Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Crow and Gwygowyn Love us and have Guided us for millenia, Gwy and Goya have given us Strength and Grace, and now you would seal them away beyond devices of cold steel? to do what join Arxyn in his greed of gold and delusions of dominion over man?
- Location
- United States
It seems as though the Ymaryn have gained Arxyn as their patron, considering they now run on greed and treat Men as Cattle.
- Location
- his hidden lair
It's even more egregious, because despite all of China's memetic Inward Perfection it sure as hell threw its weight around abroad at times. Tribute Fleets, Tributaries, importing bullion, exporting culture and ideas.
The notion that Ymar became a massive, prosperous, and largely stable empire that promptly proceeded to exert no influence on other nations is mind boggling even ignoring the values promoting foreign interaction.
The notion that Ymar became a massive, prosperous, and largely stable empire that promptly proceeded to exert no influence on other nations is mind boggling even ignoring the values promoting foreign interaction.
Warning: THIS IS NOT A JOKE EITHER
- Location
- National Capital Region, USA
this is not a joke either
@jamie96969, you will stop troll-rating serious posts as 'Funny' because you disagree, or you will be infracted or threadbanned.
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
Truly we must return to the old ways when people followed the Primordial Truth as Crow taught them.
Nah, the direction the Ymaryn went was something that some posters already knew, taken from the posted traits. (Pretty sure @veekie was posting about the problem, from way before I quit the quest during the Trelli war.) What you're missing is the interaction between all the traits; you're missing the bigger picture by just comparing two traits.
The biggest offenders are the Elites trait and the Philosopher trait, combining in awful ways with the Gardeners and Purity traits.
The Elites trait meant that, to the Ymaryn, being better than you was the way to gain honour/status in Ymaryn society, and that Elites can't be questioned. Combined with the Philosopher trait and how the Ymaryn was a Great Power, it turns into The Ymaryn know better than you and can't be questioned. Combined with the Gardeners trait and how it encourages people to think only about their own patch of land, the Elites trait manifests as People who focus on improving their own land are better than people who focus outward. Combined with the Purity trait, it turns into The Ymaryn are better than foreigners and presenting yourself as Ymaryn is better than being seen as foreign.
All together, the whole clusterfuck means The Ymaryn know better than foreigners and are better off focusing on their own land.
Pride in Acceptance has, what, one trait supporting it? And that's the Elites trait, where the combined manifestation is the super shitty, condescending, and patronizing variation of the White Man's Burden.
As the great Ymaryn ships swim through the Gwygo on their way to new sun's we must not forget our patrons, the avian god of plots nor the genderbreaking goddess of purity and excellence. Through their worship will we continue to resist the predations of the plague god bloody war god which have come so close to success before. Let us pray.
Last edited:
Thing is, first round vote was flawed in many respects. We never knew it was two items, so monofocused on internal, we never knew the length of the timeskip (I thought it was 100-200 years, exactly so we could avoid "Why are we so different now" problems and giving people a bit more say in how we developed), so the zeal of internal focus was born from our then lack of foreign threats and pressing problems of a possible civil war, perhaps above all else, it was extremely short, so we didn't even had the time to think and ask questions and figure everything out.
But I am not too salty about the outcome, since there was always an undercurrent of "Outside is, mostly, a source of problems, and we can get what little good it brings ourselves", both in our society and among the participants. It's really not hard to imagine it becoming far more pronounced. Now, later, people really should've known better, especially with the Khan, but oh well. Some wanted to just #YOLO and burn everything down anyway.
But I am not too salty about the outcome, since there was always an undercurrent of "Outside is, mostly, a source of problems, and we can get what little good it brings ourselves", both in our society and among the participants. It's really not hard to imagine it becoming far more pronounced. Now, later, people really should've known better, especially with the Khan, but oh well. Some wanted to just #YOLO and burn everything down anyway.
You mean, after we integrated everything and everyone around us? We also traded a lot, even if wasn't on forefront. Would be interesting to know how our collapse affected the trade anyway.
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA, United States
Oh! Look! PoC is back and it looks like there are several updates for me to read through! Nearly 150 pages worth!
