You don't think we'd be so unoriginal as to copy a canon mechanic for a new Bloodline Limit, do you?

The Sharingan's powers revolve around copying and manipulating other people. The Iron Nerve's powers revolve around copying and manipulating yourself. Thus, logically, if the Mangekyō Sharingan is unlocked by killing another, its Iron Nerve equivalent should be unlocked by killing yourself.

Better get cracking on that resurrection tech...
The best part of this is that I could totally see this being a thing.

So, either resurrection stuff, or teaching Noburi lightning affinity and how to restart someone's heart...

On another note! @eaglejarl I've thoroughly enjoyed the chapters of Marked for Death with commentary on your patreon. You've done a great job with them!

e: Wait, I just realized, restarting someone's heart may not be sufficient depending on at what point the chakra fades from them.
 
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Since it is traditional for for Hazō's plans, especially list-shaped ones, to be devised by the players, I am happy to listen (in a non-binding way) to the hivemind's suggestions for date spots/activities.

Hazou is all about optimization, so he would set up a date in such a way that it would test the participants' eligibility to date. Keiko's eligibility isn't in question since she is his sister, but Hazou would do his utmost to make sure that Shikamaru is a good match for Keiko in all of the ways that truly matter:
  • Is Shikamaru strong enough to support Keiko in a combat scenario? Are they equally matched?
    • Verify via sparring
  • Can they cooperate and if so how well do they do so?
    • Couples sparring could work here, or more esoteric methods such as dancing
  • Could Shikamaru support Keiko financially once they are officially married? Could he personally recover from his clan ejecting him and fending for himself and his wife-to-be?
    • Hazou could have Shikamaru come up with a list of contingencies to make sure Keiko's well being is never in jeopardy
  • Most importantly, can Shikamaru come up with and utilize enough lists for any possible scenario?
    • In order to be ready for anything, one must be tested with everything: see below
Hazou would see all of these things (and more, ofc) that absolutely must be tested, but he will begin to despair knowing there simply isn't enough time to do each of these tests one at a time. So, in a fit of mad genius he comes up with ways to combine multiple activities so that Shikamaru and Keiko can have their compatability assessed in multiple ways simultaneously. To further optimize, Hazou then schedules everything (with both Shikaku's and Jiraiya's begrudging acceptance (while Mari laughs uproariously)) back to back in a 24 hour non-stop, Hazou Goketsu special, whole day date from Hell. For those 24 hours Keiko and Shikamaru must work together to defeat various obstacles Hazou will arrange for them in no particular order while also having to complete various objectives:
  • Find a place to rent on your own while Hazou and a partner hunt you to prepare you for assassinations attempts
  • Enjoy a romantic meal together while balancing a budget and dealing with annoying petitioners who want your clan's favor
  • At your new place design a security system which will later be stress-tested by none other than Kagome
  • Practice your cryptography together in the library to get the code that now bars your access to each of your personal funds (again, the code should be made by Kagome)
  • Dodge "patrols" while taking a walk through the woods
  • Kill, clean, and eat a meal together using nothing but food foraged and hunted from your local wilderness, but the meat has to come from something that can kill an ordinary genin or it doesn't count since this is also meant as a way to test their combat potential together
  • Go shopping together with money you earned only that day: remember, the clans can't lose face by having their members buying cheap stuff, so earn money quickly
Now to make it really adorkable have Hazou, whenever he messes with Shikamaru and Keiko in person or in notes, mention how he intends for these activities to actually be romantic. Why waste time with small talk when it's far more efficient to simply state your wants and desires plainly in list form and then plan from there? Isn't that more romantic since it achieves a deeper relationship faster? However there will also be some touching reasons too. What's more romantic than having one person whom you can emphatically trust no matter what will happen? If your spouse to be can't be that person, why would deign you get married to them?

'If talking about your feelings helps a relationship and fighting alongside your partner can improve your partnership as well, then it must be even better to do some 2v2 sparring while having a deep conversation with your significant other must be even better since it takes the same amount of time to do twice as much!' - Hazou's logic, applied to a 24 hour date. Just use that same pattern with any number of activities and it's sure to turn out hilarious.
 
While that sounds hilarious, I do note that Shikamaru is a Nara, and Hazou is aware of this. Arranging for extracurricular sparring is probably a no-go.
 
