Wait, that wasn't Orochimaru getting annoyed with us and unleashing a fragment of his KI, which caused us to have flashbacks and another Out episode?
Yes, it was.

Not to self.

Do not even try to purposefully dredge up the senations or impression s related to the Out Sealing failure.

Especially when confronting an elite jounin.
I actually made a point of doing that in order to start laying the IC groundwork for when you buy Prophet of the Out. It then fed nicely into the "Oro gets annoyed and uses KI! It's super effective!" scene.

@eaglejarl can you give us feedback about what part of the plan works and what don't? Would be helpful next time to help us improve our planmaking skill.
It's a fair question, but I don't feel comfortable answering it. It's not information that Hazō has, so offering it OOC feels dodgy.

@eaglejarl, @Velorien, @OliWhail: Are there any mechanics for the Jounin Aura yet?
When I did the scene with Zabuza I modeled it as Intimidation vs Resolve, with appropriate bonuses on both sides. I don't know if we'll keep that or use a different model.

I mean, presumably we'll be able to acquire one and get better at resisting them.
Bumping Resolve would be a good place to start.
@eaglejarl: Can we have a TYS point? I think being vivisected by the aura of one of the most monstrous individuals in the setting should count.

Though, that experience will probably make it hard to get TYS from being blasted with killing intent from now on. It's going to hard to top Orochimaru for sheer horror.
No, sorry. Especially since that wasn't a serious effort of Oro's part. That was him getting annoyed and swatting you, not him seriously trying to break your mind.
 
I actually made a point of doing that in order to start laying the IC groundwork for when you buy Prophet of the Out. It then fed nicely into the "Oro gets annoyed and uses KI! It's super effective!" scene.

Thank you for the build up.

I imagine the rest of the clan will insist on Tsunade checking us over/cussing us out at this point?
 
Is it a Practical Guide to Eggplants?
Nope! I know that you, on the contrary, haven't read it.

Wait, now that I'm remembering, I think @Dissonance had said she didn't finish it either. I was referring to
Twig.
Twig's plot is centred around a colonial revolution against a biopunk!Britain ruled by sociopathic posthuman nobles-turned-experiments and mad bioengineers who created them (Orochimaru would have felt right at home there, come to think of it). Its last arc, named "Crown of Thorns", involves the main characters taking over the colony — after it was reduced to ashes by war, WMD deployment, and a superintelligence-generated superplague.

In addition, at that point the protagonist is experiencing identity death caused by long-term abuse of intelligence-enhancing drugs; more specifically, the mental models he used to predict his enemies' actions start acting independently, merge, and eventually replace his own personality, at which point he starts referring to himself using royal "we". It's all exceptionally unsettling.
 
Hmm, I'm wondering whether it's a good idea to get cleaned up and push harder on Orochimaru in the next in-game hour or so. After meeting with the clan.

I know the thread tends to be pretty risk averse after an event like this and at the very least it's going to cost us more mental consequences, but I think it bears serious consideration.
  • The longer we let Orochimaru have free reign without getting some form of agreement, the more room he has to fuck us over.
  • We're interesting to Orochimaru right now, but that won't last long, and we'll lose that opportunity to engage.
  • We need to convince Orochimaru to cooperate, because he's going to become a gigantic liability (to Leaf as a whole more than just the Goketsu) after the war. The only checks on his power will be Tsunade and Naruto and if he falls back into old patterns then the only real option is for them to kill him, and that's going to cause a ton of damage on its own.
  • I'm rather convinced that we're the only party in Leaf that can cooperatively disagree with Orochimaru. Kabuto isn't going to disagree and everyone else can only cooperate with Oro by getting out of his way.
Basically, Orochimaru needs to be leashed and there's no way to do that with just power. Strength can only ever contain him and that containment is mostly going to be flawed in ways that allow him to cause serious harm. Especially since any useful containment is going to be adversarial in nature.

We need to convince him that being awful is not in his best interests. Being in a position of weakness is actually rather useful for that, since it gives Orochimaru control and agency without compromising our ability to manipulate him.

But being in a position of weakness isn't sufficient to manipulate Orochimaru. We also need him to engage with us, to want to hear us out. We need to be sure that we are interesting to him and that we stay interesting to him. The more interesting we are to Oro, the less expendable we are. I don't want to lose that leverage unless it's too costly to too keep and that leverage is cheapest right now.

Mind, this isn't an argument to go all in on manipulating him. It's an argument to try making ourselves interesting but not expendable to Orochimaru in the immediate future. (i.e. After, we chat with other clan members but before we go to bed)

In general, we need to bring Orochimaru into the power structure of Leaf rather than letting him act independent of that power structure. I think the only ways to keep him from repeatedly trampling over that power structure are to manipulate him or kill him.

Edit: I think we might need to make an actual psych profile for Orochimaru, anyone here know how to do that?
 
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cost us more mental consequences,
On this point: we only have a Medium mental consequence left for the next 24 hours or so. I'm not sure what happens when we run out of mental consequences to take, but its surely not good. Given that Zabuza pretty much trivially gave us a Mild and a Medium with *his* intimidation check, I don't doubt Oro would be able to reduce us to mental giblets in our current state.
 
On this point: we only have a Medium mental consequence left for the next 24 hours or so. I'm not sure what happens when we run out of mental consequences to take, but its surely not good. Given that Zabuza pretty much trivially gave us a Mild and a Medium with *his* intimidation check, I don't doubt Oro would be able to reduce us to mental giblets in our current state.

Yes, that's absolutely a risk. Hence why I said it's going to be at least that bad. As far as I'm concerned getting away with a medium consequence is a best case scenario.

