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Paths of Civilization

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TotallyNotEvil said:
@ctulhuslp Whats so good about Siberia, tho?

Wouldn't climate conditions make it bitchingly hard to do anything there?

Alaska at least isn't a frozen wasteland, and we know is very very rich in resources. If we do get Siberia, both become very close anyway.
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That we don't have to go to war to claim it.
It's not amazing land, but it's dirt cheap to acquire without compromising our international standing in any way whatsoever. Conquered land would make for all kinds of diplomatic tensions.

And land in Americas would require outstanding naval arm to hold, while Siberis only needs land army, which we kinda have. And nobody has all that much competing claims on it anyway.

Also, Siberia has quite a few riches in it too, even if developing them is hard due to distance and climate. The easy-to-get ones are timber, furs, amber and ores from not!Ural; there also will be some precious metals and gems, oil and natural gas if memory serves me right. Not prime real estate for farming or making megapolises of course, but good enough resource extraction otherwise.


All in all: it's easy to take and hold politically and militarily, and offers good enough sources of raw materials and place to put any extra population without risking overpopulation pretty much ever.
 
Academia Nut said:
Blame your alchemists. They developed a theoretical framework for viewing the world that slowly crept in, and when the break came in instead of sitting in the theoretical background it surged forward. You still have a pretty strong empirical tradition, but it often has to sit within the elementalist theoretical framework, although that is starting to break down as chemistry grows.
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Interesting.
Germ theory is going to find it much more difficult to gain traction due to it's similarity to the old religion's ideas.


Cavalier said:
You didn't have "germ theory." You had "invisible demons cause disease by curses" theory. And once the religious establishment supporting that theory was butchered...

Well look up Semmelweiss for why empirical results without a credible theoretical framework fail to gain traction.
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It used religious terminology, but it was essentially the same theory. Invisible vs too small to see; either way the theory is saying the cause cannot be seen pre-microscope. Both have cleaning agents kill the microorganism/curse so sanitation acts as a preventive. Both have the idea one type of microorganism/curse causes one type of illness. Both have the microorganism/curse spreads from one person/animal/plant to another. Both had the idea exposure does not guarantee infection, but without exposure there will be no infection.
The only real difference is where the microorganism/curse came from; evolution verses demons.

Semmelweiss made a number of key mistakes, he failed to publish his results, he failed to apply the scientific method and he established hostile relationships with other doctors. The lack of a credible theoretical framework was one of the issues but by itself would not have prevented his ideas gaining traction.
 
JaceAoT said:
Lots of trees in Siberia.
We love those.
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Well yes, taiga is another boon of Siberia, but we kinda lapsed on our obsession with forests.
Should do some more research into our archives and into ecology to revive it...also revitalizing our religion I guess...

Ha. Our religious fundamentalists will totally be eco-terrorists.
 
Chrestomanci said:
Interesting.
Germ theory is going to find it much more difficult to gain traction due to it's similarity to the old religion's ideas.
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Not necessarily. Most early scientists were theologians as well. If they find something that reaffirms their religion, they will be very happy.

It may well fall under secular knowledge as well. The priests may have been the caretakers and users of medical knowledge, but we had doctors just before the timeskip, whom would use the same theories.

@Academia Nut

What is Not!Siberias climate like? Is it as horrible as RL or did the southward shift warmed it up?
 
As soon as Oil becomes a thing we've basically won.

Over half the worlds Oil Fields are tight slap bang in the middle of our territory. We'll be the richest faction yet again.
 
Random Member said:
UPM: "We're gonna invade ya for your oil, err, to spread freedom and democracy!"
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If we stay out of this war long enough for our industrial revolution to really get kicking, that and Not!Russias abundant natural resources and the massive population of the Empire we'll have means we'll be able to fuck everyone up for the next century. Long enough for us to dissuade them from invading.

Yo @Academia Nut how do the other nations view the Dual Monarchy? They trust us. But what do they think of our army, culture and history etc etc?
 
DakkaMania said:
Not necessarily. Most early scientists were theologians as well. If they find something that reaffirms their religion, they will be very happy.

It may well fall under secular knowledge as well. The priests may have been the caretakers and users of medical knowledge, but we had doctors just before the timeskip, whom would use the same theories.
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Much of the pre Great Khan Ymaryn is gone.

The religion is different so it will not reaffirm their religion.
The doctors have adopted elementalism theory, and have rejected earlier ideas.


McLuvin said:
As soon as Oil becomes a thing we've basically won.

Over half the worlds Oil Fields are tight slap bang in the middle of our territory. We'll be the richest faction yet again.
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Tragically so, earlier in the quest a few posters wanted to use our control over the oil to basically skip internal combustion cars straight to electric(wind/hydro generated).
As it is now we will sell the oil very profitably or face invasion.

When we reach the 20th Century, we should be able to win the Space Race. Hopefully we will continue to develop space after reaching the moon, with a Mars colony before the 21st
 
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The history of scurvy is a nice little example of how medical knowledge can be gained and a lost:

How Scurvy Was Cured, then the Cure Was Lost
Scott And Scurvy (Idle Words)

Basically, they found out empirically that limes, lemons and watercress would prevent scurvy, but didn't know why. Then Germ Theory came along and scurvy didn't fit into that framework, that combined with the fact hat new ways of preserving lemon or lime juice essentially eliminated the vitamin-C, and scurvy became a thing again.

Atkinson inclined to Almroth Wright's theory that scurvy is due to an acid intoxication of the blood caused by bacteria...
There was little scurvy in Nelson's days; but the reason is not clear, since, according to modern research, lime-juice only helps to prevent it. We had, at Cape Evans, a salt of sodium to be used to alkalize the blood as an experiment, if necessity arose. Darkness, cold, and hard work are in Atkinson's opinion important causes of scurvy.
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On the topic of Not!Siberia, what do people think about enacting our own Mid-Canada Plan on the place?

The grandiose — but failed — 1960s plan by an Ontario war hero to settle a 'second Canada' below the Arctic

http://www.plancanada.com/midcanada_corridor_report.pdf

As it is I think the Ymaryn heartland and Gylruv proper are going to be badly over-populated in the coming centuries. We can mitigate that by spreading the people across Not!"Siberia and gain a firm groundwork for resource extraction projects later.
 
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HanEmpire said:
On the topic of Not!Siberia, what do people think about enacting our own Mid-Canada Plan on the place?
http://www.plancanada.com/midcanada_corridor_report.pdf
As it is I think the Ymaryn heartland and Gylruv proper are going to be badly over-populated in the coming centuries. We can mitigate that by spreading the people across Not!"Siberia and gain a firm groundwork for resource extraction projects later.
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Yeah, seems reasonable enough. It should also keep land from being an issue if we play it right, and get our people to keep settling Siberia as we go. I mean, there's plenty of resources to be had, and with a lot of investment, we could make the area incredibly profitable.

We'll need a lot of railroads though.
 
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