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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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faflec said:
I wrote the plan and if anytHING GOES WRONG ITS MY FAULT AHHHHHHHHHHHHH
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You should really try to get over this. The plans are a collective endeavour and collective responsibility. Every person who votes for your plan instead of writing their own takes on an equal share of responsibility for making sure it's good enough and has no mistakes.

ContextBot said:
You make a number of really safe updates with extra xp and give us a sense of safety and security and then BAM Zaubuza Edo Tensei Zabuza!
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What makes you think Zabuza is dead? The only person who knows for sure, by virtue of being the one to fight him, is currently (probably) miles away in an Akatsuki hideout.

faflec said:
Though this may be just to make the fight scene cooler.
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I see you have discovered the foundational logic behind all canonical taijutsu, ninjutsu and genjutsu mechanics (among others).
 
Velorien said:
What makes you think Zabuza is dead? The only person who knows for sure, by virtue of being the one to fight him, is currently (probably) miles away in an Akatsuki hideout.
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Didn't Jiraiya stay behind after the fight to seal away the dead/get clues? Wouldn't he be very much willing to seal the corpses of Mei and Zabuza, who were really powerful ninja, as proof of their demise?
 
MadScientist said:
WHAT.

This changes EVERYTHING.

We need to purchase this jutsu and the right to hack it. Safe mental enhancements are the holy grail of most settings, including this one.
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Arguably that jutsu should help with infusion, because Hazou noticed the sealing failure, if he reacted faster nothing would have happened.

faflec said:
Didn't Jiraiya stay behind after the fight to seal away the dead/get clues? Wouldn't he be very much willing to seal the corpses of Mei and Zabuza, who were really powerful ninja, as proof of their demise?
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You see, Jiraiya was so distraught by Sarutobi's death that he forgot to check.
 
So, you know, that lightning jutsu. Theoretically, if Shadow Clone were to allow one to use elemental jutsu (which I'm pretty sure it does canonically)... just imagine what would happen if Naruto got access to it.
 
faflec said:
Didn't Jiraiya stay behind after the fight to seal away the dead/get clues? Wouldn't he be very much willing to seal the corpses of Mei and Zabuza, who were really powerful ninja, as proof of their demise?
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Jiraiya said he'd retrieved the bodies of the Leaf dead, but didn't say anything about the Mist ones. For all you know, he never found Zabuza's body and assumed Naruto had blown it up.
 
Velorien said:
I see you have discovered the foundational logic behind all canonical taijutsu, ninjutsu and genjutsu mechanics (among others).
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Wait. MfD!Canonical?

MadScientist said:
I fully approve.



Let's talk about what the current paradigm is, before attempting to throw it out of a window.

  1. Some people (ninja) have useable chakra. Others (civilians) do not.
  2. Ninja can use chakra to enhance their physical abilities, but not their mental abilities.
  3. Ninja can use chakra to befuddle another person's senses (genjutsu), but not to affect their minds in other ways (barring very rare "utter bullshit"-tier techniques like Kotoamatsukami).
  4. Ninja can use chakra to heal others, but not significantly better than IRL modern medicine can.
  5. Ninja can utilise techniques based on fire, water, earth, lightning, and wind, though aquiring multiple elements is difficult.
  6. Ninja can utilise non-elemental techniques based on yin and yang chakra, but these seem either very basic (henge, substitution) or rare (shadow clone, needle jīzo).
  7. Some ninja have innate ninjutsu encoded into their biology (bloodline limits). Most do not.
  8. Ninja tend to operate in teams of three to ten. Smaller or larger groups are rare.
  9. The tech level is pre-industrial. Machinery is rare and expensive cutting-edge tech.
  10. Ranged weapons are either thrown or archery-based.
  11. Mechanised cavalry is non-existant.
  12. Ninja tend to be squishy. Defensive techniques are rare. Elemental defensive techniques can be countered by 20% of elemental ninjutsu.
  13. Ninja are highly mobile to compensate for their squishiness. They run fast, but with rare exceptions (now including all of Leaf), cannot fly or teleport.
  14. Permanent resurrection doesn't seem to exist.
  15. Most ninja are subject to ageing.
  16. Sealing research is dangerous.
  17. Learning Sealing is difficult.
  18. Sealing knowledge cannot be passed on perfectly between sealmasters due to everyone using a different sealing language.
I'm sure I could go into more detail, but I think that's enough to be getting on with.

I think we might want to research seal equivalents of the Simple Machines (pulleys, levers, etc.) that we can then build more complicated seal machines out of. Seals like
  • Activate the next seal along the chain after x seconds.
  • Stop the next seal along the chain from activating.
  • Apply x Newtons of force in y direction.
  • Change the angular momentum of the connected object by x amount.
  • Change the temperature of the connected object by x amount.
  • Change the speed of the connected object by x amount.
  • Store "0" or "1" until you have chakra flow into you, in which case flip your stored bit.
  • Check the stored bit of the connected seal and output chakra flow if it's "1".
Really simple things that can be used as standardised parts.
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Your paradigm stuff is great, but I think there's more Simple Machines than the ones we have in our no chakra universe.
I'd add to the list:
  • Create [any] Elemental Chakra
  • Put X in Y space
  • Retrieve X from Y space
 
