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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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With a plan like @faflec's, Nara leading the team is almost identical to Hazou leading the team, as no matter who takes charge, Hazou's ideas will be refined by Nara and Keiko until everyone agrees. The most key differences listed in 'why Shikamaru should lead' are that the other Leaf teams trust Shikamaru more and that he knows them better.

Given that I think Hazou's plan has a good chance of succeeding no matter who leads it (The other Leaf teams don't distrust Hazou either, except maybe Neji, and most of the fine details of the teams will be handled within the team), I feel like I would prefer a version of your plan where Hazou takes charge but am also fine with the current plan.

[X] Action Plan: Twelve Ninjas Strong
 
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Briefvoice said:
Let's look at our resources, shall we?



For reasons of speed, it may be more efficient to split into two units of six genin each.

[X] Plan Teams of Six

Division of Labor
  • Hazou proposes that the group divide into two teams of six and each go hunting.
  • Rationale: By covering multiple locations, we maximize our ability to locate enemy teams with the required seal count.
    • Going to only one location risks that the 'hunting' will be too sparse.
    • Two teams will allow hunting to happen twice as fast, making sure we can beat deadline.
    • Hazou knows his team has fighting prowess far in excess of most genin, and so do many of the other Leaf genin in the group. He is confident that six member groups will be sufficient.
    • Additionally, trying to coordinate 12 ninja simultaneously could result in loss in efficiency.
    • Each time assigned to hunt down at least four rival teams and steal their seals.
  • Proposed teams and locations
    • Team A: Hazō, Noburi, Keiko, Akane, Sakura, Haru. Team A will take "Midway Through the Forest".
      • Hazō to take leadership role
      • Four members of Team A have great experience working together, and all four have at least some stealth skills (but not *too good*... see lure plan below). Sakura can use genjutsu to help cover us as well.
      • Midway Through Forest allows solid ground for tunneling and living roots and Syrup Trap or Goo Bombs, while Noburi can use the stream for chaka drain and water jutsu.
    • Team B: Ino-Shika-Chō, Neji, Tenten, Lee
      • Leave it up to them to decide who will be leader and which ambush site they will take.
      • We will be willing to give them all the explosive seals they think they can use, Banshee seals, and Banshee Slayers, and a couple of Kagome (but not Jiraiya) goo bombs each)
    • Each group is made up of people who are more familiar with each other's capabilities.
    • We would like to meet up afterwards and 'balance out' seals in case one team had bad luck or one exceptionally good. Goal is for all Leaf nin to pass.
Team A Battle Plans
  • We will use a lure strategy.
    • Noburi, Keiko, and Akane on the surface, hiding using regular stealth to attempt an ambush, Noburi chakra sensing in the stream for any ninja who have entered the water.
    • Meanwhile Hazou, Sakura, and Haru hide just below the surface in a Pangolin-created tunnel.
    • Maintain communication with Hazou using Living Roots to monitor the surface from the tunnel, and the upstairs team using tap-code to let know status.
    • The surface team attempts to execute ambushes. If they are spotted, likely enemy will attempt to fight them since numbers are equal. On a sucessful or failed ambush, tunnel team will burst and out join fight, making it suddenly unequal.
  • Fight strategy
    • Sakura opens with a genjutsu, while Keiko and Haru activate Goo Bombs to make sure enemy can't flee.
    • Meanwhile Hazo, Noburi, and Akane move in to engage directly.
    • From them on, fight as appropriate to our training.
    • We aren't sure of Sakura and Haru's fight capabilities; so this is up to Akane's judgement. Should Sakura and Haru go to seal-throwing duty?
  • Contingencies
    • Go to Banshee seals if enemy seems unexpectedly dangerous. They will alert everyone in the area we are fighting, so it's not the preferred starter. Could warn other teams to avoid the area.
    • Hazou will armor up with Ghost Scales if he has a round of warning from the surface team's tap code.
    • Try to avoid lethal violence unless there's no other choice. Deliberate killing will get us kicked out of the exam.

Putting this out there for now.... willing to listen to improvements/suggestions.
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Remember that we know from apocrypha that there is a large group of multiple teams working together against us. Splitting up to be outnumbered may be a bad idea.
 
