- Location
- United States
I interpreted that to mean he intended to sleep with his girlfriends before lunch, which he would then confess to after everything is over.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
-
- Tags
- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
He doesn't need to be married to Kumokogo to enter Arachnid territory, just to view the Great Seal.
Iris-Iven-Ibis
Interested-Idiot-Immortal
- Location
- You know
[III] Action Plan: Not Actually A Fleshed Out Action Plan
Someone @ me when we get the finalized version of this plan
Someone @ me when we get the finalized version of this plan
Last edited:
- Location
- The Soviet Republic of Canuckistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I've now also pointed out that even if we die, Orochimaru lives. That's a problem for them, and he's going to find out that they were serious about this Rift thing.
You misspelled 'makes clear that we understand the realities of the situation and that Itachi is also obviously aware of those same realities'.
Put another way: what am I saying that isn't painfully obvious? What am I saying that hasn't been painfully to the Akatsuki at large since they found out we visited the Rift?
I think it's far from guaranteed that we'll be ordered to do this—living in an Akatsuki world seems plausibly safer for Leaf than a desperate attempt to kill them. And if we were ordered to do this, I think we should just refuse to cooperate. Getting killed by Akatsuki and taking most of Leaf with us (they would inflict reprisals) is not actually better than getting killed by the Hokage, if they were even willing to push us that far. Orochimaru isn't guaranteed to cooperate either.
I don't think this is true. They would still try to recruit Hazō for the extra help even if they thought they could do it without him. Also, why are you so confident Sasori won't be able to replicate our results? We've gotten like 1/4 of the way to figuring out necromancy, the results themselves aren't even that spectacular, he has all of our notes, and his stats are probably high enough to do the research himself.
They can't guarantee it, but they don't need certainty. And Itachi was just talking about how if the world was to see true peace, it couldn't come from killing. They could kill us to guarantee Leaf won't close or open the rift, but they don't want to and they don't need that guarantee.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Though the punishment for divorce is exile, but maybe there's an exception in wartime or somesuch
[X] Yes
[X] An Interview With Akatsuki
[X] Action Plan: Not Actually A Fleshed Out Action Plan
Same as above, it would be nice to know if someone fleshes out the Plan that is [Yes + Reveal lithosealing to get Itachi to listen to the suggestion to try and work out a 3rd non-betrayal option]
[X] An Interview With Akatsuki
[X] Action Plan: Not Actually A Fleshed Out Action Plan
Same as above, it would be nice to know if someone fleshes out the Plan that is [Yes + Reveal lithosealing to get Itachi to listen to the suggestion to try and work out a 3rd non-betrayal option]
Last edited:
- Location
- Fifth Dimension
Yes but in the same way, you don't tell the guy with a gun trained on you "You know I can always after you and oppose you, right? Like as soon as you leave?" Like yes, it's a known thing, a possibility even, but you don't say it and provoke them into attacking you. It's asking to die.
- Location
- U.S.
I appreciate the vote of confidence, but that is intended as a outline for a plan, not a plan itself. I would need help with optimizing it towards being a actual conversation with Itachi, remove all the notes in the plan that are intended for the people reading it, par down the word count a lot, solidfy the if-statements, etc.
Last edited:
Yup its one big "What are you gonna do, shoot me?"
- Location
- The Soviet Republic of Canuckistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
If Itachi is going to kill us unless we come with him that decision has already been made and any move short of leaving with him right now will result in our death.
If he entered this conversation serious about letting us leave alive he did so with the full awareness of everything I say.
Under which plausible circumstances (the Akatsuki have discussed this at length over a period of weeks, Itachi acts rationally) do you think that part of my plan would make a difference? Again, Itachi isn't going to kill us right now in a fit of pique - not for stating the obvious, anyway.
The decision as to whether or not we'll be shot has already been made. Discussing the relevant factors sets up the pitch, as we're making it clear to him that if our options are join and die, we pick death, which is an outcome he seemingly wants to avoid.
Last edited:
- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
I wish we had discussed our exfiltration and how we could keep our family safe despite it more. Like, clearly Itachi's plan is to fake either our death or our abduction. But which of the two was he going for? And does he have any idea how to prevent our family, and especially Kagome, from going Pretty Damn Far™ to rescue/avenge us?
Ah well, it's too late to ask now and have that influence my vote. We can't delay our final answer by another chapter. So I will have to default to no.
Okay then. Next step is full disclosure to Tsunade, though maybe leaving out the part where we genuinely considered going with Itachi. Just a full report on necromancy and the importance of those "dimensionalism sealing notes, lithosealing and the advantage it might give us over Akatsuki, and everything Itachi revealed about Akatsuki's plans and goals.
