Noumero
Omit Needless Words
Oh, she totally dies in the Riftwar, 80% sure.
Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest
- Thread starter eaglejarl
- Start date
-
- Tags
- naruto rationalist romance armageddon is looking better and better damn you kishimoto explosions everywhere explosives solve everyone if in doubt surrender to the mercy of zabuza it seemed like a good idea at the time looks like a really bad case of being a jōnin my god. where does the lore end? precommitting is the winning plan screaming in kagome screw the rules i have explosives something bad might still happen sometimes you gotta sociopath stabby zabby subsection c of paragraph 9 should include we can weaponize this so hard
- Location
- United States
@eaglejarl @Paperclipped @Velorien
Apologizes if this is an obvious oversight on my part, but is there a reason we are not just….leaving a month-duration Force Dome around them? Or two of them for that matter, with one containing the village and another smaller one protecting both itself and the other rune.
- Location
- Yes.
Because the raid is designed to look like a raid by unknown, Skywalking ninja? The existence of the Force Dome, even if the rune isn't immediately noticed, gives away that some fuckery is afoot here.
- Location
- UK
This seems straightforwardly not true, in the sense that Hazō has already found more than one essie hax. For example, if Elemental Mastery's discovery was handled more sensibly, he could easily have transformed it over time into a moveset of specialist, battle-ready jutsu by learning technique hacking to mere moderate levels. Or similarly, if runes didn't happen, there seem to be several ways Hazō could have become a viable essie just by building out his sealing repertoire, and if he hadn't traded Skywalkers st. everyone has them now, the path to dominating mere jounin seems, well, not instant, but very achievable in not ultimately too long. And then the various training hacks he has compound this; I don't know how long Guy-tier punching would take if we pivoted to that, throwing away all Hazō's real specialisms, but it seems to me like it would actually have been achievable in a frankly too reasonable time frame, despite being the absolute dumbest path to power. S rank abilities are meant to be rare, and Hazō is flooded with them, limited mostly by the fact he's busy fighting dragons and Akatsuki and running a clan and shit like that. The claim that Hazō is locked out of these by format seems unfounded. Rather, it makes sense to me that the specific exploits we find are found by discovery, rather than being chosen upfront.
- Location
- Europa, Jupiter Orbit
Sure they exist. Mythological tales are full of them. The regular surface of the moon gets eclipsed by some fantastical giant eye.
Cover for "he's actually a missing nin and Leaf actually wants him dead too and no siree, nothing he's doing out there is at our word or for our benefit, believe me, mister Akatsuki sir".
I was thinking of this as well, in both directions, except further from home. Specifically, do nations like Lightning and Earth ever have out of nowhere inventions, or chances of their Essies dying, or alliances forming and breaking among their own top clans that lead to international political consequences? And what do the various independent and roaming Essies and Summoners do? Might any one of them mistakenly break the seal that holds back some great horror? Or found a new nation and ask to join AMITY?
But such things are pretty much impossible to simulate. At best one could have a "global events" dice roll and roll for whether it's good, bad or neutral, before inventing something fitting. Anything else would require a giant table of random encounters with multiple sub-tables and someone dedicating quite a bit of time just to implement whatever gets rolled up each in-game month (which would be even harder during time skips).
Honestly, just the fact that something like the Great Collapse was possible already is a testament for the massive amount of work you put into background simulation.
I'd suggest that you could be more transparent with how you run such things (but not what the possibilities are or any exact numbers), but to be honest I do worry that someone among all the smart people here might end up metagaming that without necessarily even meaning to.
Enma might just be the most famous Leaf summon, beyond even the Sannin's Boss summons.
- Location
- The Soviet Republic of Canuckistan
- Pronouns
- He/Him
He just needs to run - it worked just fine for us. 'Orochimaru and Hazo obviously are both dyed-in-the-wool traitors' explains this perfectly.
- Location
- United States
- Location
- UK
@_The_Bomb I don't follow the presumed implied argument.