@faflec We just said in this chapter that all seals other than are considered trump cards for later; I'm not sure we want to be whipping out the Silence Mines.

eaglejarl said:
"Everyone knows that I am the Pangolin Summoner," Keiko said. "During this event I have called upon, and thereby revealed the existence of, Paneru, Panashe, and Panjandrum. It's public knowledge that Paneru is an engineer, Panashe is a scout, and Panjandrum is a melee combatant. I would prefer to keep all other aspects of my summoning abilities private, as well as not going into detail on what those three are capable of."

"Done," Hazō said, nodding. "We'll want to keep some of the seals secret as well. We've shown Air and Earth Dome, as well as Five Seal Barrier, Lesser Barrier Formation, and of course explosives. Let's keep the rest of it secret, unless we really need to fight. Especially the one Noburi used against Hyūga."
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huhYeahGoodPoint said:
@faflec We just said in this chapter that all seals other than are considered trump cards for later; I'm not sure we want to be whipping out the Silence Mines.
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I know that, which is why I wrote "if reasonable (and doesn't fuck OPSEC)". If we decide we want to keep it secret we won't. Also I'd point out that we're about to enter a combat situation, and Hazou says in your quote "Let's keep the rest of it secret, unless we really need to fight".
 
faflec said:
Here's a plan variant of @Briefvoice's that has us not splitting the party. I'm having Nara take the leadership for reasons in the plan, but am willing to write a version of the plan where Hazou leads instead.

