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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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MMKII said:
By "Static defenses" I am NOT saying we use these as force blades. These are to protect locations only. As actual walls.
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They're still sharp. Somebody will bump into one in chaos, get beheaded/de-limbed. Hm. I suppose it will be fine as long as we use them for sniper protection only, specifically deactivating them afterwards.

Would this design be acceptable? Do you want it more winding? Give an approximate angle difference, if so.
 
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We need to make sure the path has at least Border: 1. Then a 3 deep area can't be covered in a single turn (would need a 60+ athletics roll to traverse the three zones, and all these folks are rocking a -1.5 AB)

If a straight path is desired
Ranged+Melee on roof.
Melee attack with AoE or use maneuvers to create tags to pass to ranged.
Nobody? can attack from >3 zones away so even ranged folks need to close within the area. Enemy has to move within range with a standard action, so cannot attack and close at the same turn.

Maybe make a straight path with 6 pratfall lines up in a row, and enough impassable areas around the sides to prevent ranged attack from flanks/rear.

From an outsider's perspective, we are hoping to pick off folks as they rush in to us, so they are encouraged to try to rush the path as quickly as possible, getting inside the building or on the roof with us.

As soon as most are in the trapped area, engage pratfalls.
 
faflec said:
TBH I'm questioning whether we even need Force Walls to set up pitfall traps. Couldn't we just dig the pit as normal, but make the upper layer of dirt thick enough to keep it from collapsing in on itself; then use LBF-triggered explosives to trigger the trap?
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Yeah, actually, conventional pit traps seem like a pretty good idea - save the seals (and sealcrafting time) for other stuff (especially since we're going to use plenty of seals setting up the rest of the traps).

Kiba said:
That's assuming perfect execution in the middle of battle where everyone is moving very quickly with absolutely no attempt to disrupt the user.

I assume everyone and everything will be hit and punted at weird angles and directions and speed.
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Anything that hits the ground-based Force Walls is much more likely to destroy them than move them, as I understand their function. Fair point that apparently there's more interest in using them in non-pitfall ways than I'd guessed based on how discussion was going.

I can definitely say that I'm against using them in ways other than pitfalls for this, given the risks and how likely it is someone will do something stupid.
 
Noumero said:
They're still sharp. Somebody will bump into one in chaos, get beheaded/de-limbed. Hm. I suppose it will be fine as long as we use them sniper protection only, specifically deactivating them afterwards.

Would this design be acceptable? Do you want it more winding?
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Re sniper nest forcewall:

Brilliant. WE WILL DEACTIVATE THESE BEFORE THE RETREAT (drop an explosive even before we leave if this needs to be speedy)

TO MINIMIZE LETHALITY.

Thanks! Design looks good.
faflec said:
Underground enemies that wander into the blades?

TBH I'm questioning whether we even need Force Walls to set up pitfall traps. Couldn't we just dig the pit as normal, but make the upper layer of dirt thick enough to keep it from collapsing in on itself; then use LBF-triggered explosives to trigger the trap?
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@Adept_Woodwright is it feasible to do this with dirt or wooden boards? Less optimal but quite feasible. We attach the ninja wire to sticks or something maybe?
 
Oneiros said:
Pointing out people who have incredibly high priors is an important thing to do. note that I am incredibly less risk adverse than the average participant. That is good for people to keep in mind when evaluating discussion
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While recognizing that you hadn't intended it this way: your phrasing strongly suggested that you were attempting to, essentially, put Kiba down in order to make people listen to them less. "Don't listen to them, they never try anything risky" comes off as very dismissive.

E: I'm not sure what phrasing would be better, but one probably exists.
 
Oneiros said:
Pointing out people who have incredibly high priors is an important thing to do. note that I am incredibly less risk adverse than the average participant. That is good for people to keep in mind when evaluating discussion
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You're not trying to point out priors, you're bitching by claiming other people never want to do anything with the slightest amount of risk, ever. You have been consistent in doing this aggravating bullshit and I am fucking sick of it.
 
faflec said:
Underground enemies that wander into the blades?
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They'll be too high for that, I think.
Couldn't we just dig the pit as normal, but make the upper layer of dirt thick enough to keep it from collapsing in on itself; then use LBF-triggered explosives to trigger the trap?
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But what if Sakamoto Shiina's invisible neck happens to be right above the explosive as we're activating it?

I'm not saying underground!FW-beheading and this scenario are exactly as probable, but they're roughly similar in that they're quite unlikely.
 
Adept_Woodwright said:
Force walls won't get displaced at odd angles - if even one tag moves relative to the other, the wall collapses, dirt falls, Goo-bomb goes off. Wood panels would fall, but would likely block the goo-bomb effect.
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Then I must have a different notion of how the pitfall trap actually works. If this is the case, then it removes practically any objections I might have.

Only issue would be someone somehow tunneling very near to the top which would be very unlikely to me. That can easily be solved with a wooden frame around the edge?
 
Noumero said:
They'll be too high for that, I think.

But what if Sakamoto Shiina's invisible neck happens to be right above the explosive as we're activating it?

I'm not saying underground!FW-beheading and this scenario are exactly as probable, but they're roughly similar in that they're quite unlikely.
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I'm...not sure how you're visualizing this? I'm arguing that we have some nonlethal explosives attached to the roof of the pit that detonate when we trigger the LBF (with a string or something, IDK), basically where the Force Wall would have been.

