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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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That would be extremely awesome. The north is going to be filled with even more rune creators that way. Imagine what so many of them in the same area will be able to achieve
How about we not trample over the fundamental building block to dwarf society?

You know, the Master/Apprentice relationship.

The Karaz Ankor fell because of multiple apocalyptic events hitting it at the same time and it managed to hold on for an additional four thousand one hundred years despite that.
 
So? There will still be many more rune makers there, and many of them will influence the area in different ways. You might have missed my point, or I might haven't been clear enough, but I don't get what you mean.
 
So? There will still be many more rune makers there, and many of them will influence the area in different ways. You might have missed my point, or I might haven't been clear enough, but I don't get what you mean.
Then what you want is not a academy, it's a symposium. Which, fair enough that works OK enough.
The problem is that academy implies many teachers teaching even more students and that's a big no-no in rune smiting culture.
 
Then what you want is not a academy, it's a symposium. Which, fair enough that works OK enough.
The problem is that academy implies many teachers teaching even more students and that's a big no-no in rune smiting culture.
Would it be so unlikely that other masters will pick some of these hopeful students and decide to teach them some of their knowledge? Not right now but in some centuries? It might 'evolve' into something like an academy, even if every teacher decides on what and whom they teach
 
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Would it be so unlikely that other masters will pick some of these hopeful learners and decide to teach them some of their knowledge? Not right now but in some centuries? It might 'evolve' into something like an academy, even if every teacher decides on what and whom they teach
Yes, that probably will be a problem. The runesmiths are incredible sensible about who is and isn't worthy. A apprentice can be denied his journeyman ship if the master deems him unworthy in the 100 to 120 years before that point.
Weeding out the unworthy is not a fast process and doing it for more then 3 people at once is almost impossible. So any kind of school clashes immediately with one of the founding tenets of rune smithing.
 
So? There will still be many more rune makers there, and many of them will influence the area in different ways. You might have missed my point, or I might haven't been clear enough, but I don't get what you mean.
This is what you were replying to:

and instead creating an Academy of Runes out of workshop.
Academies trample over the Master/Apprentice system, which is the fundamental building block of Dwarf society. I don't want to do that because we're playing Dwarf Runelord Quest. Not Human Runelord Quest.

Cultural institutions are typically there for a reason. Stripping that away would simply strip away what makes Dwarfs "fantasy."

Would it be so unlikely that other masters will pick some of these hopeful students and decide to teach them some of their knowledge? Not right now but in some centuries? It might 'evolve' into something like an academy, even if every teacher decides on what and whom they teach
I am going to be blunt. I hate that idea. Masters should perfectly capable of finding apprentices on their own.

Let alone how Runesmiths would take it. As I have been repeating very strenuously the Master/Apprentice relationship is the building block to Dwarf society, trying to topple it would almost be as bad as removing electricity from modern society.
 
[X] [Home:] Reject
- [X] Find new accommodations: In removing one problem, that being the overcrowding of your home, you have created another. Perhaps it is no concern of yours, but you will do what you can to find a way to house them now that squatting in your home is no longer an option. Unlocks further options.
[X] [Burudin:] Yes
 
I got the feeling we would setup a place for all these Runesmiths that come to us so that they have a space to freely exchange ideas , to have a forum for new theories and different approaches. Not some kind of university. Which is pretty much the same thing that the Burudin should be, so if we go with it we should set up measures so it doesn't get corrupted, if that is a concern. Just having a place where all the different view points can be debated, not totally changing how Runesmithing is taught.
A consequence of such occurrences was that the entrance gallery, long since rendered incapable of doing what you initially intended it for, now serves as a sort of gathering place, not only for the numerous Dwarfs who lodge in your home but sometimes the odd Runesmith from the rest of the Karak has wandered in here to meet with a visiting colleague.