[X] Action Plan: Twelve Ninjas Strong
  • General:
    • Keep in mind OPSEC. We don't talk about Vampiric Dew, or Pangolins/seals (save for those revealed beforehand).
    • Discuss the plan with teams, especially Keiko and Nara. Make changes as necessary.
    • If Nara takes the command, this Action Plan is a list of suggestions for Nara to accept or reject as he sees fit. Be polite when suggesting, and no complaining if he rejects it.
  • Continue expressing support for Nara as ground commander.
    • Thank him for believing that we'd be a good leader for the teams.
      • E.g., "It's a generous offer and I would like to say thank you for having such faith in my skills".
    • Say that Nara would still be a better ground commander than Hazou.
        • Argue that our exploit and revolving strategy isn't necessarily indicative of being a superior ground commander, it's indicative of having better resources (access to Party Trick seals to exploit the loophole) and having access to intelligent teammates (running the plan through with Noburi/Keiko, multiple times).
          • Note: These aren't bad qualities to have, but it doesn't necessarily translate to being able to command multiple teams at once.
        • Nara has also shown impressive insight, being able to deduce our earlier plan within moments of actually hearing it, and perceiving the flaw (lack of seals) which probably saved our asses here.
        • Nara is likely waaay more trusted among the teams here; and trust in their leader is probably one of the most important things when directing multiple teams in the heat of combat.
        • Point out that Nara would be better at leading the teams as his knowledge of our capabilities is higher: he's spent his entire life among Leaf (and thus the Rookies), whereas Hazou has spent...a couple of months, at the most.
        • Finally, note that Nara's suggestion from earlier (to have himself in a central position, while Hazou is at the perimeter) would put him in a better position to see the overall battlefield.
    • Conclude that we're willing to make suggestions and/or a general plan of ambush, but that Nara should still take on-site tactical command for if things go awry.
  • Make for the ambush site.
    • We've already gotten an approved evac plan, so we use that.
      • Keep in mind the possibility of other teams having a similar plan to ours (ambush people near the rendezvous). Have eyes open.
      • Noburi should be draining various animals as possible, to keep up with chakra demands (obvious stuff, shouldn't need to say it).
      • As possible find and take clumps of reeds/bramble bushes for later disguises (see below).
    • Go to the swamp ambush site.
        • Our ability to attack teams hiding underground is weak (only Hazou and Pangolins have some way to reach them); this site nullifies that.
        • (Uncertain) Keiko can hide Panjandrum inside the water, as he did when attacking the Sunset Racer (don't mention that example).
        • Watery area covers up signs of battle better than the other locations.
        • Presence of reeds/trees makes setting up traps plausible. We also have underwater-functional seals.
        • Presence of water makes full use of Noburi's Suiton ninjutsu (and bloodline, but let Noburi mention this).
        • Closeness to Ring of Death means teams are more likely to go to our ambush site.
          • Note: This is a pro and a con, since other teams could hear us fighting and move towards it...but we're Twelve Ninjas Strong, we can handle this.
        • (Unsure) Water still works with the Kagemane jutsu (Naruto Chapter 535, Page 6).
  • Do ambushes.
    • Preparations:
      • EVERYONE:
        • Familiarizes themselves with the area, to gain an Aspect related to knowing the lay of the land.
        • (With enough trust) Everyone gives Kawarimi permissions until the end of this Exam Stage.
        • Selects and chooses a spot to hide in.
          • Generally, follow Shikamaru's advice from earlier: Neji/Shikamaru in a central position, everyone else around the perimeter.
          • As plausible have teams grouped closer together to promote team synergy.
          • Ponder usage of Silence Mines for additional Stealth; if reasonable (and doesn't fuck OPSEC) suggest for all teams.
      • Noburi: Refills everyone who uses chakra, and get chakra from ambient life. This should be obvious, and likely left unstated.
      • Keiko: Summons Panjandrum, who disguises himself with reeds/bramble bushes in preparation for ambush.
        • Note: Panashe's showing in Chapter 159 suggests she can sneak up on (and thus defeat) low-Awareness teams. If plausible she could be also summoned and sent hunting for low-Awareness teams to take out. Otherwise she may add to scouting, if capable; or simply not be summoned to conserve chakra.
      • Akane (and high-Trapmaking individuals): Set explosive traps as dictated by their skill/best positional advantage.
      • Neji (and high-Awareness individuals): Alert teams if enemies approach.
    • Smackdown enemy teams:
      • Nonlethal only, as if it has to be said. Be fast, be efficient, (if possible) be quiet about it.
      • Use chakra. Our enemies have it, and Noburi can transfer it to us.
      • As possible use inter-team synergy (e.g., Sakura and Shikamaru can snag enemies with genjutsu/Kagemane for other combatants to KO).
      • Noburi drains all enemy ninjas of chakra during and after combat (again, this is obvious, don't state it out loud).
    • Post-battle:
      • Loot enemies. Don't just take Night Light/Party Trick seals, grab combat seals, weapons, and VERY IMPORTANTLY their word-half from the First Stage of the Exams. You know, the ones that give us access to the next stage?
      • Chakra drain + tie enemies up, stuff them up trees or similar.
      • Noburi tops our chakra off with chakra from enemy teams (again, this is obvious, don't state it out loud).
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Argue that our exploit and revolving strategy isn't necessarily indicative of being a superior ground commander, it's indicative of having better resources (access to Party Trick seals to exploit the loophole) and having access to intelligent teammates (running the plan through with Noburi/Keiko, multiple times).
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That's some Hazou-worthy phrasing alright. Probably best not to imply everyone else is an idiot. :p
 
faflec said:
Here's a plan variant of @Briefvoice's that has us not splitting the party. I'm having Nara take the leadership for reasons in the plan, but am willing to write a version of the plan where Hazou leads instead.
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You can't do that. You can't tell Nara, "You're in charge." and then follow up with, "But here's the plan." I'm sorry, but that just doesn't work. If you're going to give it over to Nara, you have to live with what he comes up with and there's no point in following it up with an elaborate plan. You pick the ambush site, for heaven's sake!

I have no problem with your plan, but Hazou has to take responsibility for it. You can't pretend that Nara is in charge, and then lay out a plan. That's bullshit, and I think we all know it's bullshit.

If it's a good plan, then Hazou needs to stand behind it.
 
