If you don't mind, what's your reasoning for choosing Shadow Imitation over Shadow Guardians?

Imo, Shadow Guardians (which is known to be useful at non-capstone levels) would be preferred over Shadow Imitation (which is designed to be a capstone attack).
I prefer Shadow Imitation because I read it as a utilityjutsu with exploit potential if used on objects/seals/stuff. Didn't really think too much on which jutsu to pick it over, but felt that Shadow Betrayal might be an AOE that can't differentiate friend from foe.
 
[X] We can use YSJ xp btw

Shadow Imitation: 1 -> 30 (464 XP)
Shadow Guardians: 1 -> 1
Shadow Step: 1 -> 20 (109 XP)
Shadow Betrayal: 1 -> 20 (109 XP)
Shadow Visage: 1 -> 20 (109 XP)

Spend 714 normal XP and 77 Yamanaka XP
 
Do we have any understanding of who supports us at the conclave and who are opposed to helping out?
Enma gave you a brief overview of his understanding of how people would feel of Hazou personally:
  • Hostile:
    • Condors -- Obvious reasons.
    • Rat -- Fairly dedicated pacifists and friends of the Condors.
    • Pangolins -- Cutting off skytower trade just before they crushed Hyena.
    • Leopard -- Stopping the crushing of Hyena, preventing the Leopards from getting rich on colonial spoils.
  • Neutral:
    • Mara -- Allied with Pangolins, will probably oppose you if the Pangolins ask but they're generally not eager to make enemies.
    • Otter -- Didn't engage much except to make sure there were no alliances formed against them.
    • Capybara -- Didn't engage much except to make sure there were no alliances formed against them.
    • Toad -- Staunchly neutral, Enma thinks they're still making up their mind about whether you or Noburi is the "real" inheritor of Jiraiya's legacy.
    • Snake -- (ambassador left the Conclave after the conclusion of the Human Path war)
  • Allied:
    • Turtle -- Benefited a lot from the trade network.
    • Porcupine -- Benefited a lot from the trade network.
    • Monkey -- Enma is in your corner.

Would you mind sharing any info Hazou has on the Conclave? Like, who are any big players there that Kei or Noburi has caught wind of, what is Hazou actually supposed to be doing there, etc? Any info on the setpiece we are walking into would be helpful for formulating plans.
The above.

Kei and Noburi can identify the summons that they see frequently in the course of their trade network business shuttling pallets of stuff back and forth. Many of these summons are traders and merchant-types that simply tell Kei/Noburi what they need to retrieve from who, and what they're offering in exchange.

Enma's proposal was that Hazou go befriend and convince the trade representatives of the various clans of the importance of the Dragons -- while these merchants may not have executive power, they definitely have more influence with their clans at large than Hazou does personally. When the real ambassadors come, they'll be more inclined to believe Enma's pitch if all their people at the Conclave are telling them that the Dragon problem is real and demands action. Enma will be busy with traveling, so he wants Hazou to do the groundwork to build up the sentiment that'll make their pitch really hit.

Is there anything more detailed that you would like, that you expect Kei and Noburi would know?


When does Mari (and Asuma, if we can ask him) think it would be best for Hazou and Co. to arrive at the Conclave?

He has a several options:
  • Proceed immediately
  • Wait a couple weeks
  • Wait for Enma to arrive in Toad
  • Wait until after Enma arrives in Toad
Do they think Hazou would be better off arriving with Noburi and Kei or by himself?

Should he ask the other Leaf Summoners (except Oro and Tsunade) to come with as well to present a united front?
Mari has been impressed with Hazou's recent progress in one-on-one socials -- she thinks he has a realistic shot at doing the groundwork that Enma asks for. Still, she doesn't think that he should go in right away. If he sells everyone on the existential risk of the Dragons, then they have to wait weeks before they can petition their bosses about it, there's a risk of losing the emotional rawness of the panic or having people freak out or turn into a "death cult" (her words). To Mari, ideally Hazou starts making his big pitch to people around two weeks before their bosses arrive. She wants to give them enough time to freak out and internalize the panic after Hazou addresses all their obvious objections, yet not long enough that they've lost the intensity of the feeling, nor long enough that they might start coming up with solutions that they try to pitch by their bosses. Mari wants Hazou to be the sole vendor of solutions to the Dragon crisis in the eyes of the summon clans. Probably, that means a week or so of general carousing before making the serious Dragon pitch.

