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Marked for Death: A Rational Naruto Quest

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Kiba said:
Why is that a particular worry?
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Because it is a failure state that hasn't been shown on screen either way but could very well be both in character for Hazō and devastating if noticed too late. And the way we are currently handling all of our underlings failures (namely ignore, console, compliment and throw money at the problem) might become problematic under certain circumstances.

I have no problem if we are more forgiving than anyone else around us. I just want to make sure that we aren't too forgiving. Our subjects should definitely feel like there is still some sort of rule of law comparable enough to what they used to have that they at least still recognize it as a serious matter.

But in general (not only when it comes to crime that is(, future generations growing up on our estate should learn by example that failing at important stuff is considerably worse than not failing and that house Gokētsu won't completely bail everyone out of every problem.

But as I said, this isn't anything with clear textual evidence. It's just something wich I have a hunch on. Thus me asking the QMs as opposed to me declaring that there is a problem to fix.
 
How to convince Kagome that operating seals really isn't for first years:
  • Get context:
    • Bring cookies, Kagome's gonna want them.
    • Ask him what learning to use chakra was generally like back in Cloud.
  • Be frank:
    • Tell him that someone reputable (don't name names yet) said that sometimes the damage from using chakra too early doesn't show up until months later.
    • We're worried for Honoka, and even if she's likely fine it would be wrong to gamble with her future.
  • Cooperate:
    • Try to figure out if it really is safe to do this kind of thing with Cloud's methods.
      • If so, then Honoka's in danger if she keeps this up and learns the Konoha way.
      • If not, then Honoka's in danger.
    • Either way, we need to be certain that Honoka's giong to be okay, even if it doesn't seem like she's in trouble right now.
  • If necessary:
    • Break past the stubbornness. If he's wrong then not only will he be executed for crippling an academy student but Honoka will never become a ninja. This is no time for pride. If you want Honoka to be safe then you need to cooperate.
This isn't exactly plan-sized but I think it's the right approach. Kagome's going to be stubborn that he's right and we need to convince him that his pride isn't worth the chance that he's wrong. It's worth mentioning that he might get executed over this but the idea of Honoka being crippled will resonate with him more so that's what we need to focus on as we push past his pride.
 
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Damn, Honoka is in potential danger. This needs to be addressed ASAP, simply because it can be the case of cumulative damage.

One way to approach this is "there are stinkers saying you are doing harm to Honoka, get her medical checkups to show them that everything's fine", then see if everything is actually fine. It'll be easier to get him to do it, but won't adress the root problem of his methods being completely unverified, and Kagome himself still believing himself infallible in this matter.

Edit: One other avenue of discussion is the fact that Kagome may be doing good teaching, but Honoka could be overeager by training on her own. As Ebisu said- most kids get killed by trying cool shit in spite of instructor's warnings.
She may be a smart kid, but this piece of wisdom is new to us, so obviously it'll be new to her.

Hell, it won't even require some fancy water-walking techniques - just a little too much training could do subtle damage over weeks.
 
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Kagome already was willing to throw down with Jiraiya over this. We already have Hokage approval. Just make sure Asuma knows and use it as a testing environment
 
Hold up a second. @eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail From my understanding Kagome asked Jiraiya to have Ebisu watch his training/progress with Honoka, which seems to include teaching Honoka about chakra manipulation. This was months ago (on November 21), how is it that Jiraiya was able to get Hazou, Noburi, and Keiko training with the man but didn't have anything for Kagome?
 
Also might I add how refreshing it is that Noburi and Asuma exist?

MMKII: Bah, we're going to be sitting around in Leaf doing nothing exciting for--

NOBURI: We should do a totally-not-a heist and rob some of those chakra Koi.

ASUMA: That sounds awesome and super cool to me. Get to it!

NOBURI: Isn't it?! As an aside, I think its cool that we finally found a valid use case for that word too. It's not like "Enter place and steal MacGuffin in some fashion." isn't one of the most generically applicable descriptors of all time as far as ninja-espionage goes, and yet its taken forever for "Meta Action Plan: Pull a Heist." to get some justification.

ASUMA: Right, chakra chameleons are pretty strange creatures. Strange. Well, you should totally-not-steal more things if you can get away with it.

NOBURI: Best Hokage ever.

ASUMA: I don't even try!