- Location
- United States
That in both Marked for Death and canon S-Rankers (even those on the same team) tend to not have significant hax overlap aside from bloodlines, also happening to have very high base stats, and occasionally shared best-in-class ninjutsu for fulfilling specific rolls in combat.
Heleor
^_^
Preface this with the fact that I love this quest as a reader (mostly not a player) and that my enjoyment would probably go up if there were no mechanics and it was completely narrative-driven. (Or even if it still had rolls but completely determined by the QMs!) The QM team are all amazing writers.
I do think that the definition of 'simulationist' being 'PCs don't have plot armor' seems a bit unfair to most other quests that run. While some absolutely have plot armor, others definitely have bad things happen to player characters or allies. (Granted, usually to much salt from the playerbase). Talos' hollow quest was a great example of that. That said, I never really liked the 'simulationist' label -- it felt a lot like punching down. All quests simulate a world. Some just do it better or more completely than others.
I cannot even begin to imagine how to balance game design, creative writing, and disparate player opinions like y'all.
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
While I absolutely agree that there are places in the sim where we are benefited by the high/low res differential, I cannot say that I am moved by the argument that it is to our benefit at large; I think it is significantly worse for us than the counterfactual. I mean, to put it to a specific in-universe example... If we didn't have the high res sample of Air Domes, we wouldn't have made skywalkers.
And further, using your example, if other sealmasters were able to create powerful original seals... We have the Iron Nerve, and if such seals existed, we would arrange circumstances to copy them ourselves. If other ninja had powerful jutsu, we would make deals with them, marry them into the clan, etc. The thing about the high/low res differential is that it affects us on all levels.
Additionally, something that isn't quite addresssed here is the idea that -- well, if you've got a vague outline for what a character's sheet is, you fill in the details, right? You give them jutsu, maybe seals. But they don't have to earn those, not really, not the way Hazou does. You just give them what makes sense for their character without rolling for if they died over the past 20 years, or retroactively having them eaten by sealing failures. And that's kinda how it has to be, I'm not judging for that or saying you should do otherwise.
But stuff like that... I mean, there's a certain degree to which that is in itself unfair to us, because we aren't 20 years in the future in game; we don't have that backlog of filled-in backstory-based XP and jutsu.
- Location
- UK
I think there's maybe some confusion resulting from using 'hax overlap' in two different ways. The Inferno Vulpix quote that I was responding to was in the context of how findable S rank skills are. The Paperclipped quote was about the ability to apply multiple modifiers to a single roll. These don't seem that connected to me.
To put it another way: A hypothetical Akatsuki that just used Elemental Mastery Release and trained up their base stats for a few years would be the scariest living S rank in the setting. A hypothetical Akatsuki that just used Hazō's counterfactual seal loadout as it would be in a few years if it were his sole focus and it were tuned for personal combat, without those seals like Skywalkers shared, backed with decent but not groundbreaking combat stats, would be scarier than Zabuza. A hypothetical Akatsuki that had runes would be setting determining, and make Sasori a footnote in our list of threats. A hypothetical Akatsuki member that did nothing but discover and open the rifts could be more impactful than any S rank, and if left undiscovered would alone overturn the quest. A hypothetical Akatsuki that just had properly tuned Zoo Rush tactics would be an overcomable but terrifying adversary to Leaf, of greater scale than a mere Hidan or Kakuzu. And even an Akatsuki member that just had stats par with what Hazō could achieve with dedicated effort and his repertoire of time-saving tricks over a healthy life of training probably wouldn't be an impressive Akatsuki member of note, but could still probably be a world famous ninja that only the best could comfortably face. I'm not saying these all cleanly add—there are huge opportunity costs that force specialization—but I am saying that I don't think it's fair to say Hazō has been limited in access to S rank skillsets by mechanical disfavor.
Last edited:
- Location
- Somewhere
I don't think scale is an arbitrary line in the sand when it comes to murder, and I don't think you are taking the geographical dimension into account. The consequences of killing 1 person, 100 people, or 10000 people are not the same, and I don't believe they scale linearly. This is not like killing 1000 people distributed across the world.
