I didn't really get that impression from NTBS, but I did sorta get it in Waves Arisen, like when
two major characters die offscreen when they're poisoned in jail, with no buildup or warning
. But Waves Arisen is weird yet good in that it didn't strike me as well written, but looking back on it, it was a thoroughly rational work that realistically displayed the realities of ninja life like that - death is sudden, unexpected, and rarely preceeded by a dramatic last stand.
That's more elaborate than my interpretation, which was pretty much just agreeing with Kagome that chakra is something the sage made up for some purpose or another, via admin privs on a post-singularity singleton AI.
Seals fit in to that a bit weirdly, though. Would make sense for it to be from the same source, especially since it still involves chakra, but it still seems to be a separate thing. Maybe its sort of a exploit? But the whole separate paths, etc is very elaborate; if AI-theory is correct, those would probably be simulations that the AI shuttles summoner/summonees to and from. But why are those there? Those couldn't be the result of a simple unintentional exploit.
Its definitely all artificial; seals/chakra are clearly anthropocentric systems (and originate from such), and if they were natural features of the world extant since the beginning, things would look very very different. For one, evolution would probably have discovered sealing and either tiled over the universe or destroyed it. And much else. But the specifics are hazy.
We have WoG that seals are capable of doing anything jutsu is capable of doing which is literally anything.
@faflec : have fun tracking down that one. No keywords to help you here.
I believe that I have mentioned Ra before. We are in a supposedly rational universe which has magic in it instead of parsimonious derivatives. Therefore, there must be some sort of being of god-like power actively fucking with us which needs to be immediately slain before I get more angry.
I don't know his list, and ratfic is hard to define, but Time Braid (Mother of Learning happens to Sakura) is probably one. Velorien made a different one (which he hasn't finished) called lighting up the dark, which is also good. I can think of a few more
We have WoG that seals are capable of doing anything jutsu is capable of doing which is literally anything.
@faflec : have fun tracking down that one. No keywords to help you here.
I believe that I have mentioned Ra before. We are in a supposedly rational universe which has magic in it instead of parsimonious derivatives. Therefore, there must be some sort of being of god-like power actively fucking with us which needs to be immediately slain before I get more angry.
Technically speaking, sealing can do anything though some things are certainly easier than others. A fort-unmake seal would be doable, but it would have to be customised to the fort in question. ETA: there is also the possibility of the fort containing seals designed to counter such.
I for once think that hazo is awere that realy itself is aginst him and his effort to un-grimdark the world, and someone eventualy have to answer for that (probably somo kaguya alien).
In that angly is the basis for what i think hazo aura would be
Welcome. Fair warning: I'm relatively satisfied with the large majority of the story but the last chapter is rushed. I was burned out on the story and wanted to wrap it up but also provide the readers some closure. It's rushed, but if I had gone on hiatus I likely wouldn't have ended up finishing it at all.
Did you seriously think you could challenge the Loremaster and win? It's my (and Velorien's) gorram story and I've lost every time I tried to fight that battle. I gave up a long time ago.
Did you seriously think you could challenge the Loremaster and win? It's my (and Velorien's) gorram story and I've lost every time I tried to fight that battle. I gave up a long time ago.
We have WoG that seals are capable of doing anything jutsu is capable of doing which is literally anything.
@faflec : have fun tracking down that one. No keywords to help you here.
I believe that I have mentioned Ra before. We are in a supposedly rational universe which has magic in it instead of parsimonious derivatives. Therefore, there must be some sort of being of god-like power actively fucking with us which needs to be immediately slain before I get more angry.
And 'sealing is like coding' is hardly new, but it does make a lot of sense as a sort of exploit in the simulation.
Especially if you think of it as coding a computer the inside.
In raw bytecode.
Which is also object-oriented, somehow.
With no modern conveniences like debuggers, typing, spell check, or the ability for a program to fail without swapping one quarter of your internal organs for the nearest pastries.
And every instruction must be hand written, every time, because no one knows how defining functions work, and the last guy to try to find out probably learned what the color of abstract geometrical gerbils tastes like.
On a side note, lets never ever even whisper the word 'AI' to Hazo. I don't know how fast something can THOOM when handed a arbitrary code execution exploit for the substrate of the universe, but it would probably look very dramatic for the 3.194 seconds before you stopped existing.
And 'sealing is like coding' is hardly new, but it does make a lot of sense as a sort of exploit in the simulation.
Especially if you think of it as coding a computer the inside.
In raw bytecode.
Which is also object-oriented, somehow.
With no modern conveniences like debuggers, typing, spell check, or the ability for a program to fail without swapping one quarter of your internal organs for the nearest pastries.
And every instruction must be hand written, every time, because no one knows how defining functions work, and the last guy to try to find out probably learned what the color of abstract geometrical gerbils tastes like.
On a side note, lets never ever even whisper the word 'AI' to Hazo. I don't know how fast something can THOOM when handed a arbitrary code execution exploit for the substrate of the universe, but it would probably look very dramatic for the 3.194 seconds before you stopped existing.