Also, didn't Keiko make Neji exceed his mental stress track? If I recall, that rendered Neji somewhat traumatized but didn't kill him. It's unclear whether Neji still has psychological issues around that experience, but he's at least mostly functional now. More importantly it didn't mind control Neji or Arikada for very long.

I also expect Mari's heartbreaker techniques worked by exceeding someone's mental stress tracker. That Jounin she nearly killed near "Let the bodies hit the floor" was only incapacitated (Mari still had to stab him), but she has caused fear based heart attacks. However that required significant intimacy and engagement with the experience to be able to set that off.

My expectation is that exceeding the mental stress track with KI will most likely render Hazou unconscious for a day or two (unlike this time where he was unconscious for only a few minutes.) and has a small chance leaving him with trauma related to Orochimaru that makes interacting with Orochimaru harder. The hivemind provides some inherent defense against that sort of trauma, but we also know that's not perfect since Hazou and Nobby nearly killed that little girl at one point.

Basically, I don't think that we'll be killed or mind-controlled by Orochimaru exceeding our stress track and he's got good reason to not kill us if we're rendered unconscious. We should probably at least plan for being knocked out a few days and having nightmares for the next month, but that's not a big issue.

I mean, all we really need to do to deal with those consequences is:
  • Make sure we have some standing orders for the clan if we're incapacitated and they need to act on their own.
  • Dip into the Out to disassociate ourselves a little during the chat.
  • Do our best to make sure we're sitting down during the chat.
  • Make sure we've got Nobby and someone else standing by with a stretcher and mop before we go in to talk.
  • Keep some minor noise seal on hand to trigger if we start to go down.
 
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On this point: we only have a Medium mental consequence left for the next 24 hours or so. I'm not sure what happens when we run out of mental consequences to take, but its surely not good. Given that Zabuza pretty much trivially gave us a Mild and a Medium with *his* intimidation check, I don't doubt Oro would be able to reduce us to mental giblets in our current state.
Most basic: you have lost the argument and acknowledge that fact.

Beyond that, it depends on what the victor was trying to do; whatever it was, you'll act in accord with that...at least a little, and at least for a short time. If they were trying to terrify you, you'll probably exit the room quickly. If they were trying to charm you then you'll be positively inclined to them, maybe lower your guard a bit. It's a narrative thing, not a crunch thing. It definitely won't be anything crazy like "Oh, I was Taken Out in Rapport-based social combat so I regard this person as my most favoritest person ever and I give them all my seals and stuffs and tell them every secret I know before making pinky-promises to be BFFs 4ever!"
 
We should make an SOP to use the restroom before talking to S rankers or something, geez.
 
Put a storage seal on the inside so that you don't have to worry about cleanup, too. Gotta stay on brand, after all.
"Sensei, I had an idea I'd like to run by you," said Hazō .

"Unhm?" Kagome said, ripping some flesh off the duck drumstick he was holding. He was sitting closer to Hazō this time -- maybe eight meters. Of course, he'd made Hazō walk through three separate layers of motion-detector mazes of madness and destruction to come have lunch. Still, it was progress.

"You know my teammate, Keiko? The girl I told you about?" Hazō said. "Well, she's a weapon user. I was thinking that I could make some small storage seals and we could stitch the paper into the fabric of her sleeves so--"

Kagome jumped to his feet, the duck meat spraying out of his mouth as he gibbered in horror.

"Nononononono very bad very stupid don't be turning her brain into goo I thought you liked her why would you do that to her?!"

Hazō raised his hands in a calming gesture that, given how much practice he'd had at it lately, he would have been able to do perfectly even if he hadn't had the Iron Nerve. "I won't! I won't do it, I promise. That's why I was asking."

"That would be--!" Kagome cut himself off as Hazō spoke. "Oh." He looked down at the mostly-eaten drumstick in his hand and the fragments of partially-chewed duck flesh all over the grass. "Um...sorry," he said. He fidgeted for a moment, then sat down again.

"Yeah, sorry," he said. "I get a little nervous around people trying to do clever things with seals."

Hazō was terribly proud of himself for not so much as raising an eyebrow.

"That would be a really dumb thing to do," Kagome said, with a strange inflection that somehow indicated both a lack of intent to be insulting and an utter incomprehension of the fact that it was. "Really dumb. Like, set-your-face-on-fire dumb."

"Okay," Hazō said. "Can you tell me why?"

"When a storage seal emits something, there needs to be free space for the object to form," Kagome said. "If there isn't enough space, the results vary. If you're very, very lucky then the seal simply doesn't activate. If you're less lucky it eats itself. Even less lucky and something half a dozen yards away eats itself. Things get very quickly worse from there." He raised a hand to stifle Hazō's excited comment. "No, it can't be weaponized. People have tried. After a couple of tries they stopped." He poured himself some tea and took a sip.

"They stopped because it was too hard to predict?" Hazō asked.

Kagome looked up at him in surprise. "No, because they died," he said. "Duh."
 
Obviously after activating the (empty) seal to store the waste, you wouldn't want to re-activate it. But if you could create a manner for the waste contents to be able to be sealed without also attempting to seal the ninjabdomen, then that (specific) problem wouldn't be an issue.
 
If Hazou shits himself he's going to be part of the "stuff" that gets eaten, meaning the seal fails (hopefully). But I see your point.
Clearly he just needs to keep a single use latrine-in-a-box in his pants for emergencies. And then contingent seal activation that triggers once chakra stops being applied to it, so that it seals the box upon Hazō's passing out.
 
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