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I'm not going to weigh in on the logic of either side's arguments, but I will ask that everyone read over what they write and really consider if the words they used are polite and won't be inflammatory intentionally or not. You cant account for people's tolerances perfectly but at least try to say your piece without saying things that can be easily construed as overly dismissive of the other side of the argument, thank you.

Please endeavour to be cordial. :^)
 
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Who, exactly, do you think the Cult of Gazul is going to be fighting, other than the chaos dwarves, that an anti-scrying/anti-magic rune would not be useful against? The priests of Gazul are specialists. If they're seeing combat instead of their more typical duties, it's a) the undead, b) chaos dwarves, c) chaos generally or d) weird shit which is likely magical in nature.

Again, given their purview and ranger-y combat culture, the wardstone rune would be a massively valuable addition to their armour in just about any typical situation they would deploy.
Fair question, so heres what we've been told about the commission
[ ] [Simple] Grave Wardens: [Cost: 12 actions] Due end of Turn 42. Productivity like No Other will proc. Gain 70 Favour and 1 Standing with the Cult of Gazul. Just as the Cult of Valaya has the inkling of a great colonization wave, the other Ancestor Cults have also taken notice. The local Cult of Gazul has come to you for the same reason the Cult of Valaya has, to arm their most senior members with the kind of equipment befitting their station, both current and for those future Dawi who may take up this most sacred of duties.
And since they say its the same reason as Valaya has heres is that.
(*Updated*)[ ] [Simple] Armoured Maidens: [Cost: (12 -6) =6 actions] Due end of Turn 40. Productivity like No Other will proc. Gain 70 Favour and 1 Standing with the Cult of Valaya. The Clergy of Valaya are making plans to expand the Valkyrie Guard in preparation for what they believe is a coming wave of colonization across the Karaz Ankor in the future. Given your history with the Cult, they've come to you wondering if you had the inclination to create armour for some of the future Valkyrie Guard that will no doubt come from the endeavour. The number is not the sum total of suits, but ones specially made for their eldest and most veteran Matrons. The foundational core of the future Valkyrie Guard in these future-Holds. The Cult will hold the suits in their vaults until such a time they are needed.
I think the wave of colonization is more relevant than the hold emphasis because I do see the Gazulites as more rangery than the Valayans. However we are also arming their senior members and I think its a reasonable assumption that these members are going to generally be kept mostly sedentary because of them.
While in a hold, the equipment is mostly likely to see use in its defense, in the recent updates for example we've seen from Khastahs PoV that smaller holds do have to fight off roving hordes of Beastmen.
While doing more rangery things, our best example is Logain, although he is unusual in his relationship with corpses I think his duties or his interpretation of them is likely to be more normal. In these circumstances its seeking out dwarves that have met bad ends while travelling and giving them rites of some sort.
People (sorry I forget who) did previously bring up that the young and experiencing relatively rapid growth is the phase that a hold is most vulnerable to Hashut infiltrators, however anti scrying is not very useful here as the big problem is identifying acolytes. And I think them escaping after identification because of scrying is probably a relatively rare occasion, for one thing the priest of Gazul is unlikely to hang around after making the discovery so theres a small window to scry before you get caught. And frankly even if they do escape by scrying, between a Elder priest of Gazul hunting a younger Hashut cultist, I know who I'd put my money on.

Basically I think the duties they're going to be used in are Hold Defense, and Wilderness Survival. And the most useful Hashut counter would probably be a rune of lie detection.
I disagree with your assertion that scrying would be involved in the typical deployment.
 
Fair question, so heres what we've been told about the commission

And since they say its the same reason as Valaya has heres is that.

I think the wave of colonization is more relevant than the hold emphasis because I do see the Gazulites as more rangery than the Valayans. However we are also arming their senior members and I think its a reasonable assumption that these members are going to generally be kept mostly sedentary because of them.
While in a hold, the equipment is mostly likely to see use in its defense, in the recent updates for example we've seen from Khastahs PoV that smaller holds do have to fight off roving hordes of Beastmen.
While doing more rangery things, our best example is Logain, although he is unusual in his relationship with corpses I think his duties or his interpretation of them is likely to be more normal. In these circumstances its seeking out dwarves that have met bad ends while travelling and giving them rites of some sort.
People (sorry I forget who) did previously bring up that the young and experiencing relatively rapid growth is the phase that a hold is most vulnerable to Hashut infiltrators, however anti scrying is not very useful here as the big problem is identifying acolytes. And I think them escaping after identification because of scrying is probably a relatively rare occasion, for one thing the priest of Gazul is unlikely to hang around after making the discovery so theres a small window to scry before you get caught. And frankly even if they do escape by scrying, between a Elder priest of Gazul hunting a younger Hashut cultist, I know who I'd put my money on.

Basically I think the duties they're going to be used in are Hold Defense, and Wilderness Survival. And the most useful Hashut counter would probably be a rune of lie detection.
I disagree with your assertion that scrying would be involved in the typical deployment.

Thank you for actually engaging with the argument. I disagree, but that at least is a reasonable point of view.
 