Cariyaga said:
They can't stop him from inserting his foot into his mouth if you tell him to.
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No, I mean write this:
Argue that our exploit and revolving strategy isn't necessarily indicative of being a superior ground commander, it's indicative of having better resources (access to Party Trick seals to exploit the loophole) and having access to intelligent teammates (running the plan through with Noburi/Keiko multiple times before presenting it to everyone).
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Though I'm starting to get the feeling we're talking over each other. Could you explain where and how Hazou is doing foot-in-mouth?
 
faflec said:
No, I mean write this:

Though I'm starting to get the feeling we're talking over each other. Could you explain where and how Hazou is doing foot-in-mouth?
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Argue that our exploit and revolving strategy isn't necessarily indicative of being a superior ground commander, it's indicative of having better resources (access to Party Trick seals to exploit the loophole) and having access to intelligent teammates
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Implies that Shikamaru does not have intelligent teammates.
 
Here's a plan variant of my previous plan which has Hazou leading, with small butterflies extending from that.
  • Deleted the line under General stating that we'd make suggestions to Nara.
  • Completely altered the leadership discussion for obvious reasons.
  • Hazou takes point since he's the leader.

[X] Action Plan: Twelve Ninjas Leading
  • General:
    • Keep in mind OPSEC. We don't talk about Vampiric Dew, or Pangolins/seals (save for those revealed beforehand).
    • Discuss the plan with teams, especially Keiko and Nara (and team leaders). Make changes as necessary.
  • Accept the leadership position.
    • Don't be a pompous ass.
    • Thank Nara for believing that we'd be a good leader for the teams.
      • E.g., "It's a generous offer and I would like to say thank you for having such faith in my skills".
    • Ask the other teams if they are okay with this arrangement and if they have any concerns or objections, and if they're willing to accept you as leader.
      • If they're OK with it then accept the position
      • If they're not suggest that Nara lead and we just take up an advisory position (at which point everything below becomes a suggestion).
    • Once settled, outline the ambush plan and ask if there are any questions/comments/concerns; listen and adjust plan as necessary. Make special note to team leaders (Haruno, Nara, Hyuga) and our team (Keiko, Noburi).
  • Make for the ambush site.
    • We've already gotten an approved evac plan, so we use that.
      • Keep in mind the possibility of other teams having a similar plan to ours (ambush people near the rendezvous). Have eyes open.
      • Noburi should be draining various animals as possible, to keep up with chakra demands (obvious stuff, shouldn't need to say it).
      • As possible find and take clumps of reeds/bramble bushes for later disguises (see below).
    • Go to the swamp ambush site.
        • Our ability to attack teams hiding underground is weak (only Hazou and Pangolins have some way to reach them); this site nullifies that.
        • (Uncertain) Keiko can hide Panjandrum inside the water, as he did when attacking the Sunset Racer (don't mention that example).
        • Watery area covers up signs of battle better than the other locations.
        • Presence of reeds/trees makes setting up traps plausible. We also have underwater-functional seals.
        • Presence of water makes full use of Noburi's Suiton ninjutsu (and bloodline, but let Noburi mention this).
        • Closeness to Ring of Death means teams are more likely to go to our ambush site.
          • Note: This is a pro and a con, since other teams could hear us fighting and move towards it...but we're Twelve Ninjas Strong, we can handle this.
        • (Unsure) Water still works with the Kagemane jutsu (Naruto Chapter 535, Page 6).
  • Do ambushes.
    • Preparations:
      • EVERYONE:
        • Familiarizes themselves with the area, to gain an Aspect related to knowing the lay of the land.
        • (With enough trust) Everyone gives Kawarimi permissions until the end of this Exam Stage.
        • Selects and chooses a spot to hide in.
          • Generally, follow Shikamaru's advice from earlier: Neji/Shikamaru in a central position, everyone else around the perimeter.
          • Have Hazou take point, since he's the leader.
          • As plausible have teams grouped closer together to promote team synergy.
          • Ponder usage of Silence Mines for additional Stealth; if reasonable (and doesn't fuck OPSEC) suggest for all teams.
      • Noburi: Refills everyone who uses chakra, and get chakra from ambient life. This should be obvious, and likely left unstated.
      • Keiko: Summons Panjandrum, who disguises himself with reeds/bramble bushes in preparation for ambush.
        • Note: Panashe's showing in Chapter 159 suggests she can sneak up on (and thus defeat) low-Awareness teams. If plausible she could be also summoned and sent hunting for low-Awareness teams to take out. Otherwise she may add to scouting, if capable; or simply not be summoned to conserve chakra.
      • Neji (and high-Awareness individuals): Alert teams if enemies approach.
    • Smackdown enemy teams:
      • Nonlethal only, as if it has to be said. Be fast, be efficient, (if possible) be quiet about it.
      • Use chakra. Our enemies have it, and Noburi can transfer it to us.
      • As possible use inter-team synergy (e.g., Sakura and Shikamaru can snag enemies with genjutsu/Kagemane for other combatants to KO).
      • Noburi drains all enemy ninjas of chakra during and after combat (again, this is obvious, don't state it out loud).
    • Post-battle:
      • Loot enemies. Don't just take Night Light/Party Trick seals, grab combat seals, weapons, and VERY IMPORTANTLY their word-half from the First Stage of the Exams. You know, the ones that give us access to the next stage?
      • Chakra drain + tie enemies up, stuff them up trees or similar.
      • Noburi tops us off with enemy team chakra (again, this is obvious, don't state it out loud).
 
