Remove ads

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

Reader mode
Vecht said:
If we're broke, then how did we have funds to commission all those statues of the heroes that died at Nagi Island? And what about that massive donation to the clanless orphanage?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Clearly we're trying to expensively signal that we aren't broke with our last savings even though we're clearly broke. Which is... what would be happening, no?
JulieK said:
Kagome already knows about the grue, and chooses not to discuss it. He might torpedo our attempts to expose it.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
That's why Mari is here: hopefully she'll notice that something is wrong and won't follow Kagome's instructions as obediently as Hazou would.
 
Noumero said:
Clearly we're trying to expensively signal that we aren't broke with our last savings even though we're clearly broke. Which is... what would be happening, no?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

No, my point is that we have quite a bit of money. It's just that the clan compound is stupid expensive. If we could get rid of that expense, it would free us up to do all sorts of other things without breaking the bank.
 
OliWhail said:
What about the reference in Mari's info-dump? :V
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
What infodump are you talking about?


Noumero said:
Yes. I was asking if there'll be a timeskip to the Keiko scenes, or if the end of Chapter 267 is the "now", as far as voting is concerned.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think the end of 267 is the now, but it depends on what @Velorien produces.

huhYeahGoodPoint said:
lol imagine having loans

they were either pretty recent, especially with interest, or on the honor of "i'll fucking sack you if you don't repay" iirc

edit: imagine being as confident as this post was in a totally wrong opinion; interest apparently existed, and might've been compounded but probably not continuously compounded.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
They had interest at least a thousand years before some Jewish carpenter got nailed to a tree.


MadScientist said:
KEI: I can't do the finances anymore now that I'm a Nara.
MARI: Don't look at me.
KAGOME: I might be able to figure it out. Eventually.
HAZOU: Well... I guess...
VIHH: Oh ffs, give them here.
HAZOU: What.
VIHH: (pouring over spreadsheets) ...and then we compound that over...
MARI: ...Hazou?
HAZOU: (stares into space for a second then snaps back to lucidity) Done the finances. What's our next problem?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
This made me laugh hard enough to be worth an XP... If only it didn't misspell "poring" which is an Oxford-comma- level pet peeve of mine...
 
I think before we start getting into esoteric scenarios we should figure out who the fuck we owe this money to and whether or not they can be negotiated with, intimidated, manipulated, blackmailed or otherwise open to under the table dealings.

Second, we should see what we can set up as far as solid income streams in the near future.

@Noumero is correct that this doesn't quite supercede our political concerns, but @firestorm440 is also correct that planning for everything to work smoothly here just in the nick of time is the height of folly and naive optimism.
 
Can we start selling the Monkeys nukes for more blood money? With Asuma as the intermediary; he can take 10% for whatever it is he was so desperate to save up on (marriage with Kurenai?). It'll also bind our clans closer together.
 
MMKII said:
I think before we start getting into esoteric scenarios we should figure out who the fuck we owe this money to and whether or not they can be negotiated with, intimidated, manipulated, blackmailed or otherwise open to under the table dealings.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

You know that one rationalist technique where you invert the framing on purchases and then reevaluate them after seeing it from another perspective?

Keeping the clan compound is equivalent to looking at our finances, and then deciding to spend 400k per month for the foreseeable future in exchange for signalling value and not having the discomfort of deciding to do something weird. (Can we buy more or equivalent signalling value for less?)

That is the irrational viewpoint. Considering alternatives to tackling the big glaring urgent issue that is orders of magnitude less important than our other concerns isn't.
 
Last edited:
Noumero said:
Can we start selling the Monkeys nukes for more blood money? With Asuma as the intermediary; he can take 10% for whatever it is he was so desperate to save up on (marriage with Kurenai?). It'll also bind our clans closer together.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We should offer Kurenai an adoption so that marrying her can be a politically valid maneuver on Asuma's part.
 
Last edited:
Is there an Uzumaki clan compound like there was in canon?

Blow our place the fuck up and go live with Naruto.
 
MMKII said:
Is there an Uzumaki clan compound like there was in canon?

Blow our place the fuck up and go live with Naruto.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
No, seriously though.

What about a Senju one?

Neither of them have a need for it if they still have it. Absolutely nobody is going to purchase these megamillion mansion estates if our "Infested by SCP monsters and walking medical slime" house was this expensive.
 
Vecht said:
You know that one rationalist technique where you invert the framing on purchases and then reevaluate them after seeing it from another perspective?

