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RHUNRIKKI STROLLAR (Warhammer Fantasy Golden Age Dwarf Runelord Quest)

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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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Czes said:
So, if I understand this correctly, shouldn't more Warp stone appear the further North/South one gets?
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I think you could argue it either way.
On the other hand: At the poles before its spread out you have the highest concentration of winds and therefore the most risk of them mixing.
On one hand: The previous argument is more of an argument for Dhar to be more common there. Its possible that the poles where the warp is flooding in the fastest I would suggest that it is unable to stagnate and pool because its still moving very quickly, thus even if it forms Dhar it can't form Warpstone. Additionally the winds that arrive away from the poles are largely not Dhar indicates that the winds are actually pretty good at naturally seperating and not creating Dhar and its possible that a large amount of whats created is actually done so by living beings. And finally, while Dhar can congeal into warpstone, that doesn't actually mean its the only way or even the most common way that warpstone can appear, the moon occasionally rains down showers of it if I remember correctly.

On balance I'm inclined against it. However our current understanding is probably limited as I don't think we can explain why Warpstone forms around Gromril meteors.
 
IronFist said:
Simple: Warpstone and Gromril are the same material with different amounts of corruption.:V
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Joking aside, for the people who don't know. This is one of the only answers that we can definitely say is incorrect, because we know Warpstone can form without Gromril and we also know that Gromril is a material that naturally exists in the void of space explicitly far far away from the winds and that from Snorris vision we know it existed without warpstone.
 
Dark as Silver said:
Joking aside, for the people who don't know. This is one of the only answers that we can definitely say is incorrect, because we know Warpstone can form without Gromril and we also know that Gromril is a material that naturally exists in the void of space explicitly far far away from the winds and that from Snorris vision we know it existed without warpstone.
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The green moon is solid warpstone, though. So the contamination these days may be inherit due to it.
 
Dark as Silver said:
I think you could argue it either way.
On the other hand: At the poles before its spread out you have the highest concentration of winds and therefore the most risk of them mixing.
On one hand: The previous argument is more of an argument for Dhar to be more common there. Its possible that the poles where the warp is flooding in the fastest I would suggest that it is unable to stagnate and pool because its still moving very quickly, thus even if it forms Dhar it can't form Warpstone. Additionally the winds that arrive away from the poles are largely not Dhar indicates that the winds are actually pretty good at naturally seperating and not creating Dhar and its possible that a large amount of whats created is actually done so by living beings. And finally, while Dhar can congeal into warpstone, that doesn't actually mean its the only way or even the most common way that warpstone can appear, the moon occasionally rains down showers of it if I remember correctly.

On balance I'm inclined against it. However our current understanding is probably limited as I don't think we can explain why Warpstone forms around Gromril meteors.
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There is a note in RoS, that says that Warpstone could be solidified High Magic instead of Dhar, and:
The longer Warpstone resides on the mortal world, the more it
absorbs and crushes the Winds of Magic into itself, in essence
becoming solidified Dhar instead of solidified High Magic.
Such ancient and tainted Warpstone may have less facility to
work bizarre and wondrous miracles than it would to manifest
horrific and hideous change or mutation. Ancient Warpstone
is very bad news and is sought after and used only by the most
powerful and insane Human magic users. Terrible immortals
and semi-immortals like vampires and Dark Elves, or the
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So this means, that gromril meteors could bring down "pure" warpstone and adamant, which are both corrupted by the Winds into "unpure" Warpstone and gromril. However finding that out would need Snorri to inspect a freshly fallen meteor of starmetal, so chances of finding out are slim at best.

Sidenote: RoS says, that the elves think that warpstone was a power source for the Old Ones, which was "ejected from its place between both the material and immaterial universes." when the gates fell. That could be a neat explanation for why it comes with gromril: the meteorites are parts of Old One devices, gromril being the structure and warpstone the power source.
 
Byzantine said:
The green moon is solid warpstone, though. So the contamination these days may be inherit due to it.
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Ian Drash said:
There is a note in RoS, that says that Warpstone could be solidified High Magic instead of Dhar, and:


So this means, that gromril meteors could bring down "pure" warpstone and adamant, which are both corrupted by the Winds into "unpure" Warpstone and gromril. However finding that out would need Snorri to inspect a freshly fallen meteor of starmetal, so chances of finding out are slim at best.

