Remove ads

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

Reader mode
If we do a actual plan instead of a interlude, can we finally arrange the Gift Basket so we have it ready for when Ami inevitably appears when we least expect it? IIRC we got PONWOG that we can just put in 'get the gift basket' as a link in the plan, so its no more than a line or two.

The gift basket plan is here:
Buggy said:
[X] Action Plan: Do Other Stuff But Also Welcome Ami Back
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Though maybe I should make a new post so people can add/change their entries if they want.
 
Buggy said:
If we do a actual plan instead of a interlude, can we finally arrange the Gift Basket so we have it ready for when Ami inevitably appears when we least expect it? IIRC we got PONWOG that we can just put in 'get the gift basket' as a link in the plan, so its no more than a line or two.

The gift basket plan is here:

Though maybe I should make a new post so people can add/change their entries if they want.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Hazou cannot interact with the Grue in any meaningful way.

We voted on it.
 
[X][MissingWhen] I want to go missing immediately, in the next day or two at the most
[X][MissingHow] Take a long-term mission so that we are expected to be out of Leaf for a few weeks / months, then don't come back
[X][MissingWho] Modern Team Uplift (Hazō, Kagome, Mari, Kei, Noburi, Yuno)
[X][OrochimaruProcess] Have Orochimaru do the bioseal process that will break Hidan's current tracking lock on Hazō

This is my main center of opinions. I'm flexible on most if not all of these depending on circumstance, but given what we currently know this is what I think is ideal.
 
[X][MissingWhen] I want to go missing immediately, in the next day or two at the most
[X][MissingHow] Take a long-term mission so that we are expected to be out of Leaf for a few weeks / months, then don't come back
[X][MissingWho] Modern Team Uplift (Hazō, Kagome, Mari, Kei, Noburi, Yuno)
[X][OrochimaruProcess] Do not have Orochimaru do the bioseal process that will break Hidan's current tracking lock on Hazō

i just wanna go lol. we've got tons and tons of outside-of-leaf plothooks burning a hole in our back pocket. let's go and get some of them.
 
Kotsuzui Kenji should also have Hazous blood. (Unless I missed a footnote and he just died)

Random people shouldn't be able to just track us. Akatsuki can be very persuasive. /s
 
Left-Hand Mutant said:
Can you explain this one to me?

Going under Orochimaru's knife is a significant risk, and Hidan's blood-tracking only has a ~2km range, if he can even use it without a fresh sample. This looks like a terrible deal to me, am I missing something?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I take it as a given that, once Hidan notices we're gone and petitions Jashin for help, Hidan will be guided in our direction by Jashin. This is not a guarantee, but since I'd rather avoid dying I'm going to assume this is a threat vector we must ward against.

So we have Hidan coming in our direction. Let's be even more careful and suppose he actually intersects our map coordinates no matter what we do (this is a reasonable upper boundary of Jashin's interference, I feel. Jashin may be a "the rest is up to you" sort of god, but I don't put it past him to know where we'll be three days from now and tell Hidan to go in that direction). This means we need to be undetectable when Hidan is right beneath us (modulo whatever skywalking Hidan is doing at the time).

If the blood tracking works, we have to be out of his range even if he's standing right beneath us. This means going up, high up into the troposphere, maybe even to the border of the stratosphere, until we're miles away from him and have a comfortable margin of safety. If Hidan is guided in a specific direction yet does not sense us at our location, he's likely to keep going since he does not doubt Jashin's guidance but also does not seem to gain information more complete than a direction (and with his lackadaisical attitude he doesn't seem inclined to ask for more intel). We're safe, but only if Hazou stays above altitudes that humans can normally survive at. This incurrs a cost, because we'd need to altitude-proof our hidey-hole, requiring a lot of scribing at minimum for active seal life support and perhaps even novel research projects if our current suite proves insufficient. I also don't want to be the first guy to troubleshoot all these extremophile problems for the very first time without IC knowledge ahead of time about what we'll have to handle. It's not a death sentence, but it's a mess.