MMKII:
 
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All right, I'm uncomfortable with continuing to lay it off. Noburi did great this update by requesting a chakra farm for a purpose separate from SC: we'll get the best version of the farm, we won't need to hide it from Leaf, and it's even less likely to be connected to SC training now. However, I can't help but feel if Noburi took even slightly different approach, it would've ended with Asuma figuring out SC FOOM. We need to classify it IC, ASAP.

[x] Action Plan: Lightcone-Ending OPSEC Incident, Narrowly Avoided
Wordcount: 399
  • Discuss with Mari and Noburi.
    • Maximal security: go into the wilderness, Tunnel Excavation downwards beyond Byakugan's range, then set up an Air Dome.
  • Explain Shadow Clone in detail.
    • This jutsu allowed Naruto to become ridiculously skilled for his age. You think we can replicate this. His unique advantage is effectively unlimited chakra, and we have Noburi. The ability to withstand clone sickness remains an issue, but there are exercises to dramatically improve on it. If one obsessively does them for years...
    • Basically, you suspect that SC could eventually allow one to quadruple their learning speed and training time, in addition to direct multitasking benefits.
    • Optimistically, we'll all hit S-rank in half a decade. We finally have a solid shot at fixing the world within our lifetimes.
  • Unless someone more well-positioned to exploit it outcompetes us. Examples:
    • Orochimaru. Bio-augmentations might allow him to offset clone sickness, and he can kidnap a Wakahisa. Already an immortal S-rank sealmaster, this'll make him a god.
    • Ami, if she somehow learns SC (how likely is it?). She's already extremely competent, and her bloodline-related skills might help with clone sickness. We'd never catch up.
    • Generally, other major clans: they'll amass power faster due to sheer size. They don't have a Noburi, but it's potentially bigger than Skywalkers: you expect we'll be severely pressured to provide services. And if everyone's S-rank, no-one is.
  • It's the most dangerous secret we possess. It shouldn't go beyond the clan, and should stay need-to-know within it.
    • Chakra transfer and SC never met before, and the few who know SC consider it mainly a weapon, so this trick hadn't been discovered.
    • How do we keep it this way? Spread subtle disinformation about VD? Imply it can't interface with certain chakra constructs?
  • Additionally:
    • What needs to happen for Akane, Kagome, Mari to get access to SC?
    • Would Mari be willing to specialize into Technique Hacking, if she learns SC? She might enjoy it, and it likely synergises with Sealing well.
      • (Subtext: Realistic alternative to retirement, where she doesn't need to manipulate or kill.)
    • Noburi, don't resign yourself to merely being the crucial component behind the clan's meteoric rise to power: we should be able to TH you a usable SC variant eventually.
  • Separately, discuss your quarantine with Mari and Kagome.
    • It's been a month, you've been fairly active, and there haven't been incidents.
    • Do they think it's sufficient to be cleared?
 
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@eaglejarl @Velorien @OliWhail If a Hazou (with SC 30) makes a Shadow Clone for training purposes, but then fails his Resolve check for clone sickness, does he still get the bonus XP from training? I've looked over the page and I can't seem to find anything suggesting that Hazou wouldn't get the bonus XP.
 
1234qwerty said:
Easier construction if edge supports are modular. Something like identical, 1 meter long sections so they can be easily stored. For a 3 by 3 by 3 balloon, this works out to 216 identical, 1 meter pipes. Very replaceable and no need for much precision. Maybe 45 extra bits for keeping force wall seals aligned if the edge supports aren't enough on their own. Easier in some ways that force walls appear an inch away from seals, not flush.
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I don't think the EN has mass production, so getting modular, identical components might be difficult. On the other hand, we could use this as a reason to invent mass production, and turn that in for the contest as well.

I agree that we should try reactionless propulsion first though. If nothing else, we can at least rule it out.


Edit:
Whoops, looks like Eaglejarl said something about that.
 
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Noumero said:
Discuss with Mari and Noburi, in utmost security (in the
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JIRAIYA: Son, I am disappoint.

We can do a bit better than this, I reckon. Once in the wilderness, spam Tunnel Excavation to go tunnel downwards(ish) until Hazou's roughly out of chakra (refill then). Ask Mari to cast any privacy jutsu she has (IIRC, she has some? @faflec ?) and then do the air + earth domes.