I am not sure it is worth Summoning 'Bunta and the TS at this total.
@eaglejarl @Velorien @Paperclipped
Did Orochimaru and Tsunade indicate how many refilled SCs they'd be willing to run?
Also, is Kurenai insisting on fighting? I think I would prefer to use Mari for genjutsu and have her chakra. Unless Mari thinks Kurenai is a superior combatant (which doesn't make sense IMO Mari has had years of FOOM and IIRC they're approximately the same age)
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
So -- the biggest thing, for me, that I'd like to see changed is...
I don't actually care that much about player agency? I mean, okay, that's not entirely fair -- I care about it a fair bit. But it has been discussed in the past that you don't have the NPCs that we go to have... ideas... and such (not entirely acurate, just take that as approximate), because you want us to own our wins. And that really hurts how reasonable the setting feels.
Noumero
Omit Needless Words
@eaglejarl, @Velorien, @Paperclipped:
MfD's story is nearing the climax of one of its biggest arcs so far. The stresses and the high-stakes decisions associated with it have created a few spots of tension between the players and the QMs. Upon reflection, the majority of the regular players have come to view these tensions as instances of systemic issues that have been long plaguing MfD. Over the past several months, we've been mulling over them, culminating in this collectively-supported letter.
It must be stressed that the players don't believe that any of these issues are due to the QMs' ill intent. We believe that the QMs are operating in good faith, doing their best to rigorously model a simulationist quest and implement a fair rules-based game within it.
Indeed, the current status quo seems to be hurting the QMs as well: both directly, by making their ability to write MfD unnecessarily harder, and by proxy, due to the negative moods within the playerbase.
The purpose of this letter is to establish a shared understanding of the problems we've identified, to serve as a foundation for subsequent discussions regarding possible solutions. We believe that by working together, we can reach an equilibrium where everyone's experience with MfD improves significantly.
Our understanding is that QMs model the established player/QM dynamics as based on an implicit social contract. The QMs faithfully and impartially simulate MfD's world, avoiding narrative causality and railroading, effectively implementing a "sandbox" in which the players' ability to guide the story is only limited by their agency. In turn, the players' knowledge is limited to only what Hazou knows, and the players' only channel of causal influence is through Hazou.
Effectively, on the players' end, MfD is intended to be a hardcore-but-fair simulation game.
Despite the QMs' best efforts, however, the simulation is imperfect. In general, flaws in it are expected and understandable: QMs don't have infinite time, effort, and knowledge necessary to perfectly simulate a world, after all. But some of those imperfections take the shape of systemic patterns, rather than one-off random errors. Specifically, patterns that markedly worsen the players' experiences in particular, in ways that might not be visible to the QMs.
Two major categories of said flaws can be dubbed "simulation lag" and "high-res vs. low-res simulation".
"Simulation lag" involves situations in which the players cannot access the resources that Hazou should, by any reasonable interpretation of the in-universe situation, have access to, due to the fact that faithfully modeling the particulars of these resources would eat up too much of the QMs' time.
Concrete examples:
This issue effectively makes the game unfair-against-us – even though no party intends this unfairness.
High-res vs. low-res simulation is exactly what it says on the tin: the difference between how the MfD world seems to work when modeled in a "low-resolution" background manner, and how it works immediately around Hazou.
Our understanding is that "high-resolution" elements are given much more scrutiny than the "low-resolution" ones, both because they're simulated in more detail (and therefore more inconsistencies become clear), and because the QMs feel the need to make their mechanics ironclad, lest we immediately exploit them into an anticlimactic, unrealistic-feeling total victory.
However, that likewise has the effective end result of systemically disadvantaging us. The details of anything we touch are subjected to much more consistency-based constraints than the stuff our enemies are allowed to get up to in the background. As the consequence, anything we get access to seems to suddenly become much weaker than advertised.