Mari thinks Hazou would be better off arriving with Noburi and Kei -- though she notes that allying himself with the Pangolins could have costs (if the Pangolins even accept him!) and that the Toads might not appreciate Noburi declaring the Toads for Hazou like that. She thinks it may be wise to ally with the other Leaf summoners for a united front -- if the other Leaf summoners could be brought together like that! In general, the more Hazou looks like he has allies and connections, the better. It makes him look less like a froth-mouthed madman predicting apocalypses that never manifest.

Asuma has little to add to the specifics of how to run a social operation -- he defers to Mari as the expert. However, he adds the following:
  • Hazou should absolutely be asking other Leaf summoners about who in their trade delegations are the most influential, and picking his targets appropriately (Don't always hit the leaders! Bring down an organization at all levels, says Mari)
  • The Rats could be a lynchpin -- they're broadly agreed to be reasonable and respected. If Hazou can sway them, many will pay a lot of attention to that.
  • The Mara have a lot of soft-power, but their summoner is an enemy. Clear any plans to interact with them through Asuma first (not that F has been spotted at the Conclave).
  • The Porcupines are fairly small-minded and focused on the little things in life. It'll be hard to sell them on a big picture threat.
  • The Otters and Capybara are largely here for fear of being cut out of potential (esp. military) alliances. Hazou could try to play on that fear, but he'll need to be delicate to avoid alienating them.
  • Save the Turtles for last. Having the Turtles evangelizing for Hazou will probably hurt his cause.
 
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Did you mean arrives in Pangolin?
I did mean that yes, correct some reason I thought the Conclave was in Toad.
  • Hostile:
    • Condors -- Obvious reasons.
    • Otter -- Fairly dedicated pacifists and friends of the Condors.
    • Pangolins -- Cutting off skytower trade just before they crushed Hyena.
    • Leopard -- Stopping the crushing of Hyena, preventing the Leopards from getting rich on colonial spoils.
  • Neutral:
    • Mara -- Allied with Pangolins, will probably oppose you if the Pangolins ask but they're generally not eager to make enemies.
    • Rat -- Didn't engage much except to make sure there were no alliances formed against them.
    • Capybara -- Didn't engage much except to make sure there were no alliances formed against them.
    • Toad -- Staunchly neutral, Enma thinks they're still making up their mind about whether you or Noburi is the "real" inheritor of Jiraiya's legacy.
    • Snake -- (ambassador left the Conclave after the conclusion of the Human Path war)
  • Allied:
    • Turtle -- Benefited a lot from the trade network.
    • Porcupine -- Benefited a lot from the trade network.
    • Monkey -- Enma is in your corner.
No Slug?
 
  • Hostile:
    • Condors -- Obvious reasons.
    • Otter -- Fairly dedicated pacifists and friends of the Condors.
    • Pangolins -- Cutting off skytower trade just before they crushed Hyena.
    • Leopard -- Stopping the crushing of Hyena, preventing the Leopards from getting rich on colonial spoils.
  • Neutral:
    • Mara -- Allied with Pangolins, will probably oppose you if the Pangolins ask but they're generally not eager to make enemies.
    • Rat -- Didn't engage much except to make sure there were no alliances formed against them.
    • Capybara -- Didn't engage much except to make sure there were no alliances formed against them.
    • Toad -- Staunchly neutral, Enma thinks they're still making up their mind about whether you or Noburi is the "real" inheritor of Jiraiya's legacy.
    • Snake -- (ambassador left the Conclave after the conclusion of the Human Path war)
  • Allied:
    • Turtle -- Benefited a lot from the trade network.
    • Porcupine -- Benefited a lot from the trade network.
    • Monkey -- Enma is in your corner.
Are any Hyenas present? Think I remember they aren't but thought I'd ask
 
