Remove ads

Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

Reader mode
Shrooms said:
okay edits are taking too long and we are running out of time so i'm posting my own kagome plan

hopefully running this by Mari/Kei assuages people's concerns about OPSEC. I personally am not concerned but I think reasonable precautions are nonetheless fine.

[X] Action Plan: Sealing is a Pathway to Many Abilities Yadda Yadda
Wordcount: 293
  • Optimize with Mari/Kei
  • Ami's right. It's time to get to work.
  • Rift sealing:
    • Talk to Kagome.
      • We finished MS6, he finished MS7, should we start researching rifts?
      • Has his Rift Sealing Ideas timeline changed since learning MS7?
      • Minato seal displays resemble Naruto's jinchuuriki seal. Investigate if promising. Cross-reference Hazou's sketches of Naruto's seal.
      • Akatsuki is probably researching the Rift. We'll need to handle them.
        • Does Kagome think they can open it without Naruto tenketsu/Minato notes? How long will it take?
        • They likely intend to resurrect Pain. Could we perma-kill him/remove his eyes from the equation?
          • Hypothetically, we could try converting him to Leaf's side and Uplift, but it seems risky.
          • Thoughts?
        • Concern: Akatsuki ambushes us upon exiting/steals the Rift.
          • Possibilities:
            • Kill Sasori, their only route to using the Rift.
              • Akatsuki'd likely come after Kagome/Hazou.
            • Create second Rift back and exit somewhere else.
            • Move Rift somewhere they'd have trouble accessing/finding it. Leaf? 7th Path? Random cave?
              • Enter Rift, collect data to target Naraka, close Rift permanently, open our own.
            • Create impenetrable 5SB airtight foil box around Rift, fortified with defenses like Jiraiya's Fire Absorber seals, and stall them out. Call in aid via 7th Path once we exit.
      • Do we need additional diagnostic seals to verify:
        • How to ward against Path drain?
        • Whether summoning/reverse summoning is possible/safe?
        • If it's possible to move the rift to a different location?
        • If it's possible to open a new portal to the Pure Lands and close the current one?
    • Offscreen
      • Sealing:
        • Continue Minato sealchain. SSA, no prep.
        • Research Directional Explosives. SSA, no prep.
        • Ask Asuma about any unknown jargon in MS9 and MS10 notes, see if he has anything to say.
        • Ask Noburi to look into Tenketsu opening.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
latest version, removed mentions of Kei/Ami/"Treason" (imo treason was never present but shrug)
 
CaramilkThief said:
Also @Shrooms



This might be pertinent to put on when talking to Kagome about Minato seals. See if Jiraiya's notes give us any insight on the Minato seals we've learned so far and what lies beyond.

Also possible that these help when researching Minato seals?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
@eaglejarl @Velorien @Paperclipped Do Jiraiya's notes on the Bijuu seal do anything to help us?

faflec said:
[X] Action Plan: Necromancy is All You Need

@FaintlySorcerous I re-express what others have said re: Kagome OPSEC.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Did you mean to ping me?
 
Last edited:
IF we're worried about failing sealing, we're better off making a couple days of prep than using SSA -- it's callig we'd be failing at, not Sealing.
 
Honestly if we're gonna do a sealing timeskip we should just have FP to burn.

[X] Action Plan: Sealing is a Pathway to Many Abilities Yadda Yadda
 
Cariyaga said:
IF we're worried about failing sealing, we're better off making a couple days of prep than using SSA -- it's callig we'd be failing at, not Sealing.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I disagree, I'm concerned about failures if we roll 24 times in a 6 day update. Rolling 4 times in the same timespan is far far safer.

If we prep for 2 days instead of using SSA we reduce the amount by which we exceed the TN by net 20. That's ~7 shifts of progress wasted per cycle.
 
If we could, having Mari TLiTF Kagome during opsec-sensitive conversations would allow us to get his input without actual risk.

I'm half-tempted to commission our doing just that, but telling him about EM and Isan.

(@eaglejarl lemme know if that sounds fun to write and if you finally increased your rates)
 
FaintlySorcerous said:
If we could, having Mari TLiTF Kagome during opsec-sensitive conversations would allow us to get his input without actual risk.

I'm half-tempted to commission our doing just that, but telling him about EM and Isan.

(@eaglejarl lemme know if that sounds fun to write and if you finally increased your rates)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Ignoring making Mari pay the price, I express concern that Kagome might be able to overcome the memory-loss effect given that he's able to overcome the grue's memory-loss effect.
 
faflec said:
Ignoring making Mari pay the price, I express concern that Kagome might be able to overcome the memory-loss effect given that he's able to overcome the grue's memory-loss effect.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I would never actually advocate for this due to the Mari-paying-the-price element. Commissioned works are not canon by default and this one would never wind up canon.
 
[X] [Conclave] Action Plan: Pacifying Pantsaa (A Hundred Years of Peace)
[X] Conclave: The Power of Friendship
[X][Conclave] Action Plan: Wrapping Things Up
[x] [Conclave] Action Plan: Not One Unusual Thing Has Ever Happened
 
FaintlySorcerous said:
(Offscreen) Ask Ma, Pa, Cannai, and Enma about Boss succession and the Hierophant/Pantsaa's predecessor. Be clear why: we want to topple Pantsaa.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I know Orochimaru can talk shit to the bosses but he's widely known as a monster. I don't know about advocating for replacing a boss outright. Feels similar to the pre-collapse fiasco we had with Naruto. It's an area they can play with around us but not something we should fully lean into. This doesn't seem like the kind of information a boss would want to risk getting out on the human path either.
 
