback from the team, when ready)

Rule Zero: We are smart and skilled ninja, while this is a guide, we should be smart and do smart things, and know our teammates will do the same. No plan survives contact with the opposition, and that is ok.

Rule One: In general, the first goal of any battle, unless there are specific reasons otherwise is to have the team survive the battle. This can be done by either defeat of the opposition or escape. Often defeat of the opposition is also desired, and we know this.
In general, success in battle is derived from pitting our greatest strengths against our oppositions' greatest weaknesses. When going into expected battles, we should plan based on this, and and if we have time, always take a moment to at least discuss tactics, or verify that we are using 'standard tactics'. When in unexpected battle with opponents of unknown weakness, we should default to tactics which are optimized for our individual strengths, used together.

At the moment We (Hazou) specialize in close in combat, and stealth.
Keiko specializes in ranged weapons, and has impressive mobility and battlefield awareness.
Noburi is also perceptive and in some situations has extra awareness due to his bloodline, he also has a devastating Water Whip and versatile Water Clones.
Given that, in an ideal combat with a single foe, we are engaged at close range. If we fall out of engagement, or if the foe is distracted, we stealth and then sneak attack, otherwise we occupy the foe at close range. Noburi moves to short range from the foe, and sends a water clone attempt to flank and hinder the foe. Given his current water clone, having the clone try to grapple is likely to be the most likely to create an advantage. He will then use his water whip and attempt to entangle the foe's main attack unless an opening for a devastating blow is presented (especially if the flank succeeds). Keiko attempts to maintain a medium range, keeping an eye out for surprises, while maintaining a barrage of ranged attacks.

If we are attacked by a single foe and I am the target, then I fight with a defensive focus until the others are able to assist. If Keiko is attacked, she should throw knives at the face of the foe to get a moment to disenguage and move to range. If Noburi is attacked, if he has the time, he should create a water whip and use it as an area denial weapon until we can support him, then he can use it or call up water clones as he sees fit.
If we are attacked by equal numbers, and they go after us, than anyone can call out rotate, and I go after the person engaging Keiko, Keiko goes after the person engaging Noburi, and Noburi goes after the person after me. Against animals, Noburi should send as many water clones as he can afer different ones to stall, while we concentrate on one at a time.

If we are attacked by larger numbers, we should circle up to be able to guard each others backs. If possible, we find a defensible position and fight out of that. If encircled, Keiko looks for the weakest part of the line and attacks it with ranged attacks. I try to break the line at that point, and Noburi guards the both of us as we do this.

Based on this, I need to work on my mobility, in order to better get into combat and to deal with unusual attacks. I could also use methods that let me stealth in combat, and defensive tools that let me better deal with drawing fire. I also could use a ranged attack.

Noburi's Ninjutsu is effective and will keep getting more so the more he does. However, it is slow, and he needs to either get really fast with creating his water whip, or refine his hand to hand as a backup. In addition, that enhances his water clones. He may want to look into getting arm bracers as part of his gear to aid in defensive fighting, and to be a extra place to store water. Given his extensive use of Ninjutsu, he should avoid anything that used his hands.

Keiko also could use close combat training. Given her abilities, a nimble style or weapon may suit her temperament better than default style. Keeping improving her Awareness, throwing, and mobility are all useful. Some substitution and improved water and wall walking likely work well with her existing mobility. We should also see if there are useful air techniques she can add to her abilities. Being able to maintain a wind to disrupt incoming attacks comes to mind.
 
Keiko also could use close combat training. Given her abilities, a nimble style or weapon may suit her temperament better than default style.

Two-handed swords are probably kings in ninja melee combat. They out-range kunais, are extremely fast and need far heavier armor to counter than ninjas can afford to use. For unexpected melee surprises there's always iaijutsu. If that sounds too boring maybe go for some sort of chain-scythe combination, bonus points if the scythe part is actually bigger than Keiko.
 
