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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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Cariyaga said:
Honestly, I don't trust that this is the "extremely bad thing we want to know about".

It strikes me as us pulling a Shikaku.
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I mean this guy accidentally poison bombing us at the wrong time during this conflict would have been like, a critical hit as far as betrayals go.

Oneiros said:
Carrot and the stick. We've shown that we are willing to cooperate and provide assets. But that we also are going to severely punish defectors
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I don't understand how thats not a rephrasing of my original statement. The carrot here is we are willing to assist any village members they have (he's the only one that has one so this is mostly an empty promise.). The stick is we have a giant clawed toolshed sized pile of scaled ready to snap necks at our command.


MadScientist said:
I think we should just keep an eye on him and prepare to K.O. him if he betrays us. Attacking him now makes things worse. Trying to negotiate with a social spec makes things worse.
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I agree that we don't have manpower to spare and that attacking him would probably alienate the Team.
 
You know, if we want to prevent him from betraying with his poison gas AOE jutsu... we could just distribute tunneler's friend and purifiers to our other team members.
 
Even assuming Doigama Emon is planning to betray us, we don't know what he wants. It's easy to think that he might want the other person from his village to get to the tournament, but it could just as easily be that Mist approached him and said 'mess with the Goketsu and we'll give favourable trading rights to Wolf'.

We can't outplay him because we don't know what game he's playing (or, in truth, if he's playing a game at all. He could still be sincere) and we can't afford to remove the threat he poses with extreme prejudice. The only thing we can do is keep an eye on him for the signs of betrayal and be ready to crush him alongside Blue team. Keep our Purifiers on hand and ready for action.
 
MadScientist said:
I think we should just keep an eye on him and prepare to K.O. him if he betrays us. Attacking him now makes things worse. Trying to negotiate with a social spec makes things worse.
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We could do as Dictator4Hire suggests and instead of negotiating with him, make him a representative of his village to us, the hokage's children.
 
Inferno Vulpix said:
Even assuming Doigama Emon is planning to betray us, we don't know what he wants. It's easy to think that he might want the other person from his village to get to the tournament, but it could just as easily be that Mist approached him and said 'mess with the Goketsu and we'll give favourable trading rights to Wolf'.

We can't outplay him because we don't know what game he's playing (or, in truth, if he's playing a game at all. He could still be sincere) and we can't afford to remove the threat he poses with extreme prejudice. The only thing we can do is keep an eye on him for the signs of betrayal and be ready to crush him alongside Blue team. Keep our Purifiers on hand and ready for action.
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While this is true I don't think that Mist would have approached a Wolf-nin with this plan in mind. If anything, they'd have gone after Katō Yūto, the Sky-nin who doesn't expect to make/do well in the tournament, since Katō doesn't have another teammate and is in a similar geographical location to Wolf.

And now let's all go nuts trying to determine if Katō is another traitor.
 
MMKII said:
Shit, we don't know if hes bullshitting us on his skills. He could be full Hanzo build and have toxic sweat or something. How do we deal with this guy?
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We obviously need to, somehow, make it clear to the others that he was planning a betrayal, before taking him down. Ask him pointed questions, utilize Katou for that end... It would be a fine way to confirm that Doigama was in fact planning to betray us, for us.

We have reasons for our suspicions, so let's voice them and trust that our other infiltrator outperforms Doigama. They're unlikely to be in cahoots, even if they're both traitors.

Cariyaga said:
Honestly, I don't trust that this is the "extremely bad thing we want to know about".
It strikes me as us pulling a Shikaku.
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EagleJarl has been vaguely supportive of the idea, in his... usual QM manner. Gave Briefvoice an Insightful and everything. It makes sense given Doigama's speciality, as well as incentives.

I'm not that sure either, but it seems to be our best guess.
Oneiros said:
Any other suggestions of what it might be?
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I made a list here. You can also find Vecht's here. EagleJarl seemed to deny that any of those are correct, though.

Maybe one of them is the positive missed thing, but not the negative one.
 
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Ok, so looking at the map, Wolf country is basically right next door to Water country (Mist's country), so it would make sense that Wolf would be allied with Mist. In which case I think our paranoia might well be justified here.

@eaglejarl, @Velorien, @OliWhail - I imagine we'd know this, but which major villages are Fang, River, Sky, and Wolf, and Rice associated with? (IIRC Rice is neutral, but I want to confirm)
 
faflec said:
I imagine that he can punch the same way Mari-sensei can punch: he learned it as a way to defend himself in case combat actually occurred, but it's not his specialty (thus, he isn't combat spec).
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If you were a conman and there was a chance that your mark would be suspicious of you, wouldn't you bluff and tell him that you are good at punching and have a jutsu that deters people from getting too close? Say, during the team introductions maybe?
 
faflec said:
While this is true I don't think that Mist would have approached a Wolf-nin with this plan in mind. If anything, they'd have gone after Katō Yūto, the Sky-nin who doesn't expect to make/do well in the tournament, since Katō doesn't have another teammate and is in a similar geographical location to Wolf.

And now let's all go nuts trying to determine if Katō is another traitor.
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Roomba said:
I reread the teammate introduction and dialogue, and didn't see anything suspicious. Well, beyond Kato being full social spec and clearly an excellent liar. Still, if he was an enemy agent, volunteering all the information he did wouldn't have been necessary. In principle, since he doesn't care about the results of this event, he'd be the most amenable to being turned, and his espionage specialization also makes him less likely to reject such an offer out of principle. Still, if he were working for Mist, why offer all this information? He could've easily just not said about half of it and we wouldn't have been any wiser. In particular, identifying himself as the person who screwed Hazou last event provides little benefit if he intends to betray us later anyway. It makes sense if he's worried that Shin could reveal it, but that shouldn't be a problem if they're working together.

