I'm broadly skeptical of the FOOM stuff here, from two directions. First, I don't think we're likely to be able to FOOM much at all, even optimistically, once you account for how much chakra we'll need for runecrafting and how much the team will want to keep in reserve for emergencies. Hunting down chakra beasts en masse to drain them feels both insufficient and problematic: I don't think even Yuno can hunt quick enough to source a lot of chakra per day, and leaving a trail of nonlethally-incapacitated-and-only-then-killed chakra beasts sounds ill-advised from an OPSEC perspective (I presume that the kind of fight we'd have Yuno doing would leave different physical evidence than regular kills. If we're doing this in enough volume to meaningfully FOOM, I think we leave way too big a signal to any hunter-nin who happen to be nearby. Unless we hunt aquatic beasts, which should leave no meaningful evidence behind.)

The second is that, unlike runes and the rift, FOOM actually isn't relevant to our mission parameters. It's not secret anymore, not our secret, but it's still enough of a secret that we shouldn't share it around without good reason. Kagome in particular, we've covered this before in the SC talks but we really can't outright ignore the fact that he's inherently an OPSEC leak. Sharing Shadow Clone itself is of course fine, there's ample benefit to having such a powerful ninjutsu in more of our team's toolkits, but if FOOM essentially doesn't exist for us (and it doesn't, I believe) then there's no benefit to talking about it other than going full-disclosure on all our secrets just for the sake of it.

I'm open to being convinced that we do actually have enough chakra budget to meaningfully FOOM even without mass-draining land-borne chakra beasts and even after leaving our team with enough chakra for emergencies. Maybe the numbers look better than I think they do, either on the face of it or after we explore how much Noburi can bring in from the oceans. Even if that's true, though, I still remain skeptical about sharing FOOM here. Even if there's ample chakra to go around somehow, raising SC to 30 would take long enough that they essentially don't get to FOOM anyways.

(Unless, of course, you mean by this that we're making Yuno and Tenten core Team Uplift members in that "we hide nothing from each other" way, and that we'd obviously cut them into FOOM even after returning to Leaf, which I can see as a fair perspective, though the Kagome OPSEC connundrum remains a problem.)

In terms of tangible requests, I would like the FOOM angle (not the SC stuff, just the FOOM stuff) scaled down to figuring out how much chakra budget we have. Discuss emergency reserves, ocean chakra farming, and the costs of Hazou's runecrafting. We can figure out after that if anything resembling FOOM is still possible, and talk about whether to share it or not.
There's definitely enough for slow FOOM on some days. Assuming double track Research it's like 900 CP on infusion days and 150 CP on prep days. Assuming the CR budget is 300 for Kei + Hazou, 200 for Tenten and Kagome, and 500 for Mari - that means we can siphon off 1500 CP per day for FOOM + research. We probably can't get that much but if we can get 2/3 of the total that's enough for significant FOOM, like 1.0x for Hazou on average.

If everyone is drained to 2/3 and regens back to full before being drained again, that should allow Noburi to capture most of their regen without compromising their combat effectiveness.

As for sharing FOOM, we cannot hide it in the TRs that Hazou is going to be spending most of his time. I don't think it's realistic to try. The secret is out more or less. The others don't really have time to train SC to the point where they can FOOM so that's not really relevant.

As for Yuno hunting, good points. I'll cut that. The idea was for her to find nests of beasts and lead Nobs to them but I think it's just too fiddley.

Can I suggest explicitly mentioning the possibility of showing the Toad Sages Naruto's letter (under "Noburi, can you keep ...")? We've talked about it before, but might not make it into the discussion if it isn't in the plan.
Uh sure, why?
 
A while back, @Inferno Vulpix made this suggestion:
Is there any chance we could just... out-distance them? Naruto's list of hotspots are all locations on the map, in the known world. If Hidan spins in a circle and walks northish and eventually finds himself on the far side of Snow Country, at some point he probably shrugs and figures he missed us. The way to never let Hidan get within 50km of us is to estimate how far he'll track us on a Jashin-given whim and go 100km farther than that.

Or, heck, 200 km farther than that, 500 km farther. Realistically, nothing stops us from going to the other end of the world entirely. We have the supplies, there's nobody we need to come in contact with, and we can still relatively easily make the return trip once we're done.
I'd like to signal-boost it. Akatsuki is certainly capable of pursuing us beyond the known world, but even if they manage to figure out the direction we went in, they're probably pretty unlikely to actually do it. There are only six of them left: Sasori's researching the rift, so he can't go; Konan's governing Rain and seems very unlikely to want to leave for the length of time required to track us down. That leaves Itachi, Kisame, Hidan, and Deidara. If they send Itachi or Kisame (plus one of Hidan/Deidara), they're losing a third of their combat power; if they don't send Itachi or Kisame, then they have no way of communicating with the away group. Plus, regardless of who they send, they have no clue how long it would take to find us, and they're committing to a significant delay in getting back if something happens suddenly.