Two-handed swords are probably kings in ninja melee combat. They out-range kunais, are extremely fast and need far heavier armor to counter than ninjas can afford to use. For unexpected melee surprises there's always iaijutsu. If that sounds too boring maybe go for some sort of chain-scythe combination, bonus points if the scythe part is actually bigger than Keiko.

Even though high end ninja combat is always reliant on speed, I imagine two-handed swords are too slow even then, and the lack of options for maneuverability are there. Your hands are locked in position and both arms have to move together, so your shoulders are locked in gear too. Compared to using small knives or short swords like tanto, you create a lot more openings.

Getting hit is certainly more devastating, but any ninja worth their salt is just gonna dodge it, get in close while you're trying to recover from your swing, and stab you between the ribs.
 
Even though high end ninja combat is always reliant on speed, I imagine two-handed swords are too slow even then, and the lack of options for maneuverability are there.

I think you are underestimating the speed and range advantage you get from using a sword with two hands. In knife vs sword the sword always gets the first opportunity to strike and thanks to leverage the speed at the tip of the sword far outpaces anything you could do with a knife. How ninja shenanigans change this dilemma? I have no idea.
 
Iaijutsu is cinematic enough to be a good shtick, blends well with ninjutsu, and is likely good for dx/wits. I certainly would support it as an option.

I'd expect a two-handed sword would be very Str/Sta. If we wanted to suggest a longer reach weapon a spear or naginata are better options, but all three are bulky and not good for extra close range.
 
I'd expect a two-handed sword would be very Str/Sta. If we wanted to suggest a longer reach weapon a spear or naginata are better options, but all three are bulky and not good for extra close range.

Ah yes, when I said "two-handed sword" I meant basically any sword that is used with two hands, not just the sort of thing Guts swings around in Berserker. In this setting it would probably be just a normal katana. That is until we get our hands on Hiramekarei or Kubikiribouchou.
 
As a general rule I try to stay out of debates here, but y'all just made me jump up and shout my transformation phrase: Sword Geek Powers: Activate!

First, I'll preface this by saying that I've studied quite a lot of dueling (Western swordsmanship - foil, épée, sabre, smallsword, rapier) which is based on one-handed weapons. I've done some Japanese swordsmanship in aikido classes using bokken (two handed, wooden training tool for katana). I feel that much of what I know from dueling still applies when using a two-handed weapon, but if anyone who is actually an expert at kenjutsu / kendo cares to contradict me I will bow out.

Second, I'll comment that not all two-handed weapons are created equal. There's the katana (a light cut-and-thrust weapon) through the claymore (a heavy cutting-and-maybe-some-thrusting) weapon, and on into the kanabo (giant war club). Ninja probably don't want to use kanabo, but a katana would be perfectly viable.

Even though high end ninja combat is always reliant on speed, I imagine two-handed swords are too slow even then, and the lack of options for maneuverability are there. Your hands are locked in position and both arms have to move together, so your shoulders are locked in gear too. Compared to using small knives or short swords like tanto, you create a lot more openings.

It's possible to release one hand from the hilt of a katana and still fight; Musashi popularized the two-weapon style, so one-handed is clearly an option. Releasing the handle is also something that you might do in close, so that you can grapple, strike, or disarm with your free hand, or draw a second weapon while corps-a-corps with the opponent. (Although, if you're using a medium-length weapon, why the hell are you in close?)


Getting hit is certainly more devastating, but any ninja worth their salt is just gonna dodge it, get in close while you're trying to recover from your swing, and stab you between the ribs.

Ninja are glass cannon, so any weapon is going to get the job done and if a swordsman is having to recover from his swing, he's definitely doing it wrong; the goal is to control the line with motions no larger than they need to be, and work with leverage instead of muscle. E.g., don't turn the sword, pivot it around its center of mass. Much faster and usually stronger.