I'm really looking forward to it! I'm back and eager to-
...
I'm going to need time to process all of this.
I'm really looking forward to it! I'm back and eager to-
...
I'm going to need time to process all of this.
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
False, we've broken through into a sub cavern and are going to spend the rest of eternity blindly scrabbling for the light until when we do find it, it's naught but blinding and the people up above look like nothing so much as food.The only way to go is up once we broke through 3 layers of ground.
Lightning Round VII
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] [Ambition] Unify the Yllthon Coast
[X] [Fuel] Sale of academy space to foreign nobles
It was a slow thing, over the course of generations, but in seeking to support their trade partners to the south the People found themselves reunifying with their cousins and neighbours around the Yllthon Sea. It wasn't entirely a conscious thing, but rather a recognition that they needed to secure the strongest thing that would help them maintain local trade, allowing them to subsidize the resistance to the Vortuga in the Monsoon Sea while also protecting their own trade as best as possible. While there were a number of military campaigns, a significant amount of this reunification was cultural and diplomatic. People realizing that they had deeper ties to each other, and that they would be better served working together rather than fighting. It started with making agreements to lower trade barriers and address piracy rather than covertly funding it against rivals, and eventually it grew to alliances and unification.
A big component was actually the opening up of the ancient academies to outsiders. From their founding the academies had been exceedingly exclusive, the domains of the upper nobility, jealously guarded, but at a certain point the state came to see them as just another resource, and opened them up to foreign nobility - although the first "foreigners" were mostly from the mercantile city-states to the west and south that spoke Ymaryn - who could pay. While some objected to secrets and sacred places being used as mere resources, it offset a major cost, and more than that it deepened ties with powerful nobles and wealthy merchants. Soon enough non-nobles who had the wealth from within the territories were being admitted, and then more distant students came with inquiries. To the west, Syffryn nobilities descended from the intermingling of Western Ymaryn, local tribes, and successor kingdoms to the Saffron Islander empires came seeking knowledge; from the north the kingdoms and trade republics of the Gylruv - descendants of Ymaryn traders, local tribes, and nomadic groups who went north and west into the desolate cold - came with esoteric questions on the ancient tending of forests.
And then the People really looked at what they had in their libraries, and felt a deep sense of embarrassment at the absurd wealth of information they had and hadn't looked at. Their ancestors had accumulated the wisdom of millennia and had just sort of... stashed it away. At a certain point they had come to the conclusion that they were the center of the world, and anything useful would either drift into their hands without trying, or then eventually the only useful things came from within. Other people came to them, they had no need to go out into the world. The Ueman Empire, the most significant group in the Saffron Sea for centuries, had entire archival buildings devoted to the various border skirmishes and trade deals recorded over the seven centuries the two groups had interacted, and the People only had a vague sense that they even existed, and that they had collapsed at some point, torn apart by internal tensions and external invasion.
Scholars actually looking at the commentary of the time could only cringe at their ancestors bragging about how they would never be so foolish collapse as the Ueman, their descriptions almost ominous, mocking foreshadowing of what would happen to them in good time.
Soon enough scholars from further afield were practically besieging the libraries of Redshore and Valleyhome, upon realizing that texts thought long lost had multiple copies mouldering in some back shelf. While lack of funding had inflicted tremendous neglect upon many works, the People were all too happy to have their ancient intellectual treasures reproduced for them - people paid them to restore their works even! However, while this revival of the classics brought back some of the bragging of old, new patterns had been established, and the People wanted to go out and meet others, rather than turning inward to the point of disconnection and hubris. The academies and libraries flourished, and new modes of teaching were pioneered in the new atmosphere. While ironically enough it seemed that the far west and far north seemed to benefit the most from the flourishing brought about by the reintroduction of their own ancestral texts, the benefits to diplomacy were significant. Across the Saffron Sea there was an explosion of art from ancient religion, cast in new light.
