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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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Tua said:
Any thoughts on Hana being allowed back into Leaf in a semi-permanent fashion if Ren agrees to Jiraiya's concessions?
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It's a touchy situation. Hana was basically kept off of her job indefinitely by the clan prior and even as Mizukage Ren isn't the unilateral power over it (although she's wielding the biggest hammer of influence no doubt). She pulled a classic Hazou and is going to be paying for it for a while I'll bet, even if she is allowed back.
 
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Roomba said:
Is anybody interested in a post-mortem of this whole disaster? I feel like we should've been able to navigate it towards a better conclusion, but I also don't think we made any major mistakes.
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Not to put too blunt a point on it (well, OK, precisely the opposite really), but I disagreed strongly at the time and made a competing plan because I thought that plan was a mistake. I've discussed reasons elsewhere (eg.), and IMO the primary takeaways are
  1. Get better at modelling characters and treating them as agents not purely driven by facts-as-you-see-it.
  2. Stop defaulting to passive commentary. It doesn't protect you against anything, and it ruins your ability to do things.
  3. Trust Veedrac, he never makes mistakes. Something something pangolins.
 
Roomba said:
In hindsight, after all the stupid jokes about being "willing to go far" running in the family, this is exactly what she ended up doing. Why are all the adults so crazy?
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They are trained to ignore emotion and whatnot and murder people at the slightest provocation (little girl yanking on your pant-leg tier slightest) from the ripe young age of... 6? 8?

These people all need serious help.
 
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Cariyaga said:
Maybe we ship Noburi and Ami and Hazou can go after Itachi.
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Half of the thread would revolt if Ami ended up with someone who isn't Hazou.

In fact, y'all are pretty lucky that I am neither a QM nor have the skill to be a writer or I would already have this plot point planned out to execute the moment Hazou returns to Mist for the tournament.

Fortunately though, I know a guy or two whose hobbies include Recreationial Villainy so nothing will stop me from planting said ideas into their heads: @Velorien @eaglejarl @OliWhail (just wait 'til he drops the masquerade)
 
MMKII said:
Lets head this next one off before it begins, shall we?

  • Every night before bed Hazou repeats the following to himself.
    • "My Mother went way too far, she's lucky she's alive."
      • Recall the killbox incident.
    • "Her judgement clearly cannot be trusted, and is compromised when dealing with me."
      • Just like in the killbox incident.
    • "I still love her, but that doesn't mean I have to agree with her."
      • What Hana thinks is best for you, and what you actually want might be different things.
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The reasoning that stuck out to me most was the Jiraiya would have found out anyways, and while OOC we know that he went easy on her, it's not too far of a stretch to imagine that a foreign agent/"diplomat" basically disabling the Hokage's wife could have had much more serious repercussions.

Hell, with ninja social-specs running around, it's probably been codified as an attack or been an actual casus belli some point in the past.
 
Tua said:
Can we add setting up Kagome with Tsunade into the big plan of getting a victory condition through the power of love? So far we have the Hazou and Ami pair, and I don't think I need to say more about that one.
Add Kagome and Tsunade to tie another sannin to us and finish it off by getting Itachi to fall into love with Keiko. Seriously though, Keiko loves being emo and Itachi managed to emo a whole generation of Uchiha¹ so they can feed off each other. Also, Itachi has great hair and keeps it in a pony tail and Keiko loves ponies.

¹Granted, said generation of Uchiha is exactly one person but this is still technically correct.
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You're probably kind of joking, but I think the slightest hint of being "set up" would be absolute poison to Tsunade. Probably nothing will happen, but if it did happen it would be dependent on no one doing or saying to imply that they're in any way trying to push them together.
 
faflec said:
*fading laughter somewhere in the distance*
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Yes.Yes.

Thanks though. I will change it back later. Both images were the Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor 2 Protagonist. I quite like that game, and I figured updating my avatar was in order once I found a new pic that I really liked.

And by that I mean, my avatar has never once changed, what are you talking about? You can go to January 5,2017 and check my first post in thread. It's this very same picture!

eaglejarl said:
Written as intended. Noburi repeated what Kagome said.
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Incidentally (you will get your due reaction from me later) roughly what portion of the stuff in the plan was done off screen?
 
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Langevin said:
Leave it to Tsunade to force the issue.
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She is not a woman to avid confronting problems, that's for damn certain.

Veedrac said:
Get better at modelling characters and treating them as agents not purely driven by facts-as-you-see-it.
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Proposal: randomly assign 2 thread members to model each significant NPC each update and bet Ninja Bayes Points against each other in predicting what that character is likely to do.
 
I just realized that sending Hana back to Mist isn't as good of a method to get Hazou away from her as initially thought since Hazou is going there as well in a week for the tournament.

And chances are Hana will cling to him even more now after Jiraiya (and by extension Mari - or so Hana will think) made it clear that he can easily seperate them whenever he wants but he probably has less power over them both while in Mist.
 
eaglejarl said:
Written as intended. Noburi repeated what Kagome said.
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The way the scene's written, it's not obvious Jiraiya would know that? Hazou reports, mentions that K said he'd kill Hana if she wasn't helping, and then Noburi says his piece:

eaglejarl said:
Jiraiya sat motionless for several seconds, silently considering Hazō's report.

[...]

"Hmm," Jiraiya said. He thought for a moment, then nodded unwillingly. "I suppose that's true. Noburi, anything to add?"

Noburi shook his head. "No sir. For what it's worth, it does seem to have helped, at least a little. Mari-sensei is out of bed every morning, eating and exercising. She's obviously not anything like healed, but she's vaguely functional again. Kurosawa accomplished that much."
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Tua said:
I just realized that sending Hana back to Mist isn't as good of a method to get Hazou away from her as initially thought since Hazou is going there as well in a week for the tournament.

And chances are Hana will cling to him even more now after Jiraiya (and by extension Mari - or so Hana will think) made it clear that he can easily seperate them whenever he wants but he probably has less power over them both while in Mist.
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Alright, we need to manipulate things such that Hana realizes that even Hazou thinks her actions were uncalled for by minimizing contact with her and driving her back into her drunken stupor.

This is the best possible outcome and should have no negative consequences whatsoever.
 
Tua said:
I just realized that sending Hana back to Mist isn't as good of a method to get Hazou away from her as initially thought since Hazou is going there as well in a week for the tournament.

And chances are Hana will cling to him even more now after Jiraiya (and by extension Mari - or so Hana will think) made it clear that he can easily seperate them whenever he wants but he probably has less power over them both while in Mist.
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It's worth noting that one of the considerations given as part of the letter sent may be that Hana is put under Jiraiya's authority at equivalent levels to Ren herself while in Leaf. (No revealing clan secrets or anything, of course, but.)
MMKII said:

This is a trap.
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Why is this a trap?
 
Cariyaga said:
It's worth noting that one of the considerations given as part of the letter sent may be that Hana is put under Jiraiya's authority at equivalent levels to Ren herself while in Leaf. (No revealing clan secrets or anything, of course, but.)

Why is this a trap?
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It is my opinion, that devoting more resources/discussion towards modelling character social interaction is not going to be very beneficial for numerous reasons.
 
Langevin said:
The way the scene's written, it's not obvious Jiraiya would know that? Hazou reports, mentions that K said he'd kill Hana if she wasn't helping, and then Noburi says his piece:
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The scene literally opens with Kagome sensei saying that, by way of Hazō:

eaglejarl said:
"...and Kagome-sensei said that he wouldn't do anything as long as Momma's actions continued to help Mari-sensei, but that if he felt they weren't then he would tell Momma to stop and if she refused he would kill her."
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Emphasis added.
 
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