While that sounds hilarious, I do note that Shikamaru is a Nara, and Hazou is aware of this. Arranging for extracurricular sparring is probably a no-go.

We don't need Shikamaru's consent; we need Shikaku's consent. It's training for the future clan head and I highly doubt there isn't precedent for Shikamaru trying to weasel his way out of training of any kind.
 
Oh! Here's something we could do. A family-fun outing into the lower levels of the Goketsu clan basement! It's even topical for Halloween.
e:

We don't need Shikamaru's consent; we need Shikaku's consent. It's training for the future clan head and I highly doubt there isn't precedent for Shikamaru trying to weasel his way out of training of any kind.

Sure, but I don't think we know Shikamaru well enough to poke fun at him that way :p
 
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Hazou is all about optimization, so he would set up a date in such a way that it would test the participants' eligibility to date. Keiko's eligibility isn't in question since she is his sister, but Hazou would do his utmost to make sure that Shikamaru is a good match for Keiko in all of the ways that truly matter:
  • Is Shikamaru strong enough to support Keiko in a combat scenario? Are they equally matched?
    • Verify via sparring
  • Can they cooperate and if so how well do they do so?
    • Couples sparring could work here, or more esoteric methods such as dancing
  • Could Shikamaru support Keiko financially once they are officially married? Could he personally recover from his clan ejecting him and fending for himself and his wife-to-be?
    • Hazou could have Shikamaru come up with a list of contingencies to make sure Keiko's well being is never in jeopardy
  • Most importantly, can Shikamaru come up with and utilize enough lists for any possible scenario?
    • In order to be ready for anything, one must be tested with everything: see below
Hazou would see all of these things (and more, ofc) that absolutely must be tested, but he will begin to despair knowing there simply isn't enough time to do each of these tests one at a time. So, in a fit of mad genius he comes up with ways to combine multiple activities so that Shikamaru and Keiko can have their compatability assessed in multiple ways simultaneously. To further optimize, Hazou then schedules everything (with both Shikaku's and Jiraiya's begrudging acceptance (while Mari laughs uproariously)) back to back in a 24 hour non-stop, Hazou Goketsu special, whole day date from Hell. For those 24 hours Keiko and Shikamaru must work together to defeat various obstacles Hazou will arrange for them in no particular order while also having to complete various objectives:
  • Find a place to rent on your own while Hazou and a partner hunt you to prepare you for assassinations attempts
  • Enjoy a romantic meal together while balancing a budget and dealing with annoying petitioners who want your clan's favor
  • At your new place design a security system which will later be stress-tested by none other than Kagome
  • Practice your cryptography together in the library to get the code that now bars your access to each of your personal funds (again, the code should be made by Kagome)
  • Dodge "patrols" while taking a walk through the woods
  • Kill, clean, and eat a meal together using nothing but food foraged and hunted from your local wilderness, but the meat has to come from something that can kill an ordinary genin or it doesn't count since this is also meant as a way to test their combat potential together
  • Go shopping together with money you earned only that day: remember, the clans can't lose face by having their members buying cheap stuff, so earn money quickly
Now to make it really adorkable have Hazou, whenever he messes with Shikamaru and Keiko in person or in notes, mention how he intends for these activities to actually be romantic. Why waste time with small talk when it's far more efficient to simply state your wants and desires plainly in list form and then plan from there? Isn't that more romantic since it achieves a deeper relationship faster? However there will also be some touching reasons too. What's more romantic than having one person whom you can emphatically trust no matter what will happen? If your spouse to be can't be that person, why would deign you get married to them?

'If talking about your feelings helps a relationship and fighting alongside your partner can improve your partnership as well, then it must be even better to do some 2v2 sparring while having a deep conversation with your significant other must be even better since it takes the same amount of time to do twice as much!' - Hazou's logic, applied to a 24 hour date. Just use that same pattern with any number of activities and it's sure to turn out hilarious.

I WANT TO GIVE THIS ALL THE RATINGS!

Seriously, I literally (not figuratively) want to give this each of the ratings.

EDIT: The perfect capstone just occurred to me:
The final note should read something like

"With the groundwork laid, you can now bond over your shared loathing of me."
 
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Not to be a downer, but I'd rather not make Shikamaru dislike us :p

We already did that with Neji.
 