That was another thing. For centuries the People's relationship with religion had been a bit odd. They had always been less concerned with the exact nature of the divine than the proper veneration of the divine - the Ymaryn were orthopraxic rather than orthodox, in the language of theology adapted from foreigners who had spent far more time thinking about this than them. The People had never particularly seen religion as something worth fighting over in the abstract sense, and in the past groups that cared to make an issue about it had always run headlong into Ymaryn warriors early on and decided it wasn't that big a deal anyway. All their neighbours sort of saw the People as being vaguely heretical, vaguely pagan, but also not so different as to take catastrophic issue. They believed in God, even if the exact pronunciation of His name and the nature of His servants could be a bit strange. In more recent centuries these issues had grown a bit more now that the Empire no longer stood in their way to make the issue moot, while in the former territories the issue of religion had become a critical issue for those whose world had collapsed, but there was something to the People's humours that kept them from getting too excited about religious differences.
However, this had a most unfortunate effect on some of their neighbours as they plunged into their archives. The People had kept texts from the Meshamini, Geoyrgon, and Samynish faiths, along with their own more native Mylathydysm, and they had kept them all, including the ones deemed heretical and/or blasphemous - only, embarrassingly the People had dispassionately kept the political commentaries that talked about why certain religious leaders had declared them heretical in the first place, which meant that more than once a text was found that had disappeared from the west that had been suppressed for reasons that were later found heretical themselves. Scholars discovered centuries of theological debate, and suddenly wondered if they were missing important pieces of their religious texts because of the stupidity of their ancestors... or if they were holding foreign fabrications and lies.
Somewhere out beyond the Storm Mountains a scholar got a copy of a book that suggested that a current piece of locally unpopular theology was in fact a much later addition to their sacred texts, only to be rebuffed by his church's hierarchy. Rather than submitting to what he saw as a corrupt institution spreading lies that could damn them all, he stuck his foot in the ground and ended up sparking a religious revolution. While normally not that much of a concern, the increased communication with the outside world revealed that the Vortuga were allied with the religious authorities opposed to this new movement. Further, the Meshamini within the People largely followed an independent sect anyway, so there would be no internal dissent if the People chose to go take a side in this foreign religious issue. With the Yllthon secured, especially with Trelli, they had secure and exclusive access to a huge number of markets through riverine and sea trade, so they could send some degree of support, as well as having the somewhat limited option to send their own ships through the Saffron Sea to harass the Vortuga and their allies from the east.
Then again, there were also a number of nobles reading through the ancient accounts and noticing that the Old Ymaryn nobility used to show off their wealth and power by inviting in foreign refugees, in order to demonstrate their piety and magnanimity. Just stirring up trouble by sending guns or pirates might be a bit crass when the option to invite these radical theologians to take shelter with them remained available. That might even cause more trouble for the Vortuga and their ilk in the long run!
Involvement in foreign religious affairs
[] [Involvement] Stay out of it (0.8x)
[] [Involvement] Offer limited support (1x)
[] [Involvement] Offer extended support (1x)
[] [Involvement] Throw fuel on the fire! (0.8x)
What form should support take? (More than one option may be taken)
[] [Form] Sell guns and cannons to your preferred sides (2x)
[] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
[] [Form] Deploy privateers to disrupt enemy logistics (1x)
[] [Form] Send in direct military aid (0.8x)
Theological debate
[] [Debate] Stay out of the debates (0.8x)
[] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
[] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
[] [Debate] Fabricate texts more favourable to your purposes (0.5x)
[X] [Fuel] Sale of academy space to foreign nobles
It was a slow thing, over the course of generations, but in seeking to support their trade partners to the south the People found themselves reunifying with their cousins and neighbours around the Yllthon Sea. It wasn't entirely a conscious thing, but rather a recognition that they needed to secure the strongest thing that would help them maintain local trade, allowing them to subsidize the resistance to the Vortuga in the Monsoon Sea while also protecting their own trade as best as possible. While there were a number of military campaigns, a significant amount of this reunification was cultural and diplomatic. People realizing that they had deeper ties to each other, and that they would be better served working together rather than fighting. It started with making agreements to lower trade barriers and address piracy rather than covertly funding it against rivals, and eventually it grew to alliances and unification.