Concrete examples:
I should reiterate that we don't blame the QMs for failing to run a perfect simulation. Indeed, it's an impossible demand. QMs have limited time, energy, and knowledge, and also lives to live.
Nevertheless, although understandable in all kinds of ways, it is still a problem. As-is, certain classes of simulation failures end up systemically disadvantaging the players.
Exacerbating the problem, it's our perception that the QMs aren't aware of the scale of the issue and how acutely the players feel it. It seems to us that the QMs still view themselves as basically succeeding at acting as balanced simulators; that any dissatisfaction with the rulings is "player salt" that can and should be dismissed with the indifference of the laws of nature; and that they must uphold the implicit social contract and act as volitionless simulation-game engines lest the entire enterprise falls apart.
On the player side, it's become particularly dire in the last several months, with many long-term players intensely unhappy with this state of affairs and considering stopping playing. The overall opinion is that significant, global changes to the way the quest is run are needed. It's not a matter of a select few bad rulings or local errors.
For one: Although perfect simulation is impossible, what we could prospectively strive for is a paradigm of "net-neutral" simulation failures. Introduce some change to the way the simulation is run which would ensure that the simulation's failures advantage the players as often as they harm them. Alternatively, make it a policy to deliberately adjust the simulation-state to cancel out the effects of any failures on the strength of our in-story position.
Another plausible point of intervention is decreasing the importance of the "hardcore-but-fair game" part of the experience. The common sentiment among long-term players is that we don't care that much about "player agency" or "earning our victories". We care about reading a rational, simulationist, internally consistent, well-written story. But that story doesn't have to pull double duty as a hardcore game.
So: we're fine with some degree of QM-guided steering, as long as it's towards problems that would be fun to solve and to plot points the QMs would enjoy writing. We're fine with narrative causality, as long as the resultant story-state is still internally consistent. We're fine with the QMs fudging the dice rolls, as long as it's for more narratively exciting outcomes (whether it's fudged in our favour or against it). Et cetera.
In turn, we would like the QMs to loosen up the rules on their end as well. Outcome-pump the hidden free variables of the simulation to accommodate our schemes sometimes, when those schemes seem exciting to all of us. Let Team Uplift display more agency, if and when it would be fun and in-character for them to do so – even if it would clash with the players' agency or lead to them solving our problems for us. Provide us with OOC information when it makes our life easier and doesn't open the door for egregious meta-gaming. (Paper bluntly telling us that the ACE date didn't matter for our ability to summon Cannai is a good example here. We would have preferred if we were told that at the very beginning, instead of engaging in the exhausting back-and-forth about the dates.) Et cetera.
Our expectation is that this would make the experience better on the QM end as well. QMs have repeatedly complained that the demands of the simulation and our choices within it maneuver the story towards states they find unpleasant or boring to write. The lighthousing, the endless meetings, the lack of punching. None of this has to be happening.
The status quo represents a suboptimal equilibrium. As relatively rational agents, we are surely capable of coordinating to move to a superior one.
Signatories: Noumero, _The_Bomb, Inferno Vulpix, Spector29, acidshill, RandomOTP, DanZapman, T_of_A, Emstar, Zampano, absoluteblack, CaramilkThief, RoadWild, Lunae, Gintarazimu, Sir Stompy, FaintlySorcerous, redzonejoe, ProperAttorney, Cariyaga, Unaligned Player, Halil.
MfD's story is nearing the climax of one of its biggest arcs so far. The stresses and the high-stakes decisions associated with it have created a few spots of tension between the players and the QMs. Upon reflection, the majority of the regular players have come to view these tensions as instances of systemic issues that have been long plaguing MfD. Over the past several months, we've been mulling over them, culminating in this collectively-supported letter.
It must be stressed that the players don't believe that any of these issues are due to the QMs' ill intent. We believe that the QMs are operating in good faith, doing their best to rigorously model a simulationist quest and implement a fair rules-based game within it.
