Even if you have a point, no one will listen to you if you're rude and impolite about it. You may claim that @Shrooms is an adult, and thus doesn't deserve to be spoken to with kindness, but I would point out that everyone in this community deserves to be treated with kindness, respect, and courtesy.

I just pointed out a time where @Shrooms moked me and I gave him an calm answer.

The same happened here, dealing with Ami in some overly nice fashion is just not going to wor or is in anyway helpful.

I am not a doormat, so yes, the rest is aggressive.
 
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I just pointed out a time where @Shrooms moked me and I gave him an calm answer.

The same happened here, dealing with Ami in some overly nice fashion is just not going to wor or is in anyway helpful.

I am not a doormat, so yes, the rest is aggressive.
Two wrongs don't make a right, even under similar circumstances. If you were offended by Shrooms's behavior at the time, then you should have reached out to him (either privately or in-thread) to discuss the matter with mutual civility and respect. You shouldn't have waited until a similar circumstance arrived so that you could "get him back."

Furthermore, there's a difference between calmly and rationally raising a possible concern and making your point in a deliberately rude way.
 
I am unambiguously opposed to pursuing Ami romantically and unambiguously in favour of treating the people in this thread kindly.
 
1) No, because you're not a child. And posted dumb shit like this:



Considering that the "Border Patrol mission" became something more complex, I don't care about your point.

2) Your plan doesn't accomplish anything but trying to be overly polite to Ami.

Try harder.
I just pointed out a time where @Shrooms moked me and I gave him an calm answer.

The same happened here, dealing with Ami in some overly nice fashion is just not going to wor or is in anyway helpful.

I am not a doormat, so yes, the rest is aggressive.
I did not see that as mocking you at all but rather a dark remark on how ninja are viewed as little more than tools made of meat. If you were offended by it I'd rather you have said something at the time, but I'm sorry.

That said, you're being a huge asshole right now and I don't really feel the need to engage in your pettiness. You bring up that Hazou needs to break up with Akane because Ami was mean to her yet neglect that Akane chooses to be friends with Ami herself. You mention how irrationally protective of Kei Ami is yet neglect that Hazou did the same and worse over Hagoromo's insults regarding her. Etc. If you don't like the plan, don't vote for it, but don't be a jerk for like no reason
 
Definitely feel like this isn't the ideal framing of how to discuss this with Mari. It could definitely lead to her deciding that Hazō is to soft to have an accurate understanding of what's going on and that she might need to take in independent action to deal with Ami if she perceives her to be a threat.
What I'm hoping for meta-wise is for Mari to take the threat seriously while Hazou remains innocent enough that Ami doesn't immediately see through his intents, so I am pretty okay with Mari doing what she deems necessary. I don't think she would kill Ami unless it really came down to it but if it did come down to it I don't want Hazou to be the reason Mari fails
 
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I did not see that as mocking you at all but rather a dark remark on how ninja are viewed as little more than tools made of meat. If you were offended by it I'd rather you have said something at the time, but I'm sorry.
Ok. I am not deeply offended, just be more clear about what your point is.

That said, you're being a huge asshole right now and I don't really feel the need to engage in your pettiness.

Ok sorry, I wasn't trying to be a big asshole, but I was.

Being nice to Ami just doesn't do much. But yes, you do you.

That's my whole point, Hazou shouldn't do that.
 
Should he actually attend? It's a good chance to spread word about the DRAGONWAR, but he's no Diplomat.
  • Also, some of Akatsuki love him, some hate him. Might sow unnecessary discord by being there.
    • Still, it would be nice having Sasori's help with the Great Seal...
  • For that matter, out of curiosity has Ami heard anything about Hidan recently?

Will vote for this if you add asking her advice on how to get the Kurosawa to help us out with great seal and start developing a working relationship strongly tilted in our favor
 
What I'm hoping for meta-wise is for Mari to take the threat seriously while Hazou remains innocent enough that Ami doesn't immediately see through his intents, so I am pretty okay with Mari doing what she deems necessary. I don't think she would kill Ami unless it really came down to it but if it did come down to it I don't want Hazou to be the reason Mari fails
Is this a huge concern since the conversation is in private? Ami isn't a mind-reader. Although she has been known to make very very large leaps of.....intuition where Hazou's state of mind is concerned. So perhaps it's for the best.
 
As long as Kei is alive, Ami is extremely valuable to Uplift. Probably more than the Goketsu.
FOOM can keep Ami alive.
Hazou already "promised" (forget the exact wording) to Kei and Ami to give Ami FOOM. Going back would be a betrayal.
 
