Yes, they will notice much more if slaves are added as opposed to the rationalization of process which merely depress wages if not outright eliminate jobs.
Paths of Civilization
- Thread starter Academia Nut
- Start date
- Original
Yes, they will notice much more if slaves are added as opposed to the rationalization of process which merely depress wages if not outright eliminate jobs.
They'll be busy. But they'll also have weapons and be defending the Ymaryn. So they'll be in a position to say 'stop that' and be heard.
- Location
- Germany
Sorry but this is dump fearmongering
Neither slaves nor half-exiles for that matter are at any point involved in the production-process of the guilds,
Miners: High Skill job
Smelter: Apprentice Guild Job
Forging: Journeymen & Master of the Guild joint venture (Journeymen keep the fires of the forges going, masters are making the individual parts)
Construction: Master working alongside Priests
If anything the high demand will work in favor of the half exiles as the draw on the manpower causes the Guilds to accept more members as Apprentices, which in turn means that other jobs will lack manpower, thus applying pressure to the govenor in charge to somehow free up more skilled people, with pardoning half-exiles being on the table for that
Yes the several hundred thousand people under arms will not be trifled with.
- Location
- Australia
I'm not fearmongering. You may not know this, but I voted in favour of the option that won. All I did was present an alternate idea of what could theoretically happen, not what would happen. That's why I wrote "could" instead of "would".
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- Location
- Germany
No it was fearmongering simple because it cannot happen, for reasons mentioned in my previous post, thus your 'alternate idea' is nothing but baseless fear at it's best and deliberate ignorance at it's worst
- Location
- Australia
No, it means I was simply wrong about my idea. There is a difference between fearmongering and wrongly predicting the possibility of a theoretical bad future. Stop making me out to be some kind of villain here.
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Dutch
Bored Spearman of the Wind
- Location
- CET
Call me a heretic, but I've always preferred Sabaton's cover.
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Yeah that one showed up sometime last night.
Its a wonderful Fist of the North Star reference.
- Location
- Australia
BungieONI
Seven gremlins in a trench coat
- Location
- Lickwidget
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Pfft! So will I.
- Location
- Germany
And there is a difference between admiting a mistake and defending once own mistakes
I have no problem with people wrongly predicting stuff, god knows it happens to me often enough,
But the fact that you then tried to defend and justify it, instead of admitting that you were wrong
That Andres is where you dug your own grave and why I accused you of fearmongering, simple because you weren't willing to give up your point despite being proven baseless or at least acknowledge the other parties point
And that is where I cast you as a villain, because as far as disscussions go, this is villany
They can't, at least not really
1. Cause for our boltthrowers they would shoot themselve to the knee with it, given that those weapons and the men that carry them are all that stand between them and the enemy overlord
2. we don't have standardized measuring and at the same time to high quality standards due to Life of Arete, which together ensure that we (as in our guild masters) will check our weapons before handing them to our minions
3. Even if we somehow manage to 'cut corners', you can bet that those 'cheaper' boltthrowers will be rather sold then used, especially since our weapons are in demand
Far more likely results are high expensive innovations, which would have been previously dismissed as simple being to expensive or other projects simple falling to wayside
- Location
- Somewhere
Are the both of you going to stop tossing words at each other now? We have been thread-locked before when accusations of fear-mongering were thrown about. AN might be able to get an update out tonight. I'd prefer an update without the 24 hour thread-lock.
A New Time for Heroes
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X][Inno] Looks important, invest heavily (-3 Wealth, -3 Mysticism, -1 Tech, ???)
[X][AG] They may join (Open games, ???)
[X][Policy] Switch to Mass Levy
[X][Trade] Push the guilds to the limit to meet demands (Trade Tech for Wealth, up to 5 per phase, to attempt to top up Wealth)
[X][Kick] 1 Stability, 2 Temp Econ damage
The call went out all across the kingdom: everything was needed for the coming fight. Every man who could be called up to fight without immediately crashing the economy was to do so, while those essential to the production of needed supplies were to work overtime. The smiths were to take on as many apprentices as possible to meet the demand not just for the levies, but also to keep trade up with Freehills and the Storm Ymaryn, which would be necessary to keep the economy from collapsing in on itself. Freehills and the Storm Ymaryn were also told that they could send artisans and their products to the Games if they wished, with a general invite being sent to the Harmurri, who were distinctly not in a position to respond as they were busy dealing with the Highlanders swarming into their territory, the news of the Forhuch war immediately sending them from being merely aggressive to having a full on war stance.