I will say one thing: katana are excellent and very dangerous weapons, but if I were choosing a sword to defend myself with, it would probably be a rapier, or possibly a smallsword if the metagame didn't include many heavy weapons. Rapier is a thrust-and-cut weapon, so it works at long- and mid-range but prefers long range. (Compare katana; it's cut-and-thrust so it prefers mid-range.) The balance of a rapier is well back towards the hilt, so you can move the point like lightning and with very little effort or windup you can deliver a snap beat that will take an opponent's weapon right out of their hands unless they know what they're doing -- all without taking your own point very far out of line at all. A stationary steel-on-steel parry against a two-handed katana cut would be challenging; you could maybe make it work, but you would definitely want to avoid it. In practice, parries would involve stepping off the line of attack, which would make it quite feasible...and, of course, the primary rapier-vs-katana defense is to stab the guy in the wrist as he prepares his cut.

The place where a rapier has trouble is right in close; the weapon is too long to thrust or cut with at grappling range. There are answers to this -- the guard will function as brass knuckles if you punch with it, the pommel knob makes an ersatz mace, you can reverse the sword for cuts, and you can try something like le Coup de Jarnac (hamstring the guy on the way past). Much better not to get to that range though.

The thing about swords is that they're long. If the other guy has a knife and you have a sword, they have to cross through your threat envelope before they can endanger you; unless they are much more skillful than you are, that is not going to be easy. There's a reason that knights and samurai both used long weapons instead of fighting with short knives.
 
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A stationary steel-on-steel parry against a two-handed katana cut would be challenging; you could maybe make it work, but you would definitely want to avoid it. In practice, parries would involve stepping off the line of attack, which would make it quite feasible...and, of course, the primary rapier-vs-katana defense is to stab the guy in the wrist as he prepares his cut.

You could argue that this is a point in favor of katana in ninja fights that usually take place in rough terrain. Less you have to maneuver while tree walking upside down on the underside of a thick and slippery tree branch while the other guy charges at you, the better.
 
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I think that in the medium run Noburi needs two more Ninjutsu, then he should focus on leveling what he has until he is Jounin tier before getting anything else. Hiding in Mist for disengaging under cover (plus allowing Hazou to Zabuza) and Water Prison because it has great synergy with both Water clones and his bloodline. Both of these can still wait though, they only become really good once his bloodline jutsu, taijutsu and clones are at a decent level.

For Keiko... I think trap making and wires would fit her personality, assuming we want her to branch out and not just level Weaponry, Awareness and her Monomaniacal skill. Sasuke pulled some pretty neat tricks using thrown weapons and wires in combat early in the manga. And wires might bud of at a high level weaponry, saving us some XP. On top of that, mass produced seals plus wire plus trapmaking = mines everywhere. This shoulđ help with her close combat weakness by making it harder to get close to her.

Hazou needs tactical movement more than most other things.
 
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Chapter 8: Gust Front

Hazō quickly weighed retreat versus advance. If there was a friendly ninja over there, and one in enough danger to use exploding tags, then there was no time to lose. By the time Team Kurosawa reported back to base and got backup, the person in need of help would almost certainly be dead. And on the off-chance that it was a neutral ninja (perhaps the inhabitant of that mysterious shelter from earlier), rescuing them from a threat would be a great way to establish first contact.

But if it was an enemy… well, if it was an enemy, then they'd need to find out as fast as possible so they could warn the base. And the enemy couldn't be that tough if they were being forced to use exploding tags against the local wildlife—something even Hazō's genin team hadn't needed to do so far. Of course, if Hazō's assumptions were wrong, then he and his team would die horribly. Just like most missions.

Oh. There was one more possibility.

"Dispel!"

Nothing happened, which was definitely for the best. A genjutsu user would mean a chūnin or jōnin enemy.

Hazō quickly made a series of hand signals. Primary. Stealth. Secondary. Speed. Pincer Formation Three. He didn't know the sign for the Water Clone Technique, but improvised. Water. Clone. Take Point.