A big component was actually the opening up of the ancient academies to outsiders. From their founding the academies had been exceedingly exclusive, the domains of the upper nobility, jealously guarded, but at a certain point the state came to see them as just another resource, and opened them up to foreign nobility - although the first "foreigners" were mostly from the mercantile city-states to the west and south that spoke Ymaryn - who could pay. While some objected to secrets and sacred places being used as mere resources, it offset a major cost, and more than that it deepened ties with powerful nobles and wealthy merchants. Soon enough non-nobles who had the wealth from within the territories were being admitted, and then more distant students came with inquiries. To the west, Syffryn nobilities descended from the intermingling of Western Ymaryn, local tribes, and successor kingdoms to the Saffron Islander empires came seeking knowledge; from the north the kingdoms and trade republics of the Gylruv - descendants of Ymaryn traders, local tribes, and nomadic groups who went north and west into the desolate cold - came with esoteric questions on the ancient tending of forests.
And then the People really looked at what they had in their libraries, and felt a deep sense of embarrassment at the absurd wealth of information they had and hadn't looked at. Their ancestors had accumulated the wisdom of millennia and had just sort of... stashed it away. At a certain point they had come to the conclusion that they were the center of the world, and anything useful would either drift into their hands without trying, or then eventually the only useful things came from within. Other people came to them, they had no need to go out into the world. The Ueman Empire, the most significant group in the Saffron Sea for centuries, had entire archival buildings devoted to the various border skirmishes and trade deals recorded over the seven centuries the two groups had interacted, and the People only had a vague sense that they even existed, and that they had collapsed at some point, torn apart by internal tensions and external invasion.
Scholars actually looking at the commentary of the time could only cringe at their ancestors bragging about how they would never be so foolish collapse as the Ueman, their descriptions almost ominous, mocking foreshadowing of what would happen to them in good time.
Soon enough scholars from further afield were practically besieging the libraries of Redshore and Valleyhome, upon realizing that texts thought long lost had multiple copies mouldering in some back shelf. While lack of funding had inflicted tremendous neglect upon many works, the People were all too happy to have their ancient intellectual treasures reproduced for them - people paid them to restore their works even! However, while this revival of the classics brought back some of the bragging of old, new patterns had been established, and the People wanted to go out and meet others, rather than turning inward to the point of disconnection and hubris. The academies and libraries flourished, and new modes of teaching were pioneered in the new atmosphere. While ironically enough it seemed that the far west and far north seemed to benefit the most from the flourishing brought about by the reintroduction of their own ancestral texts, the benefits to diplomacy were significant. Across the Saffron Sea there was an explosion of art from ancient religion, cast in new light.
That was another thing. For centuries the People's relationship with religion had been a bit odd. They had always been less concerned with the exact nature of the divine than the proper veneration of the divine - the Ymaryn were orthopraxic rather than orthodox, in the language of theology adapted from foreigners who had spent far more time thinking about this than them. The People had never particularly seen religion as something worth fighting over in the abstract sense, and in the past groups that cared to make an issue about it had always run headlong into Ymaryn warriors early on and decided it wasn't that big a deal anyway. All their neighbours sort of saw the People as being vaguely heretical, vaguely pagan, but also not so different as to take catastrophic issue. They believed in God, even if the exact pronunciation of His name and the nature of His servants could be a bit strange. In more recent centuries these issues had grown a bit more now that the Empire no longer stood in their way to make the issue moot, while in the former territories the issue of religion had become a critical issue for those whose world had collapsed, but there was something to the People's humours that kept them from getting too excited about religious differences.
However, this had a most unfortunate effect on some of their neighbours as they plunged into their archives. The People had kept texts from the Meshamini, Geoyrgon, and Samynish faiths, along with their own more native Mylathydysm, and they had kept them all, including the ones deemed heretical and/or blasphemous - only, embarrassingly the People had dispassionately kept the political commentaries that talked about why certain religious leaders had declared them heretical in the first place, which meant that more than once a text was found that had disappeared from the west that had been suppressed for reasons that were later found heretical themselves. Scholars discovered centuries of theological debate, and suddenly wondered if they were missing important pieces of their religious texts because of the stupidity of their ancestors... or if they were holding foreign fabrications and lies.