Question has there been any plans to make some really good weapons like tier 3 and 4 stuff for our bodyguards? So there become better at aiding others and killing our enemies? What's the general consensus there right now?
The consensus is that there's not enough time.
There's an idea floating around about making a weapon for the champion/hearth lord, but nothing really widespread.

Between the two large commissions for the cults, learning Eltharin, researching alchemy and all our other obligations, it's not likely that we'll make time for individual weapons.
 
The consensus is that there's not enough time.
There's an idea floating around about making a weapon for the champion/hearth lord, but nothing really widespread.

Between the two large commissions for the cults, learning Eltharin, researching alchemy and all our other obligations, it's not likely that we'll make time for individual weapons.
Ok thanks for answering it and I'm sure when we're done with the current simple requests we can make some time and make a few weapons for the hearth guard.
 
Ok thanks for answering it and I'm sure when we're done with the current simple requests we can make some time and make a few weapons for the hearth guard.
Gazul commission => 12 actions
Az Dreugi => 2 actions (at least)
Eltharin => 5 actions
Basic Alchemy research => 10 actions
Secrets of light => 5 actions
Mind of things => 6 actions
Chainmail part 3 => 17 actions
Master Rune of Purification => 5 actions
Rune metal part 5 => 6 actions

I don't see it happening any time soon, unfortunately.
 
Gazul commission => 12 actions
Az Dreugi => 2 actions (at least)
Eltharin => 5 actions
Basic Alchemy research => 10 actions
Secrets of light => 5 actions
Mind of things => 6 actions
Chainmail part 3 => 17 actions
Master Rune of Purification => 5 actions
Rune metal part 5 => 6 actions

I don't see it happening any time soon, unfortunately.
Well we're a dwarf we actually do have the time in a century of course and as long as we don't take anymore Simple Requests then in 10 turns I'm sure we can get to it.
 
Ok thanks for answering it and I'm sure when we're done with the current simple requests we can make some time and make a few weapons for the hearth guard.
We're actually kinda limited in the equipment we can make for the Hearth Guard:
Gear:
The final mechanic is gearing out the company itself. In this case, I'll now offer options to alter, improve or even give gear to the company. Now, instead of just giving you however many gear slots per dwarf in the group I'll instead treat your retainers as a single entity both for the sake of my sanity and stopping game-breaking shenanigans. For gameplay's sake you'll be able to individually craft the following for your dwarfs:
  • 2 Weapon slots or 1 Weapon and a Shield
    1 Armour slot.
    UP TO 3 banner slots.

    The armour, weapons and one banner will be worn by the leader/champion of the company while the other potential banners held aloft by standard-bearers. Set Bonuses in this case would only involve the dwarf with the armour and weapon and Banner, OR between the three banners but not all together. Ergo you could have two set bonuses active, one for the champion and one for the banners and greater company, but not one mega bonus amongst all the items. Equipping the company wholesale will be done through simple actions (write-ins for this is still pending, I'm still considering) and impact the Retinue's stats which goes as follows, not including special traits like Unbreakable, Tireless, etc:
So we can't make more than 2 weapons max. If your goal is an improvement to the Hearth Guard in general rather than just a more powerful champion Banners are the way to go rather than making multiple weapons. We did order a T4 pegasus heart for a mobility banner for the Guard, Thungni only knows when we'll actually get around to making that though.
 
We're actually kinda limited in the equipment we can make for the Hearth Guard:

So we can't make more than 2 weapons max. If your goal is an improvement to the Hearth Guard in general rather than just a more powerful champion Banners are the way to go rather than making multiple weapons. We did order a T4 pegasus heart for a mobility banner for the Guard, Thungni only knows when we'll actually get around to making that though.
Should of clarified there but no it's not my intention to improve the whole Hearth guard more it's commander and champion with better weapons. But I would be down for getting them a banner as well.
 
Should of clarified there but no it's not my intention to improve the whole Hearth guard more it's commander and champion with better weapons. But I would be down for getting them a banner as well.
Ok my bad, I read a few as like 5 or 6. I wouldn't mind trying to slot in a weapon for Ylva somewhere soon it's just so hard to make the time.
 
Ok my bad, I read a few as like 5 or 6. I wouldn't mind trying to slot in a weapon for Ylva somewhere soon it's just so hard to make the time.
Yeah my intention was to make some weapons' for Rudil and Ylva since there probably our best fighters in the group. And it is hard to make the time with all the Simple request people want to take on(and everything else right now). And while I would prefer not to do anymore simple requests and only the take on difficult request's commission wise it's not that big a deal for me and given there's no major or imminent threat heading our way getting some better weapons for the guard can wait 10 turns.
 
What would the combo be to create an MRepair that can regenerate serious damage? I'm pretty sure Smednir would be in there, maybe Repair+Smednir+Stone?
Id say it would depend entirely on what it's used on. Something smelted like armour would have Smednir + Forging. A weapon might have Grimnir + Smednir (might just be another Smednir + Forging one tbf) the underway might be dependant on what is being repaired. Defences would be Morgrim + something (not sure what exactly) and the underway itself might be repair + stone + ??? (Grungni maybe? He is famed for moving the earth, typically breaking it though).