On the other hand, they've already worked together, and Shin would absolutely figure out (or outright be informed) that we'd get minor village people in our team, and make an offer to Kato in advance. In that view, his behaviour could be seen as being as honest as he can afford to be - the foundation of any good deception. Not sure how we'd approach testing for this, though. If he was going to betray us, how would he do it?

Or maybe, there won't be any betrayal strictly speaking, but the opposing Blue Team has Downfall in it, and they have a pre-arranged way of tracking Kato? In that case, we really want to get a headstart on detecting their approach while we're still locked in place by the proctor.
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Could be. If he's truthful about his chakra reserves (which we can check via Noburi), however, he'd have limited means of acting against us.
 
Noumero said:
Maybe one of them is the positive missed thing, but not the negative one.
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I would bet the farm its the word halves. Its too reasonable to not be the case.

Ughhhhhh I wanted to punch things and not worry about backstabby social-fu nonsense but now we have some more to deal with.
 
Enjou said:
Ok, so looking at the map, Wolf country is basically right next door to Water country (Mist's country), so it would make sense that Wolf would be allied with Mist. In which case I think our paranoia might well be justified here.

@eaglejarl, @Velorien, @OliWhail - I imagine we'd know this, but which major villages are Fang, River, Sky, and Wolf, and Rice associated with? (IIRC Rice is neutral, but I want to confirm)
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Yeah, alright, okay, fair.

Hm. What if Shin talked to Doigama and convinced him that our team was a threat to Wolf's relationship to Mist?

It doesn't necessarily have to be him wanting his fellow Wolf-nin to do well.

...What is their village called, anyway? Village Hidden in the Wolf? :p
 
On the actual punching, I admit I'm leaning more and more towards punching everyone during round 1, stealing their word halves, and using them as leverage to manipulate round 2 into a favourable outcome.
 
We need remote triggered thumbnail-size 500khz 200db Banshees already. I'd like to see anyone betray us then.
 
Cariyaga said:
I mean, it could be something badass like being hidden in the bones of a giant wolf chakra beast.
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I'm not sure whether that classifies as badass or just admits to the fact that they are so weak they lost to the chakra beast and are now living in it.
 
Now I mean, perhaps all of this is paranoia.

If Doigama is suspicious for having one other person from Wolf in the Event, how suspicious are we for having 7 other people from Leaf in the Event?

UPLIFT: It's everyone for themselves; we need to beat the other Leaf teams to win.

DOIGAMA: Exactly how I feel about that other person from Wolf.
 
Briefvoice said:
Now I mean, perhaps all of this is paranoia.

If Doigama is suspicious for having one other person from Wolf in the Event, how suspicious are we for having 7 other people from Leaf in the Event?

UPLIFT: It's everyone for themselves; we need to beat the other Leaf teams to win.

DOIGAMA: Exactly how I feel about that other person from Wolf.
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To be fair we as a whole don't really give a shit save for Team Asuma? Jiraiya has explicitly told us now to bring the hammer down on Team Kurenai at this point.
 
Briefvoice said:
Now I mean, perhaps all of this is paranoia.

If Doigama is suspicious for having one other person from Wolf in the Event, how suspicious are we for having 7 other people from Leaf in the Event?

UPLIFT: It's everyone for themselves; we need to beat the other Leaf teams to win.

DOIGAMA: Exactly how I feel about that other person from Wolf.
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TBF we have political reasons (Hokage's children) to not throw to support our allies, and they should be able to predict this.
 
Briefvoice said:
Now I mean, perhaps all of this is paranoia.

If Doigama is suspicious for having one other person from Wolf in the Event, how suspicious are we for having 7 other people from Leaf in the Event?

UPLIFT: It's everyone for themselves; we need to beat the other Leaf teams to win.

DOIGAMA: Exactly how I feel about that other person from Wolf.
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Frankly, we'll need to talk about this with our teammates anyway, and Doigama's reaction will tell us something. If he doesn't mention the other Wolf ninja unprompted, something's probably afoot.

If our concession towards Team Asuma is going to be leaving their word halves alone, we can do the same for Doigama's compatriot, no big loss.
 
Briefvoice said:
Now I mean, perhaps all of this is paranoia.

If Doigama is suspicious for having one other person from Wolf in the Event, how suspicious are we for having 7 other people from Leaf in the Event?

UPLIFT: It's everyone for themselves; we need to beat the other Leaf teams to win.

DOIGAMA: Exactly how I feel about that other person from Wolf.
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Actually, I'd be upfront about our political motives here - we want Team Asuma to be ok, but we want to punch out Team Kurenai (specifically Hinata). If we want to ask him about his motives, being upfront about ours would work.

I would also state that we're the son of the Hokage and the nephew of the Mizukage, and that the Mizukage has to appear tough on us to appease the hardliners but has other motives to see us succeed.

And if he does want the other Wolf guy to do well, we could maybe negotiate something. Like giving him a number of the word halves we seize from our victims, on the premise they may be worth points.
 
Enjou said:
I would also state that we're the son of the Hokage and the nephew of the Mizukage, and that the Mizukage has to appear tough on us to appease the hardliners but has other motives to see us succeed.
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Are we going to say this in front of the proctor? We aren't allowed to leave her sight and this is something we should be dealing with sooner than later.
 
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