On top of that, if we just leave the EN, a good chunk of Akatsuki may conclude that we've decided to get out while the getting's good, and so they may not even think we pose a threat. (Itachi is already the only one who really sees us as a threat, if my impression is correct.)

If they do send a pair, the mobile options they have are:
  • Itachi:
    • Crow mounts (?) for fast travel - however, probably doesn't have the chakra to sustain these for too long.
    • Crow scouts (?) for searching areas.
    • The most invested in hunting us down.
    • However, likely the most powerful member of Akatsuki, so probably won't want to leave for weeks/months on end.
  • Kisame:
    • Shark summons likely efficient for crossing ocean, but no known fast travel or efficient search abilities on land.
    • Seemed relatively positively inclined towards us; unlikely to want to sink huge amounts of effort in hunting us down.
    • Also, no point in sending both him and Itachi, and the advantage of having Itachi in the EN over Kisame is probably not huge; if Itachi is willing to send Kisame, he's likely willing to go himself.
  • Hidan:
    • Can potentially hunt us down via Jashin-knowledge, but this is likely highly inefficient over wide areas. Would need to be paired with a fast mover to have a hope, I think, meaning Deidara or Itachi.
    • Not particularly patient, fairly unlikely to want to leave his cultists for extended times, very unlikely to want to spend extended time away from easily accessible sacrifices.
  • Deidara:
    • Clay dragons for fast movement, plus personal flight. The only mobile member of Akatsuki who is likely to possess indefinitely-usable strategic movement capabilities (do Deidara's constructs cost chakra to move or maintain?).
    • Wide-area assaults for destroying any area they suspect may conceal us.
They won't send more than a pair, because doing that would mean being unable to protect the rift site from Leaf. If they don't send Deidara, they have no good sustainable fast movement options (at least, none that we can't match, i.e. skywalkers). If they don't send Hidan, they probably don't have any good methods for finding us - even Crow scouts can only cover a limited area. If they send Deidara + Hidan, the rest of Akatsuki can't communicate with them to e.g. tell them to come back because Sasori suceeded in opening the rift; furthermore, Deidara and Hidan is the pair we're most likely to be able to kill, and if Itachi is consdering us to be enough of a threat to send a pair after us beyond the EN, he likely also considers us to be enough of a threat that we might be able to beat a pair of weaker Akatsuki members.

In summary, I think leaving the known world - getting to the ocean, picking a direction, and running that way until we hit land - might actually be a good tactic. The main failure mode is that we don't find land for weeks, in which case we've basically lost those weeks plus extra weeks to get back afterwards, but skywalkers have no height limit and all we need for research is an island (albeit that would make it easier to find us than being in a random place on another continent).

Because I'm worried the Toad Sages will refuse to continue teaching Noburi if they think he betrayed Leaf, and having evidence that he didn't actually betray Leaf may be important for changing their minds.
 
Tenten was, uh...talking. A lot. Are we certain she's Tenten?
TENTEN?: Of course I am Tenten. Now stop asking inconvenient questions and be distracted by girlfriend-like amorous activities.

KEI: Absolutely. Allow me to--

[splat]

KEI: Oh, no. What happened?! And what is this flashing sign in the air?

UCHIHA ITACHI HAS BEEN BANNED FOR VIOLATING THE SUFFICIENT VELOCITY TERMS OF SERVICE
 
[X] Action Plan: It's Not Paranoia, Right?
Word Count: <300
  • Sanity-check with the team.
  • Tenten:
    • Thank her for coming.
    • Hazou has some new seals he'll need to scribe for everyone. Kei'll get you read into to our codes ASAP.
      • Scribe seals (RRBs, Force Blades, skywalkers, etc.) for everyone for the rest of the day.
  • Noburi's squad:
    • In the Seventh Path, before meeting:
      • Confirm they aren't being tracked.
        • Does Noburi have a Toad with this speciality? Can you Summon them to further confirm?
      • Ask Ma/Pa to check Noburi for genjutsu.
    • When meeting, send appropriate Summons ahead to the rendezvous to check if anyone else followed them. If any are desummoned, run.
      • If Ma/Pa have special detection abilities, ask Noburi to summon one or both to further confirm.
    • After they're cleared, fill them in.
  • Work out a chakra budget for runecrafting and FOOM
    • Noburi how much chakra can you drain from the environment per day on land/at sea.
      • From the team? Without compromising combat effectiveness? Say everyone goes around at 2/3 full reserves.
    • Now that we're missing-nin, Hazou will teach Shadow Clone to anyone who wants to learn it.
    • Depending on the chakra budget it, it likely makes sense to funnel it all to Hazou so that he can learn Runecrafting faster and research runes in parallel.
  • Head to Oro's chakra cave in Wind.
    • Plan: Skywalk to directly above it and dive down under cover. Use a telescope/Summons to confirm area has no human presence.
    • Any other suggestions to get in undetected?
  • FOOM as much as time/chakra costs permit, read notes with extra blocks.
 