And condemning the Burudin, a group that was founded with very similar ideology and is made up of the most respected Runesmiths, at the same time as we do that would be the height of arrogance. Even Yorri admits that their integrity is mostly intact thanks to the efforts of other dwarfs that are part of it, and if these ideals are so important to us we should do our part in preserving them instead of ignoring what's (potentially) happening right now.
 
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Academies trample over the Master/Apprentice system, which is the fundamental building block of Dwarf society. I don't want to do that because we're playing Dwarf Runelord Quest. Not Human Runelord Quest.

Cultural institutions are typically there for a reason. Stripping that away would simply strip away what makes Dwarfs "fantasy."
We're literally teaching Runes to whatever dwarves come and qualify to learn them, that also trample over the master/apprentice relationship. We're already doing that, the ship sailed when we decided it was better for more people to know these Runes.

The vote to embrace this is exactly this.

We are currently playing as a Runelord in a developmental era of the dwarves, humans arent even past being tribals yet, its very possible Academies of Runescript could become as much a tradition in the North as M/A relationships are a tradition all over right now.

I really don't see how having an Academy will somehow strip the dwarves of whatever makes them fantasy? This just seems ridiculous to me. What makes dwarves fantasy is... The fantasy.
Bloody hell, humanity had a master/apprentice system too in the past you know? And it progressed into a more Academic system with more development.
This isn't to say apprentices don't exist anymore in the modern world, in trades for instance. But we can absolutely give all local Runesmiths a 'basics' set of rune learning in an academy and let them go off for apprenticeships afterwards etc.

Snorri clearly has a mind to change stuff, it just feels ridiculous to pretend now that he hasn't already, or that it somehow makes him less fantasy dwarvish.
 
Angkra's created the Wall of Shields, a Runic Shield that creates a swarm of magical golden shields that independently intercepts and returns enemy fire back at them as explosive magical projectiles.
Sounds like that pulls from the Master Rune of the Ancestral Aegis, plus Parrying for the reflection, plus the Master Rune of Spellspite or something like it.
Kept chunking over this and I think I've found the ticket to something that works like the Wall of Shields, if it isn't outright the same:

Armor Master Rune of Ancestral Aegis, for the golden shields that eats enemy magic.
Rune of Parrying to enable the targeted interception and return, ala what happened with the Drake's Mantle Hailmantle combo, or the Master Rune of Spite.
Then rounding it off with the Rune of Spellburning, which breaks magic cast against the wearer and burns the caster.

I think all of those would do something like "generate golden shields that feed and grow on magic thrown at them, reflect it back, as broken explosive spells".

Sad part is we don't have Spellburning. Fjolla might develop that one, or plausibly we could get it in a trade from Angkra.

The hypothetical banner version is also quite interesting as a wider scale variation for folks like the Ironarm Huskarls.
 
[X] [Home:] Embrace
Fine. Fine. If the idiots are choosing to be cheeky and finagle a way to stay in your home, they're going to at least pay for the privilege! It will require a good deal of work, and cost a pretty penny both in time and effort, but if it's going to be done, then it's going to be done right. Your southern colleagues may grumble and growl, but when have they not? You're over a thousand years old, they can suck on a particularly porous piece of pumice for all you care! Unlocks further options.

I could go either way on the Burudin, but this is a path for Snorri to become Dwarf Dumbledore as well as Santa, thus unlocking the prestige of holding the roles of two culturally significant old men with beards.
 
We're literally teaching Runes to whatever dwarves come and qualify to learn them, that also trample over the master/apprentice relationship. We're already doing that, the ship sailed when we decided it was better for more people to know these Runes.
That's not true. Setting trials for Journeymen to learn some specific non-master rune is traditional. One of our apprentices learned a rune from Hammerspite that way. As is deciding one or more specific runes are too useful not to share. They're just both things that only the oldest, most renowned runelords are allowed/have the balls to do. And considering we literally just got an invite for the Burudrin, Snorri qualifies.
 