Wakahisa's two clones moved to the front of the formation, and the party began to move.

After a few seconds, Mori, still facing forward, suddenly moved her hand out towards Wakahisa, and made a series of signs. Abort. Ninjutsu. Risk of Exposure.

The movement being in Wakahisa's peripheral vision, it took him a second to notice and react. In that second, one of his clones moved too close to a clearly visible banshee lizard, and the creature let loose one of its characteristic paralytic shrieks before vanishing into the water.

Damn damn damn. Hazō had overlooked, and Wakahisa had failed to remind him, that water clones only had a small fraction of the original's skill and power—and Wakahisa's sneaking skills were already the minimum required to qualify as a genin. Now anything in the target area (and quite a large range nearby) would know that they were coming.

The team abandoned any pretence of stealth, and ran.

-o-
Of course, the area was completely empty.

"Great job," a frustrated and humiliated Hazō told Wakahisa. "I thought Mist didn't use distraction genin anymore, but since I'm clearly wrong, I'll get Shikigami-sensei to issue you the standard black pyjamas."

"Oh, yeah?" Wakahisa shot back, his face a vivid shade of pink. "Well, maybe it is my fault—for trusting our glorious leader to pay attention when giving orders. You're supposed to know your teammates' abilities off by heart instead of—"

"Boys."

If looks could kill, Mori would never have been assigned to Logistics & Support.

"Moving on…" Hazō said once the petrification had worn off, "we need to fan out and look for clues as to what happened here. Five minutes, then we report back to Shikigami-sensei."

The source of the explosion wasn't hard to find. There was a big, roughly spherical dent in a nearby ridge, the remaining soil covered with blood. If there were any other remains, Hazō suspected, they were somewhere deep under the water, and would probably be consumed by the local fauna before any detailed investigation could locate them.

What was odd was that there were no other signs of battle. No ninjutsu damage, no kunai or shuriken sticking out of any surfaces, no lesser predators drawn by blood in the water. Could it be that—

"Kurosawa, Wakahisa, you need to see this."

Mori led them to a nearby tree. Something glinted in the sunlight among the branches. No, not something. A forehead protector, its location about right for a small object thrown clear by the explosion.

The sight of its torn blue cloth sent a chill down Hazō's spine in a way that the splatter of blood on the ridge had not. Forehead protectors were an easily-replaced and rarely-useful piece of armour, but they were also sacred. The forehead protector was the spirit of a ninja; it was what you brought back when you couldn't retrieve the body.

And the symbol this one bore consisted of five lines. The four wavy lines of water-unbound-by-form, slashed by the sharp horizontal line of the missing-nin. Hazō's mother had explained to him once, in a particularly morose mood, that some missing-nin kept their forehead protectors the same, indicating that they had been forced to leave the village but were loyal in spirit. Others put a slash through theirs as if cutting away their past, faking the original marking only when an objective demanded it. To them, wearing an unaltered forehead protector was like wearing a dead lover's clothing.

What the forehead protector said, in short, was that an ally had died here.

"Check it out, but don't move it. The location might be important," Hazō said softly.

Wakahisa quickly found himself something else to investigate, while Mori obediently climbed up.

Her face was completely expressionless when she climbed down.

"I know this one."

At Hazō's questioning look, she elaborated. "Inoue-sensei explained to me that the scratch in the lower left-hand corner was from when a Hidden Rock sniper nearly killed her. She often tells. Told. She often told that story because of how she repaid the sniper afterwards."

There was someone nearby powerful enough to take out Inoue-sensei. No prizes for guessing who.

"Well," the voice came from behind him. "So far, all according to plan."
-o-
Hazō whirled around, a kunai already in his hand. But what he saw froze him in his tracks.

Inoue-sensei, completely unharmed, gave him a friendly smile. "I knew you wouldn't have any trouble with those steelbacks."