Orisha91 said:
I know Orochimaru can talk shit to the bosses but he's widely known as a monster. I don't know about advocating for replacing a boss outright. Feels similar to the pre-collapse fiasco we had with Naruto. It's an area they can play with around us but not something we should fully lean into. This doesn't seem like the kind of information a boss would want to risk getting out on the human path either.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah I agree completely that this sounds like another potential Naruto fiasco. Such thing will set a precedent for summoners and the bosses definitely do not want human to meddle in their internal affairs, especially to the point of a boss removal.
 
Noumero said:
  1. Failing explicit knowledge of (5), which groups are likely to hold power in the Pangolin society? Ways to infer this:
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We did answer (5). I'll note that the hardest resource constraint is food, and the land that produces food. The Pangolins are one of very few clans that intentionally cultivate the land with something approximating agriculture, though their inesctivorous nature means that it shares little in common with agriculture we recognize (read: we don't want to bother constructing exactly how this works). [Actually, this point was still under discussion]

  1. How dependent are the Pangolins on the inter-Clan interactions? Are they completely isolationist? If the other Clans, for example, became convinced that the Pangolin Clan systemically breaks oaths, would that have a meaningful impact on them at all?
  2. How powerful are the Bosses on their home turf? Drawing on known historical precedents...
    1. Are they impossible to oppose even if their entire Clan bands together against them? Or are they more like a Kage, such that several of their military elites may stand a chance against them?
    2. Can an invading Boss stand a chance against the Boss holding the territory, assuming no allies on either side? E. g., why did Conjura flee instead of slaughter all invaders?
    3. Are there metaphysical mechanisms for disempowering a Boss if the rest of the Clan becomes dissatisfied with them?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
  1. The Pangolins are not isolationist, and enjoy relationships with several clans, of whom the Toads and Otters are noteworthy examples, though they also have many enemies. It would likely be very harmful to Pangolin if other clans thought them oathbreakers.
    1. Note that such a claim might be attributed more specifically: e.g. Pantsā, while acting on behalf of the Pangolin Clan, broke an oath, so he specifically is an oathbreaker. Then, the Pangolin clan would only be ostracized while Pantsā remains in power.
  2. Kei does not know these answers, nor does she have enough information to hazard a guess at them. Mari notes that this information, especially things like the specifics of boss succession, may be intentionally kept out of the hands of human summoners to prevent them from getting ideas that they shouldn't have.
 
Last edited:
Paperclipped said:
[snip]
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Thanks for the answers!
The Pangolins are not isolationist, and enjoy relationships with several clans, of whom the Toads and Otters are noteworthy examples, though they also have many enemies. It would likely be very harmful to Pangolin if other clans thought them oathbreakers.
  1. Note that such a claim might be attributed more specifically: e.g. Pantsā, while acting on behalf of the Pangolin Clan, broke an oath, so he specifically is an oathbreaker. Then, the Pangolin clan would only be ostracized while Pantsā remains in power.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yay. Sounds like the core idea is workable.
Kei does not know these answers, nor does she have enough information to hazard a guess at them. Mari notes that this information, especially things like the specifics of boss succession, may be intentionally kept out of the hands of human summoners to prevent them from getting ideas that they shouldn't have.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The very fact that there's something to be hidden says enough on its own, doesn't it? (I rather doubt they'd act this way if a Boss was really implacable.)

Hm, I wonder if Conjura would be more open about that. She already told us to investigate a previous succession.
 
Shrooms said:
Optimize with Mari/Kei
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Are we just papering over everyone's issues without a good speech first?

Edit: Specifically I'd like to talk about what Ami said with them, on the off chance that it helps them.

FaintlySorcerous said:
(Offscreen) Ask Ma, Pa, Cannai, and Enma about Boss succession and the Hierophant/Pantsaa's predecessor. Be clear why: we want to topple Pantsaa.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Could this be another "ask Naruto for help to do a treason" moment? It kind of feels like one.

Edit: Concrete reasons for my suspicion beyond the initial gut feeling are that Ma and Pa might be involved in high level Toad policy making and the Toads have a defensive alliance with the Pangolins. If the Rats are right about 7th Path contracts then Ma and Pa might be signatories, or close to it. And conspiracy against Pantsā is likely to be something that would trigger a clause in the defensive alliance contract.
 
Last edited:
Rafin said:
Edit: Specifically I'd like to talk about what Ami said with them, on the off chance that it helps them.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I expect it to actually make things worse. On our current highest-credence model, souls in Naraka deteriorate at a speed inversely proportional to the number of living people remembering them. Jiraiya, a worldwide legend, appeared severely affected a mere ~year after ending up there. Isan, an isolated village, was wiped out wholesale, with only Yuno remembering more than a dozen of them. We're at least months away from opening the rift. By the time we get there, they'll almost certainly be all gone.

Either our pitch doesn't work, or it works for a few moments until they realize the Isanese are likely unresurrectable by the avenue we're currently trying, and they get more depressed.
Concrete reasons for my suspicion beyond the initial gut feeling are that Ma and Pa might be involved in high level Toad policy making and the Toads have a defensive alliance with the Pangolins. If the Rats are right about 7th Path contracts then Ma and Pa might be signatories, or close to it. And conspiracy against Pantsā is likely to be something that would trigger a clause in the defensive alliance contract.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Those are good points, especially in the light of @Paperclipped's answer to my question upthread. @FaintlySorcerous, consider removing at least the "be clear why" part, plus removing Ma and Pa from the core meeting.
 
Last edited:
Mechanics Proposal: Honesty Attacks
(AKA: the Kagome Effect)​

When you are trying to convince someone that you're telling the truth (and you genuinely are), you can make a Deceit attack against them. On a success, they remain suspicious (you're a decent liar, after all). However, if you fail the attack, they become inclined to believe that they can read you well enough to know that you're being honest.
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top