[X] [Home:] Embrace
Fine. Fine. If the idiots are choosing to be cheeky and finagle a way to stay in your home, they're going to at least pay for the privilege! It will require a good deal of work, and cost a pretty penny both in time and effort, but if it's going to be done, then it's going to be done right. Your southern colleagues may grumble and growl, but when have they not? You're over a thousand years old, they can suck on a particularly porous piece of pumice for all you care! Unlocks further options.
 
That's not true. Setting trials for Journeymen to learn some specific non-master rune is traditional. One of our apprentices learned a rune from Hammerspite that way. As is deciding one or more specific runes are too useful not to share. They're just both things that only the oldest, most renowned runelords are allowed/have the balls to do. And considering we literally just got an invite for the Burudrin, Snorri qualifies.
I think its a matter of scale. Hammerspite had a handful of Journeymen learn his Runes, and it was presumably a special occurance.

Our Academy has stringent requirements, but I think it's fair to say its a continuous process now which isn't limiting the number of applicants.

I feel like trying to say otherwise is just being obstinate for the sake of fluff at this point.
 
I think its a matter of scale. Hammerspite had a handful of Journeymen learn his Runes, and it was presumably a special occurance.

Our Academy has stringent requirements, but I think it's fair to say its a continuous process now which isn't limiting the number of applicants.

I feel like trying to say otherwise is just being obstinate for the sake of fluff at this point.
Not really? Based on the context of Nain's title and how Snorri set up his trials, the cultural expectation seems to be one will get a number of Journeymen semi regularly.

Plausibly not as much as Snorri does, but too be honest we don't actually have a good measure of comparison between how many Journeymen Snorri gets and how many another Runelord down south might get.
 
I think its a matter of scale. Hammerspite had a handful of Journeymen learn his Runes, and it was presumably a special occurance.

Our Academy has stringent requirements, but I think it's fair to say its a continuous process now which isn't limiting the number of applicants.

I feel like trying to say otherwise is just being obstinate for the sake of fluff at this point.
And we are teaching exactly 3 runes, one of them only to master rune smith's, the other 2 only to journeyman who pass our trials. What we are doing is no academy and transforming it into one would break many rules, not traditions, rules.
 
We're literally teaching Runes to whatever dwarves come and qualify to learn them, that also trample over the master/apprentice relationship. We're already doing that, the ship sailed when we decided it was better for more people to know these Runes.

The vote to embrace this is exactly this.

We are currently playing as a Runelord in a developmental era of the dwarves, humans arent even past being tribals yet, its very possible Academies of Runescript could become as much a tradition in the North as M/A relationships are a tradition all over right now.

I really don't see how having an Academy will somehow strip the dwarves of whatever makes them fantasy? This just seems ridiculous to me. What makes dwarves fantasy is... The fantasy.
Bloody hell, humanity had a master/apprentice system too in the past you know? And it progressed into a more Academic system with more development.
This isn't to say apprentices don't exist anymore in the modern world, in trades for instance. But we can absolutely give all local Runesmiths a 'basics' set of rune learning in an academy and let them go off for apprenticeships afterwards etc.

Snorri clearly has a mind to change stuff, it just feels ridiculous to pretend now that he hasn't already, or that it somehow makes him less fantasy dwarvish.
Releasing Runes is something that has a precedent in Dwarf culture. Even ignoring Thungni, Gottri Hammerspite teaches his Runes to all Journeymen that prove themselves worthy. Other Runelords have released Runes that they deem important to the wider community.

You are humanizing Dwarfs far too much. Dwarfs are stubborn perfectionists.

Master Runesmiths won't want to teach a half-assed apprentice and Snorri wouldn't accept such a shoddy education. Humans didn't have the master/apprentice relationship define them to the degree that we see Dwarfs consumed by it in Warhammer.

Apprenticeship, grudges, perfectionism, ecty are a large part of what defines Warhammer Dwarfs.
 
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Now Accepting User Generated Runes
A post made by one of the users got me thinking and I've come to a decision.