Ok, so we have 8 ninja on estate.
So here's the plan to sell FOOM to asuma

First sanity check the hell with mari.
First we bring attention to Hazou's ability to form complex plans quickly, then mention that is not all he can do, he is also able to optimize training regimes in order to avoid blocks and stagnation, ensuring that chunin would be able to make special jounin strenght in optimal time.
Make clear of the cost that this method ensures, namely hazou would know exactly how strong someone is and what are their specialities, this would not go well wen attempted in ninja from other clans.
Then explain to Asuma how the goketsu method of shadow clone training work, how hazou is able to calculate how much someone can push without being seriously hurt, explain the downsides on lost of relative power on the short and medium term in favor of a noticeable shorter overall time that would take a chunnin to achieve spec jounindom.

then ask some things, first a pardon from haru so he can be a ninja again.
then permission to teach shadow clone internally so hazou can bolster leaf as much as possible without political headaches.
Then ask to extraordinarily give all clans 3 more tickets (5 in total) so they can bolster their depleted ranks.

pary to jashin the will of fire to not get killboxed.
 
[X] Action Plan: We Need to Talk About Ami

Is there any way you can sneak in a "congrats on your repatriation" into that plan?

We always knew Ami was better than us at secretly doing the treasons, but now she's doing it blatantly! Jealous!
 
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I want to experiment whit something.
Let's make a sharp chakra barrier and a skyslicer collide to see which one overpowers the other, that way if the biju are 100% pure chakra we will know whether we could even be able to use it against them.
You know, for when they come knocking next week.
 
[X] Action Plan: We Need to Talk About Ami

Premise: It will soon become clear that the SC users of the Goketsu are rapidly becoming stronger than those without. Furthermore, Ami may leverage her position in Leaf in order to acquire the Shadow Clone technique. As a social spec jonin, it is probable that she has higher than average Resolve, which would allow her to begin using FOOM almost immediately. Shikamaru also suspects what we are doing, and I find it likely that is Ami got FOOM information out of Akane, it is possible Ino has as well.

What I'm trying to say is that FOOM is not as secret as we intended it to be, and any of these parties can use this information to negotiate with Asuma for greater access to the jutsu.

I say we beat them to the punch.
Firstly, we've yet to reach the point where FOOM breaks even on investment (for Akane/Kei this should be at the end of Detour 1, i.e. when they reach Resolve 70 after idling at Resolve 69 for a while grinding column stats), so we're still a long way away from worrying about 'what's their secret?' from the general populace. You do have a point about Ami and Shikamaru plausibly figuring it out and ruining our sales pitch for it.

However... the critical value of FOOM is not what we get by selling it to Asuma, but how it's our path to supremacy. Selling it earlier ensures that Ami can't sell it for us, but it also means we hard-cut the comparative advantage we get from it to, well, not that much overall. Asuma and whoever he trusts to FOOM would start powering up before we could even get close to their level, ensuring that they always stay ahead of us. The longer we hold exclusivity on FOOM, the better our comparative advantage, and the gains from selling it are the cherry on top, nice to have but not worth trading away a layer of the cake just to make sure.

That said, if there's reason to believe that Ami would sell it in a way that reaches Orochimaru's ears, that's absolutely reason to pre-empt her and do it right, because FOOM-Oro is an existential threat. I don't presently think that's likely though, because an Ami who knows enough about FOOM to sell it would similarly not want it to get into Orochimaru's hands, and neither would Asuma either.

Ultimately I think it's reasonable to learn more about what Ami knows and/or what she might do once she knows, or to try and guide her potential response without leaking even more info, or something along those lines, but I don't think that we're in such a bad spot that the best thing for us to do is abandon ship and sell it while the selling's hot. Not yet.
I don't mind, but the word count probably needs to be trimmed first
I personally approve getting the Kurosawa on board with the Great Seal (if anyone can give us some tips on the Iron Nerve as it applies to seal downloads, it's them), but I disapprove of trying to make the working relationship 'strongly tilted in our favor'. Firstly, we are not diplomat enough to be adversarial with them and perform particularly impressively. Secondly, I'm not personally interested in the 'become the Kurosawa heir' scheme that the line seems geared towards, nor do I think Hazou would be at all interested in substantial cooperation with the Kurosawa who exiled and suppressed his mother.

The Kurosawa are most likely going to be useful to the Dragonwar, and so there's nothing wrong with cooperating with them towards that end, but I do not see the need, gain, or merit in pursuing a long-term relationship with them, let alone starting it by trying to act like we're already a better diplomat than Ren.
 
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Firstly, we've yet to reach the point where FOOM breaks even on investment (for Akane/Kei this should be at the end of Detour 1, i.e. when they reach Resolve 70 after idling at Resolve 69 for a while grinding column stats), so we're still a long way away from worrying about 'what's their secret?' from the general populace. You do have a point about Ami and Shikamaru plausibly figuring it out and ruining our sales pitch for it.