Hazō's mind went into overdrive. If Inoue-sensei was dead, this was an impostor. But an impostor wouldn't pretend to be her right when they found evidence of her death. Therefore Inoue-sensei wasn't dead.

If Inoue-sensei wasn't dead but it looked like she was, then she'd faked her own death. If she'd faked her own death, she wouldn't want any witnesses saying she was alive. That meant she was about to kill them. Talking to them first was odd, but it fit her character. She'd been their teacher, if only briefly, and that meant she'd want to say goodbye.

Knowing he was probably already dead, Hazō threw the kunai anyway.

It passed right through Inoue-sensei as if she were a ghost.

"Dispel!"​

Everything stayed exactly the same. Hazō stared at his hands, still in the sealing position, as if they'd turned into venomous serpents.

"Dispel! Dispel! Dispel!"

Nothing.

"Good reflexes, Hazō!" Inoue-sensei beamed, unconcerned. "Here's the thing, though. A genjutsu mistress facing three genin who only just learned the technique? From that same mistress, no less? I can just overwhelm you with pure chakra. It's not something that comes up very much, because if you're that much stronger than the enemy, you don't normally need to bother with genjutsu in the first place."

Then there was only silence. No background noise of lethal swamp monsters seeking their prey. No bubbling of random gases escaping the water. Not even a breath of wind disturbing the leaves on the few nearby trees. Just silence.

"Will you kill us?" Even now, Mori's voice was barely audible.

"Come on, kids. If I wanted to kill you, I wouldn't stop for a chat first." Inoue-sensei rolled her eyes.

"Then…" Mori's eyes widened with some peculiar combination of fear and hope. "You intend to to ask us to flee with you!"

"You see? This is why I love my Mori!" In a blur of unreal motion, Inoue-sensei appeared in front of Mori, and wrapped her arms around the girl in an affectionate hug.

Mori went completely still, her arms down at her sides and her expression blank. Inoue-sensei winced, quickly disengaged and took a step back.

"Anyway, you've got it in one."

Wakahisa frowned sceptically. "Why would you want to run away? You and Shikigami-sensei gave that whole speech about how we had everything covered."

"Shikigami, huh?" Inoue-sensei sighed. "You know, when he described his plan to me and Kanna back in Mist, it all sounded perfect. Save lives, avoid the coming war, found a new village based on new ideals, do this, do that, contingency plans for absolutely everything…

"But I don't think he can pull it off anymore. Leaf is coming for us, Captain Zabuza is coming for us, and Shikigami doesn't have control of the big picture the way he thought he would. His plan to beat Captain Zabuza ? It's suicide, and even if it works, it doesn't solve anything. So Captain Zabuza dies. All that's going to happen is that the Mizukage is suddenly going to take us a lot more seriously. And I don't need to tell you why that would be bad.

"I don't want to die, kids. Rarely have, never will. But I'm an infiltration specialist. I know when to cut my losses and run, and I know how to make a clean getaway. That's why I've spent the last week pretending to pretend that I wasn't in despair. That's why I'm using up half the blood in my storage seals and why I've chosen a point on one of the more frequent patrol routes. When Captain Zabuza turns up, all he's going to get out of whoever he tortures is that I took my own life. Maybe he'll believe it and maybe he won't, but either way it beats sitting in that cave waiting to get killed."

"You really think we can't beat Captain Zabuza ?" Hazō asked.

"Come on now. You think the Mizukage is going to send one of his star jōnin alone against worse than three-to-one odds? I don't know what's coming any more than you do, but it's going to be worse than Shikigami claims. Maybe we can win with the defensible location and the knowledge of the swamp and its dangers, or maybe Captain Zabuza picks us off one by one and lets whoever is left in the cave to starve. I won't pretend I don't love gambling, but the Legendary Sucker herself wouldn't take those odds."

The logic, now Hazō looked at it, was inescapable. They'd only ever talked about facing Captain Zabuza himself, which would be scary but manageable with three jōnin against one, but they didn't really know anything about what Mist was going to do. For that matter, it was only an assumption that the Mizukage would send Captain Zabuza. It could be someone else, someone with abilities completely different to the ones Shikigami-sensei was preparing to counter.

"All right," he nodded. "Why us? You know we'd only get in your way."

Before Inoue-sensei could answer, Hazō's own mind abruptly filled in the blank on the answer sheet.

"You want us as sacrificial pawns to slow down pursuit."

"It's always a pleasure hearing a genin think like a ninja," Inoue-sensei told him. "But the truth is, maybe, despite our differences, I'm a little like Shikigami after all. He knew the mission was going to have a high casualty rate, and he could have bailed on his own, but instead he decided to save everyone he could. I can't do that, but I can at least save someone. And you guys? Well, Keiko here is the most adorable thing ever, and I get the feeling that if I invited just her, she'd ask me to bring you guys along anyway.

"Not that I mind too much. Mako and I go way back—went way back—and I'd feel bad if I let her one of her genin trainees die."

Warned by some primal instinct, Hazō tried to dodge the inevitable. But Inoue-sensei cheated, and the very fabric of unreality twisted and warped around his head, ruffling his hair while Inoue-sensei remained at long range. Hazō scowled, and made a note to brush up on his Dispelling Technique.

"And Noburi? I want to see if you can fulfil your potential. You could be a real ladykiller one day, if you can just learn how to use your tongue properly—and rest assured, that's something I can teach you in detail." She gave Wakahisa a mischievous wink, causing the latter to do his best beetroot imitation.

Then the smile dropped off her face. "Serious time now. The way I see it, you've got four options. You can come with me. I won't lie to you: it won't be easy. Small groups of missing-nin get taken out all the time. But on the other hand, I'm the best when it comes to going unnoticed, and in my plan we won't be hanging around next door to the world's strongest ninja village going, 'Hey, we're a great big potential threat, come and deal with us.' As an extra layer of paranoia, I won't tell you where I'm going unless you're coming with, but I can sum it up in five words. The. Hell. Away. From. Here.

"Option two: you throw yourselves on Captain Zabuza's mercy. If you walk out into the swamp making it really clear that you're just three genin trying to surrender, he might be generous. Mist must be pissed at the loss of manpower, and getting some of it back will earn Captain Zabuza brownie points with the Mizukage. You will have to tell him every tiniest detail about the base and the rest of the group, meaning you'll be signing their death sentence, but if you're OK with that, and if you play up the 'we were forced into it by a bunch of scary jōnin' angle, Mist may take you back into the fold.

"Option three: you start a rebellion. I'm not the only ninja questioning Shikigami's strategy, just the only one with the guts to take action. I'm not saying you try to fight Shikigami head-on, because the man is a combat monster, but if you and a bunch of others decide to straight-up walk out of there, what's he going to do? Kill you himself? Of course, a bigger group is also more likely to run into trouble on their way out.

"Final option: you follow Shikigami. He thinks he can take on all comers until he can strike some kind of deal with Leaf. I don't. Even if he manages to deal with Mist, Leaf has a hundred reasons to wipe us out and maybe a dozen to let us live. Hidden Swamp was a beautiful idea, and maybe if things were different it might even have worked. But we fled from a village whose ruler will do anything to eliminate traitors, and we chose to hide next door to a village so powerful that we can only exist at its mercy.

"Still, it's your life, and it's your decision."

She blinked as if remembering something. "Oh, yeah. Whatever you choose, I won't hurt you. You're in a forbidden genjutsu called Truth Lost in the Fog. As long as I'm willing to pay the price, I can choose for you to wake up as if you were dreaming, and forget everything you saw and heard.

"Now, make your choice. I have to be gone before the next patrol arrives."

[] Escape with Inoue-sensei
[] Try to surrender to Zabuza
[] Return to the base and try to leave with others
[] Forget all these disloyal options and stick with Shikigami-sensei's plan

Write-ins accepted.

Voting closes on Saturday the 9th​, 9 am Pacific Standard Time.​
 
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hahahahah we're all fucked

Ok four options that are going on here.
  1. It's actually Zabuza/his allies and we're already dead. No point considering this option since it won't matter what we do.
  2. Second is that Inoue is telling the complete truth and that she'll let us live even if we disagree with her. Very unlikely because lolNinjas, but it's a remote possibility.
  3. Third is that she's still loyal to Shikigami and us betraying him means we die. This is basically a test for us/whoever showed up.
  4. Fourth is that she's disloyal to Shikigami but will kill us if we don't go with her.
@eaglejarl @Velorien @Jackercracks @AugSphere Do we know the alternative genjutsu-dispel method (stabbing yourself)? Can we try this?
 
My opinions on the options:

1. The one most likely to not get us killed. Even if it is a loyalty test, saying we'd rather go with the jonin in front of us than the one a few miles from here is just the smart thing to say.

2. Zabuza MIGHT be merciful. He plays the hardass act, but he's shown he can be a big softie at times in canon. Additionally, Shikigami's words of how he kills people who surrender to him could be exaggerated to dissuade turncoats. In fact, I'm almost certain of it.

3. Trying to leave with Inoue is one thing. Trying to steal others out from under Shikigami's nose is something else entirely. He'll kill us for rebels and call it justice, the mad bastard.

4. If we pick this, she'll kill us if she's serious about leaving and won't if she isn't. I doubt this is a loyalty test.

Therefore, my belief is option 1 is the best outcome. We've done our tutorial, we've shown we can survive even in the most hostile of environments. We should leave the swamp and move on.
 
Lol k, guys keep in mind when i was saying we have highest stealth so we should go ahead that actually means our team mates are fucking failures at being stealthy and they should never be in a k of us when we are sneaking.

Straight out we should have an idea staying is suicide and moving constantly is the bets bet for a missing nin.
 
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@Inf0mercial Cut your vote. We need to discuss this first and vote SECOND. Every single time people vote with their gut instincts it ends up badly. We need to TALK, not VOTE.
 
Hey let's keep it civil, eh questers? We're all here for fun.

Edit: I'll get back to you on leg-stabbery right quick.
 
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@Inf0mercial Cut your vote. We need to discuss this first and vote SECOND. Every single time people vote with their gut instincts it ends up badly. We need to TALK, not VOTE.
I'll cut it but as i see it this is the best course of action and probably the only one that doesn't have us being killed, plus well from an ic perspective i can't help but think this would be a rational choice.
 
@Inf0mercial I understand and respect that but it never is a good idea to just vote without discussing with the hivemind to find the best decision. Also I don't think IC is important.
 
Other possibilities for what we're seeing:

Inoue is dead, and this is Zabuza henge'd into her.

Inoue is or isn't dead, and this is Shikigami or Inoue henge'd proposing a loyalty test. Accepting the offer is failure and instadeath.

The situation is as it is presented.

OOC, it seems odd to present a "I can make you forget this" option given that there will be many pages of discussion, so I'm skeptical of that aspect, making me think it's more likely that that specific aspect is a bluff.
 
You could argue that this is a point in favor of katana in ninja fights that usually take place in rough terrain. Less you have to maneuver while tree walking upside down on the underside of a thick and slippery tree branch while the other guy charges at you, the better.

Granted. Still, plenty of ninja fights seem to happen on the ground or on the water, too.

One point in the katana's favor that I hadn't considered: you're less likely to be able to control distance against multiple attackers, so a mid-range weapon might be preferable in a melee. On the other hand, ninja battles seem to be duels more than melees most of the time -- they're generally deployed in penny packets so there's not a lot of people involved, and they move fast enough that the fight is spread out over plenty of ground.

Rapier is actually a really interesting weapon; there's several different styles for it that are extremely different. Spanish rapier came first -- it's fenced on the round and is utterly lethal, but complex to learn. Italian rapier was an offshoot of Spanish; the Italians wanted something they could learn quickly and use for self-defense in street brawls, so they evolved a very simple linear style based on opposition and power. Then the French came along and evolved a soft-style system explicitly designed to beat Italian, but kept the linearity. You can tell just by looking at someone's stance whether they're fighting Spanish, Italian, or French: Spanish is upright, feet close together; Italian is crouched, feet very wide; French is in the middle, a mostly-upright crouch.
 
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Also tricky-GM possibilities for a situation like this, if I were a GM - If we choose to leave with her, then it ends up having always been real. If we try to defect to Zabuza, it ends up that it was him in the first place. If we choose to stay loyal to swampy, it ends up that it was Shikigami testing our loyalty after he learned of her betrayal, and/or he just got her to give a loyalty test to fuck with us.

And the "subversion from the inside" is presented as an option that is so laughably stupid that they will just instakill us for even thinking it's a possibility.

Thus, our choices might literally rewrite reality, which is a thing to keep in mind.
 
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Also tricky-GM possibilities for a situation like this, if I were a GM - If we choose to leave with her, then it ends up having always been real. If we try to defect to Zabuza, it ends up that it was him in the first place. If we choose to stay loyal to swampy, it ends up that it was Shikigami testing our loyalty after he learned of her betrayal, and/or he just got her to give a loyalty test to fuck with us.
We definitely don't re-write reality around you mid-conversation.
@eaglejarl @Velorien @Jackercracks @AugSphere Do we know the alternative genjutsu-dispel method (stabbing yourself)? Can we try this?
Stabbing yourself is effective for low-level genjutsu. For the higher level stuff it isn't really a practical option because the level of self-stabbery necessary scales with the skill of the genjutsu caster, so it can get fairly debilitating. For example with the higher level stuff you might get yourself an unspecified number of challenge dice due to having a less than fully functional leg. Generally your teachers have been fairly dismissive of self-stabbery for the purposes of breaking out compared to even a basic dispel. It's more awareness that you are in a genjutsu that's the limiting factor in the vast majority of cases. Of course, you've already been told you're in an genjutsu here so you didn't need to roll.

You have the option, anyway.
 
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Evidence/reasoning: Inoue claims she wants to bring us with her because she feels some sort of loyalty to us/wants to see us grow. HOWEVER she cannot possibly have predicted that we, specifically, not only would be close enough to hear the explosion, but also that we would rush to investigate it. If she really wanted to save us she would have waited until we got back, tested our loyalty via the forbidden genjutsu while we slept and nobody noticed us, and made her decision then. Therefore she doesn't specifically want to save us. If her actual, original, plan was to lure a team to her "suicide" why stick around? She set the explosive tag, got the blood out...why is she still there?

Therefore she wants to have a conversation with whoever showed up. But for what purpose?

The obvious answer, which Hazou said, is to have sacrificial pawns. But this doesn't hold up under hindsight: the entire point of the suicide scene is to make it seem as though she's dead. What purpose would it serve to bring genin: slower, more obvious, and thus more prone to getting noticed by ninjas, with her? They're going to get noticed, and that will draw ninjas to Inoue's position, making it harder for her to actually escape. Smart ninjas would scour the area with an electron microscope to find other ninjas. It's a unnecessary risk since they would more than likely notice a high-level ninja, even if they don't know who. Therefore she doesn't want pawns to die for her. But then why ask? She could have asked other genin teams at the base, one by one, until she found teams that would be loyal to her and picking the most competent one. Then it's just a matter of suicide and escape. No need for this conversation, period. Therefore she doesn't want a team to 'save'. But then why bother talking?

Conclusion: This entire situation is a loyalty test from Shikigami. It's the only option that fits (or it's Zabuza looking for info, but we're fucked no matter what happens so we may as well ignore it).

Can the rest of you read my thoughts and figure out the flaws in my argument?
 
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