[X] Action Plan: Laying the Groundwork
Word Count:TBD
  • Timeline: 5 days
  • Sanity check: Mari, Kei
  • Find a defensible spot to camp well inside the border of Pangolin
    • Set up a camp with camouflaged skyslicers on the perimeter.
    • And MARS paired implosion seals
    • Give each seal-trained Dog a section of the perimeter traps to activate if the camp is attacked
    • Prepare the defenses like Kagome will be inspecting your work for thoroughness.
  • Notify the nearest Pangolin outpost of your presence
    • Just resting on our way to the Conclave
    • If they seem unhappy about it, bribe them
    • If they seem very unhappy about it, play on your kinship with Pangolin Summoner
  • Spend the majority of the days in Leaf
    • Any dogs that want to come are welcome
      • Check in with the Seventh Path throughout the day
    • Work on seal research
      • If Hazou thinks he can get away without using SSA Multithread SCs for Goo Bombs and Macerators 3.0
      • If those are finished, prep a single day for Dragon's Roar to gauge its difficultly and start Rocket Boots (with Kagome's permission and help if possible)
    • (Offscreen) Ask Kei and Noburi about their Clan's representatives at the Conclave.
      • Ask them if what they think about arriving together. Relay Mari's concerns
      • Get a crash course in Toad and Pangolin body language and gestures to help build Rapport with their reps. Take notes, study then
    • Start meeting with the other Leaf Summoners. Priority, Condor, Porcupine, Turtle
      • Ask them if they know anything about their Clan's representatives.
      • Get the same crash course on body language and culture.
      • Ask them to present a united front at the Conclave about the importance of the Crusade.
    • Keep checking in to Arachnid in case Enma arrives.
      • If he does, end the update early.
      • Meet with Condors there, ask them for help building Rapport with other members of their Clan.
____________________________________
I'm going to keep updating this until Tuesday night. Ping me here or on Disc if you have questions, comments, or concerns. I'll do my best to implement them
 
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[X] Action Plan: Laying the Groundwork
Word Count:TBD
  • Timeline: 10 days
  • Sanity check: Mari, Kei
  • Find a defensible spot to camp well inside the border of Pangolin
    • Set up a camp with camouflaged skyslicers on the perimeter.
    • And MARS paired implosion seals
    • Give each seal-trained Dog a section of the perimeter traps to activate if the camp is attacked
    • In general, act like Kagome will be inspecting your work for thoroughness.
  • Notify the nearest Pangolin outpost of your presence
    • Just resting on our way to the Conclave
    • If they seem unhappy about it, bribe them
    • If they seem very unhappy about it, play on your kinship with Pangolin Summoner
  • Spend the majority of the day in Leaf
    • Work on seal research
      • If Hazou thinks he can get away without using SSA Multithread SCs for Goo Bombs and Macerators 3.0
      • Once those are finished, ask Kagome if he's willing to let you research Implosion seals and Rocket Boots. Work with him on it if he has time.
    • Ask Kei and Noburi about their Clan's representatives at the Conclave.
      • Ask them if what they think about arriving together. Relay Mari's concerns
      • Get a crash course in Toad and Pangolin body language and gestures to help build Rapport with their reps. Take notes, study then
    • Start meeting with the other Leaf Summoners. Priority, Condor Hedgehog, Turtle (am I missing any here guys?)
      • Ask them if they know anything about their Clan's representatives.
      • Get the same crash course on body language and culture.
      • Consider approaching Neji through Hinata.
      • Ask them to consider arriving with Hazou to present a united front.
        • Exercise Hazou's (Mari's) best judgement here. We don't want an incident between Pangolins and Condors
    • Keep checking in to Arachnid in case Enma arrives.
      • If he does, end the update early.
      • Meet with Condors, ask them for help building Rapport with other members of their Clan.
    • Check in with Cannai
      • Report the attack and the aftermath
        • Hazou is deeply ashamed that he couldn't protect the Horizon Chasers.
____________________________________
I'm going to keep updating this until Tuesday night. Ping me here or on Disc if you have questions, comments, or concerns. I'll do my best to implement them
So my immediate concern with this plan is that while it's fine it does seem like the sort of thing paper will give low base rate for, since it's mostly prepping to do things rather than doing things. (I could be mistaken, @Paperclipped feel free to share your opinion.) May be worth adding something actionable at the end of all the prep. Or if we're fine with accepting bad base rate for the moment to get a better framework for our approach then perhaps we can just do it anyways.