You don't think we'd be so unoriginal as to copy a canon mechanic for a new Bloodline Limit, do you?

No, but I don't think just inverting a Bloodline counts as fully original either :p.

its Iron Nerve equivalent should be unlocked by killing yourself.

We need to test if the experience of dying is enough for this to work, a heavily modified version of a Shadow Clone that is completely self aware might do the trick. What's the death of one of your versions for the power Hazou could gain?

Or maybe using the Yamanaka mind technique on someone else while they are dying might be sufficient? Torture Hazou under genjutsu? So many things to do, so many things to make snake-uncle proud.

Also you don't trick me @Velorien, you said Iron Nerve equivalent, while I was talking about the Sharingan itself. I still believe that we can get the Sharingan + Iron nerve! (I know we don't have evidence if that's really possible, but I choose to believe it sage damn it!)
 
On another note! @eaglejarl I've thoroughly enjoyed the chapters of Marked for Death with commentary on your patreon. You've done a great job with them!
Thank you! They've been fun to write. I'm still in the single-digit chapters, as you obviously know, and it's weird to look back that far and remember both what was going on at the time (in universe and out) and how far we've come.
 
Not to be a downer, but I'd rather not make Shikamaru dislike us :p

We already did that with Neji.

We won't actually be making him hate us, that would be a bad idea.

But having him face bizzare obstacles all day that bolster his friendship with Kei by merit of forcing them to face them together, and then acknowledging that this was entirely deliberate might, at worst, be seen as a declaration of prank war.

...which is, of course, just another step in Hazou's plan, since working together to get Hazou back will just encourage their friendship even further! MWAHAHAHAHAHA!
 
[X] Interlude: Keiko and Shikamaru's next outing follows the itinerary set out by Keiko's new self-proclaimed "temporary" personal assistant, Hazou Goketsu

I feel like this should involve a double date with Akane at some point.

Also, if I were Hazou, a major worry would be Shikamaru's willingness to make sacrifices for the sake of Keiko's well-being--maybe a bunch of contrived situations related to that? (e:Trolley problems involving saving Keiko by risking his/other Naras' lives? Obviously this is where Shiori comes in...)

I like the idea of exploring the catacombs--maybe Noburi or Mari's told him how people have trouble distinguishing between the emotional arousal of fear and desire. Actually, Mari's probably the eminence gris here, right?

Obviously for maximum Drama Points this should involve Shiori in some way--maybe she gets tested along with them, because an adequate suitor must have a personal assistant up to Hazou's glorious standards?
(e: see above about trolley problems. Boy, I love turning Velorien's evil genius towards making someone else's life extremely troublesome.)
 
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Not to be a downer, but I'd rather not make Shikamaru dislike us :p

We already did that with Neji.

We did? Pretty sure Neji is just being a tsundere with Nobby.

E:
[X] Interlude: Keiko and Shikamaru's next outing follows the itinerary set out by Keiko's new self-proclaimed "temporary" personal assistant, Hazou Goketsu

Why not? I mean, besides the part where we decide to torment two of the people we will be closely working with in the near future without considering any of their input or feelings. Still, this seems perfectly in character and someone should already come up with an Action Plan to apologize to save time. :V
 
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On a note related to the Hyuuga, we need to be careful with Hinata; remember, she pulled the same kind of thing that Mari did during Game Night, in getting on on first-names basis with the Goketsu clan.

e: Actually, we could signal to her that we know what she did by making an oblique reference to "Team Nobuneji"
 
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On a note related to the Hyuuga, we need to be careful with Hinata; remember, she pulled the same kind of thing that Mari did during Game Night, in getting on on first-names basis with the Goketsu clan.

e: Actually, we could signal to her that we know what she did by making an oblique reference to "Team Nobuneji"

Why would we signal that we figured it out?

Edit: this thread is full of ninjas
 
I do not think that we can be an inside-context-problem with regard to people who have spent their lives training for politics. Neither we nor Hazou are prepared for that.

Therefore, if we can give those who would otherwise use vagueries and metaphor ala Hidden Mountain -- ie the Hyuuga -- reason to treat us straightforwardly, such as by showing that we see the game they're playing and that we would prefer to play it straightforwardly, I think it is to our advantage. After all, in this case, Hinata is using a culturally-approved method to make us see her as a closer compatriot, so why wouldn't she take the option that we tell her we would prefer?
 
