???
IIRC their goal is to figure out a way to sustain themselves indefinitely, so while it isn't explicitly stated that they're trying to solve entropy, achieving their goal seems to require doing so
I think people often don't appreciate the time scales of heat death. The entities have experienced multiple near extinction event over the course of their evolution, there are many orders of magnitude more time between now and heat death really starting to kick in and between now and the big bang. Ergo they will experience millions of near extinction events between now and Heat death. The odds that one of those is particularly bad and destroys the race is near certain, especially given that the trend was that each one was worse than the previous.
Now granted, Wildbow is people thus he may also have fallen victim to this fallacy.
However in that case if they can't work out how to drag matter from one dimension to another, slowing the expansion of the universe thus preventing heat death in at least a fraction of realities, then they deserve to die.
 
For what it's worth, I'm willing to actively campaign against what I see as gratuitous evil. See: Armageddon Initiative. I want to see our heroes fighting back against the darkness of a death world and knocking enough holes in the curtain that light can shine through. No need to patch them ourselves.
 
[] Proto-Action Plan: Pulling a Naruto
JiraiyaJoutarou may appear the strongest guard for the scroll, but he's also willing to flaunt himself in public while leaving the scroll behind with his lackeys, who almost never leave the room. This means that we need to collect information before we plot a way to steal thescroll.

Goals:
  1. Stay alive & anonymous.
  2. Get more information on Joutarou's lackeys.
Methods:
  1. Stay alive & anonymous.
    1. Make sure to use unique Henge at all times, with masks to keep us anonymous if Henges break.
  2. Get more information on Joutarou's lackeys.
    1. Ask Honami questions:
      1. When have they left the room? What do they do? Is Joutarou in the room when they leave?
      2. How do they act around each other and with outsiders?
      3. Are meals brought to them? Is room service (and under what circumstances)?
    2. Discuss how to use Noburi to test their chakra.
      1. If the lackeys use the hot springs, try to position Noburi as happened with Joutarou.
      2. If the plumbing system allows it, try to use the bathroom water (sink, bathtub...) as a medium for Noburi.
    3. Try to interact with the lackeys (NOT WHILE JOUTAROU IS THERE).
      1. If they participate in any activities, join them.
      2. If they just stay in their room, Henge into staff and visit them under a good excuse (e.g., room service).
    4. If they are isolated, genjutsu + search them.
      1. Take anything that may seem like the information scroll, but DON'T take anything else unless we find the scroll.
      2. Note any distinguishing features (ANBU tattoo...).
      3. Check chakra levels if genjutsu doesn't get disturbed.

I was going to comment and critique this, but then I noticed that it's pretty much the same as the Kobolds proto-plan.
 
You know... I mean, as much as I hate to admit it, I think this mission may very well end up being mostly on Mari's head. Because let's be honest: in her specialization, I'd be very surprised if she hadn't learned to deal with traps and stuff in achieving an objective. So maybe we're looking at this the wrong way. Maybe the genin should engineer some sort of crisis (without interacting with Joutarou) that would demand his attention while she investigates? Actually, what do we know about Joutarou? Regardless of whether he's ACTUALLY a political figure or he's henged as one, we might be able to find out if there's anything we can distract him with. If he's a merchant of some form, we might get merchants from town to come pester him or something
 
You know... I mean, as much as I hate to admit it, I think this mission may very well end up being mostly on Mari's head. Because let's be honest: in her specialization, I'd be very surprised if she hadn't learned to deal with traps and stuff in achieving an objective. So maybe we're looking at this the wrong way. Maybe the genin should engineer some sort of crisis (without interacting with Joutarou) that would demand his attention while she investigates? Actually, what do we know about Joutarou? Regardless of whether he's ACTUALLY a political figure or he's henged as one, we might be able to find out if there's anything we can distract him with. If he's a merchant of some form, we might get merchants from town to come pester him or something
We could just try and act as her support team and ask what she needs. She just seems to be uncomfortable with being put into leadership positions. (Something we have taken advantage of in the past)
 
Interlude: The Last Hours of Sunlight
Interlude: The Last Hours of Sunlight
The Mori Clan were not the most revered in Hidden Mist. While some clans could step across the fabric of space in an instant, leaving waves of lightning in their wake, and others could swamp their opponents with constructed giant crabs, the Mori were sometimes referred to as "human abacuses" by the ignorant, their support specialisation rendering them second-class citizens until the time came when Mist's forces could not coordinate without them.

