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Paths of Civilization

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So. Judging by the fact that our power-7 Guilds want it and this is the last turn to get it, I assume we will be getting Ironworks 3 soon. That is going to be... something.

Lets take the effects one at a time:
  • Changes certain action costs. This is liable to be one of the biggest effects of the action, but it is a complete wildcard; hopefully it turns out well, but nobody can say.
  • +1 Econ to City Upkeep cost. This one is actually not really a cost at all, thanks to Markets; we are consuming 1 extra Econ a turn in return for producing 1 Wealth and 0.25 Culture. A positive trade overall, albeit only because we have the Markets in place for it already.
  • +1 Tech/Turn. An unambiguous benefit; an extra stat point would certainly come in handy, and if I had to pick any stat to generate addition income, Tech is certainly the best. Unfortunately, 1 Tech a turn doesn't really go far these days. At all.
  • Increases City Attraction by 1. Nobody cares; Redshore is a Free City so City Attraction isn't even tracked.
  • Increase the effect of City-Support and Agriculture policies at the cost of additional Tech. Assuming this increase is still done at a 2 Econ per 1 Tech ratio, this is a good thing: it means that we actually only need a single City Support policy to cover all of the expenses from our three Free Cities plus Redshores lvl2 Block Housing plus the Ironworks payment. The Tech cost is a bit of a pain, but at 2:1 it is worth it.
  • Adds +1 Econ and -1 Tech to Expand Economy. And here is the catch. This is actually pretty crappy for us. We need an extra point of Tech -> Econ conversion on that action like we need a brick to the face. As it is, our Tech refunds are probably not going to reach 3 anytime soon, but with this our Tech costs are only going to keep going up. Furthermore, the only significantly way to refill tech directly is to take Support Artisan actions, which are now significantly stat-negative due to the wealth cost. Our only saving grace is overflow from Mysticism+Culture - but if that ever gets shut down for even one or two turns, our Tech drain is going to be a critical problem.
 
PrimalShadow said:
So. Judging by the fact that our power-7 Guilds want it and this is the last turn to get it, I assume we will be getting Ironworks 3 soon. That is going to be... something.
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Wait, how much can our infrastructure policy build this turn? Cause if the guilds try to force it through because we don't have 9 infrastructure progress this turn to take...
QingChina22 said:
So confusing......
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Which part? Maybe me or another can help?
 
[X] [Marriage] From the Storm Ymaryn to gain an alliance
[X] [Main] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Dam
[X] [Secondary] Dam x2
[X] [Secondary] Annex - Great Hall
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X] [Secondary] Switch Policy - Offensive
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Mills x2
[X] [Guild Secondary] Build Mills
 
PrimalShadow said:
Adds +1 Econ and -1 Tech to Expand Economy. And here is the catch. This is actually pretty crappy for us. We need an extra point of Tech -> Econ conversion on that action like we need a brick to the face. As it is, our Tech refunds are probably not going to reach 3 anytime soon, but with this our Tech costs are only going to keep going up. Furthermore, the only significantly way to refill tech directly is to take Support Artisan actions, which are now significantly stat-negative due to the wealth cost. Our only saving grace is overflow from Mysticism+Culture - but if that ever gets shut down for even one or two turns, our Tech drain is going to be a critical problem.
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It might be worth trying to force our Infrastructure policies to build a Governor's Palace next turn. It only costs 3 Econ and 3 Culture to get three progress which could then be picked up and completed by our current suite of policies in a single turn. Add a [Main] Redshore Aqueduct and our policies could deal with that issue too. Econ and Culture are cheap to replenish so the costs aren't that great. If we're lucky, then Redshore will use its policies to free up 2 Infrastructure progress so that our Infrastructure policies and build a Market in Blackmouth when combined with its normal policies.

Having a fourth GP would immediately give us a second point of Tech refund and go a long way to deal with our ongoing lack of good ways to generate it. Only a couple actions cost more than 2 Tech and only Baths (which we already don't want to make) and Build Ceramics Kilns cost more than 3 Tech.

It won't solve our problem to get 2 refunded, but it will go a long way to solve our ongoing Tech issues. Ideally, we want a Tech refund of 3 since that covers basically all of our actions and most of the bleed induced by our policies. Of course, to get there means have to build 3 more GPs.

Considering everyone is chomping at the bit to Build Roads, it may be worth looking at building more GPs to increase our connectivity cap for centralization.

Academia Nut said:
Governor's Palace - Every palace lowers Min. Centralization by 0.5 and adds +1 to max interconnectivity, Temp Econ damage resistance, and adds +1 to max Martial, but also reduces Max. Centralization by 1 and can serve as the core of a breakaway state in a civil war. Each {S} costs 3 Econ and 3 Culture and produces 3 Progress
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Do we have any suitable locations in order to build more Governor's Palaces? If yes, where would the current Admin Chief recommend we place them to maximally ease the strain of our administration?
 