In the good news department the People's trading partners on the Yllthon Sea responded by sending over boatloads of ore, dirt cheap, knowing that the People could process it far easier than they could and that the final product would generally be better than anything they could produce. The "generally" though was there from the fact the two groups had had a few ideas of their own for competing with the People's metalworking, and had pushed it towards the limit. While neither group had figured out a way to compete with the raw quantity of iron that the People could process, they had both spent several generations working on the quality they could produce via skilled smiths. They brought with them a number the projects they had been working on, and the smiths of the People had rapidly realized that all three of them had a part of a greater whole.
The People could produce huge amounts of cheap but poor quality iron, useful for things like nails, cookware, or being laboriously welded together with softer bloom iron to get something that had the best qualities of both. The Storm Ymaryn had some of the expertise to do this, but were lacking in a number of areas, notably their ability to make the high quality charcoal and furnaces that could get hot enough to do what they wanted. However, they had access to a number of materials that let them make ceramics that could withstand the heat quite well, and had been experimenting with smaller but more intense furnaces so that they could get a little of the best iron. Meanwhile the Freehills smiths lagged far behind the People and their cousins in terms of smelting, but had compensated by learning all the different types of iron one could find and had made it an art to identify and blend those varieties to best effect. So dependent were they on imported iron that they had worked out ways to refine and improve the quality of ingots that the People and Storm Ymaryn would just throw back in the furnace... or sell to the Freehills if they didn't want to pay for the charcoal. The two groups independently had their own reasons for wanting an invite to the artisan games, but when they actually got it, all of the artisans together realized that each group had some skills and knowledge that they lacked, as evidenced by their different end results. While the guilds weren't exactly happy about collusion, they also wanted to know what the others did, and were thus willing to do some limited collaboration.
The end result was "king's iron", a method of blending different grades of iron together in a furnace using a sacrificial pot. The ingots so produced required skills and materials such that they were fairly judged as being at least worth their weight in gold, but it was also agreed that the metal was worth the effort. While only a miniscule amount could be produced, the products produced were fairly judged as being worthy of being wielded by kings and the greatest warriors of the land. While again the guilds grumbled a bit at various bits of knowledge getting out, they were more than a little mollified by the new product that they would definitely have an advantage in producing. Plus the patrician war leaders were plenty happy to have every extra edge possible.
Also, as the back and forth for the iron work accelerated the traders discovered that whatever grudge they had against the king for increasing prices on them had been satiated by the incredible wealth the iron trade was bringing them. People other than the People sold ore cheap and were more than happy to accept the elevated prices for the high quality goods the People made.
A few priests pointed out that the ore was so bloody cheap because it had been mined by slaves, and more than a few local mines were struggling from being undercut by foreign ore, but the People had other concerns, and the miners could be pulled out for warrior duty.
This was about the extent of the good news in the west, as the initial levy call had resulted in more than a few troubles as there was a scramble among those who didn't want to go to find some way to be declared essential, and among the leadership over what exactly was 'essential'. There was confusion and more than one riot over what exactly was going on, and any hope of an early scramble of the levies to the east was dashed.
Somewhat fortunately, the Forhuch were more interested in loot and conquest rather than psychotic purgation, and thus were a bit more careful and conservative with how they fought in comparison to the Pure from generations past. While the first responders had been pleased to find that the Thunder Horse had not been completely wiped out in the field, part of the problem was that the Forhuch king - confirm to be Fotharnim, youngest son and eldest surviving son of the first king of the Forhuch - had been taking his time to blood his warriors and send back captives and loot to secure his backing, and also to tempt in other steppe tribes. Already an unaffiliated northern coalition had decided that they wanted in on the fun and had attacked the Heaven's Hawk and the Memory of Spirits marches, distracting them from providing any assistance against the Forhuch. Somewhat fortunately the governor of the Memory of Spirits had proven himself a brilliant commander and had kept his freshly deployed forces from suffering major casualties. Sadly, his relative lack of cavalry meant that he had been unable to adequately pursue the enemy, so the north was a back and forth stalemate where neither side wanted to get stuck into a decisive battle, lest they get crushed.