Or, it'll depend entirely on how conceptual some things are. If it's a prosthetic it might be Valaya or Smednir, healing vs forging.

So, yeah, rambling aside it might depend entirely on what you want to repair. Smednir seems like a pretty good general ancestor rune to use but I could definitely see some specialised versions using the other gods.
 
I feel like the rune of repair is something that'll basically never be used on something meant for battle since a third armor/weapon/talisman rune meant for fighting is just a better to have than repair that any runesmith can do after the fight is over. It's great for utility commissions that only have one or two runes on them like I'm guessing most of the forged limbs, torques, transcribers sort of objects have. Stuff that the person can pay a little extra to have self repair on that doesn't take the spot of a needed rune.
 
I feel like the rune of repair is something that'll basically never be used on something meant for battle since a third armor/weapon/talisman rune meant for fighting is just a better to have than repair that any runesmith can do after the fight is over. It's great for utility commissions that only have one or two runes on them like I'm guessing most of the forged limbs, torques, transcribers sort of objects have. Stuff that the person can pay a little extra to have self repair on that doesn't take the spot of a needed rune.
wonder if rune of repair would let us generate gromril? shave off small pieces from items with repair rune on it, let it repair itself then shave off more
 
Well I'm going to say what Snori can't because it's heresy, that was a poor gift and some not very interesting runes Valaya. Better luck next time.
In fairness they're literally runes she had on a picnic basket. It would have been really weird for her to have put useful weapon/armor runes on it or anything we could directly derive that kind of thing from.

That stacking rune could be a useful starting point for more space altering runes, but it could also be the case that she just gave Snorri a basket of stonebread so he'd have a basket of stonebread instead of specifically handing him a research project to go with the gromil chain.
 
In fairness they're literally runes she had on a picnic basket. It would have been really weird for her to have put useful weapon/armor runes on it or anything we could directly derive that kind of thing from.

That stacking rune could be a useful starting point for more space altering runes, but it could also be the case that she just gave Snorri a basket of stonebread so he'd have a basket of stonebread instead of specifically handing him a research project to go with the gromil chain.

To be less fair she was not contractually obligated to hand out baskets

"Not a very interesting gift"

Right after giving us two new and useful engineering runes on top of her own personal Master Rune

Sure, okay man.

The basic runes are unlikely to show up in most of our projects and he own master rune doubles things we have already done.
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I mean. If we can figure out a way to boost its potency we can get selfrepairing equipment/warmachines/gronti.

And wasn't Valaya more in favor of various small hints that lead to big achievements in contrast to Grungni big all-in-one challenges?
 
I do not get the hate for valayas runes I think they are pretty sick one allow us to ignore enemy magic attack we can only use it indeterminately but still something that negate mages is super big, Then the rune of repair I think is still pretty big since that will eliminate a lot of minor repair and it a first step! which is her whole thing giving us beardling something to work toward, also rune of stacking same apply/ also first step toward santa/ having more room to store stuff is huge/ so yah I was not tottaly on reaserching this but tottaly worth it in my opinion
 
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I do not get the hate for valayas runes I think they are pretty sick one allow us to ignore enemy magic attack we can only use it indeterminately but still something that negate mages is super big, Then the rune of repair I think is still pretty big since that will eliminate a lot of minor repair and it a first step! which is her whole thing giving us beardling something to work toward, also rune of stacking same apply/ also first step toward santa/ having more room to store stuff is huge/ so I yah I was not tottaly on reaserching this but tottaly worth it in my opinion
It's because it doesn't fit into the streamlined min-maxed layout that some people have put together for how we should proceed. People are getting it into their heads that certain things must have the application they say it does, before we even actually know what the research will give us. So in this case since people were somehow thinking that the runes on the basket were going to be applicable to armor, they're upset that it's not and thus dissing on the runes as being "useless" since it doesn't fit into their pre-conceived plans.
 
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It's because it doesn't fit into the streamlined min-maxed layout that some people have put together for how we should proceed. People are getting it into their heads that certain things must have the application they say it does, before we even actually know what the research will give us. So in this case since people were somehow thinking that the runes on the basket were going to be applicable to armor, they're upset that it's not and thus dissing on the runes as being "useless" since it doesn't fit into their pre-conceived plans.

Not the case for me I voted against the basket because I thought they would not be applicable. I still think we got less value both IC and OOC than we could have gotten elsewhere.
 
To be less fair she was not contractually obligated to hand out baskets



The basic runes are unlikely to show up in most of our projects and he own master rune doubles things we have already done.
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She isn't, but I wouldn't call it her fault that we decided it'd be more than exactly what it presented itself as; an excellent basket full of baked goods. Dawi!super grandma made us cookies, and we started obsessing over the secrets of the plate she served them on.

Those runes could make for some excellent logistics boosters, so they are useful, but the point may have been more symbolic than anything else. Similar to how Gazul and Smednir both gave Snorri trinkets with mundane purposes to essentially say that they thought this particular beardling was neat.
 
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