And assuming they're both unlikely...If the Force Wall edge gets someone they're going to be injured or dead, the blade is impossibly sharp. But the Weapons:0 explosive has a far lower chance of getting someone killed.
 
faflec said:
You're not trying to point out priors, you're bitching by claiming other people never want to do anything with the slightest amount of risk, ever. You have been consistent in doing this aggravating bullshit and I am fucking sick of it.
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Apologize. I went ahead and deleted the post. However it's incredibly aggravating to me that any think that is slightly risky is instantly shot down without giving it any actual consideration. It constantly makes me want to quit playing.
 
faflec said:
You're not trying to point out priors, you're bitching by claiming other people never want to do anything with the slightest amount of risk, ever. You have been consistent in doing this aggravating bullshit and I am fucking sick of it.
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Despite frustration levels, can we be polite please? This can be worded in less insulting ways as @Erolki has done.

Kiba said:
@MMKII If you want to use a wall for sniper protection, I suggest air or earth dome.
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The problem is you need to fire these off in a reactive sense where the forcewalls will be already activated.

I think my addition of "WE WILL DEFINITELY TAKE THIS DOWN AFTER THEIR USEFULNESS IS DONE." should alleviate these concerns? The enemy is heavily limited by action economy: our ranged locations are a depth of 2-3 zones in. They cannot penetrate this before we retreat.

I understand your objection re: traps. Im trying to see if we can come up with a workaround.

@Adept_Woodwright Would 1 part goo bomb and 1 part explosive suffice for dispersal purposes? I think this would remove the wooden barrier problem wholesale.
 
eaglejarl said:
Yes, you can shape the wall to a certain degree. Low and flat is certainly an option, as is "with trough in the middle". (EDIT: Provided that the wall is a couple feet wide. The resolution on MEW isn't very good.)



This, exactly.


The incentive is 200 word thresholds with a 3 point base, so:

1-199 words in the plan: +3 XP
200-399: 2 XP
400-599: 1 XP
600-799: 0 XP
800-999: -1 XP
etc
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Should this be 1-200, 201-400, 401-600, etc?
 
Kiba said:
Then I must have a different notion of how the pitfall trap actually works. If this is the case, then it removes practically any objections I might have.

Only issue would be someone somehow tunneling very near to the top which would be very unlikely to me. That can easily be solved with a wooden frame around the edge?
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My understanding is that they're only a few inches under the ground, right?
 
The Force Wall is used because it is just really big, so it's more likely to destabilize someone on top when it goes off - you'd need a lot of dirt to span a 4x4 meter gap with enough strength not to collapse if someone is walking on it.

I've been calling them a pratfall (when I remember to, anyway) to distinguish them from a pitfall. We only want these inches from the surface. Enough for the LBF and camouflage dirt. Anybody on top has a split second of oh-shit freefall, in the middle of which they get splattered with the goo.
 
faflec said:
I'm...not sure how you're visualizing this? I'm arguing that we have some nonlethal explosives attached to the roof of the pit that detonate when we trigger the LBF (with a string or something, IDK), basically where the Force Wall would have been.

And assuming they're both unlikely...If the Force Wall edge gets someone they're going to be injured or dead, the blade is impossibly sharp. But the Weapons:0 explosive has a far lower chance of getting someone killed.
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Well, yes, but what if someone is kneeling next to it, or got pushed into it, or otherwise positioned self relative to the explosive in such a way that it kills them, "training" it is or not? (Or are "nonlethal" explosives actually nonlethal, not just "mostly" nonlethal? If someone puts one in mouth and activates it, will that person survive?)

I'm saying that all our traps could in theory kill someone; some more than others. I'm also saying that FWs in pitfalls pratfalls are about as likely to kill someone as nonlethal explosives, which we directly used in R1 if I recall correctly.
 
MMKII said:
Despite frustration levels, can we be polite please? This can be worded in less insulting ways as @Erolki has done.


The problem is you need to fire these off in a reactive sense where the forcewalls will be already activated.
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So you want our snipers to fire over an invisible wall in the middle of a battle? I don't think it's safe to use because its edge are invisible.

With an air dome and earth dome, you can turn it side way and use it as a wall. It does the same thing except that it's visible and non-sharp.
 
Oneiros said:
Apologize. I went ahead and deleted the post. However it's incredibly aggravating to me that any think that is slightly risky is instantly shot down without giving it any actual consideration. It constantly makes me want to quit playing.
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We are currently making a plan to take out a force 3x (4x if Hyuga's team shows up) our number based on the hope that ISC can run sufficient interference for our advantages (Pangolins, sealmaster) to outweigh their numbers and abilities. This is a risky plan. That we are arguing a part of this plan, which some of us think is risky, does not mean that we don't want anything that is even slightly risky.

And for the record, we have made and agreed up on risky plans in the past. Like the Lizardbreath plan. Yeah, I wasn't fully on board with it because ohgodaieeeeeeee...but it wasn't shut down, it made it through planning, and it did its job just fine. Really risk plan, but wasn't downvoted into oblivion.
 
MMKII said:
Despite frustration levels, can we be polite please? This can be worded in less insulting ways as @Erolki has done.


The problem is you need to fire these off in a reactive sense where the forcewalls will be already activated.

I think my addition of "WE WILL DEFINITELY TAKE THIS DOWN AFTER THEIR USEFULNESS IS DONE." should alleviate these concerns? The enemy is heavily limited by action economy: our ranged locations are a depth of 2-3 zones in. They cannot penetrate this before we retreat.

I understand your objection re: traps. Im trying to see if we can come up with a workaround.

@Adept_Woodwright Would 1 part goo bomb and 1 part explosive suffice for dispersal purposes? I think this would remove the wooden barrier problem wholesale.
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My first thought on this was a bouncing goo Betty, which is what I visualize when I imagine this.

My concern would be the explosive destroying the Goo-tag without it going off. Also would require 6 elements (2xLBF, 1 Goo, 1 Explosive) vs. the base 5 elements.
 
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