Velorien said:
Jiraiya said he'd retrieved the bodies of the Leaf dead, but didn't say anything about the Mist ones. For all you know, he never found Zabuza's body and assumed Naruto had blown it up.
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eaglejarl said:
"Sarutobi-sensei engaged Yagura, I engaged Mei, Naruto engaged Zabuza, and our ANBU engaged their jōnin. In the ensuing battle we wiped out their jōnin force as well as Mei and Zabuza." He cleared his throat. "I didn't see what happened exactly, but when I finished with Mei I saw that Naruto had just killed Zabuza so I turned to help Sarutobi-sensei, who had taken a wound in his thigh and was having difficulty opening the distance. Before Naruto or I could reach him, Yagura...." He paused, clearing his throat and wiping at his eyes for a moment. "Yagura killed Sensei.
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He knows that Naruto just killed Zabuza which implies that he knows that Zabuza is dead.
 
faflec said:
He knows that Naruto just killed Zabuza which implies that he knows that Zabuza is dead.
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Well, he at least thinks it. If Zabuza was merely wounded grievously, he might have gotten away and Jiraiya might not have noticed. Of course, Jiraiya is actually Zabuza, as we all know, so it would only be sensible to fake his death to lull us into a false sense of security.
 
Enjou said:
Well, he at least thinks it. If Zabuza was merely wounded grievously, he might have gotten away and Jiraiya might not have noticed. Of course, Jiraiya is actually Zabuza, as we all know, so it would only be sensible to fake his death to lull us into a false sense of security.
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This is why a minimum of Medical Ninjutsu training should be necessary to become genin/chuunin/jounin (something like 3/7/15).
 
huhYeahGoodPoint said:
Not at the cost of skywalkers. Maybe a second negotiating round for the skytowers, or something else.
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If it's our pathway to FOOM... possibly at the cost of skywalkers.

We'd have to figure out the limits of the jutsu (there's a reason the Pangolins aren't using this to rule the seventh path), but just having a working and safe example of a jutsu that enhances our brains opens the floodgates for hacking different variations and upgrades of it. This is huge.
 
MadScientist said:
If it's our pathway to FOOM... possibly at the cost of skywalkers.

We'd have to figure out the limits of the jutsu (there's a reason the Pangolins aren't using this to rule the seventh path), but just having a working and safe example of a jutsu that enhances our brains opens the floodgates for hacking different variations and upgrades of it. This is huge.
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Before we do that we should ask Jiraiya if he knows any examples of it himself. ...depending on how much he trusts us after this update.
 
Velorien said:
Can someone point me to a reference for this ninjutsu?
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OliWhail said:
"Fiiiiine. Pangolin Flash Technique!" Lightning chakra surged through Pantone's veins and skimmed along his scales, and the world slowed around him. He took a moment to revel in the high, and then assessed the situation. He could see one tag-laden kunai flying toward his mate, slipping through her technique's guard. He contemplated doing nothing about it, but that would probably get him a talking-to later, and those were always so troublesome.

So instead of doing nothing, he sprinted forward, wrapping his tongue around the kunai's handle, on the way, and drove it into the face of the man who had thrown it. There were some intermediate steps of shattering the hapless fool's guard as well as his arm bones, but they didn't matter over much.
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Interlude: The Breaking of Warlord Sen

Edit: I bet it will now be retconned out of existance :(
 
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huhYeahGoodPoint said:
No, that's literally just lightning chakra boost. Nothing special about that at all.
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The

"He took a moment to revel in the high, and then assessed the situation. He could see one tag-laden kunai flying toward his mate, slipping through her technique's guard. He contemplated doing nothing about it, but that would probably get him a talking-to later, and those were always so troublesome."

line does imply increased thought speed.

Edit: I mean, if he has time to enjoy the technique's use mid-combat, and if he can notice a projectile getting through his ally's guard and then spend some time deciding whether or not to interfere rather than just fighting on automatic at a higher speed than normal, then that really should mean sped-up cognitive functions.
 
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MadScientist said:
The

"He took a moment to revel in the high, and then assessed the situation. He could see one tag-laden kunai flying toward his mate, slipping through her technique's guard. He contemplated doing nothing about it, but that would probably get him a talking-to later, and those were always so troublesome."

line does imply increased thought speed.
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Should have quoted more:

OliWhail said:
Pantone leapt back toward Panel as the technique wore off and the world returned to its less interesting speed. The tag went off, forcing the new corpse's teammates to dodge to either side and giving the pair of pangolins a moment's respite.
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MadScientist said:
The "He took a moment to revel in the high, and then assessed the situation. He could see one tag-laden kunai flying toward his mate, slipping through her technique's guard. He contemplated doing nothing about it, but that would probably get him a talking-to later, and those were always so troublesome." line does imply increased thought speed.
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But we had that "increased perception" as chakra boost since basically the start of the quest. If you want to FOOM off of chakra boost, go ahead, but this jutsu isn't really special.

Edit: For a really striking example of chakra boost enhanced perception, Chapter 29 Let The Bodies Hit The Floor has an excellent bit where Hazou watches the chain scythe go by slowly.
 
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