Sidenote: RoS says, that the elves think that warpstone was a power source for the Old Ones, which was "ejected from its place between both the material and immaterial universes." when the gates fell. That could be a neat explanation for why it comes with gromril: the meteorites are parts of Old One devices, gromril being the structure and warpstone the power source.
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Morrisleb is terrestial near earth in origin though (probably ancient past is often deliberately vague and unclear in this setting.):

Article:
Ancient myth has it that when the magical energies of Chaos first broke through into the Known World through the Old Ones' Polar Gates, an enormous chunk of warpstone was hurled high into the sky, where it circles endlessly to this day, spreading Chaos on the lands over which it passes.[6a]​

It would be interesting to know if a literal moon sized chuck of solidified magic was being used by the old ones in someway, or if the gates deliberately slowing the flow of the winds caused the area upwind of them to stagnate and mix and the creation of this was an unpleasant accident.
E: Terrestrial was an incorrect word to use. However I stand by that Morrisleb and warpstone seems to be a near planet phemonemon whereas Gromril meteors seem to be further out into space.
 
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Dark as Silver said:
Morrisleb is terrestial near earth in origin though (probably ancient past is often deliberately vague and unclear in this setting.):

Article:
Ancient myth has it that when the magical energies of Chaos first broke through into the Known World through the Old Ones' Polar Gates, an enormous chunk of warpstone was hurled high into the sky, where it circles endlessly to this day, spreading Chaos on the lands over which it passes.[6a]​

It would be interesting to know if a literal moon sized chuck of solidified magic was being used by the old ones in someway, or if the gates deliberately slowing the flow of the winds caused the area upwind of them to stagnate and mix and the creation of this was an unpleasant accident.
E: Terrestrial was an incorrect word to use. However I stand by that Morrisleb and warpstone seems to be a near planet phemonemon whereas Gromril meteors seem to be further out into space.
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The wiki says about the Polar Gates:
"The eldritch machineries of the gates crashed down upon the world in a burning hail of star-metal. "

So gromril being Old One stuff falling back to the planet seems pretty reasonable.
 
Ian Drash said:
The wiki says about the Polar Gates:
"The eldritch machineries of the gates crashed down upon the world in a burning hail of star-metal. "

So gromril being Old One stuff falling back to the planet seems pretty reasonable.
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It also describes them as stone
Article:
The shattered gate appears as a great ring circled by stone machineries, dwarfing the mountains around it

Theres a lot going on there. And a lot we don't understand.
 
Dark as Silver said:
It also describes them as stone
Article:
The shattered gate appears as a great ring circled by stone machineries, dwarfing the mountains around it

Theres a lot going on there. And a lot we don't understand.
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Personally I am kind of amazed that such things as discrete mountains can be said to exist besides the broken Gates, much less for the mountains to be stone and not say... screaming faces spewing the curses of daemons
 
So I only found this quest not too long ago, and I'm pretty sure I will never have the time to go through every page (or even the last few hundred) of it. So just for clarification:
The Gazul comission is to be done in 2 rounds, so with 12 actions that means at least 4 (3+2(Prod)+1) in round 41 and 4 in round 42, leaving Snorri with 1 free action to be spent on going to the Rhunkalbrogg/other stuff. Am I seeing it right?

After that there are no pressing comissions, if we don't take the Grugni one. Personally, I don't think that's a good fit right now, despite the rewards. Snorri is very much about usefulness for the hold and the empire, and him spending time figuring out to fully commercialize gromril chain would be much better for the Karaz Ankor and Kraka Drakk than doing another simple job, that in a measly hundred years would need "only" master smiths or Runesmiths. The fact that he has been doing this kind of work with less time for real masterpieces for decades is only the cherry on top.

I would say, he should get some proper runesmithing done sometimes in the next half a century, maybe taking both the Skrundaz and the Az-Dreugi at some point.
 
Ian Drash said:
So I only found this quest not too long ago, and I'm pretty sure I will never have the time to go through every page (or even the last few hundred) of it. So just for clarification:
The Gazul comission is to be done in 2 rounds, so with 12 actions that means at least 4 (3+2(Prod)+1) in round 41 and 4 in round 42, leaving Snorri with 1 free action to be spent on going to the Rhunkalbrogg/other stuff. Am I seeing it right?