(And I know that Hazou will spend a lot of his time on 7Path, and thus away from Hidan's blood-sensing. I again point to the principle of caution listed above and say that we must assume Hidan reaches our map coordinates when we are on the Human Path.)

Contrast if the blood tracking no longer works. We only need to be properly camoflauged from Hidan, since if he cannot blood-sense us and cannot see us then he has no reason to believe we are here and will keep going along his Jashin-ordained line waiting for one of those facts to change. (Again, pointing at his lackadaisical nature, he is not likely to second-guess this route until it becomes abundantly clear that he missed us, far far away from us. Even with more suspicion, he still has no way to discern where along the line he traveled we are, or if we're still there now that he missed us and gave us time to leave, even under the generous assumption that Jashin led him directly on a route to intersect our then-current hidey-hole). We can hide at more survivable altitudes, requiring less work to sustain and giving our people more freedom to enact our other goals.

The consequence, of course, is what Orochimaru will do to us during the surgery. I do agree with the sentiment that it's functionally inevitable he will install some sort of countermeasure against us for the eventuality where we become enemies (say, a kill-switch that he needs only activate a certain jutsu to use). I'm... not actually all that worried about that? We just had a talk with Orochimaru about killing essies, and how the only sensible way to do that is from a great distance through indirect-yet-incredibly-potent means without them even knowing they are being targetted. The set of events where we face Orochimaru in a direct showdown and are thus crippled by such a killswitch is, in my opinion, negligible. And more broadly, while I do think Orochimaru would install a kill-switch like that (or at least that we would have to assume he did, and thus act with the assumption that it's there), it does appear that Orochimaru prides himself on being a fair dealer. I don't think we will have to worry about him installing "come for repeat surgeries every month or die" gotchas when (IIRC) he already said that the procedure does not involve anything of the sort. My expectation is that we will come out of the surgery with only one negative externality that in practice has negligible impact.

That little, in exchange for making our margins of safety much better, for giving us more freedom to do the missing-nin adventures we need to get what we need to achieve our goals? It sounds like a good deal to me.
 
[X][MissingWhen] I want to go missing immediately, in the next day or two at the most
[X][MissingWhen] I want to go missing but not until certain things have happened
[X][MissingWho] Modern Team Uplift (Hazō, Kagome, Mari, Kei, Noburi, Yuno)
[X][OrochimaruProcess] Have Orochimaru do the bioseal process that will break Hidan's current tracking lock on Hazō
[X][MissingHow] Take a long-term mission so that we are expected to be out of Leaf for a few weeks / months, then don't come back
 
Inferno Vulpix said:
I take it as a given that, once Hidan notices we're gone and petitions Jashin for help, Hidan will be guided in our direction by Jashin. This is not a guarantee, but since I'd rather avoid dying I'm going to assume this is a threat vector we must ward against.

So we have Hidan coming in our direction. Let's be even more careful and suppose he actually intersects our map coordinates no matter what we do (this is a reasonable upper boundary of Jashin's interference, I feel. Jashin may be a "the rest is up to you" sort of god, but I don't put it past him to know where we'll be three days from now and tell Hidan to go in that direction). This means we need to be undetectable when Hidan is right beneath us (modulo whatever skywalking Hidan is doing at the time).

If the blood tracking works, we have to be out of his range even if he's standing right beneath us. This means going up, high up into the troposphere, maybe even to the border of the stratosphere, until we're miles away from him and have a comfortable margin of safety. If Hidan is guided in a specific direction yet does not sense us at our location, he's likely to keep going since he does not doubt Jashin's guidance but also does not seem to gain information more complete than a direction (and with his lackadaisical attitude he doesn't seem inclined to ask for more intel). We're safe, but only if Hazou stays above altitudes that humans can normally survive at. This incurrs a cost, because we'd need to altitude-proof our hidey-hole, requiring a lot of scribing at minimum for active seal life support and perhaps even novel research projects if our current suite proves insufficient. I also don't want to be the first guy to troubleshoot all these extremophile problems for the very first time without IC knowledge ahead of time about what we'll have to handle. It's not a death sentence, but it's a mess.

