So, we're an elective monarchy.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
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- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
So, we're an elective monarchy.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
There can be no true dictatorships (military or otherwise) in MfD-verse because you need support and a resource base. Ninja need to eat,sleep, etc.
Rational! Dragonball Z likely would be a different story.
- Location
- USA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
He's two weeks from the end of his three-month probationary period. Whether or not he keeps the hat after this is based on results and politics.
Sure, go for it. It will probably be a while before we process the, though.
Whatever you want. Treat it as a normal open-ended vote.
I wasn't deliberately trolling, I simply fell prey to typical mind fallacy, assuming everyone else knew what I did about timing.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Clarification:
You still want us to do the Mist (stay or go) thing then, I assume?
Noumero
Omit Needless Words
@MMKII, WRT Nakano Ryouichi:
He was Blue first round, not either ISC's teammate or on our assigned Blue Team. That means he scored -225 in R1 and either -495 or -330 during R2. Overall, if he had e. g. 300 points after the Fourth Event, he now has -255 or -420.
Team Kurenai, in comparison, has +135 or -30. These scores are conjoined: either he has -255 and Kurenai has -30, or he has -420 and Kurenai has +135.
I don't think we should save him. His best-case scenario has him scoring 225 points below Team Kurenai, meaning we'll need to push him up by 290+225 = 515 points, or 52 word-halves if they're worth 10 points.
29 word-halves are enough to send one member of Team Kurenai into the tournement in this scenario. As such, declining to help Team Kurenai in exchange for him will be a political statement.
There are some arguments for making that statement (e. g., Haru), but I don't think we should.
(Note that I'm running on an uncomfortable number of assumptions at this point, but it should be roughly correct.)
He was Blue first round, not either ISC's teammate or on our assigned Blue Team. That means he scored -225 in R1 and either -495 or -330 during R2. Overall, if he had e. g. 300 points after the Fourth Event, he now has -255 or -420.
Team Kurenai, in comparison, has +135 or -30. These scores are conjoined: either he has -255 and Kurenai has -30, or he has -420 and Kurenai has +135.
I don't think we should save him. His best-case scenario has him scoring 225 points below Team Kurenai, meaning we'll need to push him up by 290+225 = 515 points, or 52 word-halves if they're worth 10 points.
29 word-halves are enough to send one member of Team Kurenai into the tournement in this scenario. As such, declining to help Team Kurenai in exchange for him will be a political statement.
There are some arguments for making that statement (e. g., Haru), but I don't think we should.
(Note that I'm running on an uncomfortable number of assumptions at this point, but it should be roughly correct.)
Politics: Neji made Hiashi look bad, the Gouketsu were generous in saving him from becoming a pariah.
- Location
- The Void
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Also need to talk to Yakuza. Maybe something about bloodrage. Maybe more work turning Neji. Make sure we stay in touch with round 1 teammates
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Finding Akatsuki and therefore Naruto has at least some leads generated.
As far as the politics goes, things were roughly tied there last that we saw, with Results being what would break the deadlock. Hiashi trying to cut out several clans by having their invitations 'lost' will likely bite him due to Hyuga arrogance. Neji causing an incident due to Hyuga arrogance will further erode his support. Our performance will vindicate Jiraiya with respect to taking us in, and the trade treaties should boost support as well.
Don't forget last minute shopping. Like seafood and grocery. A taste of home, after all.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Dear Politicking and Word Half Distribution Plotting Friends:
In light of thoughts about Jiraiya's tenure as Hokage and various political considerations to that end, I have just thought of an excellent point to this end that may score us some extra credit:
As far as I was aware: Inuzaka and Aburame were not blood allies or anything with Hyuga. They can still potentially be swayed. As such, maybe NOT making a spectacle of the word half thing and only doing it between us, them and ISC would be beneficial. Kiba and Shino will go back to their clans and report that we did them a solid in the name of Greater Leaf Domination. This will likely raise us up a few points in the Aburame's and Inuzaka's eyes.
Something to consider.
Ah. @Cariyaga we will have to settle for doing him a serious solid in some other way. Maybe gift him a few years salary worth of explosives and invite him to board game nights henceforth? In addition to the medic thing.