After that there are no pressing comissions, if we don't take the Grugni one. Personally, I don't think that's a good fit right now, despite the rewards. Snorri is very much about usefulness for the hold and the empire, and him spending time figuring out to fully commercialize gromril chain would be much better for the Karaz Ankor and Kraka Drakk than doing another simple job, that in a measly hundred years would need "only" master smiths or Runesmiths. The fact that he has been doing this kind of work with less time for real masterpieces for decades is only the cherry on top.

I would say, he should get some proper runesmithing done sometimes in the next half a century, maybe taking both the Skrundaz and the Az-Dreugi at some point.
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We could also do a 3 and 5 arrangement on turns 41 and 42, and that's the generally discussed set up for doing it that I recall. Just so we have an extra action to do things on turn 41.
 
Ian Drash said:
So I only found this quest not too long ago, and I'm pretty sure I will never have the time to go through every page (or even the last few hundred) of it. So just for clarification:
The Gazul comission is to be done in 2 rounds, so with 12 actions that means at least 4 (3+2(Prod)+1) in round 41 and 4 in round 42, leaving Snorri with 1 free action to be spent on going to the Rhunkalbrogg/other stuff. Am I seeing it right?
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This is the next two turns to my knowledge.
ActionsTurn 41Turn 42 – Grave Wardens Due
AP 1Grave Wardens
Grave Wardens
AP 2Grave Wardens
Grave Wardens
AP 3Grave WardensGrave Wardens
AP 4??? (Defense in Depth)Grave Wardens
AP 5RhunkalbroggGrave Wardens
It's better to do a 3-5 action split than a 4-4 one due to how procs work as for the same number of actions we get more done with a 3-5 split than a 4-4 split.
Ian Drash said:
After that there are no pressing comissions, if we don't take the Grugni one. Personally, I don't think that's a good fit right now, despite the rewards. Snorri is very much about usefulness for the hold and the empire, and him spending time figuring out to fully commercialize gromril chain would be much better for the Karaz Ankor and Kraka Drakk than doing another simple job, that in a measly hundred years would need "only" master smiths or Runesmiths. The fact that he has been doing this kind of work with less time for real masterpieces for decades is only the cherry on top.

I would say, he should get some proper runesmithing done sometimes in the next half a century, maybe taking both the Skrundaz and the Az-Dreugi at some point.
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Eltharin, akazit, odd places, and the secrets of light are most of what has been tossed around as being stuff we should complete from turns 43-45/46. And I heavily disagree on the commissions if we're doing commissions which is a fat if it should be the next cult one or no commissions as maxing out a cult's standing will provide a lot more than Skrundaz or the Az which only provide a +1 which unlike with the cult commission won't pay itself back.
 
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DragonParadox said:
Well daemons, presuming you ask the question right. I do not think daemons can explicitly lie. They have to play games with half-truths and misdirection.
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I'm pretty sure daemons can lie just as much as anyone else can, if it's consistent with their nature. I think the only ones that wouldn't would be a subset of Khornate ones that lean into the 'honour' aspects of his nature.
 
Woltaire said:
Wait what... why? isn't that one of Tzeentch whole shticks and therefore their demons?
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Alratan said:
I'm pretty sure daemons can lie just as much as anyone else can, if it's consistent with their nature. I think the only ones that wouldn't would be a subset of Khornate ones that lean into the 'honour' aspects of his nature.
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i seem to recall something about daemons being creatures of truth on some level, ideas given form and thus being unable to explicitly lie (rather than deceive indirectly). It might have been a 40K thing though... I'll have to look it up.
 
Also fyi if we want dwarves to start going on ocean and have trade with elves be more back and forth then we should probably investigate that Azrilwut(silverwood) that had potential to be as strong as gromril, which would reach dwarves standards for them to be comfortable with going onto open sea
(turn 33 results)
 
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DragonParadox said:
i seem to recall something about daemons being creatures of truth on some level, ideas given form and thus being unable to explicitly lie (rather than deceive indirectly). It might have been a 40K thing though... I'll have to look it up.
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40K daemons can almost certainly lie. There's multiple references to them doing so, I think. The debate in 40K is more whether daemons can tell the truth, or whether they always lie.
 
The Grungni commission is just 1.5 turns of stuff now that we have 5 actions back so it's not a big deal. We can do that and a mat sci project and clear the back log a bit w/e we get closer to the deadline.
 
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