(And I know that Hazou will spend a lot of his time on 7Path, and thus away from Hidan's blood-sensing. I again point to the principle of caution listed above and say that we must assume Hidan reaches our map coordinates when we are on the Human Path.)

Contrast if the blood tracking no longer works. We only need to be properly camoflauged from Hidan, since if he cannot blood-sense us and cannot see us then he has no reason to believe we are here and will keep going along his Jashin-ordained line waiting for one of those facts to change. (Again, pointing at his lackadaisical nature, he is not likely to second-guess this route until it becomes abundantly clear that he missed us, far far away from us. Even with more suspicion, he still has no way to discern where along the line he traveled we are, or if we're still there now that he missed us and gave us time to leave, even under the generous assumption that Jashin led him directly on a route to intersect our then-current hidey-hole). We can hide at more survivable altitudes, requiring less work to sustain and giving our people more freedom to enact our other goals.

The consequence, of course, is what Orochimaru will do to us during the surgery. I do agree with the sentiment that it's functionally inevitable he will install some sort of countermeasure against us for the eventuality where we become enemies (say, a kill-switch that he needs only activate a certain jutsu to use). I'm... not actually all that worried about that? We just had a talk with Orochimaru about killing essies, and how the only sensible way to do that is from a great distance through indirect-yet-incredibly-potent means without them even knowing they are being targetted. The set of events where we face Orochimaru in a direct showdown and are thus crippled by such a killswitch is, in my opinion, negligible. And more broadly, while I do think Orochimaru would install a kill-switch like that (or at least that we would have to assume he did, and thus act with the assumption that it's there), it does appear that Orochimaru prides himself on being a fair dealer. I don't think we will have to worry about him installing "come for repeat surgeries every month or die" gotchas when (IIRC) he already said that the procedure does not involve anything of the sort. My expectation is that we will come out of the surgery with only one negative externality that in practice has negligible impact.

That little, in exchange for making our margins of safety much better, for giving us more freedom to do the missing-nin adventures we need to get what we need to achieve our goals? It sounds like a good deal to me.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I disagree with your conclusions(you weight oro killswitch way to low), assumptions(assuming jashin won't give precise location), and analysis(Hidan will be paired with either Deidara, who we can take, or Itachi/Kisami who can sense the chakra in our camouflage seals), but thank you for explaining.
 
Left-Hand Mutant said:
I disagree with your conclusions(you weight oro killswitch way to low)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
...but I agree it'll happen? I just don't think it's that big a deal.
assumptions(assuming jashin won't give precise location)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
This isn't really an Orochimaru question then, because if the Akatsuki can find us no matter what we do then we just die no matter what. If this is your world-model, the Orochimaru question is moot because we can't afford to go missing at all.
Deidara, who we can take
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
???????
Itachi/Kisami who can sense the chakra in our camouflage seals
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I don't believe either of their chakra-sensing is a long-range passive effect the way Hidan's is. Itachi isn't going to be turning on his Sharingan and staring up at the sky for the entire trip across the continent as he follows Hidan's path, and Kisame I don't recall anything that suggests his chakra-sensing is that sophisticated.

You have to remember what the threat profile is. Assuming Hidan doesn't get our exact location for free (in which case we do not even have this conversation because they've already won and we may as well give up and putter around with infrastructure projects forever), they will be covering a large range of possible locations and cannot examine each and every spot in detail. Hidan's tracking is so powerful because he doesn't need to ration it out, waiting until he's found a promising spot before flaring his senses and using his limited resources trying to find us. Itachi cannot be staring at the sky with his Sharingan on indefinitely, so he'll only be using them to look for us when he has a reasonable suspicion we are already in sight-range, which we won't give him if Hidan's already-OP passive senses can't find us.
 