Actually, first we should check what's missing from our sealing notes and whether Itachi grabbed more than he should. And check on Kagome to see of he's okay. And discuss everything with Mari, Kei and Snowflake.
Though again, maybe we shouldn't even tell them how close we came to abandoning them. In fact, we maybe should have Hazō rationalize that the reason he stayed was that he couldn't possibly abandon his family/Clan/friends/village. Hazō believing that seems much better than trying to succeed in social rolls. He can just retroactively believe that his conversation with Itachi was more about keeping things apparently cordial with Akatsuki by using the Dragonwar as a valid excuse to stay.
Anyway, after all that and briefing Tsunade, we the players have to pick our path forward concerning necromancy. Do we concede to, race, or sabotage and assassinate, or outright oppose Akatsuki by forming an alliance of the rest of the world against them? But I'm sure that any decision regarding such a path will be influenced by Hokage Tsunade's opinion on it.
And then the next big decision is how much we collaborate with Orochimaru. If we choose any path other than conceding, we might want to fully disclose both necromancy and lithosealing to him. Or we might not, because he seems worse than Akatsuki in some ways. But if we ally with neither Akatsuki nor Orochimaru on this then our path forward seems truly hard.
You literally spell it out repeatedly to Itachi. He can't keep Leaf from interfering except by killing Hazō. Even though Hazō could keep Leaf from interfering very easily, because Leaf doesn't even know that it should interfere without him telling them to, let alone have any tools to do so effectively.
So Itachi has two choices. Risk everything and subordinate not just Akatsuki, but Saint Nagato himself to a council of bickering idiots who mostly hate each other. Or just kill a punk whose sealing notes he already has.
I guess maybe, maybe, we can mitigate the suicidality of your plan by a) being much more respectful, b) actually offer him something in return for letting us live, and c) believably revealing that we have cracked 3D sealing (but not necessarily how we did that).
Ah well, it's too late to ask now and have that influence my vote. We can't delay our final answer by another chapter. So I will have to default to no.
Okay then. Next step is full disclosure to Tsunade, though maybe leaving out the part where we genuinely considered going with Itachi. Just a full report on necromancy and the importance of those "dimensionalism sealing notes, lithosealing and the advantage it might give us over Akatsuki, and everything Itachi revealed about Akatsuki's plans and goals.
Actually, first we should check what's missing from our sealing notes and whether Itachi grabbed more than he should. And check on Kagome to see of he's okay. And discuss everything with Mari, Kei and Snowflake.
Though again, maybe we shouldn't even tell them how close we came to abandoning them. In fact, we maybe should have Hazō rationalize that the reason he stayed was that he couldn't possibly abandon his family/Clan/friends/village. Hazō believing that seems much better than trying to succeed in social rolls. He can just retroactively believe that his conversation with Itachi was more about keeping things apparently cordial with Akatsuki by using the Dragonwar as a valid excuse to stay.
Anyway, after all that and briefing Tsunade, we the players have to pick our path forward concerning necromancy. Do we concede to, race, or sabotage and assassinate, or outright oppose Akatsuki by forming an alliance of the rest of the world against them? But I'm sure that any decision regarding such a path will be influenced by Hokage Tsunade's opinion on it.
And then the next big decision is how much we collaborate with Orochimaru. If we choose any path other than conceding, we might want to fully disclose both necromancy and lithosealing to him. Or we might not, because he seems worse than Akatsuki in some ways. But if we ally with neither Akatsuki nor Orochimaru on this then our path forward seems truly hard.
This sounds cool and all, but my read of it is that in the end its just a very wordy suicide plan.
You literally spell it out repeatedly to Itachi. He can't keep Leaf from interfering except by killing Hazō. Even though Hazō could keep Leaf from interfering very easily, because Leaf doesn't even know that it should interfere without him telling them to, let alone have any tools to do so effectively.
So Itachi has two choices. Risk everything and subordinate not just Akatsuki, but Saint Nagato himself to a council of bickering idiots who mostly hate each other. Or just kill a punk whose sealing notes he already has.
I guess maybe, maybe, we can mitigate the suicidality of your plan by a) being much more respectful, b) actually offer him something in return for letting us live, and c) believably revealing that we have cracked 3D sealing (but not necessarily how we did that).
Itachi could just be trusting Hazō to not do the thing. That's what Itachi is essentially saying. "You are the only person who can do the thing we don't want you to do. Normally that means I should kill you. But you seem to be sensible (as I define it) so I'll just tell you not to do the thing. But if you do do the thing, then we'll kill you after all."