I will now be accepting User Generated Submissions for New Runes and Names for Runes that probably already exist and I haven't bothered to name.

PLEASE USE #Rune-Ideas somewhere in the post for searchability


Aside from that, you can submit potential Rune ideas or even just names for Runes to me, and if I find them acceptable I will add them to the Public Rune List and categorize them accordingly. For Rune submissions that are close to being accepted but have a few parts that don't work I'll let the poster know, offer potential changes and if they accept them then I'll go ahead with adding the revised version to the list as well. Note that just because I accept a Rune does not necessarily mean Snorri will know it, sometimes it may exist and he just doesn't know it, or it may not exist yet and I may use it in a future Rune Trade.

A few tips and rules of thumb when submitting a Rune are as follows:
- Names are the least scrutinized and generally follow the rule of cool/thematics. Basically, if it sounds Dwarfy then it's probably good.
- If its effect can't be explained in two lines or less it's probably not going to fly.
- Master Runes are generally more powerful and/or versatile than Regular Runes.
- For Master Runes, the stronger their effect the more likely I'll make it have a rarer ingredient.
- Battle Magic tier effects are generally the realm of Master Runes, and more mundane spells the realm of Regular Runes, but not always.
- I'm willing to add Regular Runes to both the future rewards or retroactively of your research trees if they fit with what's there, but they'll obviously be under far greater scrutiny.

Please format submissions as follows:
Rune Name: Rune Effect.
Brief description and backstory (optional)

That's all that's really important and you can stop reading here.

The next bit is just me airing out my thoughts and rationale really, because I think it helps to have a record as to why I do stuff because god only knows I forget half the time and I see no issue with it being public.

Basically, it boils down to me wondering if the way I have it set up with the public Rune List has been creatively limiting. I've stated that Snorri knows a lot of Runes, and I've just not listed them in their totality to the thread, but I haven't seen many people poke me to see if a Rune exists and I just haven't listed it and the people who go through the effort are using the Runes I have listed and nothing else. In Hindsight I'm now coming to see that creating a Write-in and or proposing an idea for a Difficult request is already creatively taxing enough, and its probably unfair of me to expect the few people who participate in that endeavour to ALSO go through the hassle of coming to me for Runes that may or may not exist, potentially get told no, and then go back to the Drawing board. So I think this may alleviate that weight. Most obviously I alleviate the workload off my back when it comes to backfilling the names of Runes you know but I haven't bothered to list. It creates a way for people who may find making an entire write-in daunting an easier way to contribute. It's a way to generate ideas for myself, and as the list grows gives people who make Write-ins more to actually work with.

Anyway that's all. I realize I didn't put an Author's note in the results for Turn 46, so this is something of a late addition to that if you wanna think of it that way. Anyhoo, if you read this far, I hope this all makes sense and that you found at least some of this useful. :^)
 
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Had another brain wave while looking through the Rune List, which if y'all haven't done yet you should, there's some new fun stuff on it.

Rune of Warning (Warns user of oncoming physical attacks outside of their field of view)
Rune of Perception (Crew are more aware of their surroundings)
Rune of Quick wits (Crew have higher reaction speeds)

I am pretty certain these three would combo and could be turned into a Master Rune, with Warning and Perception stacking on each other by perception widening situational awareness with Warning clearing up the last little blindspots, and then Quick Wits giving the user something to do with that enhanced awareness.

In this case, get out of the way of the attack. I do not think this is a combo for the Master Rune of Eagle Eye, which has the following function incorporating accuracy elements.

* Master Rune of the Eagle-eyed (Grants war machines massively improved accuracy, crews have improved vision)

I think this is something else, like a Master Rune of Reflex or some other spideysense adjacent term.

A post made by one of the users got me thinking and I've come to a decision.

I will now be accepting User Generated Submissions for New Runes and Names for Runes that probably already exist and I haven't bothered to name.