Inferno Vulpix said:
I don't recall anything that suggests his chakra-sensing is that sophisticated.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Paperclipped said:
His sensory techniques particularly impressed me. He exceeds even me in that regard – he has near-theoretically perfect vision, hearing, and smell. He can separately sense water and chakra around him to a massive range, making him an exceptionally powerful blindfighter and exceedingly difficult to evade. Frustratingly, he can also avoid chakra sensing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Paperclipped said:
Of course, his chakra sensing is not truly his own. In truth, Kisame represents not one member of Akatsuki, but two. His weapon, Samehada, is no mere weapon crafted from chakra metal. It is a genuine relic from the age of the old gods. Uniquely, it is sentient and likely sapient of its own right, though I am unsure how long its memory stretches into the past. It would not surprise me if Kisame had, over his decades by Samehada's side, learned ancient secrets and techniques from it. At the bare minimum, bonding with the weapon has expanded his chakra reserves further, granted him the ability to sense and drain chakra, and massively improved his physical resilience, even including minor regeneration. I suspect Samehada itself acts like a second mind for Kisame in combat, indicating threats and analyzing enemy techniques while he is preoccupied with fighting, though I have no evidence for such. The weapon has native chakra drain of its own that is far, far more powerful than any bloodline ability – to the point that ninjutsu are destroyed with a single swipe of the weapon, and even jinchūriki can be drained unconscious in less than ten seconds. While called a sword, the weapon is really more of a club. Specifically, a club made out of several dozen sharks fused together. Yes, this is absurd. It is also reality.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Kisame is bullshit.
 
Inferno Vulpix said:
...but I agree it'll happen? I just don't think it's that big a deal.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I understand you, I think an Oro killswitch is a big deal, and you're way to dismissive about it.
"it weights heavily on the scales"

Inferno Vulpix said:
This isn't really an Orochimaru question then, because if the Akatsuki can find us no matter what we do then we just die no matter what. If this is your world-model, the Orochimaru question is moot because we can't afford to go missing at all.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I do think it's likely we'll have to fight an Akatsuki pair eventually, with or without Blood-surgery.
Thus urgent need for time chamber, runic defences, akatsuki-specific countermeasures, ect.

Inferno Vulpix said:
???????
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Deidara is enormously vulnerable to being killed by an invisible flying ranged-attacker, and he has only one good attack. Anti-explosion seals neuter him, and Kei/Snowflake can kill him even without.
FSB also makes defending against is bombing more feasible.
Also if Hidan+Deidara show up, Hazou+Kagome get to roll the best socials ever.
 
Left-Hand Mutant said:
I understand you, I think an Oro killswitch is a big deal, and you're way to dismissive about it.
"it weights heavily on the scales"


I do think it's likely we'll have to fight an Akatsuki pair eventually, with or without Blood-surgery.
Thus urgent need for time chamber, runic defences, akatsuki-specific countermeasures, ect.


Deidara is enormously vulnerable to being killed by an invisible flying ranged-attacker, and he has only one good attack. Anti-explosion seals neuter him, and Kei/Snowflake can kill him even without.
FSB also makes defending against is bombing more feasible.
Also if Hidan+Deidara show up, Hazou+Kagome get to roll the best socials ever.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Honestly, I want Kagome to send Deidara fan-mail, just to try to ensure that he joins the eventual hunter-team.

It gives us social options, and with research, we could actually win that fight, and then their tracker is dead.
 
_The_Bomb said:
Wow, I can't wait for Ino to be tortured to death.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I can't wait for Itachi to butcher his way through all the named Goketsu civilians claiming to be looking for one that might have an inkling of an idea of where Hazou went off to, knowing full well that none of them would have any idea and that the entire massacre was to a) calm his raging fury; b) serve as a message to Hazou; and c) show everyone that the Goketsu bailed on everyone when it came down to it.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top