Indeed, the current status quo seems to be hurting the QMs as well: both directly, by making their ability to write MfD unnecessarily harder, and by proxy, due to the negative moods within the playerbase.
The purpose of this letter is to establish a shared understanding of the problems we've identified, to serve as a foundation for subsequent discussions regarding possible solutions. We believe that by working together, we can reach an equilibrium where everyone's experience with MfD improves significantly.
Our understanding is that QMs model the established player/QM dynamics as based on an implicit social contract. The QMs faithfully and impartially simulate MfD's world, avoiding narrative causality and railroading, effectively implementing a "sandbox" in which the players' ability to guide the story is only limited by their agency. In turn, the players' knowledge is limited to only what Hazou knows, and the players' only channel of causal influence is through Hazou.
Effectively, on the players' end, MfD is intended to be a hardcore-but-fair simulation game.
Despite the QMs' best efforts, however, the simulation is imperfect. In general, flaws in it are expected and understandable: QMs don't have infinite time, effort, and knowledge necessary to perfectly simulate a world, after all. But some of those imperfections take the shape of systemic patterns, rather than one-off random errors. Specifically, patterns that markedly worsen the players' experiences in particular, in ways that might not be visible to the QMs.
Two major categories of said flaws can be dubbed "simulation lag" and "high-res vs. low-res simulation".
"Simulation lag" involves situations in which the players cannot access the resources that Hazou should, by any reasonable interpretation of the in-universe situation, have access to, due to the fact that faithfully modeling the particulars of these resources would eat up too much of the QMs' time.
Concrete examples:
- Jiraiya's seal hoard. Little more needs to be said on that topic.
- Publicly available Tower seals. We'd voted to download them, and never received them.
- Any number of seals and jutsu that Asuma would've briefed us on and given us access to in order to assist us in the Dragonwar.
- More generally, all of the actions we choose not to take because we know it would overload the QMs. (For example: not asking for a list of all publicly known non-village-affiliated clans, so that we can scan it for interesting targets to raid.)
- Our Team Uplift advisors failing to provide sufficiently detailed analyses of in-story situations.
- The second half of King Kamehameha's conversation.
- Ambiguities regarding how certain mechanics work, such as:
- ACE refresh dates.
- DoB's interactions with non-research infusions.
- MedNin research.
- Last-minute retcons due to suddenly revealed inconsistencies. (Such as the entire "the Akatsuki's anti-summon seal array" incident.)
- Various subtler continuity errors, which make us uncertain regarding which elements of the setting/characterization we can rely on, and which have since fallen Out.
This issue effectively makes the game unfair-against-us – even though no party intends this unfairness.
High-res vs. low-res simulation is exactly what it says on the tin: the difference between how the MfD world seems to work when modeled in a "low-resolution" background manner, and how it works immediately around Hazou.
Our understanding is that "high-resolution" elements are given much more scrutiny than the "low-resolution" ones, both because they're simulated in more detail (and therefore more inconsistencies become clear), and because the QMs feel the need to make their mechanics ironclad, lest we immediately exploit them into an anticlimactic, unrealistic-feeling total victory.
However, that likewise has the effective end result of systemically disadvantaging us. The details of anything we touch are subjected to much more consistency-based constraints than the stuff our enemies are allowed to get up to in the background. As the consequence, anything we get access to seems to suddenly become much weaker than advertised.
Concrete examples:
- Every jutsu, seal, or resource accessible to the players has a rigorous receipt attached to it: how we got it, why, and what it's capable of. By contrast, the Akatsuki can be freely given an incredibly powerful seal array, because their history isn't modeled in as much detail. There are numerous "free variables" in there that can be tweaked to patch the holes in the simulation.
- The chakra-water cave. In low-res, it was apparently the thing that let the Sannin survive Hanzo long enough to earn their title. In high-res, it's a relatively underwhelming 20% discount, and it's hard to imagine how it could've had its described low-res effect.