Aside from that, you can submit potential Rune ideas or even just names for Runes to me, and if I find them acceptable I will add them to the Public Rune List and categorize them accordingly. For Rune submissions that are close to being accepted but have a few parts that don't work I'll let the poster know, offer potential changes and if they accept them then I'll go ahead with adding the revised version to the list as well. Note that just because I accept a Rune does not necessarily mean Snorri will know it, sometimes it may exist and he just doesn't know it, or it may not exist yet and I may use it in a future Rune Trade.

A few tips and rules of thumb when submitting a Rune are as follows:
- Names are the least scrutinized and generally follow the rule of cool/thematics. Basically, if it sounds Dwarfy then it's probably good.
- If its effect can't be explained in two lines or less it's probably not going to fly.
- Master Runes are generally more powerful and/or versatile than Regular Runes.
- For Master Runes, the stronger their effect the more likely I'll make it have a rarer ingredient.
- Battle Magic tier effects are generally the realm of Master Runes, and more mundane spells the realm of Regular Runes, but not always.
- I'm willing to add Regular Runes to both the future rewards or retroactively of your research trees if they fit with what's there, but they'll obviously be under far greater scrutiny.

Please format submissions as follows:
Rune Name: Rune Effect.
Brief description and backstory (optional)

That's all that's really important and you can stop reading here.

The next bit is just me airing out my thoughts and rationale really, because I think it helps to have a record as to why I do stuff because god only knows I forget half the time and I see no issue with it being public.

Basically, it boils down to me wondering if the way I have it set up with the public Rune List has been creatively limiting. I've stated that Snorri knows a lot of Runes, and I've just not listed them in their totality to the thread, but I haven't seen many people poke me to see if a Rune exists and I just haven't listed it and the people who go through the effort are using the Runes I have listed and nothing else. In Hindsight I'm now coming to see that creating a Write-in and or proposing an idea for a Difficult request is already creatively taxing enough, and its probably unfair of me to expect the few people who participate in that endeavour to ALSO go through the hassle of coming to me for Runes that may or may not exist, potentially get told no, and then go back to the Drawing board. So I think this may alleviate that weight. Most obviously I alleviate the workload off my back when it comes to backfilling the names of Runes you know but I haven't bothered to list. It creates a way for people who may find making an entire write-in daunting an easier way to contribute. It's a way to generate ideas for myself, and as the list grows gives people who make Write-ins more to actually work with.

Anyway that's all. I realize I didn't put an Author's note in the results for Turn 46, so this is something of a late addition to that if you wanna think of it that way. Anywho, if you read this far, I hope this all makes sense and that you found at least some of this useful. :^)
Thank you so much! I personally see this as a means to get a bit of a dialogue going in terms of Runes and I really really like that. Hopefully I can scrounge up some spare time to contribute!
 
So to start things off I propose the Master Rune of Beer. When inscribed on a barrel it turns any liquid put into it into beer. If beer is put into the barrel it does the equivalent of gromril in the adamant smelter to the brew. Legend has it the resulting drink gave Thungni such a hangover that he's been unwilling to share the master rune for fear of killing off any runelord insane enough to drink this alchemical beer.

This should obviously be the capstone of akazit.

Only half joking here.
 
Well what the hell, the worst that can happen is my ideas don't get accepted.

Master Rune of Volcanism: Banner rune that when activated shrouds the army in a heat shield that burns and melts anything that tries to enter the field.

Editing this to make it more distinct from conduction
 
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Well what the hell, the worst that can happen is my ideas don't get accepted.

Master Rune of Volcanism: weapon rune that gives weapons extra force, heat and causes the ground to melt in a small radius
That just sounds like Conduction. Give it a bit more thought so that Soulcake doesn't have to shift through tonnes of stuff that has to end up getting rejected.
 
Let's clear any possible low hanging gems first. Can anyone think of any particularly dwarfy rune that isn't on the rune list?

Something smithy, or mining related? Or maybe Engineering related runes to finally give us the ability to impress Morgrim senpai?
 
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