Another thing:
...But at the same time are totally willing to do this Ami thing for no other reason than an in-joke, when this may open up a serious can of emotional worms with Keiko.
Do we not care about Keiko? Relatively speaking, I care more about the general opinion of Team Uplift on actions orders of magnitude more than I care about how Named Ninja 43 from Rock Village feels about us and general things he might say afterwards that won't effect things too much in the short to medium term.
Not pointing any fingers. Just taking the opportunity to say that.
In light of thoughts about Jiraiya's tenure as Hokage and various political considerations to that end, I have just thought of an excellent point to this end that may score us some extra credit:
As far as I was aware: Inuzaka and Aburame were not blood allies or anything with Hyuga. They can still potentially be swayed. As such, maybe NOT making a spectacle of the word half thing and only doing it between us, them and ISC would be beneficial. Kiba and Shino will go back to their clans and report that we did them a solid in the name of Greater Leaf Domination. This will likely raise us up a few points in the Aburame's and Inuzaka's eyes.
Something to consider.
Ah. @Cariyaga we will have to settle for doing him a serious solid in some other way. Maybe gift him a few years salary worth of explosives and invite him to board game nights henceforth? In addition to the medic thing.
Also talk to the Yakuza.
Another thing:
It really bothers me that some of y'all were getting on the fence about a bluff speech to literal strangers on grounds of making them not like us or ruining our general public image as nice guys...
...But at the same time are totally willing to do this Ami thing for no other reason than an in-joke, when this may open up a serious can of emotional worms with Keiko.
Do we not care about Keiko? Relatively speaking, I care more about the general opinion of Team Uplift on actions orders of magnitude more than I care about how Named Ninja 43 from Rock Village feels about us and general things he might say afterwards that won't effect things too much in the short to medium term.
Not pointing any fingers. Just taking the opportunity to say that.
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Vecht
Self-Requested Ban
- Location
- Snarksville, Snarkland
H: *fuming* This is beneath even you, Jiraiya.
J: Oh?
H: Don't play coy with me. These trade deals are far too one-sided for any sane tradesman -- much less a Kage -- to agree to. How deeply did you sell us out so you could look good on paper to the council? How much of Leaf did you screw over just so you could keep the hat?
J: My dearest friend Hiashi, you know that details of this nature are a matter of village security. If you would like, you may lodge a formal inquiry to the office of the Hokage -- I believe Nara is handling those now? If you would like, I will send him a personal missive to expedite the process.
H: *deathglare*
J: *S-rank Smug Grin no Jutsu*
- Location
- Yes.
Alright, more in-depth analysis.
I'm a bit less in agreement with Noburi going to the Hinago Medical Facility (NB: the Hydra Medical Facility has nothing to do with the Capybaras save metaknowledge of Orochimaru being involved). It's in Rice, which is notoriously isolationist: our missing-nin selves wouldn't care much about that but our Leaf selves would be subject to way more scrutiny. There are probably ninja guards out of the wazoo, and...well, last time we were in Rice it didn't go so well for us. The fact that it's also a ways away from Leaf means that we'd have to spend upwards of a week doing any investigation, though this may be mitigated by doing some wilderness training or something. Might I suggest checking in with Jiraiya, see what leads his investigations into the thing turned up, and we can maybe just skip this step in favor of acting on that intel instead?
Hazō and the Yakuza...I'm honestly not sure if the Yakuza would give leads on Summoners, since in Chapter 140 Minami expects their Summoner-related knowledge to be based on ninja on retainer; this suggests that any information the Yakuza could give would be supported by Mist...who would not likely be willing to part with such valuable intel. And also because our trust is nowhere near the point where they would want to, even if they had it. To get to that point...it would take a month, at least. We'd be better served talking to Jiraiya directly, since his spy network is probably greater than Mist's and he'd be more willing to give us actionable intel.
So yes, I do want rumors to be spread about us which will set up expectations for us to smash the tournament, and once we win that we can start people singing our praises to further the idea of our badassery. But doing the bards and books now seems...premature, I guess. Apologies if this was unclear from my previous post.