- Location
- The Soviet Republic of Canuckistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I'll edit my plan to ask if this is what he's counting on. If it is, then I'll remove the relevant sections, or somehow gate them.
Its not too late though, it was even quite explicitly stated near the end of the chapter - Hazoupilot thinks revealing Lithosealing would certainly make a difference and give us a way to continue the conversation, and iirc we were planning to do that anyway, in the meeting with Sasori, if we joined. Maybe if we do this we can even pull Ami into the talk and figure out a way to make this work without putting our family / clan in jeopardy.
Last edited:
- Location
- Fifth Dimension
I feel like it's just a risk that is highly unnecessary. I can think of plenty of situations where Itachi was keen on leaving Hazou alive but hearing what is said in your plan, now makes him feel as if he needs to kill Hazou. He could interpret it as:
1. Hazou's right, until he's dead, it's always a risk. Just kill him.
2. Hazou is saying implicitly that he is going to resist us and be our enemy. In that case, the same way he is valuable as an ally, is he dangerous as an enemy, kill him.
3. Hazou dares to take his mercy as weakness. He doesn't actually learn, best to simply kill him.
4. Hazou is actually threatening Akatsuki. He must be dealt with.
There's no reason to even say that we will oppose him. It brings no benefits and only brings ire.
I *mostly* agree with this, but want to propose changes.
Point out that Itachi himself is approaching this from a framework that treats us as hostiles, not comrades(no dog scroll, ect.)
This is a BIG ask. It's likely Itachi will dismiss it out of hand because "Hazou isn't worth that much". Maybe let him know that we aren't the second-best sealmaster in leaf. We don't know how good Sasori is, but we're pretty sure our sealing skill is better than Orochimaru but worse than Jiraiya.
If Itachi won't discuss this collaboratively with Ami and Tsunadae present, STAY IN LEAF.
Last edited:
Hm, come to think of it, couldnt we go full on good will and share 3D Sealing lore in good faith? Then explain that we are currently severely injured and it will interfere greatly in our Sealing capabilities for the next 2-3 months so we wouldnt be of much use in joint research with Sasori at the moment? Plus yesterday's mess in Leaf and the Conclave and the fate of our clan if we were to disappear has us worried? Then suggest that perhaps in three months once the situation has calmed down a bit would be a much better time for cooperation, and maybe it wouldnt have to be treason then, plus it would give us time to settle the Dragonwar etc. Essentially give them a huge free candy and leave the door open in the future, that'd have very little drawbacks but many positives. Honestly, we were planning on showing 3D Sealing to Asuma anyway and Orochimaru will develop the tech in a couple months or so regardless, so it wouldn't be that big a deal for us to share it, everyone but us would be starting from scratch anyway, and we're less stagnated than essies. And with the events being as they are? We cant independently research the Rift, we are not going to singlehandedly rule the world so helping Akatsuki to Pain is not bad, especially with an Apocalypse breathing down our necks - and they would be grateful.
Not saying its a good idea, just thinking about options for building friendly ties with Akatsuki, which seems like a great idea as far as I can see, and I think the above might be a genuine option.
Or we could invite Sasori to Leaf instead of going to Rain haha (this one is a no-go probably).
Not saying its a good idea, just thinking about options for building friendly ties with Akatsuki, which seems like a great idea as far as I can see, and I think the above might be a genuine option.
Or we could invite Sasori to Leaf instead of going to Rain haha (this one is a no-go probably).
Last edited:
I want to say no to Itachi, and I don't like FS' plan, so here's what I've got. Feedback welcome if you think there's something else it's important to include.
[X] Action Plan: Politely Decline
Word Count: <300
[X] Action Plan: Politely Decline
Word Count: <300
- Decline Itachi's Offer
- Our work on the dragonwar is too important
- Offer to arrange parley with Enma.
- He considers the dragonwar an existential threat. All options are on the table
- Ask Itachi to talk to Karanium about approaching the Arachnids
- Debrief with Tsunade
- Tell her everything about the meeting with Itachi and anything she wants to know about necromancy
- If she suspects/accuses us of treason
- We are not willing, and were never willing, to betray Leaf to join the Akatsuki
- We wanted to
- Not get killed by Itachi
- Give a sufficiently good reason to decline without getting killed
- Get information about Akatsuki's short and long-term plans without getting killed
- Check what notes Itachi took
Last edited:
I could've sworn that it was Ami who originally brought Karusu seals up as a hook for Hazou. That may have been a ploy for something else, but still interesting lore.
Don't remember that being in the plan...interesting that Hazou-Pilot brought it up.