In the lowlands, the War Chief himself had met with mixed success. For his own part he had crushed the forces that he was able to pin down quite adequately, but the Forhuch advantage in horses made actually getting their king to battle with the bulk of his forces a trying task. Fotharnim preferred to hit isolated but 'glorious' targets to give his troops experience, generate tales to encourage more steppe tribes to join up, and pick off loot. A particularly nasty tactic they had learned was that if they took captives and it looked like they were being slowed down they would abandon the captives and then circle around. If the forces of the People went to go help the captives they would pounce in that moment, while if the People held back the Forhuch would ride through the captives, stabbing and shooting everything in their path in the hopes of getting the People into a blind rage to charge out and get picked off instead of engaging logically. The Blood Rain Banner Company had suffered catastrophic losses when their commander lost his head in such a moment.
The metaphor had become quite literal, and the enemy commander responsible for that had been seen with the decapitated head of the commander displayed as part of his standard.
The War Chief, having more reliable access to the Spiritbonded, had smashed a large raiding party that had tried to pull the same trick on him. If the Forhuch suspected that he might be in the area they just ditched their captives and ran. So while this said good things for once the levies actually arrived, the fact of the matter was that the People were being pulled in multiple different directions. They needed to deal with the Forhuch in the east, nomads in the north, and the Highlanders were by all accounts making progress against the Harmurri in the south.
Choose the disposition of your heroes
[] [Hero] Both the War Chief and the Governor of MoS are Heroic Martial
[] [Hero] The governor is competent enough, but War Chief is the ideal general (Heroic Martial and Diplo leader)
[] [Hero] The War Chief is an Avatar of War (Genius Martial, at least semi-stable Diplo and Admin)
Choose your targets
[] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[] [Target] Split focus between the Forhuch and the nomads
[] [Target] Split focus between the Forhuch and Highlanders, hold against the nomads
[] [Target] Split focus between all three enemies
The traders ire is satiated. Do something with them?
[] [Traders] No
[] [Traders] Support Faction for an extra turn (Patricians will switch support to Yeomen immediately)
[] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)
Reaction
[] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
[] [React] Sec Restore Order
[] [React] Sec Build Mills
[] [React] Sec Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[] [React] Sec Support Sacred Orders
[] [React] Sec Blackmouth Ironworks (tech cost accounted for by Guild Push)
Kick
[] [Kick] No further kick
[] [Kick] 1 more kick
[] [Kick] 2 more kicks
Astrological Prediction: The greater the bundle of arrows, the harder they are to break if they are unified
[X][AG] They may join (Open games, ???)
[X][Policy] Switch to Mass Levy
[X][Trade] Push the guilds to the limit to meet demands (Trade Tech for Wealth, up to 5 per phase, to attempt to top up Wealth)
[X][Kick] 1 Stability, 2 Temp Econ damage
The call went out all across the kingdom: everything was needed for the coming fight. Every man who could be called up to fight without immediately crashing the economy was to do so, while those essential to the production of needed supplies were to work overtime. The smiths were to take on as many apprentices as possible to meet the demand not just for the levies, but also to keep trade up with Freehills and the Storm Ymaryn, which would be necessary to keep the economy from collapsing in on itself. Freehills and the Storm Ymaryn were also told that they could send artisans and their products to the Games if they wished, with a general invite being sent to the Harmurri, who were distinctly not in a position to respond as they were busy dealing with the Highlanders swarming into their territory, the news of the Forhuch war immediately sending them from being merely aggressive to having a full on war stance.