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@Jello_Raptor : Quite a long time ago you posted some suggestions that dealt with the probability of an idea already having been thought of in MfD -- adding up a set of modifiers based on whether it required scientific knowledge, etc. Can you link those for us?

@faflec, pinging you as well since you are the de facto MfD Imperial Archivist.
 
@eaglejarl, @Velorien: I feel like this is an unreasonable test given the structure of this world.

It's a death world, there's not nearly so many people around to think up and optimize ideas as in our world. Most of the people who are around are mainly concerned with not dying in immediate future, social networks are weak, cities are smaller than what we would consider large towns. Even fewer are ninja, with access to the chakra and jutsu needed to think up the innovations needed. Thinking up clever ideas is hard and often takes experimentation and testing. A mentality sorely lacking the primarily feudal world you've laid out for us, with the possible exception of Orochimaru1​.

But @HyperCatnip and others have pointed out how good ideas are rare, testing is rare, and bad luck can kill notions in the crib. Which is an important set of things to point out, but I think there's a bigger point that you might be missing.

We don't care about whether someone else has had the idea, just whether the idea existing or not would have a noticeable effect on the world. So to that end I think there's a bit of a checklist that works as a better test.
  • How simple is the idea?
    • Assuming someone has the prerequisites and wants the goals, how likely are they to think up the idea on their own?
    • Something like henge-ing into cloth to slow down would be very simple, but something like building a lattice structure out of 5 seal barriers much less so.
  • How available are the prereqs?
    • What is the chance that someone will have what the idea needs in order to be tested?
    • Something that requires just one of the basic 3 would be highly available (to ninja), but something that requires a high level of sealing and dangerous research would be less available.
  • How likely are the goals?
    • What is the chance that someone will want the goal the idea works towards?
    • Some things, like quickly stopping a long fall are pretty rare since few people are going to be falling long distances in this sort of world, but better single-person defenses or longer distance offensive techniques are incredibly common needs.
If these are all likely then many people have probably thought of the idea. If any of these are unlikely, then few (if any) people have thought of the idea. Then you need to figure out whether the idea has propagated.
  • How hard is the idea to test? Does it require many resources?
  • How likely is it to propagate? Is it more helpful kept secret or made widely available?
  • Are there better solutions available for most people?
  • Does the landscape change wildly if only a few people have access to the idea? or only a little?
With the above you can figure out how the notion shifts the large scale landscape. There's also a few other social differences that make your test unreasonable.


This world doesn't have a gentleman's academia like the royal society, much less the professional academia we have now. There's no phone network, and I don't think we've really seen international mail networks. Information flow across large distances seems mostly diplomatic or military. These informational and social structures are incredibly important to the sort of innovation that would merit using a test of "Why hasn't someone else done this yet?" as a first pass.

There's also a strong culture of secrecy. A really good idea might be stuck with a small group of people for fear that releasing it would nix whatever comparative advantage it provides. A lot of good ideas would be squashed by that alone, providing a boost to just a few people rather than a huge change in the status quo. It also makes it harder for someone to build on the work of others.

Not to mention that for sealing in particular, the entire field of engineering is designed to require each individual to do much of the bootstrap work themselves. It's not like fields of engineering where you can literally build on top of the work of others. You need to spend time replicating everything you need, even if you have the work of others to look at. For most people in a village getting to a base level of skill and churning out common seal to sell would be a fast path to relative safety, like most other professions.

You might get the rare privileged seal-crafter with the time, money, and intelligence to do cool research, but it would be hard to pass on to others and kept secret anyway.

The current state of human society is profoundly weird. We've got a level of excess resources, societal trust, and information sharing that is profoundly anomalous. For most of human history technology moved very slowly for a slew of reasons. If MfD is similar, there's no good reason to expect the entire space of low hanging fruit to be searched.


1: I really hope you have an explanation for why Orochimaru felt that striking out on his own was better than accepting both the experimental restrictions and support that would come with good standing as a Konoha nin. There's pros and cons, but that support network seems incredibly useful for most of Orochimaru's canon goals.
Is this what you're looking for, @eaglejarl?
 
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