[X] Training Plan Hazou: Sealing Step

[X] Action Plan: It's Not Paranoia, Right?

@faflec, why is the Wind cave better than getting a good look at an old rift ?
 
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Ask Ma/Pa to check Noburi for genjutsu.
Ma/PA might not know about everyone becoming Missing Nin yet. If not, I'd rather let Noburi and Mari workshop a discussion about that, first.

If the TS find out from Hazō asking them to check their Summoner for mental compulsions, then we'll have set of an explosive in our faces.
 
@faflec, why is the Wind cave better than getting a good look at an old rift ?
I want to spend that day doing more research on killing Akatsuki, moreso than spending that time on a different rift taking readings. I acknowledge this limits our ability to do rift research in the future, but I argue that we should focus on our actual mission more than the secondary objective.
 
Plan draft for something I want to do very soon, though perhaps not this cycle.

[ ] Action Plan: Seducing Eldritch Horrors
Word count: <399.
  • Talk to Kei, Snowflake, and Kagome. Outline the problem of Hidan.
    • Jashin's probability-manipulation has been corroborated by Orochimaru, Kamehameha, and empirical evidence. According to Orochimaru, Hidan leverages it for tracking.
    • Based on your calculations, taking a conservative view of Hidan's capabilities, he can easily find us across hundreds of miles. Realistically, he can "refuel" his "budgets", using sacrifices or something. If so, even going beyond the EN won't save us. If he's focusing on us, and Jashin is guiding him, tracking us is just a matter of time. He might already be en route.
    • We can deal with Hidan, alone. He won't be alone. If he and one other Akatsuki find us, we're dead, period.
    • If Jashin is guiding him. Kei confirmed that in Bakuchioka, a probability-manipulating entity skewed luck in Hazou's favour. The outcome of Hazou's fight with Daizen likewise seems unnatural.
    • Whether this was Jashin or, per Kamehameha, a different entity, doesn't matter. There's a probability-manipulating entity willing to counteract Hidan's probability-manipulation for Hazou.
    • You suggest communing with it, and negotiating keeping Akatsuki away, in exchange for a favour. The entity seems at least partly aligned with Hazou. Doubtlessly there are places where its values are orthogonal to ours: just weird, not monstrous. That's the space for mutually beneficial trades.
    • This is an insane idea. That's why you're looping in Kei and Kagome: if they agree it's reasonable, it likely is.
      • Hazou already has some experience managing Out-possession.
      • Kei had hinted she knows of methods to "interface with inimical entities" in relative safely.
      • Kagome has built an entire paradigm around managing the attention from Out.
    • Currently, this seems like the only way to prevent Hidan inevitably finding us.
  • Conduct the ritual, if approved.
    • Draw on how you set up the seance. Do it while having a DoB consequence; have Jashin's symbol nearby.
    • Employ whatever other optimizations Kei, Snowflake, and Kagome can suggest.
      • Prioritize mental safety. The risk of moderate damage is probably unpreventable, but don't proceed if you expect severe damage.
    • Ensure there's some way for the entity to communicate what it wants using probability-manipulation. A spirit board; a parchment with an ink bottle standing precariously near it; dice being rolled.
    • Opening offers:
      • Maximizing the future flow of souls across Paths (Washerman). (Say, by popularizing recreational cross-Path travel.)
      • Locking-in a constantly changing world (Unkind One). (Say, by making it constantly oscillate between different, but equally utopian, states.)
 
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I want to spend that day doing more research on killing Akatsuki, moreso than spending that time on a different rift taking readings. I acknowledge this limits our ability to do rift research in the future, but I argue that we should focus on our actual mission more than the secondary objective.
I think this is a terrible trade off, since it forever removes our ability to take readings at the bladehorror rift, to save a single day of time. It's just a bad trade off if we ever want to work on Rift Runes.
 
