The walls of the arena are rock, while the floor is dirt, right? So presumably, it is dramatically harder for the pangolins to dig through to us in the wall. Actually, if they notice this and hole up in the center of the arena, we can pretty easily test if they have a sensory jutsu by slowing digging our way under.
 
Macerators are storage seals. If you want to use them, you can. No one will be able to argue as long as you demonstrate in advance that that's all they are.

Are they? They're not standard storage seals. If we did the Incredibly Stupid Box, it'd technically cause an explosion, but it wouldn't be a standard explosive tag.

And in any case, winning here is not worth revealing how Macerators work, I think.
 
Alright, I am convinced.

[x] Speech Plan: The Abject Despair of an Uncaring World

Not sure how to elegantly include quotes; I've added some links instead, albeit not to the chapters you quoted.

Maybe you could just make another post where you quote those lines yourself and then link to that from the speech plan post?
 
Macerators are storage seals. If you want to use them, you can.
Ah, temptation! :p

!!!

[] Proto-plan: Ask J if revealing Macerators is worth It

Because he would be able to judge that, while we can't.
Now hold up for one second.

Let's not blow all of our good stuff on a tournament match that ultimately means nothing from a functional perspective. I really really don't want to have to fight someone else with Macerators. (Like, ever).

There is little advantage to Hazou winning as opposed to Keiko. Quite frankly, its much better for Keiko to win. She has a higher probability of becoming Pokemon League Champion, and if she loses she's just going to hole herself up in the room for a few days.

On the flip side: if we lose, we can actually go out and do interesting things all day in between watching fights. We can suggest combat plans for Keiko to optimize for her own usage. Seems like a pretty decent scenario?

Yep. And if those were legal then Keiko would have them too. She's got the same load out that you have.
That's true, but the pangolin(s) won't have access to these right away so there's potentially something that could be done there.

I agree with your general point of "Any half-trained fool can use these provided they get their hands on them", for what its worth. This is probably something we should be more careful about in the future/figure out a clever workaround for future toys, since this is a pretty big downside (as well as a pretty big upside depending on how you look at it). Bah, double-edged swords.
 
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Regardless, how much more impressive would it be for Hazō to win using only seals that every ninja has access to but no one has ever used in this way? It would show off his real strengths / comparative advantage, which are creativity and planning.
I'd have said Skywalkers and nukes were Hazō's comparative advantage, but maybe that's just me.
 
So I'm considering changing my strategy in light of the fact that Pangolins can probably burrow into the arena walls without fear of collapsing it and causing DQ by endangering the audience into something like what Keiko's R1 opponents tried: using the lake zone as a no-go space for the Pangolins. Except I want to trick the Pangolins into attacking us near the wall where the Pangolins are, and somehow leveraging their massive bulk into making them fall into the water.

Thoughts?
 
their massive bulk into making them fall into the water.
How deep is the lake?

If its only 10 feet deep at the deepest point, they can just stand up.

If its more of a cylindrical/conical pit filled with water and is 30 feet deep, that sounds a lot more viable.
 
Hmm.

If you can think of a viable way to get the garage sized pangolin in there, that sounds like a good idea?

I think we're better served by hit-and-run tactics with explosions and storage seals, like you have in your plan currently.
 
[x] Speech Plan: The Abject Despair of an Uncaring World

[x] Speech Plan: The Abject Despair of an Uncaring World
  • Confirm with Keiko beforehand, hash out an outline.
  • Greet the crowd.
    • Assert that, despite everything, you're genuinely enjoying the Exams and everything they represent: international cooperation and diplomacy, a chance to mingle with different cultures and other-minded people.
    • Doesn't that paint a picture of a better possible world?
  • Let Keiko respond.
    • She would likely note that this event is not about cooperation at all: every village still cares only about itself, and Exams only happen because peace and diplomacy are moderately more advantageous than war, at the moment.
    • All peace is volatile, and could never last for long.
  • Continue verbal sparring from there, expanding the ideological conflict from here-and-now to the global situation. Draw from your past discussions within the team.
    • Insert stories "from your travels" or from Leaf as appropriate. Keep OPSEC in mind.
    • Keep the crowd engaged.
  • By the end, your fight should be framed as a fight about ideals:
    • Hazou's victory should represent the triumph of humanity, evoking hope and joy.
    • Keiko's victory should represent the triumph of the uncaring world, evoking despair and horror.


Feedback? @MMKII, @faflec?

So, my major point would be to inject some levity into the proceedings, else we bore everyone with all the seriousness.

Examples that come to mind:
  • Hazou jokingly playing up how scary Keiko is. "Why is my sister so scary? And she summons huge armored monsters with claws longer than my arm! How fair is that?"
  • When talking about how the exams are a cooperative event, he could point at where the Kage sit and point out no fights have broken out yet.(Are the Kage sitting in relative proximity? That's the impression I've gotten. Disregard otherwise.)
  • This is pretty important in general when referencing our time as missing-nin, as the subject in general is pretty touchy for all the ninja involved. Stuff like "Simple life advice: Don't go to Snow Country without some warm clothes, even if you've just learned Sealing and think you're a really clever bastard".
  • The point is to establish a contrast, so Hazou should be somewhat facetious against Keiko's unrelenting seriousness.
I'd also add that Hazou should acknowledge that the world isn't easy to change, but that's not a reason to stop trying. And even if it crushes him, he'll keep getting back up until it works.
 
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Really fucking major changes here, so I'm also keeping the original just in case:

  • Pre-match preparations:
    • Make several explosive/storage hybrids (an explosive seal safely attached to a storage seal (with a boulder/log in it).
  • The Pre-Match Speech:
    • Greet the crowd
      • Hey, its me again! Hope you all liked the last fight. Shame about the other guy... he was really tough though! In fact, everyone in this tournament has done a great job, winners and losers alike. I'm glad to be standing here with them. Especially here with Keiko!
      • Anyways folks, I'm the scrappy underdog here so I hope you're all rooting for me!
    • Let Keiko begin her cynicism spiel, likely about how easily she will demolish us or a cold denouncement of our foolish optimism.
      • Listen intently, bright-eyed and with a small smile.
    • Rebuttal:
      • Actually, no. Not a rebuttal. Build up on what she said.
      • Sure, things suck. We might lose, and won't that be humiliating? We might die not having improved any part of humanity, and won't that be sad?
      • But that doesn't mean we should give up, it doesn't mean we aren't going to do everything in our power to change things for the better.
      • I suck at writing speeches, please help.
  • Battle:
    • R1:
      • Supplemental: Substitute into SE Zone.
      • Standard: HLaM. Go underground.
      • Supplemental: Move into SE Wall Zone (still 'underground').
    • R2:
      • Standard: Living Roots.
      • Free (?): Move aboveground into SE Wall Zone, get information on Keiko's actions/location, go back underground.
      • HLaM: Move (underground) underneath Keiko's Zone (if too far, get closer).
      • Supplemental: Palm a hybrid seal.
      • Supplemental: Palm a hybrid seal.
    • R4:
      • HLaM: Emerge aboveground in Keiko's Zone.
      • Supplemental: Pantokrator's Hammer.
      • Supplemental: Equip Pangolin Gauntlets.
      • Standard: Punch.
    • Contingencies:
      • Pangaya: Activate + throw a hybrid seal at Keiko, let Pangaya redirect it at her, let the explosive + oversized object Dispel her.
      • CQC Summon: Keep Summon between Keiko/Hazou, blow it up with explosives while going underground to dodge it, Substitute with an object to get closer to Keiko...
@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail Can a person using HLaM surface completely and then go back underground if the jutsu is still active? Partially? Also, can they HLaM through the walls in the arena?

[X] Action Plan: In Which Our Hero Tries to Assault His Sister

Word count: 214
  • Pre-match preparations:
    • Make several hybrid seals (an explosive seal safely attached to a storage seal, containing a boulder/log).
    • Stuff some of your smelly clothes into multiple easily-accessible storage seals (smelly seal).
    • Get Jiraiya's permission for using Macerators/PMYF.
    • Discuss with Keiko the possibility of her tapping out if we get her, so we don't have to KO her and let it get out that Pangolins go away if Keiko is KO'd.
  • Battle:
    • R1:
      • Supplemental: Substitute into SE Zone.
      • Standard: HLaM. Go underground. Go into SW Wall Zone.
      • Supplemental: Palm a smelly seal.
    • R2:
      • HLaM (free): Move aboveground and get information on Keiko's actions/location.
      • Standard: Living Roots.
      • Supplemental: Move closer to Keiko's Zone.
      • HLaM (free): Go back underground.
      • Supplemental + Free: Activate/drop the smelly seal (underground).
      • HLaM: Move orthogonally towards Keiko's Zone (should be 1 Zone away).
    • R4:
      • HLaM: Move to Keiko's Zone, emerge aboveground.
      • Supplemental: Pantokrator's Hammer.
      • Supplemental: Equip Pangolin Gauntlets.
      • Standard: Punch.
    • Contingencies:
      • Pangaya: Activate + throw a hybrid seal at Keiko, let Pangaya redirect it at her, let the explosive + oversized object Dispel her.
      • CQC Summon: Keep Summon between Keiko/Hazou, blow it up with explosives while going underground to dodge it, Substitute with an object to get closer to Keiko...
      • Pangolin going underground: Alpha blitz Keiko.
      • Keiko riding Pangolin: Help.
 
My final contribution before I go out is that we should start the fight with some spectacular and confusing move that won't serve any purpose but will keep Keiko guessing. Something like unsealing and scattering "seal blanks" everywhere.
 
So, my major point would be to inject some levity into the proceedings, else we bore everyone with all the seriousness.

Examples that come to mind:
  • Hazou jokingly playing up how scary Keiko is. "Why is my sister so scary? And she summons huge armored monsters with claws longer than my arm! How fair is that?"
  • When talking about how the exams are a cooperative event, he could point at where the Kage sit and point out no fights have broken out yet.(Are the Kage sitting in relative proximity? That's the impression I've gotten. Disregard otherwise.)
  • This is pretty important in general when referencing our time as missing-nin, as the subject in general is pretty touchy for all the ninja involved. Stuff like "Simple life advice: Don't go to Snow Country without some warm clothes, even if you've just learned Sealing and thing you're a really clever bastard".
  • The point is to establish a contrast, so Hazou should be somewhat facetious against Keiko's unrelenting seriousness.
I'd also add that Hazou should acknowledge that the world isn't easy to change, but that's not a reason to stop trying. And even if it crushes him, he'll keep getting back up until it works.
Ah, making Hazou even more pleasant and interesting to listen to, as opposed to Keiko's terror and depression? Good idea. Changes made, review:
[x] Speech Plan: The Abject Despair of an Uncaring World
  • Confirm with Keiko beforehand, hash out an outline.
  • Greet the crowd.
    • Assert that, despite everything, you're genuinely enjoying the Exams and everything they represent: international cooperation and diplomacy, a chance to mingle with different cultures and other-minded people.
    • Doesn't that paint a picture of a better possible world?
  • Let Keiko respond.
    • She would likely note that this event is not about cooperation at all: every village still cares only about itself, and Exams only happen because peace and diplomacy are moderately more advantageous than war, at the moment.
    • All peace is volatile, and could never last for long.
  • Continue verbal sparring from there, expanding the ideological conflict from here-and-now to the global situation. Draw from your past discussions within the team.
    • Insert stories "from your travels" or from Leaf as appropriate. Keep OPSEC in mind.
    • Hazou: Inject levity and jokes from time to time, to win the public over.
    • Keiko: Don't get too abstract, be sure to make the grim picture vivid and relatably horrible.
    • Most of all: keep the crowd engaged.
  • By the end, your fight should be framed as a fight about ideals:
    • Hazou's victory should represent the triumph of humanity, evoking hope and joy.
    • Keiko's victory should represent the triumph of the uncaring world, evoking despair and horror.
      • After losing, if possible: Hazou admits that the world isn't easy to change, but that one failure isn't reason to stop trying.

Maybe you could just make another post where you quote those lines yourself and then link to that from the speech plan post?
I've thought about this, but is it really warranted? We're not planning to quote things that explicitly, I think.

@eaglejarl, @Velorien, @OliWhail, would it be helpful to include quotes from past chapters to the speech plan about Keiko vs. Hazou debate? About Uplift/its viability.
 
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...ah shit. CHANGING
Also casting jutsu underground is hit or miss still. Something about dirt interfering with handsigns.

@eaglejarl @OliWhail @Velorien

Has QM opinion on "Casting jutsu underground" solidified at all? IIRC the fluff for HLaM was that it creates some sort of earth chakra effect near your body that causes dirt and rock to act as a fluid. Presumably this would allow for handsigns to be made, unless that was changed?
 
Also casting jutsu underground is hit or miss still. Something about dirt interfering with handsigns.

@eaglejarl @OliWhail @Velorien

Has QM opinion on "Casting jutsu underground" solidified at all? IIRC the fluff for HLaM was that it creates some sort of earth chakra effect near your body that causes dirt and rock to act as a fluid. Presumably this would allow for handsigns to be made, unless that was changed?
I'm casting the jutsu aboveground. My plan specifically has us going aboveground to cast jutsu/seals before going back underground. I'm assuming going above/belowground is a free action, @eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail?

Anyway, changes to make sure we don't seal failure.
@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail Can a person using HLaM surface completely and then go back underground if the jutsu is still active? Partially? Also, can they HLaM through the walls in the arena?

[X] Action Plan: In Which Our Hero Tries to Assault His Sister

Word count: 282
  • Pre-match preparations:
    • Make several hybrid seals (an explosive seal safely attached to a storage seal, containing a boulder/log).
    • Stuff some of your smelly clothes into small porous sacks, and then into multiple easily-accessible storage seals (smelly seal). This may serve to obfuscate our scent and mess with Pangolin tracking.
    • Get Jiraiya's permission for using Macerators/PMYF.
    • Discuss with Keiko the possibility of her tapping out if we get her, so we don't have to KO her and let it get out that Pangolins go away if Keiko is KO'd.
  • Battle:
    • General: Stay out of sight as possible.
    • R1:
      • Supplemental: Substitute into SE Zone.
      • Standard: HLaM. Go underground. Go into SW Wall Zone.
      • Supplemental: Palm a smelly seal.
    • R2:
      • HLaM (free): Move aboveground and get information on Keiko's actions/location.
      • Standard: Living Roots.
      • Supplemental: Move closer to Keiko's Zone.
      • Supplemental: Activate the smelly seal.
      • HLaM (free): Go back underground.
      • Free: Drop smelly clothes (underground).
      • HLaM: Move orthogonally towards Keiko's Zone (should be 1 Zone away).
    • R3 onwards:
      • Keep moving towards Keiko's Zone, dropping smelly clothes along the way. Spend extra Actions on other prep.
    • Round finale:
      • HLaM: Move to Keiko's Zone, emerge aboveground.
      • Supplemental: Pantokrator's Hammer.
      • Supplemental: Equip Pangolin Gauntlets.
      • Standard: Punch.
    • Contingencies:
      • Pangaya: Activate + throw a hybrid seal at Keiko, let Pangaya redirect it at her, let the explosive + oversized object Dispel her.
      • CQC Summon: Keep Summon between Keiko/Hazou, blow it up with explosives while going underground to dodge it, Substitute with an object to get closer to Keiko...
      • Pangolin going underground: Alpha blitz Keiko.
      • Keiko riding Pangolin: Consider ranged options (SotE, Macerators, traps?).
      • Some crazy bullshit we can't beat. Go full defense, try to outlast Keiko's Pangolin. Then punch.
 
I'm casting the jutsu aboveground. My plan specifically has us going aboveground to cast jutsu/seals before going back underground. I'm assuming going above/belowground is a free action, @eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail?

Anyway, changes to make sure we don't seal failure.
I'm confused. There seems to be quite a lot of moving going on there as a free action (it's not being counted in as a supplemental/standard). Why is that?
 
Pfff-hahaha, we're giving @eaglejarl a plan where most of the match will be Hazou and Keiko elaborately arguing with each other, instead of punching. This is hilarious.
 
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