- Research mechanics, such as sealing. Initially, it was introduced as ultimately all-capable. But once we got more into it and reached jounin-level, it became clear that its actual capabilities must be extremely limited. Else, why wouldn't sealmasters already rule the world?
- Sociopolitical developments. People like Ami can weave incredibly intricate social schemes – as long as they stay "low-res", with the details of what/who they're manipulating being fleshed out simultaneously with the idea that they've succeeded in the manipulation. By contrast, Mari struggles to think circles around Orochimaru or even Shikamaru, because once they're brought on-screen, their details and Mari's capabilities become fixed – and it becomes unrealistic for Mari to win hard.
I should reiterate that we don't blame the QMs for failing to run a perfect simulation. Indeed, it's an impossible demand. QMs have limited time, energy, and knowledge, and also lives to live.
Nevertheless, although understandable in all kinds of ways, it is still a problem. As-is, certain classes of simulation failures end up systemically disadvantaging the players.
Exacerbating the problem, it's our perception that the QMs aren't aware of the scale of the issue and how acutely the players feel it. It seems to us that the QMs still view themselves as basically succeeding at acting as balanced simulators; that any dissatisfaction with the rulings is "player salt" that can and should be dismissed with the indifference of the laws of nature; and that they must uphold the implicit social contract and act as volitionless simulation-game engines lest the entire enterprise falls apart.
On the player side, it's become particularly dire in the last several months, with many long-term players intensely unhappy with this state of affairs and considering stopping playing. The overall opinion is that significant, global changes to the way the quest is run are needed. It's not a matter of a select few bad rulings or local errors.
For one: Although perfect simulation is impossible, what we could prospectively strive for is a paradigm of "net-neutral" simulation failures. Introduce some change to the way the simulation is run which would ensure that the simulation's failures advantage the players as often as they harm them. Alternatively, make it a policy to deliberately adjust the simulation-state to cancel out the effects of any failures on the strength of our in-story position.
Another plausible point of intervention is decreasing the importance of the "hardcore-but-fair game" part of the experience. The common sentiment among long-term players is that we don't care that much about "player agency" or "earning our victories". We care about reading a rational, simulationist, internally consistent, well-written story. But that story doesn't have to pull double duty as a hardcore game.
So: we're fine with some degree of QM-guided steering, as long as it's towards problems that would be fun to solve and to plot points the QMs would enjoy writing. We're fine with narrative causality, as long as the resultant story-state is still internally consistent. We're fine with the QMs fudging the dice rolls, as long as it's for more narratively exciting outcomes (whether it's fudged in our favour or against it). Et cetera.
In turn, we would like the QMs to loosen up the rules on their end as well. Outcome-pump the hidden free variables of the simulation to accommodate our schemes sometimes, when those schemes seem exciting to all of us. Let Team Uplift display more agency, if and when it would be fun and in-character for them to do so – even if it would clash with the players' agency or lead to them solving our problems for us. Provide us with OOC information when it makes our life easier and doesn't open the door for egregious meta-gaming. (Paper bluntly telling us that the ACE date didn't matter for our ability to summon Cannai is a good example here. We would have preferred if we were told that at the very beginning, instead of engaging in the exhausting back-and-forth about the dates.) Et cetera.
Our expectation is that this would make the experience better on the QM end as well. QMs have repeatedly complained that the demands of the simulation and our choices within it maneuver the story towards states they find unpleasant or boring to write. The lighthousing, the endless meetings, the lack of punching. None of this has to be happening.
The status quo represents a suboptimal equilibrium. As relatively rational agents, we are surely capable of coordinating to move to a superior one.
Signatories: Noumero, _The_Bomb, Inferno Vulpix, Spector29, acidshill, RandomOTP, DanZapman, T_of_A, Emstar, Zampano, absoluteblack, CaramilkThief, RoadWild, Lunae, Gintarazimu, Sir Stompy, FaintlySorcerous, redzonejoe, ProperAttorney, Cariyaga, Unaligned Player, Halil.