Keeping the clan compound is equivalent to looking at our finances, and then deciding to spend 400k per month for the foreseeable future in exchange for signalling value and not having the discomfort of deciding to do something weird. (Can we buy more or equivalent signalling value for less?)

That is the irrational viewpoint. Considering alternatives to tackling the big glaring urgent issue that is orders of magnitude less important than our other concerns isn't.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Social standing is not liquid like money, and it is irrational to treat it as such. This thread nearly made the same mistake in the Chunin exams when people wanted to throw the exams to go gambling. As a trivial example, consider the classic "but you fuck one goat..." joke.

The clan compound is not a well of "social standing" like a Vespene geyser. It is a basic necessity for having a legitimate claim to clan status.
 
We probably should figure out what A&B rank missions actually pay. If there are some that we could do and it would give us some breathing room or extra money for investments it would be good.
 
firestorm440 said:
Social standing is not liquid like money, and it is irrational to treat it as such. This thread nearly made the same mistake in the Chunin exams when people wanted to throw the exams to go gambling. As a trivial example, consider the classic "but you fuck one goat..." joke.

The clan compound is not a well of "social standing" like a Vespene geyser. It is a basic necessity for having a legitimate claim to clan status.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I'm sorry, no.
  1. Having a clan compound is necessary. Having a clan compound that costs 400k per month is not.
  2. I am not suggesting that we treat social standing as a liquid asset. I am suggesting we game the system to dump our massive financial liability and then use the actual fungible money that saves to help spin the narrative in a way that benefits us despite any detractors. You can in fact buy goodwill.
 
Lailoken said:
We are already approved to sell storage seal variants. Work with Kagome to obfuscate the oil misterator design as much as possible, make them black paper seals, and sell them as Gouketsu-brand superexplosives. After what happened at the exams there's going to be a huge demand for explosive seals, and we have a monopoly on the most explody explosives around.

Ask the pangolins how much they'll buy meat for, and just as importantly a method of storing it perfectly fresh. Get Noburi and Keiko out in the field with a literal army of summons dragging every chakra monster in an area in for draining and processing before moving on. If enough of the pangolins sign on clearing square kilometers an hour should be possible. This also generates XP for Noburi to buy the summoning stunt with.

General arbitrage. We have access to the largest market in the world, with merchants invited in from the world's premier naval trade power. What are the prices of various things on the human path vs the animal path? They almost certainly aren't in sync, which means free money.

Gambling.

Get in touch with the yakuza. Point out that the authoritarian Hyuuga is going to win if votes aren't turned, and oh, hey, here's a clan who would love to vote against them if only their financial troubles were resolved. Would the yakuza happen to know anything about the business interests of major powers in Leaf and/or be willing to make a donation to the "anybody but Hiashi" campaign?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm going to implement most of these plans, with the exception of the gambling/Yakuza parts, since I'm not entirely sure how well we'd be received. Might end up asking Mari's advice, and/or getting her to check said underground before doing it.
Vecht said:
Edits to reduce wordcount. Added a bullet point under misc as my price.

In case you were wondering, I am definitely @Vecht and not @Noumero disguised as @Vecht.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Done :p
MMKII said:
@faflec do they use paper bills or coins here for Ryo? I have a vague recollection of it being paper bills ...
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Serious note: Pretty sure they're coins, since the Mori's entire thing with the Nara and related clans uses coins.
Lord Marshal said:
Considering Keiko is a Nara, and she probably is at Nara compound, could i propose?

-Send Keiko an invite to have lunch with us(With an excuse like "now that you're married we are not going to see you as often, leave us a last lunch all together with you).
-Talk with Mari(With more detail because we have the wordcount to do so)
-Do the things we need to do.
-Then talk to Keiko at lunch all together? And decide all the things we need to do together
-Use the rest of the afternoon to do the things we didn't do and possibly talk to Ino/Choji and so on.

In this way we also have a secure place in which to talk, instead of Shimakamaru House, even better, in this way we should have time-skip, so the time can be used more efficiently.

EDIT:
This way
-One, we leave a clear timeline to follow, so we don't eat unnecessary time
-We talk about the matters of the Clan all together, Keiko included.
-We deal with Mari before dealing with Keiko
-We talk to Keiko all together
-We have the afternoon to do the rest
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm leery of re-adding the Mari section, there were some concerns earlier about us needing to reevaluate her based on the most recent chapter.
MMKII said:
I think before we start getting into esoteric scenarios we should figure out who the fuck we owe this money to and whether or not they can be negotiated with, intimidated, manipulated, blackmailed or otherwise open to under the table dealings.