Edit: missed the bit about talking to the Condors, might be worth expanding on that bit? That seems to meet the criteria I meant.

Edit 2:
Meet with Condors, ask them for help building Rapport with other members of their Clan.
Ah i thought you meant Conclave Condors, I think the Condors in Arachnid already left to rejoin the other Condor freedom fighters.

Porcupine

Ask them to consider arriving with Hazou to present a united front.

Enma seemed to think it was a good idea for Hazou to play on Jiraiya legacy stuff, so arriving as a trio with Kei and Noburi as both his heirs and a sort of echo to the Sannin is also an option I think is both solid and pretty cool
 
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I'll admit some hesitance wrt Shadow Imitation, but if we can use Yamanaka XP to get Kei a 30 and several 20s? Works for me.

[X] We can use YSJ xp btw
 
Ah i thought you meant Conclave Condors, I think the Condors in Arachnid already left to rejoin the other Condor freedom fighters
That's not my understanding I thought they were planning on testifying at the Conclave. @eaglejarl @Velorien @Paperclipped are the Codors we rescued still in Arachnid?
Enma seemed to think it was a good idea for Hazou to play on Jiraiya legacy stuff, so arriving as a trio with Kei and Noburi as both his heirs and a sort of echo to the Sannin is also an option I think is both solid and pretty cool
I don't necessarily disagree with the vibes, but there are real concerns with the Pangolins supporting us.
she notes that allying himself with the Pangolins could have costs (if the Pangolins even accept him!)
They might not even be willing to support Hazou at all.
She thinks it may be wise to ally with the other Leaf summoners for a united front -- if the other Leaf summoners could be brought together like that! In general, the more Hazou looks like he has allies and connections, the better. It makes him look less like a froth-mouthed madman predicting apocalypses that never manifest
And there's this. The more support the better. Certainly we need to meet with the Summoners to ask them about their trade reps. Might as well feel them out about coming with Hazou at the same time.
 
I don't necessarily disagree with the vibes, but there are real concerns with the Pangolins supporting us.
I'm not saying no other Summoners at all, we could arrange to meet them there at the Conclave. I just specifically mean the initial approach. It would definitely be good to have them around though, especially Ruri who is a good diplomat.
 