[We should invent an easy way to create air-filled structures underwater. That way we can just do these meetings at the bottom of a lake or something in the future. ]
 
Noumero said:
Should we spread subtle disinformation about VD? Plant evidence suggesting it's bad at interfacing with certain chakra constructs?
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This may tip Ami off to FOOM, as she likely knows a lot about the Wakahisa bloodline and will therefore realize that we're covering something up.

1234qwerty said:
Anything else before fleshing out details?
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Do you think there's space to add a scene similar (but a bit shorter, presumably) to the one in Noumero's plan? I like the things your plan is doing, but it feels like making FOOM a clan secret is something that needs to be done sooner rather than later.

[x] Road Trip
 
MMKII said:
JIRAIYA: Son, I am disappoint.

We can do a bit better than this, I reckon. Once in the wilderness, spam Tunnel Excavation to go tunnel downwards(ish) until Hazou's roughly out of chakra (refill then). Ask Mari to cast any privacy jutsu she has (IIRC, she has some? @faflec ?) and then do the air + earth domes.

[We should invent an easy way to create air-filled structures underwater. That way we can just do these meetings at the bottom of a lake or something in the future. ]
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I...I don't recall her having any privacy jutsu? When we were in that Leaf "secure site" back when we'd first entered Leaf Mari never used privacy jutsu even though it would have made perfect sense to use it then, and there's a lot of other times where such a technique would have made sense.
 
Hm... Actually, I think the best way to handle the Honoka thing is to do a bit of research. Ask Ebisu where records on that kind of thing would be held, get permission to look at and share them with Kagome, and point out that X out of every Y ninja whom have gotten that kind of training has died.

Kagome doesn't respond well to arguments from authority, but he does respond well to arguments from logic or numbers.
 
Cariyaga said:
Hm... Actually, I think the best way to handle the Honoka thing is to do a bit of research. Ask Ebisu where records on that kind of thing would be held, get permission to look at and share them with Kagome, and point out that X out of every Y ninja whom have gotten that kind of training has died.

Kagome doesn't respond well to arguments from authority, but he does respond well to arguments from logic or numbers.
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Wouldn't those records be in the Tower or Academy?
 
faflec said:
If a Hazou (with SC 30) makes a Shadow Clone for training purposes, but then fails his Resolve check for clone sickness, does he still get the bonus XP from training?
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Yes, EagleJarl answered that on Discord. Search for "the reintegration always succeeds".
MMKII said:
We can do a bit better than this, I reckon. Once in the wilderness, spam Tunnel Excavation to go tunnel downwards(ish) until Hazou's roughly out of chakra (refill then). Ask Mari to cast any privacy jutsu she has (IIRC, she has some? @faflec ?) and then do the air + earth domes.
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I blame cached thoughts. This good?:
Discuss with Mari and Noburi, in utmost security (go in the wilderness, Tunnel Excavation downwards until beyond Byakugan's range, then set up an Air Dome).
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1234qwerty said:
I'm for it. Might be more credible after hitting SC 30, first? Also not sure how I feel about the trade off between telling Mari and Noburi soon vs making superduper sure no one overhears us telling them.
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We'll be as private as we're ever going to be in the coming months, and I'm too worried about Hazou or Noburi re-discovering the idea and mentioning it to someone to put it off.
Sentient Tree said:
This may tip Ami off to FOOM, as she likely knows a lot about the Wakahisa bloodline and will therefore realize that we're covering something up.
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That would require very intricate knowledge of it, I think; I'm doubtful that even Ami would have access to it.
 
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Noumero said:
That would require very intricate knowledge of it, I think; I'm doubtful that even Ami would have access to it.
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We can also potentially... just frame things as us being overly cautious wrt Noburi's bloodline (which is explicitly in character) or something? If whatever we do isn't tripping any immediate alarms, we'll probably be fine for the time being given whatever else is on her plate.
 
faflec said:
...well that seems...ok. Just fail the check such that you'd only get a Mild Consequence, which fades over the day so you don't take additional penalties upon repeat.
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AFAICR this has been the uniform running assumption on all the SC math anyway, so the good news is that none of that needs a rework.
 
Spend a Fatepoint so that Jiraiya included those Academy notes on those students who ruptured their chakra coils.
 
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