In the good news department the People's trading partners on the Yllthon Sea responded by sending over boatloads of ore, dirt cheap, knowing that the People could process it far easier than they could and that the final product would generally be better than anything they could produce. The "generally" though was there from the fact the two groups had had a few ideas of their own for competing with the People's metalworking, and had pushed it towards the limit. While neither group had figured out a way to compete with the raw quantity of iron that the People could process, they had both spent several generations working on the quality they could produce via skilled smiths. They brought with them a number the projects they had been working on, and the smiths of the People had rapidly realized that all three of them had a part of a greater whole.
The People could produce huge amounts of cheap but poor quality iron, useful for things like nails, cookware, or being laboriously welded together with softer bloom iron to get something that had the best qualities of both. The Storm Ymaryn had some of the expertise to do this, but were lacking in a number of areas, notably their ability to make the high quality charcoal and furnaces that could get hot enough to do what they wanted. However, they had access to a number of materials that let them make ceramics that could withstand the heat quite well, and had been experimenting with smaller but more intense furnaces so that they could get a little of the best iron. Meanwhile the Freehills smiths lagged far behind the People and their cousins in terms of smelting, but had compensated by learning all the different types of iron one could find and had made it an art to identify and blend those varieties to best effect. So dependent were they on imported iron that they had worked out ways to refine and improve the quality of ingots that the People and Storm Ymaryn would just throw back in the furnace... or sell to the Freehills if they didn't want to pay for the charcoal. The two groups independently had their own reasons for wanting an invite to the artisan games, but when they actually got it, all of the artisans together realized that each group had some skills and knowledge that they lacked, as evidenced by their different end results. While the guilds weren't exactly happy about collusion, they also wanted to know what the others did, and were thus willing to do some limited collaboration.
The end result was "king's iron", a method of blending different grades of iron together in a furnace using a sacrificial pot. The ingots so produced required skills and materials such that they were fairly judged as being at least worth their weight in gold, but it was also agreed that the metal was worth the effort. While only a miniscule amount could be produced, the products produced were fairly judged as being worthy of being wielded by kings and the greatest warriors of the land. While again the guilds grumbled a bit at various bits of knowledge getting out, they were more than a little mollified by the new product that they would definitely have an advantage in producing. Plus the patrician war leaders were plenty happy to have every extra edge possible.
Also, as the back and forth for the iron work accelerated the traders discovered that whatever grudge they had against the king for increasing prices on them had been satiated by the incredible wealth the iron trade was bringing them. People other than the People sold ore cheap and were more than happy to accept the elevated prices for the high quality goods the People made.
A few priests pointed out that the ore was so bloody cheap because it had been mined by slaves, and more than a few local mines were struggling from being undercut by foreign ore, but the People had other concerns, and the miners could be pulled out for warrior duty.
This was about the extent of the good news in the west, as the initial levy call had resulted in more than a few troubles as there was a scramble among those who didn't want to go to find some way to be declared essential, and among the leadership over what exactly was 'essential'. There was confusion and more than one riot over what exactly was going on, and any hope of an early scramble of the levies to the east was dashed.
Somewhat fortunately, the Forhuch were more interested in loot and conquest rather than psychotic purgation, and thus were a bit more careful and conservative with how they fought in comparison to the Pure from generations past. While the first responders had been pleased to find that the Thunder Horse had not been completely wiped out in the field, part of the problem was that the Forhuch king - confirm to be Fotharnim, youngest son and eldest surviving son of the first king of the Forhuch - had been taking his time to blood his warriors and send back captives and loot to secure his backing, and also to tempt in other steppe tribes. Already an unaffiliated northern coalition had decided that they wanted in on the fun and had attacked the Heaven's Hawk and the Memory of Spirits marches, distracting them from providing any assistance against the Forhuch. Somewhat fortunately the governor of the Memory of Spirits had proven himself a brilliant commander and had kept his freshly deployed forces from suffering major casualties. Sadly, his relative lack of cavalry meant that he had been unable to adequately pursue the enemy, so the north was a back and forth stalemate where neither side wanted to get stuck into a decisive battle, lest they get crushed.