It is worth bearing in mind that in-universe it is not possible, a priori, to know that sealing can do anything. That would require you to have a complete list of things that are possible, or something equally difficult to obtain (such as a complete list of laws of physics). For example, if black holes exist in the MfDverse, then this fact is not known to sealmasters. A sealmaster cannot know whether it's possible for sealing to manipulate the unique properties of black holes.
Yeah, it's some sort of strange combo of both in practice. The internal mechanics are reminiscent of EE, while the overarching principles and failure modes look like what you'd expect a computer bug to look like from the inside.
But it's also clearly more complicated in that in some unknown way. In a computer program, simplicity is generally the measure of how hard something is to code, not the overall effect on data by some other metric. Overwriting, swapping, modifying values are basic operations.
If you extended the 'sealing is coding' metaphor, you'd expect effects like, say, deleting all matter in a spherical volume to be trivially easy, as would replacing it all with rock. Or solid gold. And scaling wouldn't be a thing - if you have a function that amounts to 'create energy at spot', the difference between warming a cup of tea and a nuke is pressing 0 a few times.
Those aren't the case, and furthermore the universe still exists, so there's apparently some sort of permission or sanity-check system in place that limits the effects of seals in a way that conforms to human sensibilities instead of machine logic. Which suggests intelligent design, so perhaps it's not strictly a unintended exploit, or the simulation/chakra interface layer is really well designed and behaves fairly sanely even in the realm of exploits.
This is reinforced by the fact that there's also a lot of sanity checks that appear to give preference to humans - there is a 'raise the temperature of air nearby by 30 degrees' jutsu and also probably a seal, but not a 'raise the temperature of flesh nearby by 30 degrees' seal or jutsu. Or if there is, whoever invented the Aura of Instant Death by Heatstroke seal is being remarkably coy about it.
And 'sealing is like coding' is hardly new, but it does make a lot of sense as a sort of exploit in the simulation.
Especially if you think of it as coding a computer the inside.
In raw bytecode.
Which is also object-oriented, somehow.
With no modern conveniences like debuggers, typing, spell check, or the ability for a program to fail without swapping one quarter of your internal organs for the nearest pastries.
And every instruction must be hand written, every time, because no one knows how defining functions work, and the last guy to try to find out probably learned what the color of abstract geometrical gerbils tastes like.
On a side note, lets never ever even whisper the word 'AI' to Hazo. I don't know how fast something can THOOM when handed a arbitrary code execution exploit for the substrate of the universe, but it would probably look very dramatic for the 3.194 seconds before you stopped existing.
Screw it. The entire setting is clearly some homeomorphically encrypted (hi mods, we all already know that you idiots can't be bothered to Google something before bringing the hammer down on an innocent victim for daring to know Greek or Latin!) program running on master computer.
It is worth bearing in mind that in-universe it is not possible, a priori, to know that sealing can do anything. That would require you to have a complete list of things that are possible, or something equally difficult to obtain (such as a complete list of laws of physics). For example, if black holes exist in the MfDverse, then this fact is not known to sealmasters. A sealmaster cannot know whether it's possible for sealing to manipulate the unique properties of black holes.
Yeah, it's some sort of strange combo of both in practice. The internal mechanics are reminiscent of EE, while the overarching principles and failure modes look like what you'd expect a computer bug to look like from the inside.
But it's also clearly more complicated in that in some unknown way. In a computer program, simplicity is generally the measure of how hard something is to code, not the overall effect on data by some other metric. Overwriting, swapping, modifying values are basic operations.
If you extended the 'sealing is coding' metaphor, you'd expect effects like, say, deleting all matter in a spherical volume to be trivially easy, as would replacing it all with rock. Or solid gold. And scaling wouldn't be a thing - if you have a function that amounts to 'create energy at spot', the difference between warming a cup of tea and a nuke is pressing 0 a few times.
Those aren't the case, and furthermore the universe still exists, so there's apparently some sort of permission or sanity-check system in place that limits the effects of seals in a way that conforms to human sensibilities instead of machine logic. Which suggests intelligent design, so perhaps it's not strictly a unintended exploit, or the simulation/chakra interface layer is really well designed and behaves fairly sanely even in the realm of exploits.
This is reinforced by the fact that there's also a lot of sanity checks that appear to give preference to humans - there is a 'raise the temperature of air nearby by 30 degrees' jutsu and also probably a seal, but not a 'raise the temperature of flesh nearby by 30 degrees' seal or jutsu. Or if there is, whoever invented the Aura of Instant Death by Heatstroke seal is being remarkably coy about it.
Welcome to the Hivemind! Here's your anti-grue gear. I assure you that although it may look like a mere tinfoil hat, it is perfectly capable of warding off the grue and other anti-memetic hazards. For evidence, please note that , , and , never wore their hats, and look where they are now.
That's right, nowhere. I told them to wear the hat but noooooooooo…. *rambles off into incoherent screaming*
Screw it. The entire setting is clearly some homeomorphically encrypted (hi mods, we all already know that you idiots can't be bothered to Google something before bringing the hammer down on an innocent victim for daring to know Greek or Latin!) program running on master computer.
Please do not use this thread as a platform to launch arbitrary potshots at the mods. Your grudges are your own; MfD does not need extra scrutiny from the people you yourself accuse of being too trigger-happy. If you have to vent, take it to the Discord.