Somewhere out beyond the Storm Mountains a scholar got a copy of a book that suggested that a current piece of locally unpopular theology was in fact a much later addition to their sacred texts, only to be rebuffed by his church's hierarchy. Rather than submitting to what he saw as a corrupt institution spreading lies that could damn them all, he stuck his foot in the ground and ended up sparking a religious revolution. While normally not that much of a concern, the increased communication with the outside world revealed that the Vortuga were allied with the religious authorities opposed to this new movement. Further, the Meshamini within the People largely followed an independent sect anyway, so there would be no internal dissent if the People chose to go take a side in this foreign religious issue. With the Yllthon secured, especially with Trelli, they had secure and exclusive access to a huge number of markets through riverine and sea trade, so they could send some degree of support, as well as having the somewhat limited option to send their own ships through the Saffron Sea to harass the Vortuga and their allies from the east.
Then again, there were also a number of nobles reading through the ancient accounts and noticing that the Old Ymaryn nobility used to show off their wealth and power by inviting in foreign refugees, in order to demonstrate their piety and magnanimity. Just stirring up trouble by sending guns or pirates might be a bit crass when the option to invite these radical theologians to take shelter with them remained available. That might even cause more trouble for the Vortuga and their ilk in the long run!
Involvement in foreign religious affairs
[] [Involvement] Stay out of it (0.8x)
[] [Involvement] Offer limited support (1x)
[] [Involvement] Offer extended support (1x)
[] [Involvement] Throw fuel on the fire! (0.8x)
What form should support take? (More than one option may be taken)
[] [Form] Sell guns and cannons to your preferred sides (2x)
[] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
[] [Form] Deploy privateers to disrupt enemy logistics (1x)
[] [Form] Send in direct military aid (0.8x)
Theological debate
[] [Debate] Stay out of the debates (0.8x)
[] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
[] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
[] [Debate] Fabricate texts more favourable to your purposes (0.5x)
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Huh, this is kind of hilarious actually. While they lost a lot of the institutional knowledge, the Ymaryn tendency to document fucking everything, and managing to avoid a "Burning of the Library of Alexandria" moment when the Old Ymaryn collapsed (Due to their core remaining intact) meant that they turned out to be a scholarly goldmine when the Not!Renaissance hit and people started actually caring about old stories again.
Now we have to resist the temptation to get a Crusade called on us for instigating the rise of Not!Protestantism.
Now we have to resist the temptation to get a Crusade called on us for instigating the rise of Not!Protestantism.
Gavoon
Genuine Gangplank
- Location
- USA
[X] [Involvement] Stay out of it (0.8x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
You've got to bring back the classic.
[X] [Debate] Stay out of the debates (0.8x)
We're more likely to lose something then gain something by involving ourselves in religious debates.
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
You've got to bring back the classic.
[X] [Debate] Stay out of the debates (0.8x)
We're more likely to lose something then gain something by involving ourselves in religious debates.
It's funny though that despite obsessively documenting every theological debate, we barely even noticed the not!Roman Empire was there.
100% this.
Like, literally none of the issues were new or unknown. We had a lot of traits which pushed strongly against natural selection pressures and individual imperatives.
None of it is individually impossible, but the ability to consistently make decisions to protect the trait...if you apply it to history the x10 and x0.1 multipliers were quite correct. It was indeed possible for a culture to go with open and accepting ideas, but you needed a hundred voices of peace and hope to compete with one voice of fear and pride.
For instance, we 'could' have decided to go seek out the source of gunpowder and overturn our preconceptions. But the moment we had 3 votes for "screw the weird foreign nonsense"? It was out entirely, our best chance was consolidating behind "maybe we should look at it and see if theres anything new to that idea, but you know in your heart those foreigners can't have any REAL ideas that weren't copied from us anyways, oh look, the results fit our preconceptions"
We COULD have bought off the nomads, like we had done back in the past when we were the Valley and they were the Traders, like we had done when we were the Core and they were the proto-Hawks. However, if you looked to the more recent turns, the thread attitude to nomads was alternately, "meh, we can take them" and "diplomacy doesn't stick more than 3 turns anyway, we should murder them all the way out to the Salt Sea to be sure", with bribing them(which I would note, we can bribe VERY EASILY because of our immense wealth, such that it doesn't cost anything but delay pet projects a few turns).