In the lowlands, the War Chief himself had met with mixed success. For his own part he had crushed the forces that he was able to pin down quite adequately, but the Forhuch advantage in horses made actually getting their king to battle with the bulk of his forces a trying task. Fotharnim preferred to hit isolated but 'glorious' targets to give his troops experience, generate tales to encourage more steppe tribes to join up, and pick off loot. A particularly nasty tactic they had learned was that if they took captives and it looked like they were being slowed down they would abandon the captives and then circle around. If the forces of the People went to go help the captives they would pounce in that moment, while if the People held back the Forhuch would ride through the captives, stabbing and shooting everything in their path in the hopes of getting the People into a blind rage to charge out and get picked off instead of engaging logically. The Blood Rain Banner Company had suffered catastrophic losses when their commander lost his head in such a moment.
The metaphor had become quite literal, and the enemy commander responsible for that had been seen with the decapitated head of the commander displayed as part of his standard.
The War Chief, having more reliable access to the Spiritbonded, had smashed a large raiding party that had tried to pull the same trick on him. If the Forhuch suspected that he might be in the area they just ditched their captives and ran. So while this said good things for once the levies actually arrived, the fact of the matter was that the People were being pulled in multiple different directions. They needed to deal with the Forhuch in the east, nomads in the north, and the Highlanders were by all accounts making progress against the Harmurri in the south.
Choose the disposition of your heroes
[] [Hero] Both the War Chief and the Governor of MoS are Heroic Martial
[] [Hero] The governor is competent enough, but War Chief is the ideal general (Heroic Martial and Diplo leader)
[] [Hero] The War Chief is an Avatar of War (Genius Martial, at least semi-stable Diplo and Admin)
Choose your targets
[] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[] [Target] Split focus between the Forhuch and the nomads
[] [Target] Split focus between the Forhuch and Highlanders, hold against the nomads
[] [Target] Split focus between all three enemies
The traders ire is satiated. Do something with them?
[] [Traders] No
[] [Traders] Support Faction for an extra turn (Patricians will switch support to Yeomen immediately)
[] [Traders] Support Faction for a new faction quest (Patricians will not switch support immediately)
Reaction
[] [React] Sec Proclaim Glory
[] [React] Sec Restore Order
[] [React] Sec Build Mills
[] [React] Sec Palace Annex - Grand Hall
[] [React] Sec Support Sacred Orders
[] [React] Sec Blackmouth Ironworks (tech cost accounted for by Guild Push)
Kick
[] [Kick] No further kick
[] [Kick] 1 more kick
[] [Kick] 2 more kicks
Astrological Prediction: The greater the bundle of arrows, the harder they are to break if they are unified
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Huh, I'd thought that the Mass Levy didn't count towards our martial limit, ah well.
Doomed Wombat
Let's go Darling!
- Location
- Dancing on wires!
Yaaaay steel...sure its bad atm, but still steel.
Ah, vague metaphor.
But certainly a statement that bringing people together makes them stronger.
Might suggest sending the Harmurri some aid will be worth it.
VoidZero
Passing Flan 布丁魔王
- Location
- Anywhere but RL
[X] [Hero] Both the War Chief and the Governor of MoS are Heroic Martial
[X] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[X] [React] Sec Restore Order
[X] [Traders] No
[X] [Kick] No further kick
The enemy horde is charging up their WAGHH meter!
Yooooooo, this is cheating! We can't move this martial into enemy and we have to keep it fed/containted or the warriors starts doing stupid stuff. Also GG to the Blood Rain company.
[X] [Target] Focus everything on the Forhuch, hold the line against the nomads
[X] [React] Sec Restore Order
[X] [Traders] No
[X] [Kick] No further kick
The enemy horde is charging up their WAGHH meter!Yooooooo, this is cheating! We can't move this martial into enemy and we have to keep it fed/containted or the warriors starts doing stupid stuff.
Also GG to the Blood Rain company.
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- Pronouns
- They/Them
I am fairly sure we could interpret that to support every option, again. Which probably means it's a decent roll.
- Location
- The Middle of the Howling Wilderness