Second, we should see what we can set up as far as solid income streams in the near future.

@Noumero is correct that this doesn't quite supercede our political concerns, but @firestorm440 is also correct that planning for everything to work smoothly here just in the nick of time is the height of folly and naive optimism.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Added.
faflec said:
[X] Action Plan: The Clan Thing

Word Count: 277
  • Meet with Keiko privately. Reaffirm you're still family. Use CCnJ.
    • You won't ask her to change her decision, but you both could've handled that better. Hazou should've paid more attention to her mental state, and shouldn't have tried to override her when she'd made her decision clear. Keiko shouldn't have presented us with an ultimatum; being a team means trusting each other and working together.
    • IFF she's willing to listen and won't take offense, Hazou has thoughts on salvaging Keiko's relationship with the Pangolins while still ending her selling of Skytowers.
      • Hazou can order Keiko to end the deal, putting the blame on himself.
      • Keiko could tell the Pangolins that for Human Path-related reasons the deal has to be negotiated by the new Toad Summoner.
      • We could sell Pangolins non-combat stuffs, like chakra monster food.
  • Determine the new Clan Treasurer.
    • Problem: The clan's too busy or inexperienced to be Treasurer.
    • Probe Akane's parents and future Uchiha adoptees for the necessary skillset. Broach the idea to the most qualified individuals; ask Keiko to give them lessons.
    • Ask Noburi if his candidates have family with the skillset.
    • Last resort: give Kagome the job.
  • Misc.:
    • You've been forgetful and absent-minded lately. Start a journal, jotting down your activities and mental state throughout the day.
    • Review Jiraiya's notes on politics (Seventh and Human Path) and the local underworld.
      • Check for details on Hagoromo's debts.
    • Enlist Mari's assistance in sending mourning bouquets to families of the fallen.
    • Set up meetings with ISC and Asuma to discuss Hat strategy.
    • Ask Mari who owns our debts, and how open they are to under-the-table dealings.
    • Scribe seals, maximizing 両 earned/hour.
      • Maybe sell oil Macerator-superexplosives?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
 
Vecht said:
I'm sorry, no.
  1. Having a clan compound is necessary. Having a clan compound that costs 400k per month is not.
  2. I am not suggesting that we treat social standing as a liquid asset. I am suggesting we game the system to dump our massive financial liability and then use the actual fungible money that saves to help spin the narrative in a way that benefits us despite any detractors. You can in fact buy goodwill.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

If we could in fact build our own without significant problems why did we originally have to buy one? This is a feudal society in which we are playing as the highest strata, with all of its corresponding social mores, restrictions, and unspoken codes. As much as cheating because ninja is a thing, it's abundantly clear that cheating because ninja is NOT a get out of jail free card for social norms. And gaming social norms is a very different game from gaming numbers.

Cariyaga said:
We also haven't explored the lower levels. Rather explicitly. :p
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

I wonder what we can poke down there :)
 
faflec said:
[X] Action Plan: The Clan Thing

Word Count: 277
  • Meet with Keiko privately. Reaffirm you're still family. Use CCnJ.
    • You won't ask her to change her decision, but you both could've handled that better. Hazou should've paid more attention to her mental state, and shouldn't have tried to override her when she'd made her decision clear. Keiko shouldn't have presented us with an ultimatum; being a team means trusting each other and working together.
    • IFF she's willing to listen and won't take offense, Hazou has thoughts on salvaging Keiko's relationship with the Pangolins while still ending her selling of Skytowers.
      • Hazou can order Keiko to end the deal, putting the blame on himself.
      • Keiko could tell the Pangolins that for Human Path-related reasons the deal has to be negotiated by the new Toad Summoner.
      • We could sell Pangolins non-combat stuffs, like chakra monster food.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Isn't the problem with Keiko mostly about her not communicating? Also, we could apologize for our knee jerk reaction.
 
firestorm440 said:
If we could in fact build our own without significant problems why did we originally have to buy one? This is a feudal society in which we are playing as the highest strata, with all of its corresponding social mores, restrictions, and unspoken codes. As much as cheating because ninja is a thing, it's abundantly clear that cheating because ninja is NOT a get out of jail free card for social norms. And gaming social norms is a very different game from gaming numbers.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
No it's fine, people are all perfectly rational actors who see the world the same way we do, we can just go ahead and take the Snake Scroll without being accused of treason sell our house and move somewhere less expensive and prestigious and it won't effect our legitimacy or signal that we're poor now.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top