Redium said:
It might be worth trying to force our Infrastructure policies to build a Governor's Palace next turn. It only costs 3 Econ and 3 Culture to get three progress which could then be picked up and completed by our current suite of policies in a single turn. Add a [Main] Redshore Aqueduct and our policies could deal with that issue too. Econ and Culture are cheap to replenish so the costs aren't that great. If we're lucky, then Redshore will use its policies to free up 2 Infrastructure progress so that our Infrastructure policies and build a Market in Blackmouth when combined with its normal policies.

Having a fourth GP would immediately give us a second point of Tech refund and go a long way to deal with our ongoing lack of good ways to generate it. Only a couple actions cost more than 2 Tech and only Baths (which we already don't want to make) and Build Ceramics Kilns cost more than 3 Tech.

It won't solve our problem to get 2 refunded, but it will go a long way to solve our ongoing Tech issues. Ideally, we want a Tech refund of 3 since that covers basically all of our actions and most of the bleed induced by our policies. Of course, to get there means have to build 3 more GPs.

Considering everyone is chomping at the bit to Build Roads, it may be worth looking at building more GPs to increase our connectivity cap for centralization.



Do we have any suitable locations in order to build more Governor's Palaces? If yes, where would the current Admin Chief recommend we place them to maximally ease the strain of our administration?
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It really surprises me that the Patricians haven't been working towards more Governor's Palaces themselves. I guess infrastructure policy hijacking is more a Guilds thing...
 
[X] [Main] Restore Order
[X] [Secondary] Switch Policy - Offensive
[X] [Secondary] Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[X] [Secondary] Dam
[X] [Secondary] Dam x2
[X] [Secondary] Hunt Troublemakers
[X] [Secondary] Enforce Justice
[X] [Guild] Build Mills
[X] [Guild] Build Mills x2
[X] [Guild Secondary] Build Mills

[X] [Marriage] From one of the Forhuch tribes to secure their loyalty

Come gather 'round questers
Wherever you post
And admit that the shitstorms
Around you have grown
And accept it that soon
You'll be salt to the bone.
If your time to you
Is worth savin'
Then you better start swimmin'
Or you'll sink like a stone
For the votes they are a-changin'.
 
Been trying to find that quote about black soil unlocking terraforming action for the last thirty minutes or so, but can't. Anybody got a better clue?
 
Susano said:
This isn't a binary proposition, you know. Our new Vassal-March will have a loyalty value, and as with all loyalty values, we kinda want that to be as high as possible.
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Citino said:
Blood ties matter at this point in time. Having a foreign king with no ties to you is bad. Having a king who married into one of your tribes, on the other hand, is perfectly acceptable.

We don't need to do it to get their loyalty, in theory, but it makes it hell of a lot easier in the future.
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Influence Subordinate - By transferring specialists and teachers to subordinates they can be nudged into behaving more to the liking of the core provinces
*S: -2 Diplo, Transfer 2 Econ, Wealth, Culture, Tech, and Mysticism; influences subordinate culture
*M: -3 Diplo, Transfer 3 Econ, Wealth, Culture, Tech, and Mysticism; significantly influences subordinate culture, +1 Loyalty

This is a guaranteed action no matter which choice we go with! We marry the Forhuch we will use Influence Subordinate on the Forhuch. We marry the Storm Wolves we will use Influence Subordinate on the Forhuch. We can't not use Influence Subordinate on the Forhuch if we marry the Forhuch because we need the Forhuch to understand our Ymaryn culture. We marry the Storm Ymaryn we need to use Influence subordinate on the Forhuch if we want to prevent them from breaking away, civil war, or just plain they have to low a loyalty score.

Theory on how high their loyalty score... I don't need Theory AN has posted how high the Forhuch are currently.

Academia Nut said:
Forhuch (Vassal-March) - Foreign territory under your control, follows you in war but has own agenda (L: 3/5, D: 4/5)
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The Forhuch are currently dependent on us with a rather average Loyalty score. Marry, or don't we will use a Influence Subordinate on the Forhuch for that Loyalty score alone. If we marry the Forhuch and that boosts the loyalty up to 5/5 we would still need to Influence the Forhuch wasting the loyalty point on the action if the Loyalty score is 5/5.

What was my point? The Ymaryn lose more by marrying the Forhuch than they do marrying the Storm Ymaryn. The Storm Ymaryn at least don't cause our necessary Influence Subordinate action on the Forhuch to potentially be a waste.

Wiadi said:
Mostly because they're likely to be a lot less impressed with Alyxunmyn's successor, and we'd rather hold that territory for more than a single king's reign.
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They will be less impressed with Alyxunmyn's successor anyway if we don't use Influence Subordinate on the Forhuch. The Ymaryn elect their leader. The position of King isn't Hereditary. The only reason it becomes hereditary through election is if the descendant is exceptional, or a born genius. We have strong cultural examples to prevent Kings like Phygrif from taking the throne.
 
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