I know the Team is sad, and everything, but I'm just hyped.

If we are to examine MfD from a narrative perspective, as one grand story arc (vis a vis the Hero's Journey) then we seem to have entered the Abyss. We've lost much. We're at the lowest point in our journey.

But all is not lost, there's still a glimmer of hope on the horizon. A training montage awaits. Then, perhaps, apotheosis.

A hype moment in tons of stories.

We have a hyperbolic time chamber and a possibility of reviving the dead. MFD has truly become DBZ.
 
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Did we ever learn if it is safe for noburi to drain summons while in the 7th path (when their bodies are not chakra constructs and so are less likely to behave like pure nature chakra)? Or does this fall into the "never take that risk" category?
 
Did we ever learn if it is safe for noburi to drain summons while in the 7th path (when their bodies are not chakra constructs and so are less likely to behave like pure nature chakra)? Or does this fall into the "never take that risk" category?
As far as I know there has been no confirmation of this. Jiraiya didn't want to risk it at all, and I would respect his knowledge on nature chakra. If we want to do this, we might as well just try to get Noburi sage mode first.
 
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"Hazō has created a new sealing discipline," Kei began.

"Kei!" Hazō exclaimed.

Kei whirled around. "Hazō, if you believe that after everything that Tenten has sacrificed, I will allow her to be–"

"Excuse me," Snowflake interrupted. "I believe what Kei is attempting to say is that runecrafting is not a clan secret due to Orochimaru's possession of same"–without even knowing what runecrafting was capable of, Tenten gave her a look of utter horror–"nor is Tenten in any position to disclose it to anyone until its existence is in any case revealed by its large-scale deployment against Akatsuki."

"Even if it were a clan secret," Kei noted, "we are missing-nin. It would technically belong to Jin and the others, with ourselves being clanless thieves to be eliminated in order to protect it.

"More to the point, you will note that Tenten has chosen to be here, aligned with Akatsuki's primary target, and not, say, on the eastern continent where she could live in relative safety until our victory or defeat. She is a member of Operation Twilight now, and entitled to full disclosure."

"I concur," Snowflake said. "That said, if you believe that it is both desirable and physically possible to conceal runecrafting from Tenten for however many months while you are conducting regular prototype infusions in her immediate vicinity, and while Kagome, aware of every detail of your research, is also within her immediate vicinity, we can–"

"Fine," Hazō said, holding up his hands, "you win. Tenten, we're out here researching runes, which are three-dimensional seals with vastly more potential power than ordinary paper seals, with the specific goal of killing Akatsuki, on Naruto's orders."

Tenten nodded. "To prevent them from opening the rift?"

Hazō looked at Kei.

"Nothing about the rift race is classified," Kei said impatiently. "The existence of the rift is known to the senior members of all council clans, and doubtless to anyone they gossip with. All of the pieces have been not only available but in plain sight ever since Itachi blurted out Akatsuki's interest in dimensionalism research in front of the entire Clan Council and it emerged that you were the only person conducting same."
Wow, what a hypocrite. If Hazō had talked to Ino about a hypothetical new ninja paradigm Kei discovered, or a secret like the rift, in front of Kei without obtaining prior consent, the length of Kei's rant would have made it the longest MfD chapter. I don't believe the thread would have voted against telling Tenten about sealing, but the way she not only does not bother asking Hazō, but acts indignant (with Snowflake providing poor cover for her behavior) really rankles me.
 
Wow, what a hypocrite. If Hazō had talked to Ino about a hypothetical new ninja paradigm Kei discovered, or a secret like the rift, in front of Kei without obtaining prior consent, the length of Kei's rant would have made it the longest MfD chapter. I don't believe the thread would have voted against telling Tenten about sealing, but the way she not only does not bother asking Hazō, but acts indignant (with Snowflake providing poor cover for her behavior) really rankles me.
Just flick her forehead and tell her she's being an annoying sister ez
 
Right, but he didn't make it strong enough to withstand sealing failures.
Seals rip a hole through the Veil using chakra, and then they maybe turn ambient chakra into [effect]. Or they may spontaneously allow [effect] to enter from the hole in the Veil with no environmental chakra being needed.

There is seemingly some disagreement between the QMs on how seals/runes actually work. Orochimaru said that seals/runes don't use chakra as fuel, but there has been WoG-ish from EJ that they do use it. I don't suppose @Paperclipped @Velorien or @Paperclipped know what the official stance is? It's possible I missed the response to this, I was away for a couple weeks.

Anyway, no sealing failures means no seals as sealing failures operate through the same mechanism as seals. It's just a different [effect] being generated than the intended one.
 
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