But no matter how many fools might scorn the Mori, none could deny their jealousy at the magnificence of the Mori compound.

Most of the buildings had been designed many generations ago by Mori Genzō, a branch family member with particularly weak access to the Frozen Skein who had instead turned his attention to architecture. Finding his inspiration in nature, he drew on the patterns and dimensions of seashells, trees and the more fascinating parts of animal anatomy to create houses of mathematically perfect ratios and elegant asymmetry. Works of art from the outside, inside the rooms were proportioned so as to instill mental and emotional calm while still serving essential ninja functions of privacy and security. Any intruders would find themselves hopelessly turned around until they stumbled into a fiendish series of traps, while residents who had memorised Genzō's design principles could be blindfolded with their legs tied together, and still be able to navigate the compound as if it were a set of ordinary civilian dwellings.

No Mori since had ever approached Genzō's genius, and whenever new construction was necessary, they could only draw on the library of blueprints he had left behind – a treasure guarded as jealously as any scroll of secret clan techniques. To this day, the reward for a Mori who had done the clan a great service was a haori decorated with one of Genzō's signature fractal symbols.

None of this was a clan secret – the Mori were happy to boast of their unique architecture to anyone who asked, which was usually no one. But Mitsuhide, a regular at the Chiaroscuro Chamber, had asked, and since he was a fellow connoisseur of the arts, and one who occasionally gave her foreign sweets besides, Kei had seen it as her obligation to enlighten him.
-o-
"The rose that blooms in spring will wilt by autumn, but a rose preserved in ice will last forever," Kei read out from the scroll in front of her.

Master Saruhiko nodded. "Good. You have completed Cypher Level Eight. But you must try harder in the future – when your sister was undergoing genin training, she cracked this one in under five minutes."

How did Master Saruhiko even remember a minor detail of something that had happened a good six years ago? No, that was a foolish question. The man was only a few ranks away from being an elder. Rumours said he was able to use the Frozen Skein in combat. It would be stranger if he didn't have a perfect memory.

And that memory once again placed her within her sister's shadow. Ami was perfect. It was an incontestable, undeniable statement. She had received ninjutsu training from Uehida Minori herself. She was so strong, they let her take point in the field despite the fact that she was a Mori. If there were such a thing as a Jōnin Exam (there wasn't, and there would be consequences for anyone who suggested otherwise too loudly), she would already be about to take it. She mocked the Mori Voice, or so she claimed. She even knew how to talk to people. They laughed at her jokes and never gave her strange looks when she made sensible observations.

One day, Kei wanted to be Ami. But apparently everyone else wanted the same thing, and they wanted her to be Ami now.

It was only noon, and Kei was already starting to feel unhappy. But the day had a saving grace – Kei had the afternoon off, and the new exhibition at the Chiaroscuro Chamber was already singing its siren song.
-o-​

Kei watched the hypnotic shifting of the shadows on the white walls of the Chamber, their precise dance telling a story that, she knew, every watcher would invent and interpret for themselves. To her, the rising sinuous curve was a serpent about to strike at the heavens. But a brief flicker of motion, a shadow that moved like a negative sunbeam, pierced its head, and the serpent changed its path, enlightenment guiding it back down to the earth where the depths would reshape it into a dragon. Yet in the corner, the cupped hands of the goddess wavered and spilled their blessing into the void. Should the serpent have kept rising beyond itself, beyond the spiked peaks and into a different existence, or was it right to follow the inspiration that led it deeper within its soul?

A gentle chime rang out. The lights faded. The mirrors swivelled back into the walls. The painted wooden blocks stayed where they were, but Yumi would be here in a minute to collect them. She loathed having anyone else touch her belongings.

"Well," Mitsuhide sighed, "it ends too soon, as always. Please give my compliments to your cousin on her ever-growing skills. That was a very fine ending, with the forest spirit submitting to the aspiring sage."

Kei nodded. Yumi's "art installation", as she called it, received few visitors, mostly travellers and a handful of merchants that visited Mist on a regular basis. Mitsuhide was one of these, and invariably generous with his contributions to the donation box, even if the forgetful silk trader always dropped in a variety of coins from different countries, most of them near-worthless here. Not that he was the only one – a number of visitors seemed to think that the symbolism of the gesture was more important than actually supporting Yumi's art (though in reality the Chiaroscuro Chamber was fully funded by the clan, and Kei wasn't entirely sure why the donation box was really there).

It was a rule of the Chiaroscuro Chamber that any Mori present at closing time would carry the donation box home, leaving Yumi free to stay and maintain the equipment, especially the expensive chemical lights. Yumi had not failed to impress upon the rest of the clan that the donations were an invaluable contribution to the Mori finances (which was a lie), and as such the loss of even a single coin from the box would place the deliverer in mortal peril (which probably wasn't).

Kei frowned as she picked the box up. Her intuition was tingling, telling her something was off. Something about the box? No, it was the same as always, in colour, size, shape and approximate weight. That only left one obvious possibility.

She looked at the foreign coins more closely. Four Leaf ryō. Two Frost ryō. Nine of those peculiar little coins they used in Fang. Kei quickly went through the rest of the coins. That combination… it was exactly the same as the last time Mitsuhide had left a donation in her presence (she'd been training her memory – one day it would need to be as good as Master Saruhiko's if she was going to become an elder herself). It seemed Kei had stumbled across something important.
-o-
Kei walked the familiar path to the underground treasury as her mind cycled through possibilities.

The labyrinthine corridors would confuse anybody who didn't know that they were patterned after the distinctive arrangement of veins on the leaves of the greater ravenous bloodflower (the branch family kept a few tame ones in the Garden of the Taken), and thus all one had to do was to take a step backwards and to the left or right, as appropriate, wherever a greater vein intersected with a lesser one. Needless to say, stepping in the wrong direction, where a real bloodflower would have its tiny hairs, resulted in instant death. Different segments of the leaf had different traps, to account for ninja with a variety of special abilities, and a typical intruder would end up dying to all of them – some twice – before they had a chance of finding the true exit. Someone like Kei, on the other hand, could walk from one end to the other in thirty seconds at an unhurried pace.

This time, Kei did not hurry away from the treasury and its somewhat intimidating atmosphere after handing over the box, but stayed next to Uncle Junpei, curious to see what he would do. She watched, as unobtrusively as possible, while her uncle sank deep into the Frozen Skein. Eventually, he picked the coins out of the box, one by one, stacked them according to currency and value, and then did something strange.

He took each coin, in order, and slowly ran the tip of his right finger around its ridges, before putting it down in a specific position and picking up the next.

After some time, with all the coins processed in this strange fashion, Uncle Junpei opened his eyes and withdrew from his focused state.

"What were you doing, Uncle?" Kei asked, cursing her lack of subtlety even as she opened her mouth.

"Checking for counterfeits, little Keiko," Uncle Junpei explained. "I don't mind you watching – elders willing, you'll be the one doing this job instead of me one day – but do bear in mind this is a secret Mori art, so don't go blabbing about it to everyone, OK?"

Kei gave him an insulted look, or what she hoped came across as an insulted look.

"Now, would you be a dear and go ask Elders Kazushi and Mirano to come down here?" Uncle Junpei asked, looking at the coins contemplatively. "There's something I want to talk to them about."

Unfortunately, that was as far as Kei's investigation went that day. Elder Kazushi promptly sent her on a series of trivial errands, and by the time she was done, the sun had set and it was too late for anything but dinner and bed. Nevertheless, she resolved to take the time to find out what was really going on – perhaps after she came back from her upcoming mission, she would have earned a sufficient measure of trust.
-o-
There was only one day left before the mission. Kei was simultaneously excited and scare- nervous. Very nervous. She would be working under Sumie-sensei in the logistics team, and while Sumie-sensei was no Ami, she was kind and thoughtful and almost eerily competent, qualities which comfortably placed her among Kei's top ten people.

This was the mission which would establish Kei as a ninja in her own right, with her own career and her own unique strengths. She would earn the elders' trust with her performance, make her family proud, and be inducted into the clan's advanced techniques and ancient secrets. And she wouldn't have to flail around trying and failing to earn everyone's affection, because she would already have their respect.

"Whatcha doing, runt?" a familiar voice interrupted her daydreams.

"Ami," she said. She recalled where her sister had been for the last hour. "How is Aunt Noriko?"

Her sister looked uncharacteristically grim. "Elder Ina's been working on her day and night. Says it's fifty-fifty odds. Not as bad as it could be, but still…"

Kei did a double-take. "Fifty-fifty?"

"Yeah. We've got the full story now, and apparently she didn't just go too deep. That scumsucker Ayanami wanted to show off his new Lightning technique, and he overextended and pulled the unit straight into an ambush. She had to use that, or it would've been a full wipe."

Kei blinked. Several times. "But… that doesn't mean…"

"It doesn't mean anything. Aunt Noriko's a fighter, Keiko. She's got twice the balls that Ayanami's going to once I'm done with him. She's not going to the Garden. She's going to come back, and when she does, you can tell her all about your heroics on your first big mission, how's that?"

Kei nodded uncertainly.

"Anyway, listen, I've got a going-away present for you. You'll love this: it's my lucky shuriken."

The thing she handed Kei did not look lucky. Rather, it looked like an abomination the mere touch of which would earn her a thousand-year curse.

"It's bright pink," Kei stated flatly.

"Yep."

"With flowers and rainbows painted on it."

"That's right."

"And is that… is that a sheep surrounded by shōjo sparkles?"

"It's supposed to be a kirin."

Ami saw her expression.

"Hey, I never claimed to be an artist! That's why it's got 'Chārī the Kirin of Maidenly Love' written under it, just so there's no confusion."

Kei looked up and met her sister's eyes.

"Ami," she said slowly, "if you wish me to be your second in a ceremony of honourable suicide, there are easier ways to ask."

"Nono," Ami shook her head, "you've got it all wrong. It's, like, you know that expression 'she's drawn her last shuriken'?"

"Yes," Kei nodded, "I am in fact familiar with basic idiom as learned by children from the age of five upwards."

"Great," Ami beamed. "I'd hate to see that all my years of hard work bringing you up had gone to waste.

"So when you draw your last shuriken, it means your situation is so desperate that you've finally run out of options, right? Well this is my last shuriken, and I will beat the Mizukage in an even fight before I let someone force me to draw this thing in front of them.

"And now, it's your last shuriken. You'll make your way safe and sound out of any pinch, because the alternative is to let your friends and enemies see you wielding that shuriken in battle."

Kei held her sister's gaze, feeling her eyes grow wet. Only this woman could take a piece of ridiculous, offensive tomfoolery… and turn it into an expression of deep affection.

"Make me proud out there, runt. Aunt Noriko and I will be waiting to welcome you back."
-o-​

Voting closes on Saturday the 6th​, 9 am Pacific Standard Time.
 
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Note that the FSB requires its seals to be at least 3m apart in a planar array. It's possible to make that work for a cannon, but you need a non-standard shape. A tube won't work, there will need to be a large flat part for the seals to go on.
When I first read this, my immediate thought was "oh, hell, Putin is a Narutoverse villain. This explains everything."
 
You want to kill a random person who cannot threaten you, has every reason to NOT hire people who can threaten you, and has no plausible reason to send them after you even if she did, for some bizarre reason, hire them?

This would also be wildly out character for our party. That's justification enough to veto it. Even if one character grew vicious enough to do that, the rest of the group would prevent them from carrying it out, smack them upside the head, or boot them from the group.

Continuity of character is important for the setting to feel "real", and make readers actually grow attached to the characters (and thus care if something happens to them.)

Torture I can see happening in extreme circumstances, if we needed information on serious threats (Eg: Akatsuki), but anyone we need to torture for information would likely be nearly impervious to it.
 
Torture I can see happening in extreme circumstances, if we needed information on serious threats (Eg: Akatsuki), but anyone we need to torture for information would likely be nearly impervious to it.

Sure, except that physical pain doesn't generally extract useful truth. Remember back in 'Snipe Hunt' when Mari wanted to find out where Noboyuki was from? (i.e. The Village Hidden in the Mountain) She didn't torture him -- she pretended that she was going to, then she stopped and explained how tired she was and how she didn't want to hurt him and he should go. And, of course, she happened to drop the words 'medic-nin' into the conversation, figuring that there was a pretty good chance that backwoods ninja wouldn't have very many of those. She then proceeded to prick at Nobuyuki's pride and those of the rest of his team, using phrases like "I don't care about your little mud hole" and "All I know is that you attack on sight, you're lousy fighters, and you didn't know that medic-nin are real." The Mountain ninja were motivated by their pride to volunteer the information she wanted. Had she simply let Kagome try the 'interrogation by explosive enema' tactic, she would have gotten nothing.
 
Make a 3x3 base, put the seals on the underside. Solved.
Wait, I'm confused now. How does the shape of the object we are protecting relate to the support seal placement? Do the support seals also need to be placed on the object we are trying to protect? Or do you mean that the cannon has to have some sort of a plane surface so we can affix the primary seal to it, like a wooden placard? Also, how does the planar array requirement work if the support seals have to be equidistant from each other and the original seal?

EDIT: Wait, the planar array doesn't work even if the support seals only have to be equidistant with each other. Have I misunderstood the definition of "planar array"? I thought it to mean "things on a single plane", like dots drawn on paper.

Actually, after checking with @Velorien it seems that I (EJ) had it wrong. The central seal needs to be on the object, the four peripheral seals can't be. So yes, you can put this on a cannon, as long as there are places around the cannon to put the peripheral seals. All the seals need to be placed on flat surfaces and the peripheral ones need to be 3-100m from the central one. (You'd need a flat spot on the cannon, but that's easy enough.) All seals must be in a plane, but the angle of the plane is not relevant. There is a few inches of leeway on "in the plane" but not a lot.

Also, @eaglejarl, @Velorien, can Mari mess around with time sense in a genjutsu? If the thing we're doing should only take 5 minutes and done, can she make 30 minutes seem like 5, or are we stuck with 5 minutes to do what we need to before they start getting suspicious? And actually another question. How visible is the entrance to their suite? Is it around a corner at the end of a hall where you'd have to actually be there to tell what's going on, or could you see shenanigans at the doorway from a large number of other rooms and/or outside the building?

She cannot mess with time, no.

The suite is at the end of a normal hotel-style hallway -- doors on both sides, the door to the suite at the end facing you as you walk down the hall.

@eaglejarl @Velorien In addition to Sleeps previous questions: Is Mari able to keep two people under genjutsu at the same time? Or was that just a quirk of the Truth Lost in the Fog.

She can't. If you think about it, she'd be having to separately and simultaneously meddle with the contents of two separate brains, in real-time. Truth Lost in the Fog can do it, but it's a forbidden technique for a reason -- remember "the price" that she's talked about.


"Attribution missing said:
Can TH be used on others? Basically can Hazou (if he has sufficient skill in it) help Nobby modify a technique without needing to be able to do it himself - alternatively, can one learn the theory of a technique in order to TH it without being able to actually use it?

No. Otherwise every village would have a few ninjutsu development specialists optimising every technique for every ninja.
 
Without wanting to be too much of a downer, I'm going to disagree with you on this.

The first part of Worm is a lot of fun, and carried me right along. Origin stories with smart protagonists are fun, and watching Taylor's first couple attempts at being a superhero was exciting.