However... the critical value of FOOM is not what we get by selling it to Asuma, but how it's our path to supremacy. Selling it earlier ensures that Ami can't sell it for us, but it also means we hard-cut the comparative advantage we get from it to, well, not that much overall. Asuma and whoever he trusts to FOOM would start powering up before we could even get close to their level, ensuring that they always stay ahead of us. The longer we hold exclusivity on FOOM, the better our comparative advantage, and the gains from selling it are the cherry on top, nice to have but not worth trading away a layer of the cake just to make sure.

That said, if there's reason to believe that Ami would sell it in a way that reaches Orochimaru's ears, that's absolutely reason to pre-empt her and do it right, because FOOM-Oro is an existential threat. I don't presently think that's likely though, because an Ami who knows enough about FOOM to sell it would similarly not want it to get into Orochimaru's hands, and neither would Asuma either.

Ultimately I think it's reasonable to learn more about what Ami knows and/or what she might do once she knows, or to try and guide her potential response without leaking even more info, or something along those lines, but I don't think that we're in such a bad spot that the best thing for us to do is abandon ship and sell it while the selling's hot. Not yet.
I will point out that the plan does not call for selling/giving FOOM to Asuma. It merely confirms what Asuma already knows, that the Goketsu have ways to increase their rate of growth, and that if he gives us more adoption tickets, he will get more jonin.
 
personally approve getting the Kurosawa on board with the Great Seal (if anyone can give us some tips on the Iron Nerve as it applies to seal downloads, it's them), but I disapprove of trying to make the working relationship 'strongly tilted in our favor'. Firstly, we are not diplomat enough to be adversarial with them and perform particularly impressively. Secondly, I'm not personally interested in the 'become the Kurosawa heir' scheme that the line seems geared towards, nor do I think Hazou would be at all interested in substantial cooperation with the Kurosawa who exiled and suppressed his mother.

The Kurosawa are most likely going to be useful to the Dragonwar, and so there's nothing wrong with cooperating with them towards that end, but I do not see the need, gain, or merit in pursuing a long-term relationship with them, let alone starting it by trying to act like we're already a better diplomat than Ren.
You don't have to worry about the become Kurosawa heir scheme becoming a reality. Entirely to much push back from the community to make that a viable path at all. This is just trying to see if theirs an angle where we get more out of the relationship than they do. Trying to make sure we don't get exploited

Edit: also if that phrasing is a big deal totally cool with removing it. Getting advice on a mutually beneficial working relationship is good enough
 
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[X] Hazou training plan: let's get to shaping earth already
Earthshaping 30 -> 34 (130xp)
Save 10 XP

I know early detours are sub-optimal, but it really doesn't feel like investing in great seal stats is viewed as the existential priority it is.
 
[X] Action Plan: We Need to Talk About Ami
@Shrooms , as part of my apology I vote for your plan.

But I still give you some polite criticism:

We technically don't have 4 Slots.

Let's not assume that were getting those slots yet from the Amori, we gave them their land, but we also caused them problems with the Bank Rush and there was a whole War in between.
 
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[X] Action Plan: We Need to Talk About Ami
@Shrooms , as part of my apology I vote for your plan.

But I still give you some polite criticism:

We technically don't have 4 Slots.

Let's not assume that were getting those slots yet from the Amori, we gave them their land, but we also caused the problems with the Bank Rush and there was a whole War in between.
Slots are supposed to refresh in January, so they should have willed them over some time ago or presumably we'd have cried foul, but I suppose we can ask since things have been hectic

@eaglejarl @Velorien Have the Amori already given us the slots they promised this year in exchange for the grape land?
 

Orochiamaru should be aware of the whole FOOM idea.

He is probably the only man alive who actually experimented on the SC, so he knows more about the ability than anyone else.

Ami figured 80% out on her own, meanwhile Oro can also observe Naruto and figure out whats happening with his actual knowledge of the technique.

Orochimaru is probably not FOOMing because the GM's just decided that a person with that much power doesn't really gain any XP that way anymore. And Oro simply doesn't give a shit about his social skills, there is people to be experimented on.


Neither are Kei and Snowflake. Who convinced Yoshida to ally with her with a sob story and Arikada believed her that Oro is back home.
No social rolls needed.

And Takahashi just needed an foreign ally, because he sucks.

We have:
  • The Mist Oyabun who wanted an allied summoner to talk with the Hokage (the situation in Mist obviously change a lot since then, but at minimum he probably does like money)
  • Yasuji, who wants to be heir and has already a business deal with us
  • Hana and Ren
Actually taking over the Kurosawa would make Asuma laugh his ass off, not complain or stopping us.

But if people don't want that, we still offer a lot of oppertunity to a Clan who lost the Kage position and has some random clan head.

And if we need a "diplomat", how about we talk with Ino or find a Dog?

It would be funny to see "Kurosawa clan head" vs "Dog Diplomat".
 
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