I fully agree that Keiko could get information from the Pangolins, and would argue that her time would be better spent getting Pandā or a similar Pangolin (who isn't going to be critical to the tournament/training) to do research in the Summoning Realm. This is because Keiko doesn't actually know the Pangolin written language (she had to get Pandā to translate when getting Akatsuki intel) and also because it saves her a ton of a time to be researching elsewhere (e.g., Konoha/Nara library).
I'm a bit less in agreement with Noburi going to the Hinago Medical Facility (NB: the Hydra Medical Facility has nothing to do with the Capybaras save metaknowledge of Orochimaru being involved). It's in Rice, which is notoriously isolationist: our missing-nin selves wouldn't care much about that but our Leaf selves would be subject to way more scrutiny. There are probably ninja guards out of the wazoo, and...well, last time we were in Rice it didn't go so well for us. The fact that it's also a ways away from Leaf means that we'd have to spend upwards of a week doing any investigation, though this may be mitigated by doing some wilderness training or something. Might I suggest checking in with Jiraiya, see what leads his investigations into the thing turned up, and we can maybe just skip this step in favor of acting on that intel instead?
Hazō and the Yakuza...I'm honestly not sure if the Yakuza would give leads on Summoners, since in Chapter 140 Minami expects their Summoner-related knowledge to be based on ninja on retainer; this suggests that any information the Yakuza could give would be supported by Mist...who would not likely be willing to part with such valuable intel. And also because our trust is nowhere near the point where they would want to, even if they had it. To get to that point...it would take a month, at least. We'd be better served talking to Jiraiya directly, since his spy network is probably greater than Mist's and he'd be more willing to give us actionable intel.
Right, I feel that this is not unreasonable, though I feel we may end up settling for some other ninja. Guy already has a team and him training us may be seen poorly by his students (yes, they're not in the Exams, but it puts a weird look on the dynamic), and Kakashi has something going on with him since he never was part of Team 7 despite his having a Sharingan and thus being suited to train Sasuke. We may end up being taught by Ebisu or some other elite-but-not-S-class Jonin. There's nothing wrong with trying and I do support this, I'm just illustrating the possibility of failure to keep salt from flying if we don't get them.
Right, so the point of contention I was having with this was the "hiring bards" and "commissioning a book" part. Right now, our legacy in the Exams has been due to us doing well in the Third and Fifth Events. We did well, but most of this wasn't seen by the greater community (merchants, daimyo, etc.) and none of it was in a life-or-death scenario. It's good, yes, definitely worthy of rumors starting up, but it's not "blow-everyone-out-of-the-water" good, like breaking the tournament would be. The latter is what I'd want bards to be singing, or books to be written about.
So yes, I do want rumors to be spread about us which will set up expectations for us to smash the tournament, and once we win that we can start people singing our praises to further the idea of our badassery. But doing the bards and books now seems...premature, I guess. Apologies if this was unclear from my previous post.
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
I had a more subtle idea to this end. Instead of hiring bards or minstrels or whatever, we can just make sure that the Yakuza spread rumour of Event 5's Glorious Beatdown to every other seedy tavern or back alley dive bar. This will help jumpstart the process without being too overt. Its also not a massive favour to ask of the Yakuza: it can literally be done in their agent's downtime.
Valid Point: The greater community did not see this firsthand, as it was a closed situation.
Counterpoint: So naturally, everyone will hear about it in a week regardless as part of the general rumour mill. No reason not to jump start that process so we can definitely frame it in a way that benefits us and makes us look scary and awesome.
I don't see the above as super unreasonable, and it only sets the stage for further such manipulations when we win the tournament. How doth thou feel?
- Location
- The Maple Syrup Mountains
I don't want to approach Ami as anything other than Keiko's sister and an influential politically active Mist Jounin. The in-jokes are fine and all, but I'm not inclined to see them acted on because they're jokes. That said, there is some level of interaction with Ami actually befitting our positions, so we may find it worthwhile to build connections with an up and coming influential Mist-nin as an up and coming influential Leaf-nin, and even maybe figure out what her faction of the gameboard is all about.
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
I'm not actually interested in the date so much as clarifying things between her and Keiko. I'm just riding on the coattails of that.
e:
Basically this.