Cariyaga
Handsome Gentleperson
- Location
- United States
To sum up my thoughts briefly- I agreed with the general thrust but have some reservations about the ending. Not enough to not support it, but enough that I want to say a few preliminary words as I sort out my thoughts. I think simulationism is one of the unique points of the quest and a strong draw- in particular, the ability to just predict what's going to happen next given enough information about a specific topic instead of having to make guesses about QM preferences and balance concerns and so on. I think that the quest has developed step by step and had to make new additions little by little, and the end result is unwieldy in several ways that could be mitigated with an overall redesign and/or redistributing some of the burden to the players. I think it starts with discussing fundamental assumptions about how the quest goes- for one, the action plans are what we want Hazo to do, not what we need to see happen onscreen.
I thought you already do this?
Anyway, I am against this. And I dislike that it's happening during a high stakes portion of the quest.
As for issues. Primarily being unable to get my ideas in action plans. And unable to identify which ideas have high chance of convincing others about, so I could at least focus my energies on those. At least one player was wary of asking NPCs for advice, because the QMs dislike us asking NPCs to do things for us. Avoiding asking NPCs for advice is unsimulationist, so I dislike it. Simulation lag. The moderation policy.
How much of that would be leftover after Tsunade, Oro(and Mari?) make their preferred number of clones, and all available bosses and elites are summoned?
It's really interesting to see Oro's strategy for handling Hazou. I wonder how long it's been since the last time he rolled a rapport check.
Between this and going out of his way to mention that he'll show us bioseals if we go to our next biosealing checkup, it's clear his control strategy for Hazou is to have a positive relationship where Hazou happily submits to his knife on the regular. He'll still install various conditioning routines and kill/control switches, obviously, but he hopes to mostly steer Hazou without needing them.
This bodes well for us, especially if we promptly purge our bioseals out and never got under his knife again, but otherwise keep up positive collaboration. Unless he gets pushy?
....Man, I hope the thread doesn't hear him respecting our abilities, and get besotted with him like an abused kid latching onto their first-ever source of validation.
(Who am I kidding, we're doomed. Players gonna be like: "But he respects us to much to plan contingencies against us!")
FB buy is more important at this critical juncture.
[x] Training Plan (Kei): Spend no XP
Reserve XP for buying FP
[x] Training Plan (Noburi): Spend no XP
Reserve XP for buying FP
[x] Training Plan (Hazou): Spend no XP
Reserve XP for buying FP
I feel like we(or at least, I) had figured this out pretty well across our experiments. At this point, hearing this directly didn't cause me to update my model much.
Our entire career is built on the advantages of being high-res.
Low-res people can't "flip it upside down" and make skywalkers.
Low-res people won't invest zoo rush(mist has shar scroll+wakahisa for generations)
etc.
There are tradeoffs, but in an very important sense, always being in high-res mode is a substantial part of our Essie Bullshit.
Sanin, Itachi, Mori, etc already cleared out the discoverable lore cashes.
We do know Crimson State is explicitly not cleaned out, but have been to sacred to try it.
... we've accrued a staggering amount of potentially-Essie bullshit a a pretty steady rate that seems to be accelerating if anything, so I really wouldn't worry. Plus, we're sitting on so much potential essie hax that we aren't even exploiting yet, we already have enough to carry us to S-rank in a year or two.
They'd suffocate, unless we dug air holes,in with case they'd be able to talk to any ninja who return from missions. So it doesn't buy us additional time.
Actually even without air holes, they can still use writing.
Good thought, though.
Noumero
Omit Needless Words
Yes, actually. That's one succinct way to put it.So, the thrust of it is, this quest has accumulated too much technical debt and needs a refactoring?
- Location
- Texas
I don't think it really passes the smell test that these lore caches remained undisturbed for ~950 years and we only just missed them to the previous generation.
would they suffocate even with a large force dome volume?
edit:
and if we leave a few Usamatsu's Glorious Life-Saving Preserver around?
Last edited: