Remove ads

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

Reader mode
Oneiros said:
Ok that's much more reasonable. We still shouldn't have Hazō be a certified seal master because he can just draw kagome seals and sell those
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
He is recognized as a sealmaster, he's obligated. No one cares if he's handing in his own seals, Kagome's seals, or some third party's who he hired to make them for him. Every month, the Tower needs someone to walk in and say "Here are 100 seals from Gōketsu Hazō."

Cariyaga said:
@eaglejarl Does this match Hazou's impression of things? How much could he get for Skywalkers (compared to explosives sold)?

e: Also yes thanks very much for the quick fix.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Skywalkers are a closely-held war secret. Selling them would be treason.

MadScientist said:
I considered that, but then things get even more confusing.

We're basically weapons manufacturers selling high-end gear to a military force.

Why would a government -- a government in a constant state of war, at that -- allow one of their departments to make it more difficult for their military to purchase high-end weapons? Why would a government department want to make it more difficult for the military forces protecting their lives from a constant and very real threat to purchase high-end weapons?

I'm imagining an american government council on metalworking laws putting punitive regulations on missile construction during the cold war, and honestly I am so fricking confused at this mental image.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I have no idea where you're getting any of this and don't really have time to unpack it. It works the way we wrote it: You're taxed 100 explosives per month. You can sell as many as you want. 50% of what you sell must be sold at Tower-specified rate. I have no idea why this strikes you as implausible, but if it does then figure out a solution that satisfies you and let that be your head canon.
 
Is our sealing skill high enough that our 1/3 skill elemental clones could make explosive seal blanks?
 
Last edited:
eaglejarl said:
I have no idea where you're getting any of this and don't really have time to unpack it. It works the way we wrote it: You're taxed 100 explosives per month. You can sell as many as you want. 50% of what you sell must be sold at Tower-specified rate. I have no idea why this strikes you as implausible, but if it does then figure out a solution that satisfies you and let that be your head canon.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

The part I find implausible isn't that the tower taxes people or the specifics of the MC licence, but that we would need an MC licence to sell weapons that civilians can't manufacture (and that do not compete with civilians in any way that I can see) to the military that keeps those civilians safe.

Making it more difficult for the ninja protecting them to purchase fancy seals seems directly against the MC's interests.
 
Last edited:
MadScientist said:
I considered that, but then things get even more confusing.

We're basically weapons manufacturers selling high-end gear to a military force.

Why would a government -- a government in a constant state of war, at that -- allow one of their departments to make it more difficult for their military to purchase high-end weapons? Why would a government department want to make it more difficult for the military forces protecting their lives from a constant and very real threat to purchase high-end weapons?

I'm imagining an american government council on metalworking laws putting punitive regulations on missile construction during the cold war, and honestly I am so fricking confused at this mental image.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

IMO it might make more sense if the Tower was the sole legal direct buyer of seals from sealmasters, and everyone else has to buy directly from them. Accordingly, it would be very illegal for sealmasters to directly sell to anyone else. This would enable the Tower to work with the Merchant Council on pricing, while simultaneously keeping control of who is able to buy certain types of rather dangerous ninja equipment.
 
I wonder if all ninja with a possible production skill have similar taxes? Do Aburame have to provide a certain amount of honey every month?
 
eaglejarl said:
He is recognized as a sealmaster, he's obligated. No one cares if he's handing in his own seals, Kagome's seals, or some third party's who he hired to make them for him. Every month, the Tower needs someone to walk in and say "Here are 100 seals from Gōketsu Hazō."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Well what are the consequences if we don't? Are we fined? Are we thrown in jail? Do we loss the ability to sell seals?

Who enforces this? Are they appointed by the Hokage? Are they independently appointed? How easy would it be to fudge the records? Can we bribe them?

(The last half won't ever be relevant because of hiveminds risk adversion but I'd still like to know)
 
Last edited:
I think 150 total a month (12.5 hours total a month) is completely reasonable and still leaves us ample room to punch the market into the dirt with trivial time investiture.

That Hazou can spend 30 minutes a day before bedtime making seals to deal with this arrangement, and round that out by making seals during mealtime or something, and we still come away with a surplus here, is a pretty good deal.

Hell, Kagome probably spends more than 2 hours a day making explosives.
 
Oneiros said:
And like magic asking about the consequences brings out the risk adversion.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Pointing out that the military dictatorship/elective monarchy is likely going to enact some form of consequences for soldiers who shirk the rules is risk aversion?

That seems like less "risk aversion" and more "stating the glaringly obvious" but call it however you see it.
 
@eaglejarl
Mines probably eat tons of explosion seals, and basically they wouldn't disrupt the economy, because they would still need to process the surplus amount of ore; so what are the rules to selling explosion seals to miners?
 
MadScientist said:
The part I find implausible isn't that the tower taxes people or the specifics of the MC licence, but that we would need an MC licence to sell weapons that civilians can't manufacture (and that do not compete with civilians in any way that I can see) to the military that keeps those civilians safe.

Making it more difficult for the ninja protecting them to purchase fancy seals seems directly against the MC's interests.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I already said that this has nothing to do with the Merchant Council. This is a Tower law. The MC is completely irrelevant to the discussion. The fact that we mentioned this law in the same post as the MC information is irrelevant. The MC is not part of this.

The tax is to ensure that the Tower has a certain number of seals coming in every month. The "sell them, but half of what you sell must be at our rate" is a compromise between the Tower wanting ninja to be able to get explosives and the clans who want to be able to make money off their sealmasters. Is it optimal? Yes, but not necessarily for the criteria that you are judging on. Think "political compromise", "clan privilege", "ego", "back room deals", etc.


Oneiros said:
Well what are the consequences if we don't? Are we fined? Are we thrown in jail? Do we loss the ability to sell seals?

Who enforces this? Are they appointed by the Hokage? Are they independently appointed? How easy would it be to fudge the records? Can we bribe them?

(The last half won't ever be relevant because of hiveminds risk adversion but I'd still like to know)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
fictionfan said:
You don't want to go there. It is a tax. Think about how governments usually enforce taxes. Then remember our unstable former missing nin position.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
This.
 
eaglejarl said:
I have no idea where you're getting any of this and don't really have time to unpack it. It works the way we wrote it: You're taxed 100 explosives per month. You can sell as many as you want. 50% of what you sell must be sold at Tower-specified rate. I have no idea why this strikes you as implausible, but if it does then figure out a solution that satisfies you and let that be your head canon.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

This would make a lot more sense if the tower has the right of first refusal for that 50% sold at a fixed price.

Without that, these just seem like a price fixing half-measure. I mean, otherwise why not just force all sales at a fixed price?
 
Last edited:
eaglejarl said:
Skywalkers are a closely-held war secret. Selling them would be treason.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Nono, I mean, could Hazou sell them to the tower (Or, well, to Jiraiya to purvey to the tower) for more than he'd get for explosive seals, given how valuable a commodity they are? IE: Given how few sealmasters are capable of infusing them, as well as how OPSEC-unfriendly their use is, it seems to me that sealmasters who are in on it could make bank by selling skywalkers to Leaf Ninja Government.
 
eaglejarl said:
I already said that this has nothing to do with the Merchant Council. This is a Tower law. The MC is completely irrelevant to the discussion. The fact that we mentioned this law in the same post as the MC information is irrelevant. The MC is not part of this.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I believe the confusion there wasn't about the tax/quota for the Tower, but the part where we needed to get a MC license in order to sell seals at all when civilians can't make or use them.
 
Last edited:
MadScientist said:
The part I find implausible isn't that the tower taxes people or the specifics of the MC licence, but that we would need an MC licence to sell weapons that civilians can't manufacture (and that do not compete with civilians in any way that I can see) to the military that keeps those civilians safe.

Making it more difficult for the ninja protecting them to purchase fancy seals seems directly against the MC's interests.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

You need a MC license to do any merchanting, because otherwise of course everyone will argue 'oh no the thing I am producing is totally special ninja only thing, don't worry'.

You need to produce seals for the tower whether you're selling seals at all or not, if the tower knows you're a seal master.

The pricing thing is weird but hey I don't expect the village to understand economics very well.
 
Cariyaga said:
Nono, I mean, could Hazou sell them to the tower (Or, well, to Jiraiya to purvey to the tower) for more than he'd get for explosive seals, given how valuable a commodity they are? IE: Given how few sealmasters are capable of infusing them, as well as how OPSEC-unfriendly their use is, it seems to me that sealmasters who are in on it could make bank by selling skywalkers to Leaf Ninja Government.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I understand your point (Sealmasters with Skywalker clearance should be able to sell Skywalkers to the Tower) but dont you think it could just as easily be "Sealmasters with Skywalker clearance are required to donate Skywalker seals to the Tower" ?
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top