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@Cariyaga How does this change look?
Argue that our exploit and revolving strategy isn't necessarily indicative of being a superior ground commander, it's indicative of having better resources (access to Party Trick seals to exploit the loophole) and even then, the plan had to undergo multiple revisions with teammates.
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Also, I'm thinking of changing the tactics from Shikamaru's suggestion earlier: I want us in a pair of semicircles facing towards the old fort (so enemies entering the ambush zone would end up facing us). Taijutsu fighters (Hazou, Akane...) would be the outermost circle; ranged fighters (Keiko, Tenten...) would be in the innermost circle. Neji would probably be in the inner circle both because of his Byakugan and because there should be someone in the back in case someone attacks us from behind.

Does anyone have an objection to the above?
 
[X] Action Plan: Twelve Ninjas Leading
I'll leave it as approval of both for now, may go back and specify one over the other tomorrow.
 
Cariyaga said:
@OliWhail @eaglejarl @Velorien How much does Panashe cost to summon?

e: By the way, I've added these questions to the QUINOA under important questions.
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Panashe costs 105 CP.

Thanks for adding the questions.

faflec said:
@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail I think this is inaccurate: Team Kurenai (Hinata, Kiba, Shino) have not arrived as far as I can recall. Thus there are 12 individuals,
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Drat. I wrote it as 33 originally, then realized that there were four teams and ninja teams are four people and therefore there were sixteen people here and therefore I had made a mistake and it was twenty-five instead of thirty-three and wasn't I clever for catching that before it went to press?

Of course, ninja teams are four people counting the sensei, who of course is not here right now. I even wrote the list of names out accurately but did not manage to count to twelve correctly.

Thanks for spotting this; it's fixed.

Langevin said:
aaaaand WE'RE BACK! <3 <3 <3

Thanks so much to the dedicated questers--and our supremely dedicated QMs--who made this rules update happen. I really appreciate all the time and effort y'all put in, and I'm excited to see where things go from here.
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You are most welcome! It's been really exciting to see all the fired-up discussion again.

faflec said:
Keiko: Summons Panjandrum, who disguises himself with reeds/bramble bushes in preparation for ambush.
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Quick reminder: Panjandrum is something like twenty feet tall standing up and nearly as tall lying down. He's not going to be good at hiding.
 
faflec said:
Here's a plan variant of my previous plan which has Hazou leading, with small butterflies extending from that.
  • Deleted the line under General stating that we'd make suggestions to Nara.
  • Completely altered the leadership discussion for obvious reasons.
  • Hazou takes point since he's the leader.