Which produced the nomad vote, where the momentum reflected thread attitudes that they would never threaten the core and we ultimately had to choose to flip off Genghis Khan as a compromise to the Honorable Death, Purity and Divinely Glorious Elites clamouring that "We can totally beat them out in the steppes".
Which is a tragedy reflecting history as well. We actually got better, Genghis didn't demand tribute. He demanded a better trade balance, which would have been irrelevant in a hundred years anyway, and which could have been met with more salterns.
The University, as different from the Academy was built around the idea of examining past ideas, of questioning and exploring, where the Academy was focused around transmitting and passing down skills. Its basically the stuff our priests were doing, except done secularly rather than religiously(and since our priesthood had blown up, they weren't doing a lot of inquiry anymore either)
As for reconquista, it's always on the table as long as the histories remain intact and the old empire territories are not taken by other great empires. However the barriers remain the same, we don't really have the logistics to control much beyond the sea and the canal route to the lowlands. Not until the telegraph.
Yeah, got tired of reiterating it to zero reception...or worse, knee jerk reflexive action that make things worse. Certainly expanionist claygrabs flavored the traits even worse. Elites + Gardeners reacts horribly with expansionism on social mentality, especially when Philosophers builds justifications for it.
- Location
- Australia
you know that this is just letting people in who get to us right? not helping them get to us.
- Location
- Sweden
[X] [Involvement] Throw fuel on the fire! (0.8x)
Burn baby, burn!
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[X] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
[X] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
Burn baby, burn!
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[X] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
[X] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
[X] [Involvement] Throw fuel on the fire! (0.8x)
What form should support take? (More than one option may be taken)
[X] [Form] Sell guns and cannons to your preferred sides (2x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
Theological debate
[X] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
What form should support take? (More than one option may be taken)
[X] [Form] Sell guns and cannons to your preferred sides (2x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
Theological debate
[X] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
VoidZero
Passing Flan 布丁魔王
- Location
- Anywhere but RL
[X] [Involvement] Offer extended support (1x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[X] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
YES YES YES YES! ALL shall know the Glory of the Goddess!
Edit: Also PROFITS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[X] [Form] Sell guns and cannons to your preferred sides (2x)
[X] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
Edit: PRINTING PRESS?
[X] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[X] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
YES YES YES YES! ALL shall know the Glory of the Goddess!
Edit: Also PROFITS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[X] [Form] Sell guns and cannons to your preferred sides (2x)
[X] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
Edit: PRINTING PRESS?
[X] [Debate] Get more copies of your versions of texts in there (1.2x)
Last edited:
- Location
- Poland
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[] [Involvement] Offer limited support (1x)
Aren't Vortuga our enemy anyway?
A small dig at them shouldn't drive them into frenzy.
[] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
Typicaly Ymaryn behavior of PiA.
[] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
Also a thing we kept doing in the good old days.
Better than selling shit (Rule of Gold still haunts), and allows to give some direct pressure.
[] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
It will improve our educational faculties, as we'll have a need for more and better teachers.
[X] [Involvement] Offer limited support (1x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[X] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
[X] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
Aren't Vortuga our enemy anyway?
A small dig at them shouldn't drive them into frenzy.
[] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
Typicaly Ymaryn behavior of PiA.
[] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
Also a thing we kept doing in the good old days.
Better than selling shit (Rule of Gold still haunts), and allows to give some direct pressure.
[] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)
It will improve our educational faculties, as we'll have a need for more and better teachers.
[X] [Involvement] Offer limited support (1x)
[X] [Form] Offer safe haven to the persecuted (1.2x)
[X] [Form] Offer mercenary services to your preferred sides (1.5x)
[X] [Debate] Offer theological and rhetorical training to preferred sides (1.2x)