- Location
- Yes.
This is fine; spreading rumors, as I've said, is perfectly acceptable to me. Having that expectation in the back of everyone's mind, and having it be validated at the tournament, will set up the second half (second coming of the Sannin) nicely.
- Location
- USA
It's hard for me to convey how diametrically opposed I am to this. Seriously, fuck no. What the fuck happened to meritocracy in the ninja-world, are we just hard advocating that those with power/boons can just dictate things as they see fit? This feels incredibly hypocritical, sparing certain ninja from our moderate injuries was pushing it as is
Noumero
Omit Needless Words
I'm afraid we already destroyed any semblance of "fairness" these Exams had. We were the most powerful combat team by far, and we were put on a heavy-combat event, paired up with relative weakling. The fact of it, coupled with the scoring rules, warped everything: the ones who are at the top now are the ones who just happened to be on a team with us.
Everyone else's work was wiped.
It's not even really our fault. It's Mist's fault, for designing this event in a way such that we were able to break it so utterly.
If you want fairness, you should vote to distribute the word-halves to the teams that were top-scoring before the Fifth Event, such that they're put right below us in the rankings. (Team Kurenai is, incidentally, one of these teams.) I'm not sure it is possible to achieve, but you could try.
- Location
- The Void
- Pronouns
- She/Her
@faflec to address some of your concerns
With regards to Noburi I don't expect him to actually go anywhere to research them. I want him to talk to other Med-Nin and see what they know. Hopefully we can actually get contact with someone who has actually been there
With regards to the Yakuza. The reason we can't just ask Jiraiya is he will just tell us not worry about it. We need to build a case on our own first and then bring it to Jiraiya. The Yakuza are one of our best contacts outside of Jiraiya. I don't expect to get much information out of them but at the same time developing a deeper relationship with them is valuable on it's own.
With regards to the rumors we need to shape the narrative so that it follows the direction that we want. Taking a less firm hand now could let things slip away. We want the association with the Sannin because they equal summoners. That plus the huge political capital we can gain from it makes me favor a more aggressive path
With regards to Noburi I don't expect him to actually go anywhere to research them. I want him to talk to other Med-Nin and see what they know. Hopefully we can actually get contact with someone who has actually been there
With regards to the Yakuza. The reason we can't just ask Jiraiya is he will just tell us not worry about it. We need to build a case on our own first and then bring it to Jiraiya. The Yakuza are one of our best contacts outside of Jiraiya. I don't expect to get much information out of them but at the same time developing a deeper relationship with them is valuable on it's own.
With regards to the rumors we need to shape the narrative so that it follows the direction that we want. Taking a less firm hand now could let things slip away. We want the association with the Sannin because they equal summoners. That plus the huge political capital we can gain from it makes me favor a more aggressive path
Emstar
The Shining One
- Location
- Trapped in an extradimensional rift.
- Pronouns
- She/They
Aside from @Noumero's points above:
I don't understand your point here. How is this inconsistent or hypocritical with our IC beliefs? These word halves were not given to us by some sort of pre-existing bias of the MfD-verse. We ultimately earned them by our own merit. If we want to use them to butter up the Aburame and Inuzaka a bit, as well as a small apology for beating the living tar out of them and stabbing/deafening them in Round 1, or maybe make utilize them to further our own agenda somehow(or all three!) then it is entirely within our rights to do so.
Furthermore: All this does is ensure that there is a very public and very deliberate beatdown in a nonlethal setting (Finals) while also coming off as a decently large favor/gift. A beatdown that we are obligated to do, really, if we end up being matched together in the finals (which we almost certainly will). If anything, we are not rewarding the Hyuga with anything they didn't deserve: a big fist to the face.
Edit:
It is actually amazing how double edged this sword can be. Not only can we make this appear as a very good natured and kind hearted gift IC, but it also all but guarantees the Hyuga's humiliation on an international stage when we beat the tar out of Hinata. We can do both with one stone. That's just fantastic.
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The Sannin are on a whole another level than us with greater talent level than us. I would not want to foster an undeserved reputation until we can support those claims.
- Location
- The Void
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Your objection is noted