[X] Action Plan: Twelve Ninjas Leading
  • General:
    • Keep in mind OPSEC. We don't talk about Vampiric Dew, or Pangolins/seals (save for those revealed beforehand).
    • Discuss the plan with teams, especially Keiko and Nara (and team leaders). Make changes as necessary.
  • Accept the leadership position.
    • Don't be a pompous ass.
    • Thank Nara for believing that we'd be a good leader for the teams.
      • E.g., "It's a generous offer and I would like to say thank you for having such faith in my skills".
    • Say that you'd be willing to accept the position, assuming the other teams (esp. Team Guy) also agree that we'd be the best leader.
    • Once settled, outline the ambush plan and ask if there are any questions/comments/concerns; listen and adjust plan as necessary. Make special note to team leaders (Haruno, Nara, Hyuga) and our team (Keiko, Noburi).
  • Make for the ambush site.
    • We've already gotten an approved evac plan, so we use that.
      • Keep in mind the possibility of other teams having a similar plan to ours (ambush people near the rendezvous). Have eyes open.
      • Noburi should be draining various animals as possible, to keep up with chakra demands (obvious stuff, shouldn't need to say it).
      • As possible find and take clumps of reeds/bramble bushes for later disguises (see below).
    • Go to the swamp ambush site.
        • Our ability to attack teams hiding underground is weak (only Hazou and Pangolins have some way to reach them); this site nullifies that.
        • (Uncertain) Keiko can hide Panjandrum inside the water, as he did when attacking the Sunset Racer (don't mention that example).
        • Watery area covers up signs of battle better than the other locations.
        • Presence of reeds/trees makes setting up traps plausible. We also have underwater-functional seals.
        • Presence of water makes full use of Noburi's Suiton ninjutsu (and bloodline, but let Noburi mention this).
        • Closeness to Ring of Death means teams are more likely to go to our ambush site.
          • Note: This is a pro and a con, since other teams could hear us fighting and move towards it...but we're Twelve Ninjas Strong, we can handle this.
        • (Unsure) Water still works with the Kagemane jutsu (Naruto Chapter 535, Page 6).
  • Do ambushes.
    • Preparations:
      • EVERYONE:
        • Familiarizes themselves with the area, to gain an Aspect related to knowing the lay of the land.
        • (With enough trust) Everyone gives Kawarimi permissions until the end of this Exam Stage.
        • Selects and chooses a spot to hide in.
          • Generally, follow Shikamaru's advice from earlier: Neji/Shikamaru in a central position, everyone else around the perimeter.
          • Have Hazou take point, since he's the leader.
          • As plausible have teams grouped closer together to promote team synergy.
          • Ponder usage of Silence Mines for additional Stealth; if reasonable (and doesn't fuck OPSEC) suggest for all teams.
      • Noburi: Refills everyone who uses chakra, and get chakra from ambient life. This should be obvious, and likely left unstated.
      • Keiko: Summons Panjandrum, who disguises himself with reeds/bramble bushes in preparation for ambush.
        • Note: Panashe's showing in Chapter 159 suggests she can sneak up on (and thus defeat) low-Awareness teams. If plausible she could be also summoned and sent hunting for low-Awareness teams to take out. Otherwise she may add to scouting, if capable; or simply not be summoned to conserve chakra.
      • Akane (and high-Trapmaking individuals): Set explosive traps as dictated by their skill/best positional advantage.
      • Neji (and high-Awareness individuals): Alert teams if enemies approach.
    • Smackdown enemy teams:
      • Nonlethal only, as if it has to be said. Be fast, be efficient, (if possible) be quiet about it.
      • Use chakra. Our enemies have it, and Noburi can transfer it to us.
      • As possible use inter-team synergy (e.g., Sakura and Shikamaru can snag enemies with genjutsu/Kagemane for other combatants to KO).
      • Noburi drains all enemy ninjas of chakra during and after combat (again, this is obvious, don't state it out loud).
    • Post-battle:
      • Loot enemies. Don't just take Night Light/Party Trick seals, grab combat seals, weapons, and VERY IMPORTANTLY their word-half from the First Stage of the Exams. You know, the ones that give us access to the next stage?
      • Chakra drain + tie enemies up, stuff them up trees or similar.
      • Noburi tops us off with enemy team chakra (again, this is obvious, don't state it out loud).
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Click to shrink...

Perhaps include what to do if the other teams disagree with Hazo being the leader. Perhaps we could acquiesce and let Nara be the leader in that case and just advise him of the plan that Hazo thought up. Also, do we have a plan for stealth to deal with the Mist guys who have the detachable body part bloodline (IIRC)?
 
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