[X] Action Plan: Laying the Groundwork
Word Count:TBD
  • Timeline: 10 days
  • Sanity check: Mari, Kei
  • Find a defensible spot to camp well inside the border of Pangolin
    • Set up a camp with camouflaged skyslicers on the perimeter.
    • And MARS paired implosion seals
    • Give each seal-trained Dog a section of the perimeter traps to activate if the camp is attacked
    • In general, act like Kagome will be inspecting your work for thoroughness.
  • Notify the nearest Pangolin outpost of your presence
    • Just resting on our way to the Conclave
    • If they seem unhappy about it, bribe them
    • If they seem very unhappy about it, play on your kinship with Pangolin Summoner
  • Spend the majority of the day in Leaf
    • Work on seal research
      • If Hazou thinks he can get away without using SSA Multithread SCs for Goo Bombs and Macerators 3.0
      • Once those are finished, ask Kagome if he's willing to let you research Implosion seals and Rocket Boots. Work with him on it if he has time.
    • Ask Kei and Noburi about their Clan's representatives at the Conclave.
      • Ask them if what they think about arriving together. Relay Mari's concerns
      • Get a crash course in Toad and Pangolin body language and gestures to help build Rapport with their reps. Take notes, study then
    • Start meeting with the other Leaf Summoners. Priority, Condor Hedgehog, Turtle (am I missing any here guys?)
      • Ask them if they know anything about their Clan's representatives.
      • Get the same crash course on body language and culture.
      • Consider approaching Neji through Hinata.
      • Ask them to consider arriving with Hazou to present a united front.
        • Exercise Hazou's (Mari's) best judgement here. We don't want an incident between Pangolins and Condors
    • Keep checking in to Arachnid in case Enma arrives.
      • If he does, end the update early.
      • Meet with Condors, ask them for help building Rapport with other members of their Clan.
    • Check in with Cannai
      • Report the attack and the aftermath
        • Hazou is deeply ashamed that he couldn't protect the Horizon Chasers.
____________________________________
I'm going to keep updating this until Tuesday night. Ping me here or on Disc if you have questions, comments, or concerns. I'll do my best to implement them

I think that our approach with the conclave should be to first approach the Pangolins, as the host and so that they do not take offense at us approaching the Condors first, but the Condors should be who we focus our attention on. This is not because I expect to make particular progress with the Condors, but because the Otters, who value pacifism (I assume that's true and that the stuff Faflec found is being retconned? @eaglejarl @Velorien @Paperclipped) should see us making genuine efforts toward the Condors. Give it a few days of that, and then approach the Otters.

In particular, we should invoke and publically reveal our High Concept Aspect: Creative Idealist. Make it clear to everyone that that is what Hazou is. This will open us up to it being used against us -- that doesn't matter, because I think that to bring the Otters on board will require a certain level of willingness to commit our skin to the game.

For specific plan feedback:
  1. That seems like a lot to put in a single plan. That's like, 6-7 scenes? Trim it down to what you want to see on screen. We have time, having gotten there early. I'd recommend focusing on getting Neji, Ruri, and the Porcupine summoner on board.
  2. The Sealing section seems a little sparse on details. What do you want out of Macerators 3.0? I assume better combat efficacy, but how? Increased spread, faster speed, larger storage mass?
  3. 'Consider' meeting Neji through Hinata? Either do it or don't, unless you're specifically interested in seeing Hazou think about it and not do it, that shouldn't be the words used. May I ask why we're doing it through Hinata? Neji is his own person, and as the wielder of a summon scroll has a substantial amount of political power within the Hyuuga. I don't think it's a snub against Hinata to approach him about it directly.
 
Enma told us that we needed to bring some Big Jirayia Energy to the conclave. So what I say we do is to start conspiring with Ruri on how we want to launch a coup against the Pangolins.
 
Enma told us that we needed to bring some Big Jirayia Energy to the conclave. So what I say we do is to start conspiring with Ruri on how we want to launch a coup against the Pangolins.
I think a start would be working out a way for Conjura to help out against the dragons -- if we can make that happen, we can probably propagandize her heroism into freeing her people.
 
  1. 'Consider' meeting Neji through Hinata? Either do it or don't, unless you're specifically interested in seeing Hazou think about it and not do it, that shouldn't be the words used. May I ask why we're doing it through Hinata? Neji is his own person, and as the wielder of a summon scroll has a substantial amount of political power within the Hyuuga. I don't think it's a snub against Hinata to approach him about it directly.

Also we've already established with Neji that we think summoner business is above clan concerns. We are special because of our shared bond to walk the path

Hazō studied Neji carefully before choosing which part of the script to move to next. "You understand that this deal is between the Summoners, right? Only those of us who have travelled through the Paths are worthy, and only we have the knowledge to make it work. The arrangement will be approved by the Hokage and all military intelligence gained will be presented to him immediately, but it's a deal between individuals. How you involve the rest of the Hyūga is up to you—obviously you shouldn't conceal it from them, but you can choose your own approach."
 
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