Then I started thinking about what was going on. The more I thought about it, the more annoyed I got. I did stick it out for quite a ways, but when the truth about powers was revealed I was angry.

The problem is that Wildbow worked backwards. He wanted to write a superhero story that made sense, but he wanted society to be the same as in reality. Therefore, Reed Richards is Still Useless and no supervillain could Cut Themselves A Check.

In order to achieve these two goals he constructed a series of justifications that are, quite literally, the biggest narrative cheats I've ever seen. Yes, he explained why the setting is the way it is, but it was so profoundly dissatisfying that it ruined the story for me.

You may disagree with me, but I seem to agree with you. :p
All your points are valid, and I also really disliked the contrived ways in which Wildbow makes the setting work.
However, I still greatly enjoyeed reading Worm, even if it was infuriatingly contrived sometimes (so many, many times)
 
Torture I can see happening in extreme circumstances, if we needed information on serious threats (Eg: Akatsuki), but anyone we need to torture for information would likely be nearly impervious to it.

I am told that interrogation experts regard torture as a generally ineffective method of gathering reliable information.

In that regard, I dislike torture interrogation as portrayed in fiction, because it has the potential to impart false beliefs about torture.

Believe it or nor, some people actually do believe what they read in fiction, especially so if it pass their disbelief filter.
 
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Torture I can see happening in extreme circumstances, if we needed information on serious threats (Eg: Akatsuki), but anyone we need to torture for information would likely be nearly impervious to it.
I could see torture (and all those other things eaglejarl listed) happening, but not for information gathering. I'd more likely see it if we ever needed to build a reputation as fucking assholes.
 
We don't have to do the actual torture in that case they just have to think we did. However we could likely get the cult talking by getting them to brag.
 
I could see torture (and all those other things eaglejarl listed) happening, but not for information gathering. I'd more likely see it if we ever needed to build a reputation as fucking assholes.

Isn't torture basically nearly universally used by most/all factions in this setting? I mean, even Konaha has a "Torture and Interrogation" department. I don't see using torture as a very useful means of deterrent. We couldn't afford to capture and torture any enemy ninja near or above our power levels, so it's not like we could scare hunters away with what we'd do to them.

Sure, except that physical pain doesn't generally extract useful truth.

True, torture is famously unreliable for finding truthful ,reliable information, even when the subject isn't a bullshit tier ninja. In most cases, there are better ways of getting information. Social Fu, spying, treating prisoners well, etc.

Generally, such methods should be tried first. But if a target won't talk any other way, the issue is important enough (depopulating cities), and you have a way to verify information (either using mind-reading or simple verification), it might be a necessary evil.

Most such situations just don't exist in this setting though, for a variety of reasons. I find it pretty unlikely we'll need to torture anyone, nor do I want us to. I'm just debating ethics, really.
 
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Man, a Kurosawa-Mori child would truly be terrifying to behold if they somehow managed to inherit both bloodlines...

Insofar as torture goes, the only way I can see it happening realistically is as a result of TPK excepting Hazou, Mari, or Kagome. They're the only ones I could see being ruthless enough to do so for the sake of revenge.
 
You know... I mean, as much as I hate to admit it, I think this mission may very well end up being mostly on Mari's head. Because let's be honest: in her specialization, I'd be very surprised if she hadn't learned to deal with traps and stuff in achieving an objective. So maybe we're looking at this the wrong way. Maybe the genin should engineer some sort of crisis (without interacting with Joutarou) that would demand his attention while she investigates?

This sounds fine as long as it doesn't turn into "ask Mari to make a plan" -plan. We as players still need to come up with the actual plan and the genin need to have a clear part in it. But maybe it is easier to start the planning process by concentrating on Mari.

What would Mari do to get her hands on the scroll if she was alone? Or if that's too hard, how would she find out more about Joutaro's companions?

Practical and actionable ideas preferred.
 
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So what is stopping us from deriving the first principles of using chakra in an external fashion? Or even deriving the first principles or chakra theory to even use chakra in the first place? Someone came up with chakra theory in the first place so how hard would it be to get results or a time table for results.
 
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